Guerrilla Soil Amendments

[DuskrayTroubador]

Never used too much kelp. It's more about budget and getting the best bang for the buck.

I feel the same way about insect frass. Can't use too much.

So I'm pretty set (I think) on my soil amendments for this year...

This is an old pic from a few years ago, but you can get an idea of the soil typical in my neck of the woods. It's a clay, but that shit dries out quick. I won't make the mistake of leaving dry, gray soil like that again... shit's a security risk.

So that's the type of dirt I generally have to work with, more or less. (Keep in mind the soil is already amended in that pic, but clearly not as well as it could have been)

So I'm gonna be using:

-Coco coir for aeration (seems to be the most practical option between it being easy to transport and wayyyyyyy cheaper than pumice & rice hulls)
-insect frass
-goat manure
-rabbit manure
-kelp meal
-pulverized lime

I'm gonna go pretty heavy on the three manures since they're all cold manures (meaning incredibly difficult if not impossible to burn plants with). 1 cup/cubic foot of insect frass, and then the goat and rabbit manure are probably gonna make up a third of each hole. Liberal with the kelp meal as well, and the trusty ol' (small, cuz of the coco coir's ph) handfull of pulverized, fast-acting lime.

I've generally done holes 3' in diameter, 18 inches deep in the middle, but I might go a little bigger. I'll probably dig the middle area a few inches deeper and throw all the small rocks I've dug up in there for a drainage pit. (If I find very decomposed branches/logs nearby, to the point where they basically crumble, I'll throw those on top of the rocks) I might also make the holes 4' in diameter as well, I think it could make a big difference in yield. This year I'm doing several 1 plant plots, and so it'll be a bit less tiring to make the holes bigger (when you're digging between 4 and 8 large holes per plot... you guys know).

Got some clover I'm gonna throw down as a cover crop as well.

A question about the coco: Can I mix a little bit of the compressed brick (like 20% the amount I want to end up with) in the hole and wait for it to expand with the rain? Or could that cause problems (pushing seedlings out if done too close to planting, mold from not being mixed/broken up well as it's hydrated)? Should I bring some big tupperware or cut a couple milk jugs in half and use those to hydrate it while I'm digging the holes?

Thanks for all the help, guys.

 

[Kygiacomo!!!]

I feel the same way about insect frass. Can't use too much.

So I'm pretty set (I think) on my soil amendments for this year...

This is an old pic from a few years ago, but you can get an idea of the soil typical in my neck of the woods. It's a clay, but that shit dries out quick. I won't make the mistake of leaving dry, gray soil like that again... shit's a security risk.

View Image

So that's the type of dirt I generally have to work with, more or less. (Keep in mind the soil is already amended in that pic, but clearly not as well as it could have been)

So I'm gonna be using:

-Coco coir for aeration (seems to be the most practical option between it being easy to transport and wayyyyyyy cheaper than pumice & rice hulls)
-insect frass
-goat manure
-rabbit manure
-kelp meal
-pulverized lime

I'm gonna go pretty heavy on the three manures since they're all cold manures (meaning incredibly difficult if not impossible to burn plants with). 1 cup/cubic foot of insect frass, and then the goat and rabbit manure are probably gonna make up a third of each hole. Liberal with the kelp meal as well, and the trusty ol' (small, cuz of the coco coir's ph) handfull of pulverized, fast-acting lime.

I've generally done holes 3' in diameter, 18 inches deep in the middle, but I might go a little bigger. I'll probably dig the middle area a few inches deeper and throw all the small rocks I've dug up in there for a drainage pit. (If I find very decomposed branches/logs nearby, to the point where they basically crumble, I'll throw those on top of the rocks) I might also make the holes 4' in diameter as well, I think it could make a big difference in yield. This year I'm doing several 1 plant plots, and so it'll be a bit less tiring to make the holes bigger (when you're digging between 4 and 8 large holes per plot... you guys know).

Got some clover I'm gonna throw down as a cover crop as well.

A question about the coco: Can I mix a little bit of the compressed brick (like 20% the amount I want to end up with) in the hole and wait for it to expand with the rain? Or could that cause problems (pushing seedlings out if done too close to planting, mold from not being mixed/broken up well as it's hydrated)? Should I bring some big tupperware or cut a couple milk jugs in half and use those to hydrate it while I'm digging the holes?

Thanks for all the help, guys.

i wouldnt personally go without earthworm castings myself. u can even get some at walmart now. they arent the best from walmart but they are better then no EWC. a 5 pound bag at walmart cost 5$ or u can go on amazon and get a 15 pound bag for 18$ of wiggle worm. ewc is loaded with humus and great beneficials. i mix my coco and water crystals in the hole dry and let the rain do its thing,but i already got my holes set for this year so i have plenty of time for shit to break down and for the coco and crystals to bulk up.

