Heart Attack Proof...

[toughmudderdave]

Oh...And another thing I might add. When I was eating a diet high in animal protein, saturated fat, low fiber, I was also on blood pressure medication and cholesterol medication. In 3 months time, by simply changing my diet, I was completely taken off meds.

I still ate meat. I still ate carbohydrates. I restricted my saturated fats and dramatically reduced simple carbohydrates (sugar).

 

[Rukind]

Oh...And another thing I might add. When I was eating a diet high in animal protein, saturated fat, low fiber, I was also on blood pressure medication and cholesterol medication. In 3 months time, by simply changing my diet, I was completely taken off meds.

I still ate meat. I still ate carbohydrates. I restricted my saturated fats and dramatically reduced simple carbohydrates (sugar).

I am honestly curious what you diet was like when you was eating a lot of fat and protein.

I would like to see how its different than mine.

I dont eat a lot of protein reallly.. i keep my fat ratio above 60 percent.

did you eat any oils, if so what kind? did you eat any carbs? how many carbs did you eat?

I would like to know this for my own health.

 

[Aksala]

the evidence is there.. u just got to drop the ego and look.

The irony in this post just broke all modern day records...

 

[nukklehead]

Ok guess I fueled the fire a while back introducing genetic background ( not that it wasnt already there) .. I work in a cardiac cath lab and if you boys dont stop fighting I will stick a stent into everyone of your RCA's , LAD's, circs, and Left mains. I do it every day. And if you dont like that I will stick a pacemaker/defibrillator in your R chest and run the leads to your pericardiums. Hell if I cant get thru the front door and you have a CTO ( chronic total occlusion) I will run my wires both ways and KISS my stents if I can open you up. If not .. guess your screwed. I try to question my patients as able to come up with my own anecdotal research. The research has shown diet has a small amount to do with it... but in the end.. Its GENETICS that rules.
So.. what yo mama and dada had .. you will have to.... if you follow a bad lifestyle it will come sooner,,, if you have a good lifestyle it will come later... thats the bottom line... can we be friends now???:friends:

For those unfamiliar with anatomy RCA= Right coronary artery LAD= Left anterior descending artery Circ= Circumflex artery. Lets not forget the left Main AKA The Widowmaker!!!!

 

[Aksala]

Its your job to say that...without heart disease you would be out of work.

So of course your gonna go along with the research done on high fat diets vs high fat diets ect....

Try some research on a low fat vegan diet with no oils and hardly any nuts/seeds....

Its only genetics if you allow it to be.

 

[nukklehead]

Its your job to say that...without heart disease you would be out of work.

So of course your gonna go along with the research done on high fat diets vs high fat diets ect....

Try some research on a low fat vegan diet with no oils and hardly any nuts/seeds....

Its only genetics if you allow it to be.

Nope stented those guys too... I question diet also.... just a job.. and anecdotal evidence... trust me I would never use the scientific method due to evidence based practice influences by the medical industry.. i.e they want you to fail to keep them in business.. it is what it is..

 

[ixnay007]

Ok guess I fueled the fire a while back introducing genetic background ( not that it wasnt already there) .. I work in a cardiac cath lab and if you boys dont stop fighting I will stick a stent into everyone of your RCA's , LAD's, circs, and Left mains. I do it every day. And if you dont like that I will stick a pacemaker/defibrillator in your R chest and run the leads to your pericardiums. Hell if I cant get thru the front door and you have a CTO ( chronic total occlusion) I will run my wires both ways and KISS my stents if I can open you up. If not .. guess your screwed. I try to question my patients as able to come up with my own anecdotal research. The research has shown diet has a small amount to do with it... but in the end.. Its GENETICS that rules.
So.. what yo mama and dada had .. you will have to.... if you follow a bad lifestyle it will come sooner,,, if you have a good lifestyle it will come later... thats the bottom line... can we be friends now???:friends:

For those unfamiliar with anatomy RCA= Right coronary artery LAD= Left anterior descending artery Circ= Circumflex artery. Lets not forget the left Main AKA The Widowmaker!!!!

Exactly what I've been saying..

My maternal grandmother died of stomach cancer, my Mom has spent a good part of her life eating the diet recommended for preventing colon cancer, high fiber, lots of green veggies, proteins in small servings, she exercises almost every day, drinks lots of water, etc.. she went for a control, and they found precancerous lesions, she's done all the treatments, and soon I'm gonna have to start with colonscopies.

