ICMAG Administration endorses The Regulate, Control and Tax Cannabis Act of 2010

[zen_trikester]

You mean this one? https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=3977154&postcount=3452

Jack Herer on California's "Legalize and Tax Marijuana " initiative:

Jack Herer vehemently denounced the attempts by the Cannabusiness community to push for the government taxation and regulation of our Marijuana during his speech at the HempStalk Festival in Oregon (09/12/2009). Unfortunately he suffered a heart attack shortly after delivering what could become his most important speech.

Mr. Herer said the following "I don't want to f**king give the United States government one f**king dollar of taxes. I think that they should go to f**king jail for getting you and me and 20 million people getting arrested for pot. It is the safest thing you can do in the universe. And that is what we are going to do in California. Okay? Come over to my booth, over there, and I will see you next time."

I think he means this one
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=3903320&highlight=%22family+jack+herer%22#post3903320

From the Family of Jack Herer, author of The Emperor Wears No Clothes

Van Nuys, California, August, 2010

Dear Friends of Hemp and Cannabis,

Our father, Jack Herer, was a man of leadership, compassion and idealism. He worked relentlessly for decades to achieve his dream of legalizing Cannabis hemp in all its forms, personal, medical and industrial. He wanted Cannabis to be free and open, and to be given full respect for its enormous economic, environmental and cultural benefits.

As an idealist, Jack was adverse to half measures. He originally opposed Prop 215 because it stopped at medical use only. He initially opposed Senate Bill 420 because it set limited quantities as a safe harbor. Over time, however, he came to appreciate the freedoms they created, and took pride in the role he played in inspiring those changes. Jack’s great fear about Prop 215 and SB 420 was that people would accept those limits, become complacent and stop working for full legalization. He feared we would be stuck with medical use forever.

Likewise, Jack railed against Tax Cannabis 2010, now Proposition 19, and its plan for limited legalization and local authority to tax and regulate marijuana sales to adults 21 and above. It falls far short of what he wanted. Jack ‘wanted it all,’ and Prop 19 is just a part of that dream. Unfortunately, Jack passed away before Prop 19 made the 2010 ballot; so many people think he would still oppose it. We don’t believe that, and we ask that everyone stop saying he would cling to that position as we move toward the Nov. 2 vote.

As his family, we want the world to know that the last thing Jack Herer would want is for Californians to vote to keep Cannabis illegal. He was smart and had the political savvy to know that once a measure is on the ballot, the time for bickering has passed. That is why he campaigned for Prop 215 despite its shortcomings. That is why, were he able, he would now be telling voters to rally around and Vote Yes on Prop 19.

Does that mean he would want everyone to stop and be happy with the modest changes that Prop 19 affords? Absolutely not! What Jack would want us to do right now is to support Prop 19, and come Nov. 3 he would be right back again, telling you to renew your commitment to bring a comprehensive California Hemp and Health Initiative to the voters in 2012 or some future date. Jack Herer would ask – no, he would demand your yes vote on Prop 19, along with a pledge to continue fighting for the plant, the people and the planet.

It is true that Prop 19 does not fulfill our father’s dream; but it takes us much closer to achieving it than we are now, and for that reason we, his family, endorse Prop 19 today.

Please vote yes on Prop 19 Nov 2, but do it with the dedication to keep working toward complete legalization in Jack’s honor.

Sincerely, Dan Herer et al.

Jed

 

[JJScorpio]

The saddest part in all of this is that we provide a platform for people to poke fun and "gloat" when this bill could have helped thousands of people. I don't know how you Gypsy, but there's other sites where people are gloating that the bill failed. It shouldn't happen here. Some have waited decades for this, and I won't have them abused on their home site by trolls....

I did expect this to fail after a conversation I had a couple weeks ago with someone with a great deal of knowlege in this. I was told there could be anywhere between forty and sixty thousand people in the State of California that either make a direct living or supplement their income through selling Cannabis. Now I haven't seen the final tally, but going on the low end, if you take forty thousand votes away from the no and give to the yes, that's a swing of eighty thousand.

So if you're one of the people that voted no, congratulations. You have your continued cash cow. But this site is for legalization. And this site stands for people not being arrested for growing or smoking Cannabis. And if you think for a minute your going to waste bandwidth here gloating and bragging. Think again.

I've learned a lot about the new wave Cannabis culture throughout all of this. And it saddens me. And it's not what this site sets it's values on. When a survey is taken and 70 percent of Californians use Cannabis, yet a Bill to legalize fails, that speaks greatly on why....

