Is is me or do some growers in Cali actually not want pot legalised??

[Yes4Prop215]

hahah the father in jail was selling crack not weed....cops dont care about MJ out here card or no card. thanks for the name calling and neg rep...you are a real swell guy.

also considering welfare...im alrite with welfare IF they prove income..so the mother of three with two jobs deserves it. but take a trip through east oakland and tell me all those folks have jobs...they are milking the system because liberal politicians are softies who give handouts for votes. its pathetic...but this isnt a political debate about welfare...its about the government raping us for more taxes to fund their wasteful spending...when they already tax us enough.

 

[dagnabit]

its about the government raping us for more taxes to fund their wasteful spending...when they already tax us enough.

no its not..

if you would like to have a discussion concerning governmental waste we can do so.
what this debate is about is treating marijuana like what it is a plant.
you bullshit stance on taxex is nothing more than an obfuscation.

you complain about getting neg rep from some other poster..
you deserve much worse!
you have abused and defrauded the medical system by your own admission!
you have convinced others that getting a med card for recreational use!
as i stated before people like you are what drug warriors point to when other states refuse to pass medical laws...
neg rep...who cares what YOU deserve is to suffer from ass cancer and go to jail for your meds. that is what your abuse of the medicinal system for your profiteering!

 

[MrBomDiggitty]

yes4prop215 you are just a hater.

how many billions of dollars are generated by the wealthy that recieve little to NO taxation?

that's who is milking the system.

The poor fools you see in east oakland are casualties of an economic war.

trust me, they are not balling out of control at the clubs buying drinks and smoking fat blunts off of their welfare. they're barely making it, man.

 

[Thundurkel]

no its not..

if you would like to have a discussion concerning governmental waste we can do so.
what this debate is about is treating marijuana like what it is a plant.
you bullshit stance on taxex is nothing more than an obfuscation.

you complain about getting neg rep from some other poster..
you deserve much worse!
you have abused and defrauded the medical system by your own admission!
you have convinced others that getting a med card for recreational use!
as i stated before people like you are what drug warriors point to when other states refuse to pass medical laws...
neg rep...who cares what YOU deserve is to suffer from ass cancer and go to jail for your meds. that is what your abuse of the medicinal system for your profiteering!

Now that's just bullshit to say bro... NOBODY deserves cancer dude get real! Also if he sells to clubs it's VERY POSSIBLE his meds are taking care or really sick people.. I'm so tired of the "You Need to be on Your Death Bed" have Aids ect to be legit with a card!!!! I look like a healthy 20something but I can't eat without it and have SUPER BAD ANXIETY!!! But cuz of folks like you I thought I needed to be worse off to get a rec. Also GOOD FOR YOU if you are fucking the system right now it's called karma for our shitty government who taxed EVERY so called legal job I had for SSI but when I'm on my down and outs and try to get help from what I PAYED INTO EVERY FUCKING CHECK I'VE HAD!!!!! I get told NO!!!!!!!! Fuck this bill keep it MEDICAL and let the people make a living and not be living in damn near poverty!!!!

 

[Thundurkel]

yes4prop215 you are just a hater.

how many billions of dollars are generated by the wealthy that recieve little to NO taxation?

that's who is milking the system.

The poor fools you see in east oakland are casualties of an economic war.

trust me, they are not balling out of control at the clubs buying drinks and smoking fat blunts off of their welfare. they're barely making it, man.

Never thought I'd say this but I totally agree with your post bro cuz the rich don't PAY SHIT IN TAXES!!!! Why is it ok for them? Big Pharma especially cuz YOU KNOW all the executives and owners of those companies fall into that category and don't pay much in taxes on the drugs the sell to us at a increase of 200-300% of what it costs them to make!!!!!

 

[dagnabit]

Now that's just bullshit to say bro... NOBODY deserves cancer dude get real! Also if he sells to clubs it's VERY POSSIBLE his meds are taking care or really sick people.. I'm so tired of the "You Need to be on Your Death Bed" have Aids ect to be legit with a card!!!! I look like a healthy 20something but I can't eat without it and have SUPER BAD ANXIETY!!! But cuz of folks like you I thought I needed to be worse off to get a rec. Also GOOD FOR YOU if you are fucking the system right now it's called karma for our shitty government who taxed EVERY so called legal job I had for SSI but when I'm on my down and outs and try to get help from what I PAYED INTO EVERY FUCKING CHECK I'VE HAD!!!!! I get told NO!!!!!!!! Fuck this bill keep it MEDICAL and let the people make a living and not be living in damn near poverty!!!!

when my father was dying of a single cell carcinoma growing from his spine in florida he was arrested in his own home for possessing his medicine. one year prior to that florida governor (then) jeb bush pointed at california as what would happen if florida passed a med bill and it never made it to the ballot box.
the person i was referring to (Yes4Prop215) suggests that if a person under the age of 21 wants to use marijuana recreationaly he should visit his local "doctor" (i have to bite back a laugh) for a recommendation.
this bill is far from perfect but it does not affect you negatively in a single demonstrable way.
what it does do is put legalization on the lips of every news network and politician if it passes!!!
what it does is MAKES the politicians recognize that the will of the people is legalization.


so please explain to me in 10,000 words or less what real repercussion do you think YOU will suffer when T.C.2010 passes?

