How do i stabilize my own first cross?

[nycdfan042]

Months back i experimented for my first time with breeding. My cozy closet provided a decent place for me to attempt my first breeding project. I tried to find a female with within 5 seeds of THseeds bubblegum and all i got were 5 nice males. I chose the nicest bubblegum male and decided to pair him with a beautiful serious seeds Kali Mist female (i got great female to male ration with the kali mist out of 8 seeds 4 were female). I pollinated all four kali mist females and got a crap load of seed. I also crossed some other plants with that THSeeds pollen, but the strains are not as excellent a quality as the ones mentioned above, so im only concentrating on this cross. Im calling it califorenia bubble mist, and hopefully gypsy willl receive the seeds i sent him soon only to give them away on his site

My question is very basic and str8 to the point: How do i stabilize this first time cross ive made? Ive recenly cracked 7 of these seeds and i hope to find some good specimens, im very excited to see what i find and how much variation there is...i will be updating this thread with my findings

 

[nycdfan042]

34 views and not a single reply...dood this is pretty weak any link info anything?

 

[Guest]

Breeding for Beginners
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=26677

That should help, also try the chat people are on now http://www.icmag.com/ic/chat/chat3.php

 

[Azra3l]

Hi,



First thing, don't think about stabilization with your F1. F1 generation is an hybrid which will be relatively homogenous if the characters you're working on are homozygous within the parents...
You've got to make your selection on your F2 which will show the recombination of parental phenotypes. Then you will select your parents within the F2 and begin to cross inbred until you stabilize it.


And you will need at least 4generations before it begin to stabilize and remember that:
-fixation of characters come through the repetition (the longer, the better ;-) )
-you've got to keep the parents (at least 2pairs of each generation) to make a back-cross in case the following generation lack vigor



Stabilization is a long way to take


post-scriptum: Errr, 7 is a bit low to make a correct selection. Just throw something like forty seeds and keep the 20 more vigorous germs


Cheers

 

[nycdfan042]

but are the pros/cons of f1 seeds? i have just recently cracked 6 of them so ill soon know...
thanks you very much for your information azra

 

[Azra3l]

Let's illustrate it with a picture:

As you see a F1 generation will be:
-relatively homogenous
-a combination of the parental phenotypes
and will have an hybrid vigor

But if you wanna reproduce it you must keep your parents because at the first cross in your F1 generation, you will get an heterogenous generation with the recombination of every phenotypes...

 

[The Dopest]

i like pictures can we have some more please?

thanks

 

[ft100]

so do you keep f1, f2, f3, f4 parents because you want to back cross to them to stabilize? or do you stabilize what traits you want by growing out generations and generations of seeds just selecting the plants that have the characteristics you like?

 

[Azra3l]

You stabilize through the generation by selecting the parents showing the most desirable traits. But you must allways keep your parents because along the path you can loose some valuable characters or vigor. And then you must back cross to re-establish these traits


++

 

[ft100]

so once you have grown the seeds out and seen good vigor and selected two more good parents can you trash the old parents? at what point do you get rid of the earlier parents is what I am asking i guess? do you just save pollen and a mother plant for just breeding and label them accordingly?

 

[Closet Funk]

It's a good idea to save some F1 seeds to backcross to later on down the road.

 

[nycdfan042]

sadly the parents are long gone, i do not have the room to have 3 stages(clone,veg,bloom) i currently only have room for two areas of growth. I will soon be moving and i will do more extensive work with these seeds and start all over with the f1's(im sure ill find some nice specimens).
wow azra thank you so much i fell asleep this morning i cant stay up late like i used to!

azra thanks so much you really brought some chrystaline clarity to the subject you make a great teacher! the visual aid was awesome and i saved it in my archives! thanks so much your truly what this site is about.

CF: i got you covered dood

 

[Closet Funk]

CF: i got you covered dood

Right on! :wink:

 

[TheBudWhisperer]

I too saved the diagram, very nice. Does that diagram show the breeding of 2 stablized (or landrace) strains? Would the first offspring of two unstabilized strains produce a wider variety of phenotypes than shown in the diagram?

 

[Brastaman]

hey nycdfan042,

How about that thseeds bubblegum strain? I had some seeds of this stuff but there was too much variety in the phenotypes. Six females out of ten and each one was different! I wonder if it is a stable enough strain to breed with? Hopefully your male is holding up his side of the bargain.

Pardon me to get off topic.

 

[Tomatoesonly]

How is this breeding effected when someone uses ST (silver thiosulfate) to create seeds?

 

[nycdfan042]

Thebudswhipsere( haha cool name!)

brastaman: i only was able to get a male out of my pack, culled first 5 for security reasons and last five were all males and looked relatively the same in size and leaf serration and shape so i hope they do in fact have some stable characteristics. At 50 GBP those thseeds seeds better be stable!!!!!!!!

Tomato: im not familiar with ST but im it sounds toxic and generally unhealthy

 

[Azra3l]

Hi,

After the recombination and obtention of the dreamed phenotype, you can use selfing to stabilize your plants by using chemicals (for example GA3). But for purpose of true breeding, I really don't like the idea:
-don't fuck up with nature, she will get his revenge
-you obtain only female which will be a dead-end
-and if your genotype is not homozygous for the traits you're aiming, it still won't be an homogenous generation

But if in a hurry, it can work but after...



+++

 

[nycdfan042]

thanks azra ill be loooking forward to my next project. this time ill keep the parents and be alittle more professional about it next time rather than pollen chucking

 

[moonymonkey]

found his thread intresting after reading this post http://www.planetganja.com/highsociety/showthread.php?t=5145 cuz it says bachcrossing after 3-4 generations to parents cud lead to dead end,if traits,fall the wrong way,as fr as dominat and rcessive go? im a little confused and dont know better? moon/xxxx