Have Done Some Research At Your Urging...

[VictoryGardener]

Ron Paul has my vote regardless.. nomination or no nomination

I will write his name on my ballot no matter what happens in the next few months

 

[Pops]

I guess that one of our biggest problems in abortion is determining when life starts. A one year old baby is totally helpless and has no intelligence to solve problems or take care of itself. I have seen adults who seem braindead(politicians) and many folks on welfare who can't or won't take care of themselves. For these folks, why not retro-active abortion? It is a question that ,as of now, has no answer. Modern medicine has determined that babies(fetus) has life far faster than we previously thought and ,with the help of medicine, can survive at an earlier stage of development. I am not wise enough to be able to make this determination. As someone said earlier, there are thousands of folks willing to adopt. If i am going to make any decisions regarding the right to life, I would rather err on the side of the baby(fetus) than the other way around. This is not the rant of a religious person defending the Bible, but the rant of an old man who has held his newborn children in his arms and could not hurt any child under any circumstances. I might smack the shit out of them when they are older, or kick their parents in the balls for not controlling them, but you will never see me take a life,at any age, unless that life is threatening someone else or trying to steal my harvest. Then I will perform a retroactive abortion and use the remains as fertilizer(see how I have tied this thread into growing cannabis).

 

[resinryder]

IMO, there are much bigger issues facing the US other than how a candidate feels about abortion. Iraq, health care, stablizing social security(which they ****eD up to start with), just to name a few. Abortion is and has been the law of the land for a while now, like it or not. To keep focusing on it severly clouds the more important issues that will affect us for generations to come.

 

[BadKarma]

Ron Paul still has to work with the congress so great ideas dont just happen because he wants them to. To be honest I dont thik he could get 10% of his ideas pushed through congress.

On the abortion issue Ive only in my 45 years of life heard of 5 or 6 people who believed life begins at conception. Thats it 5 or 6

 

[usa]

Ron Paul still has to work with the congress so great ideas dont just happen because he wants them to. To be honest I dont thik he could get 10% of his ideas pushed through congress.

Well that’s where the grassroots level really picks up; it isn’t over after Election Day. Your local & state reps are next that will be taken to task. Meanwhile Ron Paul can veto any bill they pass that is goes beyond the budget spending allocated.

He can in fact remove the troops from the Middle East and save the next generation trillions of dollars of debt. He can enforce border security. And the big one, .......Leave us the hell alone. Liberty with responsibility. If that is all he accomplishes I’d be happy.

Why have so many adopted the Stockholm syndrome of a Socialist Welfare & Police State? crazy

 

[BadKarma]

The American people grow fat every day on entitlements, that is something IMO you will never change.

We elect people as a popularity contest, who will do something for US not who will do whats best for the country. They have divided this country into R's and D's and that's the way they like it. So that's the way it will stay IMO

 

[Guest]

I feel the same way that some(not all) people are shouting "vote Ron Paul!" just because he wants to legalize and don't really look into his other beliefs

However, as far as I've seen, he allows the most freedom of things that should be your business and nobody else's, especially not the government's, which is why I will probably vote for him. I'm not even sure if I'm going to vote because really why should I? Have to go to the church it's held at(which is kind of ironic) and wait an hour in line to place my vote on president which doesn't even count because the electoral college makes the actual selection and is not required to base it off the people's vote. That is one of the biggest things that should be changed in my opinion, followed by some sort of campaign to help motivate everyone to vote

 

[zymos]

I don't think males should even be allowed to voice an opinion on abortion. Males can't have an abortion, they can't gestate and birth a baby, and most of the time, they have very little to do with raising the baby. Just more patriarcal shit foisted on half the humans on the planet.

Also, Libertarians scare me...

 

[HuffAndPuff]

Zymos,
I agree 110% about the abortion thing. But why do we libertarians scare you? Big Brother should scare you! Are you afraid of having the freedom to do what you want, as long as you're not botherin nobody? Or is it the possibility that your state's laws will trump federal ones? I guess it's like the Helsinki syndrome- A hostage gets so used to being under his captors' control that he finds freedom to be frightening. I guess it's a self-protective mechanism.

There has been some excellent discussion in here, thanks guys! FYI, the abortion thing isn't my main concern- it was just what I viewed to be a discrepancy where free will is concerned. I remain undecided, but I vote in a state that is supposed to carry weight, so I'll be making my mind up soon. At least for round one. I can tell you now, I am gonna be bummed if Hillary takes the nomination. She is the only democratic candidate I have decided on, and she gets a resounding "OH HELL TO THE NO!"

HuffAndPuff

 

[vaprpig]

I listened to a guy on Thom Hartmans radio show once who gave an example of libertarian/neocon views. I can't remember his name but he was the head of or a bigwig at the Ayn Rand Institute, neocons pray at the altar of Ayn Rand.

Remember the exploding Ford Pintos?

Well he said that because there are poor and less fortunate people (their own fault of course) in this world they need to be given the opportunity to purchase a cheap vehicle. In order to produce a vehicle that cheap the automaker would have to cut corners and produce a vehicle that was not as safe as others.

So the moral is, if you don't want to have to drive exploding cars you should make more money.

Thats were I separate from a libertarian viewpoint.

 

[zymos]

Zymos,
But why do we libertarians scare you? Big Brother should scare you! Are you afraid of having the freedom to do what you want, as long as you're not botherin nobody?

I'm not afraid of the freedom to do what I want,but I am afraid sometimes of other "people" (more like corporations) getting to do what THEY want. Our system doesn't work as well as it could, but I WANT things like the EPA to say-"sorry if it interferes with your bottom line, but you can't just dump that shit in the river."

