irrigation line configuration fed by electric pump?

[Swamp Thang]

For the first time ever, I am looking into an off grid semi-automated drip irrigation system, on account of climate change having lowered the water table even in my beloved swamp grow site.

My grow site is right next to a water source that contains a fair bit of particulate and plant matter, so I intend to place a bucket-sized sieve into the water, to clean up the water flow being drawn into the inlet pipe of the car battery powered water pump I ordered from ebay.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/12-volt-DC...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

Due to stealth concerns, I discarded my initial idea of going the whole hog and installing a car battery, trickle-charged by a 12 volt solar panel, and wired through a 12-volt powered timer that would start up the water pump every few hours to fill a plastic drum which would in turn be drained by several pre-drilled pvc drip lines positioned alongside each plant.

I am instead going to keep things simple, by installing only the plastic 55-gallon drum, connected to the perforated PVC drip lines carefully buried out of sight beside each plant. To refill the drum every few days, I would then bring in the pump, along with a couple of 12 volt motorcycle batteries that should be adequate to power the water pump long enough to refill the drum.

Stay tuned. When all this theory translates into action, I'll have some pictures of the crime scene to share.

 

[CrushnYuba]

I have done it with a very small panel and battery and a diaphragm rv pump similar to that north star. I don't think it would stick out much. I found some plans on a homestead website a while back that i copied. I'm sure u can find it. It just used a car battery. U have to go solar. There is no battery that is going to stay charged for months. PERIOD.
Swapping out batteries seems like allot. Lead acid batteries are heavy. U need a decent sized battery to push a pump even one time.

For emitters, i would DEFINITELY use 1/4" poly emitter line. They have it in every 6" and every 12". They are the only lines that really work with gravity and lower pressures.

You have to have emitters. U can't just put holes in pvc and expect it to be uniform. I would also imagine dirt would get in the holes if you bury it and it would get clogged. Why not just buy the line that is meant for the job. It's SUPER cheap and u won't spend hella time with a drill for something that doesn't work very well.

 

[Swamp Thang]

I have done it with a very small panel and battery and a diaphragm rv pump similar to that north star. I don't think it would stick out much. I found some plans on a homestead website a while back that i copied. I'm sure u can find it. It just used a car battery. U have to go solar. There is no battery that is going to stay charged for months. PERIOD.
Swapping out batteries seems like allot. Lead acid batteries are heavy. U need a decent sized battery to push a pump even one time.

For emitters, i would DEFINITELY use 1/4" poly emitter line. They have it in every 6" and every 12". They are the only lines that really work with gravity and lower pressures.

You have to have emitters. U can't just put holes in pvc and expect it to be uniform. I would also imagine dirt would get in the holes if you bury it and it would get clogged. Why not just buy the line that is meant for the job. It's SUPER cheap and u won't spend hella time with a drill for something that doesn't work very well.

Just spotted your reply today, and I thank you for the idea of using drip line emitters instead of drilling the tubing. I see that the emitters are dirt cheap in ebay, so I might get a few, to see how they perform if the water is a little dirty, as it will be out in my grow spot.

 

[CrushnYuba]

I mean emitter line. It's a line that already has emitters in them.
If your water is dirty, filter it. Filters for drip are only like 15$. Get a disc filter, they are better then mesh.

You can do separate emitters but make sure u have the flow and pressure for what you pick. Flag emitters are good for low pressure and if they ever clog, they pull apart to be washed.

 

[Swamp Thang]

I mean emitter line. It's a line that already has emitters in them.
If your water is dirty, filter it. Filters for drip are only like 15$. Get a disc filter, they are better then mesh.

You can do separate emitters but make sure u have the flow and pressure for what you pick. Flag emitters are good for low pressure and if they ever clog, they pull apart to be washed.

The need for filtration has me thinking outside the box now. I might try the idea of installing a piece of fabric, stretched over a circular frame that will be positioned near the top of my water reservoir drum, such that the water pumped in will pass through that fabric as it pours into the drum.

