How long does it take for a dry amendment top dressing into soil to ACTUALLY start working?

[ninox33]

90L fabric pot outdoors, 3+m Thai hybrid. A 2cm thick dressing of dry amendments and castings under the mulch completely consumed in less than a week. Every week I redo and all I find under the mulch is solid earth and dense fine roots. In the right situation it’s like feeding a hungry child.
I’ve never fed a plant, just feed your soil, keep up the water and magic happens.
PS. Pot in 3rd season, untouched except for amendments, this year green manure over winter.

 

[PadawanWarrior]

That was a fade. Some GDP genetics.
That was my last soil grow. My current grow is in coco.

And i disagree dude, guanos are immediate. Bat guano anyways. At the most it takes about a day and a half, not that far behind chemicals seabird is pretty fast too

But its not something im gonna stand on a hill and argue over. I never let my plants get that bad to where they need it immediately

What you call a fade I call phosphorus deficiency. Funny how it's the only plant that faded huh, lol. I'm not against the fade though as long as it's only at the very end of flower.

I don't know where you got the idea that guanos are immediately available. Probably from someone at a grow shop. . Your plants look nice though.

 

[iStruggle]

What you call a fade I call phosphorus deficiency. Funny how it's the only plant that faded huh, lol. I'm not against the fade though as long as it's only at the very end of flower.

I don't know where you got the idea that guanos are immediately available. Probably from someone at a grow shop. . Your plants look nice though.

I know what a phosphorus deficiency looks like lol

Are you one of those guys who force feeds a plant even tho it cant adequately metabolize it? Do you fight lactose intolerance by drinking more milk?

Have you ever grown something with color lol?

Also, tell me Mr Cervantes, what makes nutrients available to plants, and wtf do you think happens when a bat or seagull digests food?

 

[PadawanWarrior]

wtf do you think happens when a bat or seagull digests food?

 

[iStruggle]

View attachment 19020471

is your mom or dad home?
Do you understand what happens inside your tummy after you eat food?

 

[linde]

I guess in the end everybody wipes their ass differently. Whatever works for youself. I've personally found too many pitfalls with Indoor organic growing. Each to their own. Carry on.....

 

[iStruggle]

I guess in the end everybody wipes their ass differently. Whatever works for youself. I've personally found too many pitfalls with Indoor organic growing. Each to their own. Carry on.....

Well that was quite a change

 

[PadawanWarrior]

is your mom or dad home?
Do you understand what happens inside your tummy after you eat food?

I do now. Thanks.

 

[iStruggle]

*Clicks on chat GPT*

“Can you tell me what happens to the bagel bite in my belly after i chew it”

 

[mudballs]

...shoulda asked it about how long top dressing takes to work

 

[iStruggle]

Me?

...shoulda asked it about how long top dressing takes to work

 

[mudballs]

But that hogan gif was fkn lit lol

 

[iStruggle]

But that hogan gif was fkn lit lol

Depends on what youre top dressing

 

[Hiddenjems]

The best end product doesn’t always come from the happiest looking plants.

I have a cut that I ran in my buddies super soil in the same room as one of my tables. It stayed green almost the whole time and had smaller looser buds than my hydro plants with burnt tips right next to them.

If you run the plants all the way out there is no “nutrient taste” to them no matter what medium you use. Flushing is an attempt to get plants all the way done sooner. When the plants are finished they stop up taking nutrients anyway.

 

[Disso]

Much appreciated and a big thanks for all the replies! I don't grow very large plants as I still am trying to simply learn how to reliably keep a plant perfectly healthy for the entire cycle and still clearly have a long way to go!!

And the soil is incredibly expensive, ranging from $30 to $35 tax in depending how far I drive and buy it from, for a mere 7 gallons which usually seems like it runs on the small side overall - so just to get somewhere around a 15 gallon pot size I'd be at $60+ in just the media alone! And that media will likely still run out and need a ton of stuff along the way, so I didn't want to mess with those sizes until I know what I'm doing

Very unfortunate, I would've been happiest around the cost of a single bag of the media since that's already very expensive to screw up at $30 for 7 gallons



I don't know I thought I was supposed to! I bought a big bag of Gaia Green 4-4-4 and 2-8-4 but they are dry and very annoying to work with (tons of messy stinky dust)

What do you recommend instead?

As far as costs go;
You may want to consider making the soil yourself. I would recommend Clackamas Coot's soil mix, you can find a guide through Buildasoil or KIS Organics which both base their soil mixes off Coot's original recipe.
Obviously a bit of extra work to DIY but will definitely save you some money.
The most cost efficient way tends to be, source the amendments online finding a balance of price vs quality, then go buy bulk ingredients like peat, aeration of choice, and compost/castings locally, and mix it yourself on a tarp etc. A compost tumbler or large cement mixer will save you effort if you have one.

Water only organic soil is kind of expensive upfront, but if you know how to properly reamend and recycle batches of soil, the cost comes WAY down and it actually becomes pretty economical. You can do this with either research and trial/error, and if you want to guarantee results and take the guessing out, get a professional soil test done after 5 cycles or so. A good starting point is to reamend at about 1/2 to 1/3 of soil building rates.

I won't mention it again, but I would seriously implore you to ditch the small pots mentality that comes from synthetic/liquid nutrient growers. I can't emphasize enough how you are fighting a serious uphill battle doing that. You say you don't want to go bigger until you know what you're doing, but I think it will be a long arduous journey to get results that satisfy that in small pots..
You're placing a big limitation on your success and then saying, 'I won't give myself a better chance until I find success with this low percentage approach'. Will that ever happen? I'm not so sure... Almost every water only organic grow I see that looks rough is in small pots.. in larger pots its pretty easy to get good results.