Seems to me that the vote was No because of all the over 65 year old voters..(mostly Republicans) who were near their mid-20's during the late 60's and attributed cannabis to 'lazy hippies' since they had grown up being fed all the propaganda such as 'Reefer Madness' e.t.c.....and believed it.....and just went on working for the corporations, and now are sitting pretty-ish on their pensions.....with nothing better to do but trundle off to the voting booth....

....and of course all of the 'lazy' youngsters who are totally complacent to any vote since they might have been too stoned at the time to bother and/or don't really care either way since small cannabis possession is only an 'infraction' now......and those that wish to grow only need to fake back-pain, go to a doctor, pay a coupla hundred bucks....and bingo!......they feel immune to prosecution....and can grow their own anyway....

Then there are the minority 'No' voters.....the cash-croppers....who didn't want this Prop to hit their bottom-line.....and see cannabis drop in value....

...Kinda sad really.....since if Prop 19 had passed it would have given growers and users of cannabis GLOBALLY a lot of hope that within their lifetimes they might see the same happen.....in their neck of the woods....

....since the USA....is the 'whipping boy' where cannabis prohibition is concerned internationally.....well it spends at least $45 Billion a year (and most probably more).....on this drug war bollocks....

 

[Smoke Buddy]

I agree with Gypsies summary. A couple weeks ago the anti 19 peeps started constantly running an ad that said if you vote yes people will legally be able to show up to work high on marijuana and there is nothing the employer can do about it until an accident occurs... this was effective as hell... They can legally show up to work stoned... that scared alot of people into a no position. I think it was bullshit but thats what they did and it was extremely effective at demonizing the prop. My sense here is that the effect of the grower community vote was not significant compared to everyday people who dont smoke weed who were scared into a no position when they very well may have voted yes otherwise. After all the numbers of growers is miniscule compared with non growers.

 

[rick shaw]

It came down to voter apathy 7,063,391 total votes 10:40 pst. In the very important Attorney General race Kamala Harris leads 45.9% to 45.6% 3,275,606 to 3,253,307 District 11:US House Jerry McNerny won by 121 votes. The biggest group of voters in America is the AARP

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

low turn out for sure

low turn out for sure

It came down to voter apathy 7,063,391 total votes 10:40 pst. In the very important Attorney General race Kamala Harris leads 45.9% to 45.6% 3,275,606 to 3,253,307 District 11:US House Jerry McNerny won by 121 votes. The biggest group of voters in America is the AARP

And to blame to 'growers against 19' for 19 failing is not accurate IMO.

To begin with, 19 was fatally flawed. Tom Ammiano had to basically revise major parts of the bill to acknowledge this fact. This revision fixed many of the claims that 19 was poorly written (because it really was). But this revision was not guaranteed to be approved so we may have been stuck with a bill that is widely accepted to be poorly written. This revision requires 2/3 to be included, and many think Tom knew he could get it, but that is not for certain.

Those 80,000 potential votes alluded to by jj would not change the outcome here. I would point fingers towards the misinformation campaign funded by non-growers against 19. Old people voted against it, and you can't blame them, they were bombarded with misinformation, same with the no on 19 growers. You can hate the straight up greedy growers who fear competition, but can't blame them for 19 failure. They are just bomba-clats, and the others are misinformed.

 

[gaiusmarius]

sad news indeed, i wonder if this was an honest vote and count? seems a rather wide margin considering the general support 19 enjoyed. i can't imagine the few industry insiders who were against this could make a difference. that is, if it was honest? seems more to do with complacency by many stoners who just assumed it would win. but in the end one has to realize that there were very powerful interests that were/are vehemently against this prop and these have stolen presidential elections before, so whats to say they didn't manipulate this vote either? but even if it was the commerce growers that turned the tide, they did have some valid points. furthermore that would mean a decent prop would have a great chance to pass with their support. it just has to promote an even playing field or forget the commercial side and just legalize use and personal growing? but i know from my country when we had a referendum about legalizing cannabis use and it got defeated everyone said it was the end and that it would be 10 years before we got another chance, but not a year later there is a new effort underway written to take into account what some complained about last time. it's not the end of the world, the next step will be made and sooner or later cannabis will be legal, the days of prohibition of cannabis are numbered, too many professionals all over the world, in the fields of medicine and law enforcement have come to see the harmful nature of the war on drugs in general and on cannabis specially. politicians are seeing it and the general public is beginning to understand it too, but these things take time. specially when the young are not bothering to go and vote.