A secondary level of filtration can be added using these inline filters I spotted on ebay, at the outlet of the drum, to further clean the water as it departs the drum via the 1/4 inch tubing that supplies the plants. Looks like I'll have some testing to do, before I take all this gear out to the grow site.

 

[St. Phatty]

I'm a little more pro-active this year.

So can set up water reservoirs slightly uphill from spots that will need water in 6 months.


One of the Challenges - you buy this 100 foot spool of 1/8 inch line.

You have to pour boiling water on it, to heat it up, to get it out of the tightly coiled shape.

Then un wind it somewhere where you got space, and pre-cut the pieces you need.

Then coil it back up so you can carry it to the forest/ swamp grow spot.

 

[Swamp Thang]

Hadn't encountered that flat hose in my ebay browsing, St. Phatty, but this morning I ordered a roll of this tubing and emitters.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-4-in-50-...EV2b&brand=DIG&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851

https://www.ebay.com/itm/100Pcs-Pac...hDarwoV3BBEV2b&_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851


Global warming has pretty much forced me into the irrigation realm, because unlike past years, the swamp water level has dropped so low that it is no longer possible to rely on ground water wicking up into the roots.

Suspended dirt and particle filtration is definitely the biggest challenge I will encounter, because the pump will become fouled at the intake, or the emitters will get blocked at the outlets, if my filtration system is not effective.

I must have a fire-and-forget system going, because now some invaders have taken up residence in the woods not far from the swamp, making daily visits to hand water, as I did in the past, a recipe for discovery by bad people.

I'll be using this pump, running off a 12-volt timer that will make it run for 30 minute stretches every hour, so that the water has time to ooze through the filtration system at the intake. The timer will toggle a relay that powers the pump, so there are quite a few things that can go wrong with this setup.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-12-Volt...120190?hash=item5b8575e5be:g:IVUAAOSwoUBf8dp8

 

[f-e]

I left a submersible on site and took a power tool battery with me. The pump was in a container with the bottom chopped out and meshed. The lid had a 13mm hole in it that my hosepipe fitted through tightly. I used a long stick to get it out into the water a bit, where it sunk between the reeds.

The OP states their pump is 17ah. Pumps are not rated in ah so I guess 17amp. So a 100ah battery can run it about 4 hours (17a for 4 hours is 17x4=68ah)

In these circumstances you probably want to work on balancing a lot, so you can have unrestricted emitters. Any resistance is more battery. My 3Ah drill battery delivered about 400 liters through an easy 35 meters hose.

Do you know how to loop your manifold to put all outlets the same distance from the pump? Thus they all flow the same if at the same height. Thus also makes the systems inlet filter the only place likely to block as everything after it is less restrictive

 

[Swamp Thang]

I left a submersible on site and took a power tool battery with me. The pump was in a container with the bottom chopped out and meshed. The lid had a 13mm hole in it that my hosepipe fitted through tightly. I used a long stick to get it out into the water a bit, where it sunk between the reeds.

The OP states their pump is 17ah. Pumps are not rated in ah so I guess 17amp. So a 100ah battery can run it about 4 hours (17a for 4 hours is 17x4=68ah)

In these circumstances you probably want to work on balancing a lot, so you can have unrestricted emitters. Any resistance is more battery. My 3Ah drill battery delivered about 400 liters through an easy 35 meters hose.

Do you know how to loop your manifold to put all outlets the same distance from the pump? Thus they all flow the same if at the same height. Thus also makes the systems inlet filter the only place likely to block as everything after it is less restrictive

A submersible pump is an absolutely brilliant idea, because it can be hidden much easier than an ordinary water pump, and will also run in complete silence for perfect stealth at the grow site. I had no idea that submersible pumps exist that can be powered by a car battery.

The only submersible pumps I have encountered here, have been heavy power-demanding devices that require mains electricity, and would not operate off a 12 volt battery.

Your post has been very educational, and has set me off on a search for small, DC powered submersible water pumps.