And no, if you have a large soil volume, you have both a much bigger margin for error, and should not need to topdress anywhere near as much.

 

[Hiddenjems]

As far as costs go;
You may want to consider making the soil yourself. I would recommend Clackamas Coot's soil mix, you can find a guide through Buildasoil or KIS Organics which both base their soil mixes off Coot's original recipe.
Obviously a bit of extra work to DIY but will definitely save you some money.
The most cost efficient way tends to be, source the amendments online finding a balance of price vs quality, then go buy bulk ingredients like peat, aeration of choice, and compost/castings locally, and mix it yourself on a tarp etc. A compost tumbler or large cement mixer will save you effort if you have one.

Water only organic soil is kind of expensive upfront, but if you know how to properly reamend and recycle batches of soil, the cost comes WAY down and it actually becomes pretty economical. You can do this with either research and trial/error, and if you want to guarantee results and take the guessing out, get a professional soil test done after 5 cycles or so. A good starting point is to reamend at about 1/2 to 1/3 of soil building rates.

I won't mention it again, but I would seriously implore you to ditch the small pots mentality that comes from synthetic/liquid nutrient growers. I can't emphasize enough how you are fighting a serious uphill battle doing that. You say you don't want to go bigger until you know what you're doing, but I think it will be a long arduous journey to get results that satisfy that in small pots..
You're placing a big limitation on your success and then saying, 'I won't give myself a better chance until I find success with this low percentage approach'. Will that ever happen? I'm not so sure... Almost every water only organic grow I see that looks rough is in small pots.. in larger pots its pretty easy to get good results.

And no, if you have a large soil volume, you have both a much bigger margin for error, and should not need to topdress anywhere near as much.

I’m curious as to your cost. Using pro grade non cannabis salts I average under $20 a lb of dried flower in nutes.

Honest question. I always hear organic is more expensive, but I’d like to know exactly how much.

 

[iStruggle]

I’m curious as to your cost. Using pro grade non cannabis salts I average under $20 a lb of dried flower in nutes.

Honest question. I always hear organic is more expensive, but I’d like to know exactly how much.

Ive spent about $200 total on dry amendments and theyve lasted me for like 3 years, and i have about 2 more left in them. But i do alternate coco and soil runs

Im gonna tell you that if youre chasing OMRI labels youre gonna pay quite a bit more. I dont think promix is technically organic.

Liquid organic nutrients are an absolute money pit tho.

-Edit-

Probably closer to $300 because i did get into the more soluble roots organic stuff last year

 

[Disso]

I’m curious as to your cost. Using pro grade non cannabis salts I average under $20 a lb of dried flower in nutes.

Honest question. I always hear organic is more expensive, but I’d like to know exactly how much.

It's a little hard for me to give an exact answer in terms of my cost in the same way you have, because its harder to track with precision over the course of multiple cycles, and many inputs etc. I'll do my best.
Also, here's an article from KIS Organics on exactly this matter which you'll probably find quite insightful. https://www.kisorganics.com/blogs/news/a-cost-analysis-of-kis-organics-soil-over-a-3-year-period

A lot can change cost wise depending on location and local availability. When you start shipping heavy organic inputs across the world, the price skyrockets compared to organic inputs that can be sourced locally. They tend to be a lot larger and heavier than an equivalent amount of liquid based nutrients, so shipping costs can be exaggerated.
Not everyone is using the same soil either, or the same amendments, or making it themselves and adapting the recipe to local availability, and so these differences can account for a lot of discrepancies that aren't covered when people just say 'organic'. You also pay for convenience as with every other industry.
Some people haven't really figured out the reamending/recycling part of organic soil growing either, so if you're buying fresh bags of premade soil every single grow like some people, its gonna be expensive.

A lot of people get hooked into the marketing and buy all the extras products. Now some of these products are really good, but generally speaking, you can get top notch results with just good soil, tap water, and a healthy dash of love. Getting the soil, watering, environment, and lighting right is of 95% plus of the battle.
In my opinion, using one or two of the best extras sparingly, like a quality microbe complex can be worthwhile, but a lot of people get caught up in ALL the extras and fancy new brands/labels/products, instead of focusing on improving their grow skills which would raise the ceiling on their grows (metaphorically speaking) much more than any product could. Its just general consumerism bleeding into the grow world. New iPhone every year type shit. That sort of stuff really pushes up the overall costs.

Before I moved to the water only organic soil, I mostly grew with the Canna Terra liquid nutrient line. I know Canna is not the cheapest brand, but compared to my relatively low cost approach to organic water only soil growing, I'm pretty sure I was spending more with the liquid nutes. This is looking at things over the course of a few cycles recycling soil, and I've gone to quite an effort to reduce costs by DIYing soil, adapting to local availability, selecting cheaper amendments/sources without sacrificing quality, recycling soil etc.

 

[ice minus]

Wait he didn't answer the question on what to feed them though!!

Secondly, if a plant is In need because I screwed up and top dressing takes 2 weeks to work, should I top dress PLUS use Botanicare liquid for a week+ or so before transitioning back to water?

Can I "stack" ?

 

[Lester Beans]

Sure a dose of Botanicare would greatly help while your soil processes the dry amendments.