In the end, it's your genes that will decide your "natural" death.

 

[AndreNicky]

I must have missed those links, yes. However, I personally am more interested in things like peer reviewed, published studies. Would those blogs provide links to actual data? Perusing them, they don't appear to be giving us the basis of their assessments and claims. They're simply making statements.

You clearly didn't read them, they link to many peer reviewed papers.

Regarding your vit A BS, its proven that many people are low responders. This shit is real

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...sg=AFQjCNEA_2N5CO3LFYOb_XxTmC1Fwjy23A&cad=rja
"Conclusion: The vitamin A activity of -carotene, even when
measured under controlled conditions, can be surprisingly low
and variable."

 

[SeaMaiden]

Are you able to define "peruse," Andre? If they linked to an actual paper, why didn't you just link to that, instead of expecting me to read through the (extensive) blog itself? And what exactly does that paper prove, anyway? That uptake and utilization are variable. What does it have to do with the debate that Aksala's report of newly invigorated health has engendered?

If you have a particular health issue that disallows utilization and conversion of beta carotene, then it is what it is. That doesn't mean that EVERYONE has such a problem any more than, for instance, my granddaughter's gluten-intolerance (non-Dx'd Celiac?) is a health concern for everyone. Just the same as with, say, food allergies. I'm not saying it's not real, I'm saying it's not everyone. No one needs terribly acute reading comprehension to understand that, do they?

Here, American Clinical Nutrition: Spinach or carrots can supply significant amounts of vitamin A as assessed by feeding with intrinsically deuterated vegetables.

 

[AndreNicky]

Are you able to define "peruse," Andre? If they linked to an actual paper, why didn't you just link to that, instead of expecting me to read through the (extensive) blog itself?

Because most can't understand the actual study data unless they have a science degree and the researchers conclusions often don't match the data. Not to mention that you can often only look at abstracts which don't tell us much. You obviously can't peruse.

If you have a particular health issue that disallows utilization and conversion of beta carotene, then it is what it is.

If you knew how to read you would see that many people are low responders.

 

[AndreNicky]

Regarfing the study look at this chart

Notice how much less Vit A is in circulation after the vegetables vs preformed A? You would need 140,000 iu of beta carotene to get 10,000 iu vit A(which is how much I need personally). I would have to eat 30 medium sized carrots to get that, assuming I absorb all the beta carotene. This study isn't very good either considering it only had 14 test subjects which is not nearly enough to test for different genetic variability.

"Although vegetable ß-carotene is a safe form of provitamin A and can provide substantial amounts of vitamin A to humans, the use of plant provitamin A as a sustainable and effective strategy for combating vitamin A deficiency in various parts of the world, from an array of plant sources, needs continued scientific and quantitative evaluation."

 

[Truthman]

You need fat eaten with the spinach to get the nutrients available to you. You also have to take account people who eat a lot of soluble fiber and how much vitamin A they have due to the soluble fiber increasing gut bacteria which breakdown the food and also make short chain fatty acids which increase absorption of nutrients due to fermentation.

I can't find it but I remember reading in 2005 a doctor finding out eating carrots with a dip with fat in it increase the beta-carotene absorption greatly due to the beta-carotene being fat soluble. Again, the different fats do increase different things(saturated fat increase iron, monounsaturated fat increase immune system, poyunsaturated fat catalase enzymes,etc.) and do different things within the body. Also, too much vitamin A is a problem which is why letting the body produce what it needs is a good thing unless you are sick and your body is weak then animal or the synthetic form is good.

You have to remember vitamin A and beta-carotene can build up over time if eaten everyday, which will happen if you eat vegetables everyday, due to being fat soluble so your body will always have some vitamin A available unless your diet becomes limited in whole fat(nuts, seeds, avocaods not processed fat for frying) and/or colorful vegetables at some point in time. SO it may look like the numbers are low for beta-carotene ingesters but over time there will be a build up and it will stay consistent as well as have some left over in the fat and who knows what it may do to the fat cells.