 

[localhero]

Originally Posted by localhero
lets hope for a better prop 2012. this is now an image campaign to combat what will be deemed a referendum on pot.

it needs to be known 19 went down because it was a poorly written proposition that did not clearly define taxation guidelines/commercial licensing guidelines, nor did it offer up substantial gains for marijuana freedoms. 25 square ft didn't win an applause from the community.

I believe a proposition that decriminalized possession of marijuana universally for those over 21, allowed up to half an acre for outdoor cultivation (no commercial wording), 100sf min indoor, and set a 10% sin tax on sales, no extra ways to fine or incarcerate, no hidden commercial agenda, no dry counties... something like that wouldn't split the community and would pass with flying colors.

on a brighter side, whitman lost

You are joking right? So anyone and everyone could grow 1/2 acre? Based on 5x5 per plant that is 820 plants! Right situation and the right grower that is 800+ lbs! If it is unregulated who is going to pay the sin tax? Does this stop gang/cartel violence? Does this provide jobs, and income for the state? Does this keep weed out of the hands of kids? Does this provide a level of job security for current growers?Does this stop gang/cartel violence? Who wants this? Prices would go to shit and pot dealers would be all over the street. Never in a million years my friend! Not even cash croppers want something like this, only wanna-be's that haven't thought things through or have no idea how an economy works.
Jed

You are joking right?

no

So anyone and everyone could grow 1/2 acre?

yes

Right situation and the right grower that is 800+ lbs!

hell yeah! but 800 would be a pretty far stretch

If it is unregulated who is going to pay the sin tax?

whoever buys it from a store front, i dont see how that isnt "regulation"

Does this provide jobs, and income for the state?

tons, alot more than 19 and its dry counties, ever try to harvest or care for 800lbs of weed by yourself?

Does this keep weed out of the hands of kids?

yes, you must be over 21.

Does this provide a level of job security for current growers?

absolutely, all grows INCLUDING COMMERCIAL may not be larger than 1/2 acre. this levels the playing field for everyone, excludes no one.

Does this stop gang/cartel violence?

if they grow more than 1/2 an acre- yes

Who wants this?

I DO, far better than 19 by leaps and bounds.


and to the person who said a stated tax guideline would get shot down by the feds- says who? if they want to challenge a legalization law then they will with or without a clearly defined tax guideline. something like 8% written in black and white would be very easy to make bold statements for tax gains in campaign advertising. focus on tax revenues in your ads and you will win over the undecided and older crowd.

Gypsy- i was reading the measure lost on all demographics, not just old people. my take is that 19 didnt excite the people the way 215 did. that lack of enthusiasm was in large part to the proposition not meeting public expectations for a measure claiming to be legalization. one ounce- arnold just gave that to us. 5x5- really?

 

[Santa Claus]

Ho Ho Ho!

Ho Ho Ho!

Hello Boys and Girls..

Time to Remind you that Family and Friend makes the difference in sad and gloomy times.
Take heart and share a hot cup of apple cider on a cold night with those you love and make peace where there has been war in your community. 2012 is not far away and perhaps what Richard Lee said last night about having something going in January must mean he has joined forces with Tom Ammiano and will be working to pass AB 2254. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marijuana_Control,_Regulation,_and_Education_Act

Peace and Joy will fill the world one day but until then we must all practice compassion and heal the wounds this fight over prop 19 has created.

OH WELL.. Be Jolly! Happy Holidays are Coming!

There are 52 days until Saturday, 25 December 2010.
Tis the Season to be Jolly!



Ho Ho Ho! Things will get better!

At Least you Californians have Jerry and not Meg. I wondered why one would pay $150 million to get a $250,00 a year job.

Be Well and Give the Gift of Love this Holiday Season and special Cookies.

 

[binaryfission]

It came down to voter apathy 7,063,391 total votes 10:40 pst. In the very important Attorney General race Kamala Harris leads 45.9% to 45.6% 3,275,606 to 3,253,307 District 11:US House Jerry McNerny won by 121 votes. The biggest group of voters in America is the AARP

isn't it all ways. 8 million is what percentage of ELIGIBLE voters??

17.2 million registered out of a possible 23.5 eligible
http://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/ror/ror-pages/15day-gen-10/
from a quick google search.

Sad.