Wow, the exact pump I need has been right under my nose all along

https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-12V-Sub...Energy-Solar-Powered-Submersible/283940174576

 

[f-e]

I used this
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Whale-Cara...705929&hash=item27a25f6dc3:g:tjwAAOxyhlJRe0AQ

12v ~4amp will deliver 15L a minute at 1 meter head. That will fill a 55gallon barrel in 15 minutes using little over an Ah so any 12v power tool battery will do it. That pump can actually push water up a 14 meter high hill before it's exhausted. The pump you linked to uses as much power but can only push up a 5 meter high hill.

That Whale pump might fit in the neck of a feed bottle, but is really to big. You might be better with a $10 one
https://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-High-F...238887?hash=item521e8349e7:g:deIAAOSwNcReMjdj

That can also push up 5 meters. Though you might be waiting a while for your barrel to fill.

These 'caravan' pumps also come as inline versions. They must not be used dry as water is the lube. However they can be summed up by putting them in line. two 5 meter head pumps makes one 10 meter pump. Which is a Bar. What drippers want. I use the inline Whale indoors so I can have a soft silicone hose on the inlet. Drawing from the bottom of my barrel. Keeping the pump away from the walls of the barrel to reduce noise to nothing. While still being a bit strong for drippers, they are compensating for a reason.

Really.. ace pumps that deserve more attention.

edit: my filter housing that contained my pump, used to contain 400g of hot choc.

 

[flylowgethigh]

For the first time ever, I am looking into an off grid semi-automated drip irrigation system, on account of climate change having lowered the water table even in my beloved swamp grow site. snip...

Stay tuned. When all this theory translates into action, I'll have some pictures of the crime scene to share.

This graph is helpful, and BTW, is always "changing", just like the weather.

https://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/soilmst/img/curr.w.mrf1.daily.gif

 

[Swamp Thang]

This graph is helpful, and BTW, is always "changing", just like the weather.

https://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/soilmst/img/curr.w.mrf1.daily.gif

I'm a few time zones removed from the USA at the moment, but the graph does reflect what is happening with global warming everywhere on this planet. Hotter dry seasons, less water, and irrigation becoming a must, rather than the option it used to be.

 

[CrushnYuba]

found those plans.
https://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/WaterPumping/SimpleSolarPump/SimpleSolarPump.htm

I basically coppied that. The materials cost HALF as much as the author paid though. I don't know where they were shopping. That will provide 3 gallons per minute and 45 psi. That's basically what you have in your house and its enough to run a real drip system. A modern 30w panel is TINY.

I used this design twice. 1 time i used it to pump from this pond through filters and really high up a long hill. It was pretty disgusting water. It needed allot of filtration.

I also used it for a drip setup. Pumping out of a storage tank. It's enough pressure to run through whatever filter and whatever emitter you want.

That type of pump has a built in pressure switch so you can use a cheap battery hose/irrigation timer.

Potheads have a desire to rig, mcguyver, and many times over complicate things. It's just something that cannabinoids do to the brain. It spurs creativity. Sometimes it's just too creative. We have to know where to draw the line.

There is no reason not to use a drip system. They are so cheap, easy and they WORK. They sell the stuff at every hardware store.

 

[Swamp Thang]

My hat is off to you CrushnYuba sir, because you have just handed me the motherlode link for construction of a discreet, silent, self-powered and reliable off-grid automatic watering system.

I really like the simplicity of the system in this link, and despite my instinct to experiment with innovative ideas like any other self-respecting stoner, the wheel has already been invented, with respect to this particular concept, and I am going to follow this blueprint to the letter.

Another thing that occurred to me is that the water reservoir needn't be right beside the grow, so it can be hooked up via a buried hosepipe, while hidden 50 yards off in deep thicket, along with the elevated solar panel atop the battery setup that would be covered with a plastic bucket painted in olive-drab colors for good measure.

I am really excited about setting up this system that will enable me to stay away from the grow site for long good long stretches of time. Low-stress, low-key semi-autonomous guerilla growing is the way of the future for me he he.