 

[MrBomDiggitty]

If T.C. 2010 passes how many people will never even entertain selling crack as a living? As it stands now, the law fucks you for selling weed, crack, meth, heroin, it don't matter. If you get caught slipping the law tears you a new one the more you get caught in the system. If weed wasn't considered a "drug" or a "medicine" and instead a "recreation" how many weed dealers would gamble on trying to make some crack money? My guess is not many.

As it stands now, you are breaking serious (felony) laws selling weed to anyone who is not part of your co-op and even then you cant profit. If you have the customer base to sell crack, why not? Same shit in the eyes of the law.

Lets separate the crack and cocaine and meth and heroin and perscription pills from the marijuana.

The cannabis is a plant which can be enjoyed by millions for recreational purposes and by millions more as a medicine.

Just like green tea.

 

[nomaad]

dagnabit: there is a reasonable likelihood that passing the legalization bill will actually set back the pursuit of medical in other states. passage will create a concrete example of medical legislation being the "gateway" to recreational legalization. jeb bush just had conjecture, but current governors that oppose medical will have irrefutable precedent to support their opposition.

i respect your passion on the issue and understand how what happened to your father fuels that, but if you're choosing to ignore the angle I just brought up, its highly likely that you're also letting your emotions blind you to other potential downsides.

 

[MrBomDiggitty]

They should have made it legal for recreational use 30 years ago in California. Then it would have had all kinds of LEGAL research to back up MEDICINAL claims. Somehow I think this would have put a lot of big business pharmaceuticals out of business.

 

[MrBomDiggitty]

And its plain and simple... if you concede that some people NEED cannabis for medicinal reasons then perhaps you must all concede that some people NEED cannabis for recreational reasons. I can't drink alcohol and I'm allergic to cocaine so WEED is the thing for me.

 

[nomaad]

and even then you cant profit.

you are misinterpreting what they mean when they say that collectives may not be run for profit. The law permits salaries and payment for the recuperation of costs associated to growing... which would include payment for your time.

 

[MrBomDiggitty]

With T.C. 2010 can growers/suppliers now actually profit from recreational sales and only medicinal stores can not?

 

[dagnabit]

dagnabit: there is a reasonable likelihood that passing the legalization bill will actually set back the pursuit of medical in other states. passage will create a concrete example of medical legislation being the "gateway" to recreational legalization. jeb bush just had conjecture, but current governors that oppose medical will have irrefutable precedent to support their opposition.

i respect your passion on the issue and understand how what happened to your father fuels that, but if you're choosing to ignore the angle I just brought up, its highly likely that you're also letting your emotions blind you to other potential downsides.

valid point on the "gateway" position....

i believe however the benifits of the national conversation outweigh the negatives when T.C.2010 passes. The people want prohibition ended however,there is a "not in my back yard" attitude amongst the dumbed down complacent masses. If they are confronted on faux news or pmsnbc with a whole state passing this bill they have no choice but to talk about it. and right now it may be the only thing rachel madcow and glen beck will agree on and their respective sheep will listen.

truly if i can make a strange analogy...

this bill is the jesse jackson to barak obama.

jesse ran for president and was laughed at later barak comes along and becomes the first non white president.

i think T.C.2010 is analogous to jesse jackson

[before the flames come out its just an analogy and in no way declares my support or antipathy for the resident president]

 

[vta]

dagnabit: there is a reasonable likelihood that passing the legalization bill will actually set back the pursuit of medical in other states. passage will create a concrete example of medical legislation being the "gateway" to recreational legalization.

I see your point but it's too late for the prohibitionists to stop Medical Cannabis. Remember, The American Medical Association voted recently to reverse its long-held position that marijuana be retained as a Schedule I substance with no medical value. That coupled with all the other endorsements and positive studies in just the last few years, nothing is going to stop it now.