 

[HIMALAYAN GANJA]

I feel the same way about insect frass. Can't use too much.

So I'm pretty set (I think) on my soil amendments for this year...

This is an old pic from a few years ago, but you can get an idea of the soil typical in my neck of the woods. It's a clay, but that shit dries out quick. I won't make the mistake of leaving dry, gray soil like that again... shit's a security risk.

View Image

So that's the type of dirt I generally have to work with, more or less. (Keep in mind the soil is already amended in that pic, but clearly not as well as it could have been)

So I'm gonna be using:

-Coco coir for aeration (seems to be the most practical option between it being easy to transport and wayyyyyyy cheaper than pumice & rice hulls)
-insect frass
-goat manure
-rabbit manure
-kelp meal
-pulverized lime

I'm gonna go pretty heavy on the three manures since they're all cold manures (meaning incredibly difficult if not impossible to burn plants with). 1 cup/cubic foot of insect frass, and then the goat and rabbit manure are probably gonna make up a third of each hole. Liberal with the kelp meal as well, and the trusty ol' (small, cuz of the coco coir's ph) handfull of pulverized, fast-acting lime.

I've generally done holes 3' in diameter, 18 inches deep in the middle, but I might go a little bigger. I'll probably dig the middle area a few inches deeper and throw all the small rocks I've dug up in there for a drainage pit. (If I find very decomposed branches/logs nearby, to the point where they basically crumble, I'll throw those on top of the rocks) I might also make the holes 4' in diameter as well, I think it could make a big difference in yield. This year I'm doing several 1 plant plots, and so it'll be a bit less tiring to make the holes bigger (when you're digging between 4 and 8 large holes per plot... you guys know).

Got some clover I'm gonna throw down as a cover crop as well.

A question about the coco: Can I mix a little bit of the compressed brick (like 20% the amount I want to end up with) in the hole and wait for it to expand with the rain? Or could that cause problems (pushing seedlings out if done too close to planting, mold from not being mixed/broken up well as it's hydrated)? Should I bring some big tupperware or cut a couple milk jugs in half and use those to hydrate it while I'm digging the holes?

Thanks for all the help, guys.

Hllo i amgladi found thi thread. i strongly believe that like someone said earlier in this thread that we can collect all kinds of ammendments from the woods. that what i do.

i prepared about 20 swamp tubes with 100 percent forest topsoil with organic fert granules thats it. that forest top soil is good stuff and has worm castings in it naturally? plus its texture is good on its own without adding perlite. [url='https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=75475&p

 

[HIMALAYAN GANJA]

free forest ammendments available on site no hauling and being spotted by your local vigilanti

 

[DuskrayTroubador]

My main concern with scraping up topsoil from around the site is that in doing so, you substantially increase the chances of your presence being known.

If someone is out walking within 100 yards of your plants and sees the top soil removed/disturbed, it's going to look puzzling/suspicious.

That doesn't mean I'm against doing it, but it does mean that I don't like the idea of taking more than a little bit of it.

 

[Bud Green]

If you enjoy walking around in the woods, especially this time of year before it gets hot out
(and assuming the ground isn't snow covered), carry a 5 gallon bucket and a small shovel...
(I have an old surplus Army folding shovel, that I've had forever)

Brush aside the leaves that fell last year and shovel up the top 2 or 3 inches of forest soil in a small area..(a few sq. ft.)
This should fill your bucket halfway.)
Brush the leaves you had moved, back where they were and in a few days no one will be able to tell that anyone has been there...

This soil is super rich and fertile, and added to your existing holes,
will give your girls most of the nutrients they need to grow very well.

 

[HIMALAYAN GANJA]

hi there bud green
you say that the topsoil in the forest actally has enough npk to support plants on its own?? that is good news if its true

 

[-BRR-]

My main concern with scraping up topsoil from around the site is that in doing so, you substantially increase the chances of your presence being known.

If someone is out walking within 100 yards of your plants and sees the top soil removed/disturbed, it's going to look puzzling/suspicious.

That doesn't mean I'm against doing it, but it does mean that I don't like the idea of taking more than a little bit of it.

Good point and same goes from the air.

Back to the topic. i’ve done the mulch thing in ground over and over in poorer soil areas. and had some suscusees but to much work imo especially when spots aren’t always permanent. Best thing is choosing the right soil in the fist place. Typically along creeks and rivers around me is where the best soil is. so grow there. Also even the bases of shallow gully’s typically is were the richest soil collects as well as moisture sinks.