I'm planting all female clones this year, so there is no reason to frequent the site, once such an ingenious self-watering rig is installed. This bud's fer you sir. I'll write back as the planet spins along its axis, to update on my progress implementing this stealth project out here in the sticks.

 

[St. Phatty]

Yeah man, so tempting, but I’m a little too “on the grid” to comfortably go that route. Though, I could probably pull it off. My plot is buried inside a bush honeysuckle forest, under power lines, which are under a flight path for the airport lol. Not much chance of choppers but I don’t really want to tempt fate.

I’ve been running some calculations on the battery and amp hours required...

a dark color solar cell in the shadows is not easy to see from the air.

of course it will get less sun.

I have a solar panel that is 24 inches square. If I wanted to "stealth" it I would need to paint the aluminum frame.

Of course you need to measure the output when it's in partial sun.

I suggest adding a 1 ohm resistor between the solar panel output and the battery. Then modifying the resistance as the circuit becomes more clear.

My panel outputs about 18 volts - in the sun.

It's POSSIBLE you would need a diode (pointing away from the solar panel) so that current doesn't flow out of the battery back into the solar panel, when the solar panel voltage is below the battery voltage.


As far as the 100 feet of drip line ... I tied one end to a fence, and unwound it. the other end is under a rock.

Haven't rolled it back up. I expect it will be like walking with a Hula hoop, of rolled up irrigation line.


I suggest using something that's not too attention getting to take a look at your grow spot from the air.

A drone, a camera attached to a mylar balloon, etc.

as long as your work doesn't itself attract attention.

 

[f-e]

A look on a solar site shows users get about 10% efficiency here. The link expects 100% for 6 hours. Calculate carefully as if you only want power while on site, then carrying in a Kg of drill battery might make more sense.

I'm back as I found a 15 meter head pump for a tenner and the thing even comes with a 12v psu for home use. I'm astounded
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/400...09#1935_668#2717#7561#355__668#3374#15176#872

Personally I need the stealth of the submersible. I'm also by a receding water source so only need water a few times. Carrying the hosepipe was enough drama.


Edit: Looking at the shurflo it doesn't pump as high or flow as much and it's $120

 

[Swamp Thang]

a dark color solar cell in the shadows is not easy to see from the air.

of course it will get less sun.

I have a solar panel that is 24 inches square. If I wanted to "stealth" it I would need to paint the aluminum frame.

Of course you need to measure the output when it's in partial sun.

I suggest adding a 1 ohm resistor between the solar panel output and the battery. Then modifying the resistance as the circuit becomes more clear.

My panel outputs about 18 volts - in the sun.

It's POSSIBLE you would need a diode (pointing away from the solar panel) so that current doesn't flow out of the battery back into the solar panel, when the solar panel voltage is below the battery voltage.


As far as the 100 feet of drip line ... I tied one end to a fence, and unwound it. the other end is under a rock.

Haven't rolled it back up. I expect it will be like walking with a Hula hoop, of rolled up irrigation line.


I suggest using something that's not too attention getting to take a look at your grow spot from the air.

A drone, a camera attached to a mylar balloon, etc.

as long as your work doesn't itself attract attention.

Just so happens that I recently took some drone shots of my grow spots and the water supply that I intend to pump with a solar powered setup.

My two spots are visible beside the reflective water surface, towards the lower edge of the picture that was carefully edited to protect the innocent.

I'm planning to hide the 55-gallon plastic drum water reservoir, in the thicket near the bamboo stand.

The water surface is about ten feet lower than the grow spots, deep in the tropical jungles

 

[CrushnYuba]

A look on a solar site shows users get about 10% efficiency here. The link expects 100% for 6 hours. Calculate carefully as if you only want power while on site, then carrying in a Kg of drill battery might make more sense.

I'm back as I found a 15 meter head pump for a tenner and the thing even comes with a 12v psu for home use. I'm astounded
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/400...09#1935_668#2717#7561#355__668#3374#15176#872

Personally I need the stealth of the submersible. I'm also by a receding water source so only need water a few times. Carrying the hosepipe was enough drama.