 

[vta]

so vote YES

 

[Yes4Prop215]

no its not..

if you would like to have a discussion concerning governmental waste we can do so.
what this debate is about is treating marijuana like what it is a plant.
you bullshit stance on taxex is nothing more than an obfuscation.

you complain about getting neg rep from some other poster..
you deserve much worse!
you have abused and defrauded the medical system by your own admission!
you have convinced others that getting a med card for recreational use!
as i stated before people like you are what drug warriors point to when other states refuse to pass medical laws...
neg rep...who cares what YOU deserve is to suffer from ass cancer and go to jail for your meds. that is what your abuse of the medicinal system for your profiteering!

You are way out of line..get of your holier than thou throne and think about the crap that is spewing from your mouth.

YOU ARE ON A GROWING FORUM, WHERE A SIZABLE PERCENTAGE OF THE POPULATION HERE ARE CASH CROPPERS/BROKERS WHO MAKE A LIVING IN THE CANNABIS TRADE LEGAL OR NOT.

You are delusional if you think theres no abuse going down with medical cards. I know hundreds of people with cards and maybe 5% of them have legit medical reasons...SO THE FUCK WHAT?? people get the cards so that they can avoid prosecution by the law and because its convienient. the government lets us do it, why not? plus i like buying hash and edibles as gifts for my non card having friends..

Im abusing the medical system? hahahahaha are you kidding me? i dont sell to clubs, i dont deal with them. my whole circle stays black market, there a few who do the club thing but that aint for me. what about richard lee?? its OK for him to make money selling MJ because he has cancer and is in a wheelchair..but the rest of us cant?

hahaah i cant believe you are acting so shocked....OMFG im one out of a million dudes who has sold buds...WOOPTY FUCKING DOO. you act like im selling crack to kids, get off your high horse and take a second to realize where the hell you are...ICMAG...a GROWERS forum where at least half the people here make money in the weed trade, from selling seeds to clones to buds

.have a nice day and enjoy your delusional thoughts where you think you are better than all the rest of us making a living in the trade...come drop by the hydro shop or club and tell all of us that we should have cancer for `profitting off the sick` LOL

btw not tripping of the neg rep because i get three positive points for my posts in this thread for every red one you give me....i guess more people agree with me than you.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

yes4prop215 you are just a hater.

how many billions of dollars are generated by the wealthy that recieve little to NO taxation?

that's who is milking the system.

The poor fools you see in east oakland are casualties of an economic war.

trust me, they are not balling out of control at the clubs buying drinks and smoking fat blunts off of their welfare. they're barely making it, man.

*OFFTOPIC NOT RELATED TO LEGALIZATION DEBATE*
sorry but im not taking your word because you dont live where i live....come take a ride through my section of town and explain to me how they are rolling on chrome and rocking the latest gadgets, clothes, etc. explain to me why my ex-roomates family (on section 8 with 3 kids)...pays next to nothing for their apartment, and why their mom just sits around all day watching their 70 inch TV...and she drives an Infiniti SUV, and her kids all have the latest video game systems, air jordans, etc etc... (which i didnt have when i was their age)....and thats just one example i can go on and on about this but its a different subject.

people like me and people like you will never see eye to eye, your a liberal progressive who thinks the lower class are all victims and deserve to sit around all day and never work hard for theirselves. more government handouts for votes thats the democrats game.

Me...i live in the urban progressive mess and see what happens every day. im not a republican because i hate their fundamentalist views but im an american who believes in LESS TAXATION, LESS GOVERNMENT CONTROL.....every man for himself just like when this country was founded...work hard in your trade and make it your damn self....enough of this poor victim BS. I know kids who made it out the ghetto and into college, why cant the rest of them do it? its because tehy are content with their government handouts....

let me guess. your an obama supporter just like dagnabit huh? dont worry...one day you will wake up and realize your ignorance...until then enjoy your day.

BACK TO ORIGINAL TOPICc.....now that i know this bill is seperate from medical (thanks VTA)...and doesnt really affect me that much..i am not opposed to it. While it pains me to see richard lee whoring our counterculture to the governments in his attempt to control the MJ industry in Oakland..in the long run it probably does not negatively affect me and positively affects thousands of other people i guess its not a bad thing....but you bill supporters are on some violent aggresive liberal BS with your SMUG posts talking down on THE PEOPLE WHO MADE THIS COUNTERCULTURE...the growers, dealers, etc....you are turning your backs on those who helped put that joint in your mouth in the first place

 

[dagnabit]

You are way out of line..get of your holier than thou throne and think about the crap that is spewing from your mouth.

YOU ARE ON A GROWING FORUM, WHERE A SIZABLE PERCENTAGE OF THE POPULATION HERE ARE CASH CROPPERS/BROKERS WHO MAKE A LIVING IN THE CANNABIS TRADE LEGAL OR NOT.