 

[zen_trikester]

Originally Posted by localhero
lets hope for a better prop 2012. this is now an image campaign to combat what will be deemed a referendum on pot.

on a brighter side, whitman lost

no

yes

hell yeah! but 800 would be a pretty far stretch

whoever buys it from a store front, i dont see how that isnt "regulation"

tons, alot more than 19 and its dry counties, ever try to harvest or care for 800lbs of weed by yourself?

yes, you must be over 21.

absolutely, all grows INCLUDING COMMERCIAL may not be larger than 1/2 acre. this levels the playing field for everyone, excludes no one.

if they grow more than 1/2 an acre- yes

I DO, far better than 19 by leaps and bounds.


and to the person who said a stated tax guideline would get shot down by the feds- says who? if they want to challenge a legalization law then they will with or without a clearly defined tax guideline. something like 8% written in black and white would be very easy to make bold statements for tax gains in campaign advertising. focus on tax revenues in your ads and you will win over the undecided and older crowd.

Gypsy- i was reading the measure lost on all demographics, not just old people. my take is that 19 didnt excite the people the way 215 did. that lack of enthusiasm was in large part to the proposition not meeting public expectations for a measure claiming to be legalization. one ounce- arnold just gave that to us. 5x5- really?

no time to line by line ya LH... though you know I want to! You said no commercial language so no storefronts unless simply anyone could sell it! Again a certain no-go. all these acres of weed would be on the street and in the schools and you know it. the only reason our kids aren't buying quarts of shine from the kid with the locker next door is because it is regulated and controlled. Child use is a big issue with a lot of users and almost all non-users as is street dealing. Your idea promotes the two of them instead of discouraging it.

as for the state tx guidelines, there was something about how that would make it the feds vs the state instead of the feds vs the people of the state. I never really took the time to fully wrap my head around that one though so I am unsure and have every intention of remaining that way!



jed

 

[localhero]

zen you got me on commercial, i meant no commercial growing limitations or allowances other than the universal 1/2 acre.

store fronts, yeah it would be like liquor. i would imitate exactly what the state implemented for alcohol sales post prohibition era and slap that on mj sales. no dry counties. i think dag hates the idea of no dry counties, but if your community doesnt want a mj store, then dont patronize it and it will go away.

 

[Anti]

I did expect this to fail after a conversation I had a couple weeks ago with someone with a great deal of knowlege in this. I was told there could be anywhere between forty and sixty thousand people in the State of California that either make a direct living or supplement their income through selling Cannabis. Now I haven't seen the final tally, but going on the low end, if you take forty thousand votes away from the no and give to the yes, that's a swing of eighty thousand.

Not to mention this thing lost by 500,000 votes. If each of those 40,000 growers have a spouse and a few extended family members (parents, siblings, grandparents, etc.) then there's most of your 500,000 votes right there.

I sure hope something can be passed in 2012. It's going to take a lot of CONTINUING EFFORT to even have a chance... starting TODAY.

 

[JJScorpio]

Not to mention this thing lost by 500,000 votes. If each of those 40,000 growers have a spouse and a few extended family members (parents, siblings, grandparents, etc.) then there's most of your 500,000 votes right there.

I sure hope something can be passed in 2012. It's going to take a lot of CONTINUING EFFORT to even have a chance... starting TODAY.

The problem there, is it may not matter. If the mid term elections were an indicator then we may very well have a Republican voted in as Pres in 2012. Then the disp raids will resume in full force. Also, if this bill had passed, and Holder held true to his word and arrested growers this would end up in Federal Court. That has to happen regardless for there to be true legalization. That's where the big change could have occured. Now, we'll never know.....

I don't think you'll see anyone else waste their money bringing another initiative forward for quite a few years. The rich don't like to toss away their money. And two years isn't going to make that big of difference.

As for how many growers voted no, we'll never know. If this sites any indicator there could be a hundred thousand people in Cali turning over money. And that number is only going to climb.

I'm just curious to see what if anything Cali is going to do to get their paws into these billions of dollars. Someday, everyone may look back and wish they'd have voted this in. Sometimes you have to be careful what you wish for......

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

If at first you do not succeed...

If at first you do not succeed...

For anyone who hates Richard Lee and at the same time supported 19... he spent all of the money from his various endeavors funding 19 and is not giving up. I think all we can do is try again.

Oakland marijuana entrepreneur Richard Lee said today that his bankroll is depleted and the next California pot legalization measure may have to depend on other donors.

But in an interview, Lee said he is determined that marijuana will be on the California ballot again in 2012 despite the defeat of Proposition 19.