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/phytochemicals/carotenoids/
"Metabolism and Bioavailability

For dietary carotenoids to be absorbed intestinally, they must be released from the food matrix and incorporated into mixed micelles (mixtures of bile salts and several types of lipids) (2). Therefore, carotenoid absorption requires the presence of fat in a meal. As little as 3-5 g of fat in a meal appears sufficient to ensure carotenoid absorption (3, 4). Because they do not need to be released from the plant matrix, carotenoids supplements (in oil) are more efficiently absorbed than carotenoids in foods (4). Within the cells that line the intestine (enterocytes), carotenoids are incorporated into triglyceride-rich lipoproteins called chylomicrons and released into the circulation (2). Triglycerides are depleted from circulating chylomicrons through the activity of an enzyme called lipoprotein lipase, resulting in the formation of chylomicron remnants. Chylomicron remnants are taken up by the liver, where carotenoids are incorporated into lipoproteins and secreted back into the circulation. In the intestine and the liver, provitamin A carotenoids may be cleaved to produce retinal, a form of vitamin A. The conversion of provitamin A carotenoids to vitamin A is influenced by the vitamin A status of the individual (5). Although the regulatory mechanism is not yet clear in humans, cleavage of provitamin A carotenoids appears to be inhibited when vitamin A stores are high. "

http://www.eatingwell.com/nutrition_health/nutrition_news_information/the_avocado_advantage

"Food scientist Steven Schwartz at Ohio State University and his team wanted to see if avocado, a great source of heart-healthy monounsaturated fat, could match the antioxidant-boosting properties of salad dressing. They gave 11 volunteers salsa or salad with or without avocado, and then tested their blood periodically for 9 1⁄2 hours. They found that when volunteers ate avocado, concentrations of lycopene, beta carotene and alpha carotene in their blood ranged from 2 to 15 times higher than when the dishes were eaten without avocado. They also found that the fat in the fruit was indeed behind the increased absorption."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypervitaminosis_A

"Hypervitaminosis A occurs when the maximum limit for liver stores of retinoids is exceeded. The excess vitamin A enters the circulation causing systemic toxicity. Betacarotene, a precursor of vitamin A, is selectively converted into retinoids, so it does not cause toxicity.

Although hypervitaminosis A can occur when large amounts of liver (including cod liver oil and other fish oils) are regularly consumed, most cases of vitamin A toxicity result from an excess intake of vitamin A in the form of vitamin supplements."

 

[Aksala]

223 lbs this morning...down 24 lbs in less than 5 weeks....

Still feel amazing....energy off the charts...no stress....

I'll keep updating every few weeks...and I'll throw up a before and after pic once I'm under 200lbs...

Again..not doing this for the weight loss...just for the health..

The weight loss is an added bonus...

 

[hunt4genetics]

Eat 50 leaves of the coleus plant daily.

 

[Rukind]

everyone can get vitamin A from liver.. just saying.

saturated fat is not bad for you and it is proven.

polyunsaturated are bad for you, that is also proven.

monounsaturated have health benefits as well.

vegetables are good for you.

its that simple.

meat and vegetables are natural and we have eaten them since we have been here. fruits need to be eaten in moderation because of the carbohydrates.

animal fat (saturated fat, also the kind that you carry around with you) is the most important part of your diet. This statement is up for debate on this forum, obviously. I just look back through our history and it makes more sense to me than anything else. It seems to me that we have had more heart disease and more health problems since we cut our saturated fat back.. all because of some bad science that benefited the USDA so we will eat more grains. Every since that time, our health has gotten worse and all they keep telling us is to cut the saturated fat.

You walk down the grocery isle and all you see is FAT FREE.. and it has a bunch of carbs in it lol

If you want to eat all vegetables that is fine, but i think you would feel better if you ate meat and vegetables.

meat that is not processed and not full of salt. meat high in saturated fat. dont buy those lean hamburgers when you can get 27/73. it is also cheaper! Dont buy margarine or vegetables oil (canola, soybean, etc..) when you can use real butter. butter is saturated fat and margarine/vegetable oil is polyunsaturated.

olive oil, macadamia nut oil, coconut oil, etc.. is mono unsaturated and they are also okay for you. although they still have small amount of poly.

If you eat both meat and vegetables. You will have all the nutrients, amino acids, protein, fiber, etc.. everything you need. saturated fats will be up so you will have decent HDL levels too.

Then exercise. It doesn't matter how you eat if you dont exercise..

also genetics of course. I feel genetics can change, though. Maybe not through you, but the future generations of you, if you keep working on the issues with your genetics.