Plus,when it comes down to it, I'm an old school liberal. I believe the main role of our government should be helping people, especially those less fortunate. Which means taking care of the sick, feeding the hungry, etc. And it's not going to happen, or not enough, if it is left up to the few private individuals who care enough to help.

 

[usa]

I'm not afraid of the freedom to do what I want,but I am afraid sometimes of other "people" (more like corporations) getting to do what THEY want. Our system doesn't work as well as it could, but I WANT things like the EPA to say-"sorry if it interferes with your bottom line, but you can't just dump that shit in the river."

Plus,when it comes down to it, I'm an old school liberal. I believe the main role of our government should be helping people, especially those less fortunate. Which means taking care of the sick, feeding the hungry, etc. And it's not going to happen, or not enough, if it is left up to the few private individuals who care enough to help.

I disagree, not sure where you live but do some research. A good deal of hospitals were founded and built by charities not govt. money. The big problem with govt distribution of funds to the needy is often it never reaches those that’s it aimed for.

Another thing is some people create their own short comings more often than not, and never have aspirations to do nothing to change it. The govt. spoon feeds; there is no incentive to do better in your socialist view. Look at Katrina as an example on many levels of this topic. The people volunteered funds and offered their homes to those affected. The Red Cross blundered most of those funds along with your govt. that still has acres of those FEMA trailers in Arkansas that remain empty that could have placed many. FEMA issued credit cards randomly to people they couldn’t even verify that lived in new Orleans wasted allot of funds giving away generators to people who had nothing to plug the thing into,lol

I could go on and on, why the govt shouldn’t dish out my funds to what you may deem as the needy. It’s my money and I should deicide who I’m going to help...especially when we struggle ourselves at times. The needy you speak of, well those funds they dipped into from Social Security went to other countries; no benefit to Americans there and most likely caused more blood shed over rice from the sky.

Look at 911 Americans came together to help many traveled to help clean the mess up and help families, public funds were no issue. By being able to keep more of your pay, it will bring awareness to your local communities to lend a hand. Instead now most wait for a monthly check,lol If someone is really that needy the community will become aware and help the ones in need. Yes people will give and still do under our current system. I just gave money to a family who lost their dad & mom was crippled to a motorcycle accident. I also gave money to help those in bonds to get items like stamps and such. I threw some cash in the boot for the fireman at the red-light the other day. I dump change all the time into those help this girl with cancer type things at convenient stores, but I know my limits on what I can afford to give while the govt doesn’t know what situation I’m in to give nor anyone else. I come first with my earnings that’s the way it should be anyways.

 

[usa]

I listened to a guy on Thom Hartmans radio show once who gave an example of libertarian/neocon views.

Goggle the definition of both words please, there is no relation. Neocons were closet far left socialist who moved from the Democratic Party and changed to Republican. They tricked many rightwing conservative voters and made the party grow.

Libertarians have both a conservative and liberal side too, but the difference is it is opposed to any form of socialism...liberate liberty libertarian are no way associated with neocons who hijacked the Republican Party.

Google vids for the word Straussian you’ll find not all the far left socialist actually changed parties some remained in the Democratic party. That’s why you’ll never really see a difference in Hillary or Guliani or either party for that matter.

Many conservative voters have no clue and many are finally waking up as its too late. There is nothing conservative or liberial in a classic sense about any of the mess we see today.

 

[Guest]

ron paul's position on abortion sucks...but that is one position out of how many? i'm not voting for dr. paul just b/c of his anti-dea stance...i'm sick of this inflation scam the federal reserve bank perpetrates on us, i'm sick of runaway government ruining our lives...i'm sick of corporations being treated like people above the law who can just rape and plunder the savings of hardworking people because they funnel money into washington...follow the money for all of these campaigns and you will see that Ron Paul spends the least amount of money per vote received in all these straw polls...

ron paul's track record in congress speaks for itself, what u see is what u get from him, we need that for a change...

 

[Fat Albert]

"A LoneStarTimes.com investigation has conclusively established that a leading figure in the American neo-Nazi / White-Supremacist movement has provided financial support to Ron Paul’s 2008 Presidential campaign.

The individual in question is Don Black, the founder, owner and operator of Stormfront, a “white power” website that both professional journalists and watch-dog groups have identified as the premier English-language racist/hate-site on the Internet."

There's a lot more of this out there, if you just look. The amount of white supremacist, militia-type backing Ron Paul has is considerable. That's why he won't get my vote.

Fat A

 

[Guest]

well way to be principled, how do u feel about that money bundler for clinton who donated over a million dollars before they found out he had an outstanding warrant for massive fraud from last decade? giuliani has made more money from 9/11 with his bullshit consulting/security firm than anyone but halliburton...if ur going to be basing ur vote on who isn't taking money from people u dislike then u might as well stay home and not vote...

 

[Fat Albert]

if ur going to be basing ur vote on who isn't taking money from people u dislike then u might as well stay home and not vote...

DING DING DING!

Ladies and Gentlemen, we have a winner!

That's EXACTLY what I'll be doing.

Cheers!
Fat A

 

[Guest]

well then my friend when they come for you there will be no one left to say anything about it

 

[nycdfan042]

just not in the face ok?
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,307680,00.html

 

[nycdfan042]

well way to be principled, how do u feel about that money bundler for clinton who donated over a million dollars before they found out he had an outstanding warrant for massive fraud from last decade? giuliani has made more money from 9/11 with his bullshit consulting/security firm than anyone but halliburton...if ur going to be basing ur vote on who isn't taking money from people u dislike then u might as well stay home and not vote...

lol tru that.... nice quote nugg