Lee, who founded Oakland's renowned pot trades school, Oaksterdam University, and heads a network including a medical marijuana dispensary, nursery and media company, donated $1.3 million to qualify Proposition 19 for the ballot and another $200,000 to the election campaign.

http://blogs.sacbee.com/weed-wars/2010/11/oakland-pot-entrepreneur-vows-new-california-marijuana-vote.html#ixzz14GRkm6Mq

 

[igrowone]

For anyone who hates Richard Lee and at the same time supported 19... he spent all of the money from his various endeavors funding 19 and is not giving up. I think all we can do is try again.



http://blogs.sacbee.com/weed-wars/2...-california-marijuana-vote.html#ixzz14GRkm6Mq

that he's ready to bankroll again is a positive, but i think we learned that a 1 person face doesn't work well for publicity
if he could be part of a group of some sort, that might be for the better

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

true that

true that

that he's ready to bankroll again is a positive, but i think we learned that a 1 person face doesn't work well for publicity
if he could be part of a group of some sort, that might be for the better

yeah, he needs to fund from behind the scenes. i think the public is looking for someone else to be the leader here.

but if he keeps putting his money into legalization i have a hard time hating the guy.

berkeley and oakland are going forward like 19 passed with commercial production... that should prove interesting considering the potential GOP whitehouse in 2012.

and shit didn't go in Oregon either, effing lame.

"Oregon marijuana proponents had their sights set on two fronts Tuesday – and most were disappointed on both.

Ballot Measure 74, which would have greatly expanded Oregon’s medical marijuana program, appeared late Tuesday night to be on its way to a solid defeat that a few months ago some thought unlikely. With over one million votes counted statewide, the measure was on the short end of a 58 percent to 42 percent tally. Multnomah County was the only county in the state to vote in favor of the measure.

Measure 74 would have allowed privately run marijuana dispensaries to sell cannabis to medical marijuana cardholders across the state. It also would have allowed for-profit state-licensed marijuana growers to supply those dispensaries.

Nearly as important to the marijuana movement was the apparent defeat Tuesday of California’s Proposition 19, which would have more dramatically remade the national marijuana landscape if it had passed. Proposition 19 would have fully legalized marijuana for adults, making California the first state to do so.

California led the way with the country’s first medical marijuana program in 1996 and Oregon followed California’s lead in establishing its medical marijuana program two years later. Oregon marijuana advocates had talked, prior to Tuesday night, of a possible 2012 legalization measure in this state if California’s Proposition 19 had passed.

Tuesday night, those advocates weren’t quite so certain what the future might bring. Anthony Johnson, co-author of Measure 74, said that the tea party climate of this year’s election was a factor in 74’s defeat.

“In a political climate like that it’s tough for a marijuana reform measure,” Johnson said

http://portlandtribune.com/news/story.php?story_id=128878793635571300

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

here goes Berkeley not giving a damn about 19 failing

"Though Californians rejected Proposition 19, Berkeley voters approved an unprecedented expansion of the city's medical marijuana industry last night, making Berkeley one of a handful of cities in the state to tax and license cultivation facilities.

Measures S and T also allowed the city council to tax and permit a fourth dispensary and reconstitute the city's Medical Marijuana Commission.

Measure S, which levied the 2.5 percent tax, has consistently been controversial in the city, with some industry representatives arguing that the business license tax - which is applied to all city businesses - is more than enough and expressing concern that the tax will be passed on to patients through higher costs."

http://www.dailycal.org/article/111047/measures_s_t_expand_medical_marijuana_in_city

 

[SCF]

here goes Berkeley not giving a damn about 19 failing



http://www.dailycal.org/article/111047/measures_s_t_expand_medical_marijuana_in_city

Berkley Patient Group is one of my Favorite Co-ops to visit. They carry a lot of great strains, or use to, from very very good reliable vender's. And only kept the same vender's, about 2 or 3 forever! knowing they can trust them...

Their product was wonderful too. But most of all the environment. They had a library where you could check out books, and bring it back whenever, also Volcano's on every table. Very sociable, and also gave out educational classes almost nightly! Now thats a medical Compassionate caregiver if i had ever seen one!

 

[Thomkal Vwalaa]

BPG

BPG

Berkley Patient Group is one of my Favorite Co-ops to visit. They carry a lot of great strains, or use to, from very very good reliable vender's. And only kept the same vender's, about 2 or 3 forever! knowing they can trust them...

Their product was wonderful too. But most of all the environment. They had a library where you could check out books, and bring it back whenever, also Volcano's on every table. Very sociable, and also gave out educational classes almost nightly! Now thats a medical Compassionate caregiver if i had ever seen one!

Yeah, that's my favorite down in Berkeley. Very of/for the people vibe. Those bottled drinks are pretty cool. They offered me an interview for the counter, but I wasn't trying to commute, plus I got gardening to do

But the buds, and of equal importance the concentrates, are better at a certain "organic only" spot up in the north bay IMO.

 

[Maria_Vanessa]

This is why I stayed away from the site for a day because I knew there were going to be alot of sore winners.