I have a fitday.com account. so i can put in everything I eat and see my calorie and ratio. I keep my fat up to 60 - 80 percent and then add as many vegetables i can in there to keep my fat above 60 percent.

Like i said, some days I eat no vegetables and I believe we dont even need vegetables.. That is my opinion and I know most people wont believe that.

 

[Secrecy]

Cheerios...?

 

[nukklehead]

Exactly what I've been saying..

My maternal grandmother died of stomach cancer, my Mom has spent a good part of her life eating the diet recommended for preventing colon cancer, high fiber, lots of green veggies, proteins in small servings, she exercises almost every day, drinks lots of water, etc.. she went for a control, and they found precancerous lesions, she's done all the treatments, and soon I'm gonna have to start with colonscopies.

In the end, it's your genes that will decide your "natural" death.

AAhhh so glad to see some common sense in this argument!!
For the guys that found improvement in there well being with diet adjustment it was because a genetic trait from way back (I mean way back) that allowed this to happen. Meaning I agree ,, diet can modify some co morbidities for those lucky enough to have the gene pool to allow it to do so.. Again not scientific evidence, just anecdotal.. Kind of like Marijuana helps with pain and nausea...
Science says no.. but we all ( who work in the medical field) know better........................anecdotally of course..!!!

 

[NiteTiger]

Again not scientific evidence, just anecdotal.. Kind of like Marijuana helps with pain and nausea...
Science says no.. but we all ( who work in the medical field) know better........................anecdotally of course..!!!

Um, no.

It's scientifically proven, and science does say yes. Just like it says yes cannabis kills cancer, yes cannabis eases spasms, yes cannabis is antibiotic, and yes cannabis helps degenerative brain disorders like Alzheimer's.

Medical use isn't some wink, wink, nudge, nudge legislation passed for shits and giggles. It took science to make that happen, not just some smoke out in the basement of the Capitol Building (can't rule anything out tho ).

Please, research much farther before speaking to its medical merits.

You just made the medical movement and its patients the punchline of your joke.

 

[nukklehead]

Um, no.

It's scientifically proven, and science does say yes. Just like it says yes cannabis kills cancer, yes cannabis eases spasms, yes cannabis is antibiotic, and yes cannabis helps degenerative brain disorders like Alzheimer's.

Medical use isn't some wink, wink, nudge, nudge legislation passed for shits and giggles. It took science to make that happen, not just some smoke out in the basement of the Capitol Building (can't rule anything out tho ).

Please, research much farther before speaking to its medical merits.

You just made the medical movement and its patients the punchline of your joke.

UUUUUUUUUUMMMMMM It is illegal in most states and the DEA still has the right to raid all dispensaries.... Im not saying it doesnt work.... wink wink nudge nudge.. it does.. anecdotally of course

I happen to have travelled in 4 different states, 6 different hospitals worked oncology and cardiac all my life. Let me tell you
75% of all oncologists disagree with science ( which you are right, Marijuana has proven to decrease nausea and increase appetite.)
Why ?? I dont know.. not politically correct I guess. Sorry .. but it is a big F'n joke because the establishment for the most part wont acknowledge it..... Just like genetics.... hereintofore was the prior argument that you forgot..... Reasons...??? Ahhh hell thats another 1000+ subject post... Im just saying how it is in the trenches everyday.. You know WTF works You know WTF doesnt... But Im just a pure curious piece of shit who wants to get thru the beauracracy and find the TRUTH And Marijuana can be the biggest blessing and wonder drug for certain patients... God Bless

 

[NiteTiger]

Whatever excuse a rogue federal agency chooses to use in the furtherance of its agenda doesn't change reality.

Reality is, it has all been scientifically proven, as you say.

Don't let the government continue to warp reality for you through its own twisted lens.

Government policy does not dictate science, as much as they'd like for you to believe otherwise.

Say it right - The science is there, and the DEA is a rogue federal agency, and everyone is scared of men with military armor and weapons invading their home and shooting them to death in their own bed, so they toe the line.

I understand now that you're saying you have to toe the line yourself (I think?), but here, at least, you're allowed to speak the truth.

Play word games with the thought police when they visit, but here, you're among friends

PS: The DEA doesn't have the right to do a damn thing, they are a federal agency, not a citizen. The Federal Government doesn't have rights, only the citizen's have rights.

Rights SPECIFICALLY reserved for the People, to protect them FROM the Government.