You are delusional if you think theres no abuse going down with medical cards. I know hundreds of people with cards and maybe 5% of them have legit medical reasons...SO THE FUCK WHAT?? people get the cards so that they can avoid prosecution by the law and because its convienient. the government lets us do it, why not? plus i like buying hash and edibles as gifts for my non card having friends..

Im abusing the medical system? hahahahaha are you kidding me? i dont sell to clubs, i dont deal with them. my whole circle stays black market, there a few who do the club thing but that aint for me. what about richard lee?? its OK for him to make money selling MJ because he has cancer and is in a wheelchair..but the rest of us cant?

hahaah i cant believe you are acting so shocked....OMFG im one out of a million dudes who has sold buds...WOOPTY FUCKING DOO. you act like im selling crack to kids, get off your high horse and take a second to realize where the hell you are...ICMAG...a GROWERS forum where at least half the people here make money in the weed trade, from selling seeds to clones to buds

.have a nice day and enjoy your delusional thoughts where you think you are better than all the rest of us making a living in the trade...come drop by the hydro shop or club and tell all of us that we should have cancer for `profitting off the sick` LOL

btw not tripping of the neg rep because i get three positive points for my posts in this thread for every red one you give me....i guess more people agree with me than you.

I DONT GIVE NEG REP SPORT.

and yes you and your ilk keep medicine out of the hands of the sick.

i have no beef with commercial sales....i truly dont understand how you inferred that from my posts.

my point was simple but ill try to make it simpler.

YOU HIDE UNDER THE GUISE OF MEDICAL TO PUT IN WORK BECAUSE YOU ARE A COWARD!
YOUR COWARDICE CAUSES OTHERS IN THIS WORLD TO SUFFER WITHOUT MEDICINE!
BE A FUCKING MAN!!! DONT ABUSE THE MEDICAL SYSTEM. GROW YOUR HERB WITHOUT A MED REC OR A LIC. LEAVE THE MEDICAL FOR FUCKING PATIENTS!
YOU ARE THE BAD EXAMPLE USED TO PREVENT MEDICAL MARIJUANA!!!

was that simple enough?
i grew commercially for years chief and have nooo problem with anyone who does so. im sorry you suffered a public education and they left your reading comprehension skills so lacking as to allow you to glean that nugget from my previous posts.

and the neg rep looks nice... i needed a red dot to offset all that green

 

[nomaad]

That's nonsense. You're judging people for using the means available to them to manage their legal risks. That's really just utter pap. And equating this with "keeping the medicine out of the hands of the sick"? Please. This is a sick sick world and a sick culture and I have rarely seen a toke by ANYONE not help with that sickness. You don't have to bleeding out of your eyes to warrant a medicinal excuse. If it makes your shitty day in a cubicle more manageable, its VALID MEDICINE.

My brother died a slow painful death from AIDS in the days before the "triple cocktail" and AZT... his wasting could have been helped with cannabis... so I understand that there are certain patients in more dire need than Little Joey Dimebag who smokes to put a smile on his face... but that doesn't mean that Joey has no right to the meds. I've made it my mission to ensure that patients like my bro do not go without for any reason... but I also consider my medicine good medicine for just about everything else... from headaches to swollen ankles. From postpartum depression to PMS. Or just to simply help manage the stress from another shitty day in a diseased world.

The judgmental quality of your posts, dagnabit, is completely unwarranted... ecven though your opinions are respectable and worthy of discussion. Again, your passion seems to overtake your reason.

To judge any grower for using a medical rec to legitimize their grow is, again, patently absurd. The reality is that cancer and AIDS patients all over the country benefit from the black market that is being grown under coverage from 215. Granted, the vast majority goes to putting a smile on Joey Dimebag's face, but the vast majority of users are NOT battling cancer, MS or AIDS. But by way of serving the less desperate users, those in the greatest need are served as well.

Are there problems with the system as-is? Sure. Are their hypocrisies involved? Yep, as with everything humans do, there are. But until we have managed to achieve something better, 215 has dramatically increased the availability of high quality cannabis to ALL patients, with needs that range from minor to major.

 

[Yes4Prop215]

haha you crack me up man....you`re lettin ya emotions get the best of you...im not gonna stoop to your level with the 3rd grade name calling....but your point of `growing without a med red` hahah please.....we@re cowards because we like having our cards? im even staying within my plant limits. you a funny guy....come out to oakland and say all that spat to the majority of cash croppers who have their paperwork...the state lets us do it so why not? no need to be a guerilla grower if the state lets you do it with a card. your point makes no sense...theres no news articles out here about people abusing paperwork..they have no way to prove i actually dont need it what are they gonna do storm into my house and prove i dont have a migraine. according to the state im a legit medical user....get off your high horse. i think you are hillarious.

WELL SAID NOMAD!!!!