Edit: Looking at the shurflo it doesn't pump as high or flow as much and it's $120

Solar definitely doesn't make sense of you are only watering a couple times of year. but the OP was asking about timers and irrigation

 

[f-e]

Yes we have been back n forth between solar and carrying in m/c batteries. The thread is of general interest (he's not actually the op) so chucking in everything remotely connected is all good information for future readers.

I just picked up a diaphragm pump for a tenner but it's not here yet. They have great pressure ability. I'm yet to use one though. I have a concern regarding the wear and tear nature of them, in regards to the diaphragm being a replaceable soft part and the pumps use of valves. The diaphragm is just waiting to happen, though not in a few months. The pumps I have shown are brushed motors so they to are just waiting to wear out. The diaphragm pump has the added problem that anything at all that makes it through the filter could effect a valves closing or even perforate the diaphragm. Particles that a centrifugal pump would pass. It's in part why I spoke of equal pressure manifolds with open emitters. Making the filter the smallest ingress point is vital, as is everything beyond the filter being able to pass anything that gets through. It is, as you know, how filters are specified. In my pond I have black thorn's that can take out a kevlar bike tyre. A splinter from one being sucked at a blocking filter with 45psi is an issue I thankfully don't have indoors.

I was stoned and drunk, and thank you for not outing my mistake if you noticed. I got lost with my feet and inches. The 45psi pump in the article has 30 meters of head capacity, while my tenner pump has 15 meters. More volume but less head.
10 foot is the requirement, or 3 meters. So a 3 meter head pump would be useless as it couldn't quite get it over the lip of a bucket. A pump that can lift 15 meters will have 12 meters of effort left at that 3 meters delivery height. So should deliver about 75% of it's rated capacity at that height, if no further resistance was added. Such as drippers that need 10 meters of pressure. So filling a barrel, okay. Powering drippers okay unless more than 15% of the pumps volumetric capacity is needed. All based on the cheap ali pump as I don't like leaving too much stuff in the woods. I'm rarely more than 100 foot from a dog walking path in this populated country. I really need a cheap submersible.

This link is too expensive for me to leave out at $50 but is an interesting drip pump. Sub or inline. 3 phase brushless that offers speed control. A bar for good dripper operation (that's 10 meters) and may be quiet at 45db before dropping in a tank.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/327...68#1000022185#1000066058#0_668#3468#15618#970
I'm tied to 12v but the 24v version is 17 meters.
I'm a little concerned about anything like 30 meters. It is mains pressure. I can't keep a hosepipe on a hose barb without a clamp at mains pressure. Garden drip systems generally use barbed connections and as such have a pressure reducing valve on the tap. I should really look on the netafim website but 3 bar sounds like my hoses would pop off. For this reason and the debris issues I wouldn't trust most diaphragm pumps in the pond I use.

 

[CrushnYuba]

Diaphragms will eventually wear out but a name brand diaphragm pump lasts a long time. I think they will outlast most other pumps in that price range or size. You can put allot of hours on them.

You can't pump big chunks of shit through them but why would you want to. The 50$ shurflo i used for those plans came with a filter. I used a another pre filter pumping out of a pond because algae would clog the small one pretty quick pumping every day.

You won't pop Barbed or compression fittings. You would only need a pressure regulator if you were running like 2 emitters. I never needed to reduce pressure. They aren't 45 psi when they are running. They have a pressure switch that shuts them off at 45psi when the valves are closed. Once you shut the valve, it needs to pump for a few seconds to hit 45 and shut off.
When they rate pumps, it's not 3gpm at 45psi. It's 3gpm OR 45psi.
It all depends what you need it for.
Centrifugal pumps are just nowhere near as energy efficient. I don't see any other type of dc pump providing the lift or pressure to push up a decent hill from battery power. Or push through a pressure compensating emitter.
I will use diaphragm pumps for any application requiring under 5gpm