As for amendments (the actually question sorry for the rant)I took interest a year or so ago the high brix following and read the high brix threads here over and over. They don’t actually advocate much mulch at all fwiw (too high in potassium) lol but there seems to be science behind it. Pretty in-depth thread though. Awesome read.
I better find a link for it...

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=263692

Dammit you guys are getting me excited again. I think it’s what this old fart needs.

Btw what you have listed there Duskray ticks allot of boxes. testing the soil ph may be a good idea also. Thanks for kicking off the thread too.

 

[Tiresmoke19]

Just a few tips I didn't see mentioned.

If using pine needles they significantly lower ph as they decompose so up your lime or amend with wood ash as both will raise it back up.

Decomposing wood will eat up nitrogen and lots (all) of it. Urea is a strait N that would be easy to carry in, would be best to give high doses of N in advance to not burn plants. Clover cover crop will fixate nitrogen from atmosphere if you wana be more natural about getting your N back.

 

[Tiresmoke19]

Oh yeah, if your a manure user. Try and find a mink farm. There manure is excellent at keeping other critters away from your plants

 

[RedDirtWarrior]

some guerilla soils work amazing on their own with WATER.

I like peat as its organic and holds water.

 

[RedDirtWarrior]

Don't poison the environment or nothin, but osmocote is guerilla gold.

As far as the best amendment, i'd say animal hair scattered about, because it helps keep critters from digging up all your hard work.

 

[Goldslug]

Howdy everyone

I want to discuss in this thread essential soil amendments for guerrillas. Obviously each person's needs will be different depending on their native soil and environment, but what most guerrillas have in common is that they can't logistically haul large amounts of heavy soil into where they'll be growing, and so they've got to haul in amendments to make their native soil as suitable as they can.

Like many others, the native soil I'm working with has lots of clay -- a mattock makes digging through this and breaking it up much easier than using a shovel. Because of my environment, I also can't use any animal-based amendments (no blood, bone, or fish) because critters and large animals alike will come and dig the soil & plants up.

Here are my main amendments that I'm planning on rolling with this year:

-Pulverized lime (raise calcium and quickly adjust ph)

-Local compost (nothing blood, bone, or fish, but manure is cool. Can't make my own this time around, any particular recommendations on what specifically I should use? I'm curious about mushroom compost, but I'll probably go with good old cow or chicken shit. I may also topdress with bat guano before flowering)

-Insect frass 2-2-2 (great source of all sorts of micronutrients as well as chitin, which is perhaps even more important because it gets the plant's SAR going to help fend off insects and disease)

-Rice hulls/lava rock/sand (whichever I can get cheaper) for aeration.

-Gypsum ( *if necessary* to increase calcium and break up the clay).

I'm probably going to go a little light on the compost for logistical reasons, and heavier on the insect frass because it's very light in comparison. Aside from compost, all of these amendments are pretty light.

Am I missing anything essential?

thx man , you help me

 

[DuskrayTroubador]

thx man , you help me

No problem, man. Glad to hear it.

I'e changed my mix up a bit since that post, however. Now I'm going with:

goat shit
rabbit shit
insect frass
lime
coco coir

Together with native soil, that's all I'm rockin.

 

[DuskrayTroubador]

Quick question, guys:

I've been breaking up the coco while dry and mixing pieces/dust into my holes. I've been putting half a brick (each half is roughly 4 in. x 4in. x 2.5x) into each hole, which is 3' wide and about a foot deep, a little deeper in the center (my holes are more like mounds).

The rain will saturate and expand the coco coir on its own. My worry is that with half a brick in each hole, if I plant in a hole before a couple rains have saturated the coco coir, is it possible that half a brick is enough to expand so much that the seedlings get pushed out of their holes?

 

[Robrites]

Quick question, guys:

I've been breaking up the coco while dry and mixing pieces/dust into my holes. I've been putting half a brick (each half is roughly 4 in. x 4in. x 2.5x) into each hole, which is 3' wide and about a foot deep, a little deeper in the center (my holes are more like mounds).

The rain will saturate and expand the coco coir on its own. My worry is that with half a brick in each hole, if I plant in a hole before a couple rains have saturated the coco coir, is it possible that half a brick is enough to expand so much that the seedlings get pushed out of their holes?

I haven't used it for a few years but it does expand a lot. Once it is fully saturated, it won't expand any more. A bigger concern might be salt. Even the pre-washed coir I used needed to be soaked and drained several times to remove all of the residue. If you take half a brick and soak it at home, you will be able to gauge the expansion. I used a large cooler filled with water to wet mine and it when breaking it up, I still found dry chunks in it.

 

[DuskrayTroubador]

I haven't used it for a few years but it does expand a lot. Once it is fully saturated, it won't expand any more. A bigger concern might be salt. Even the pre-washed coir I used needed to be soaked and drained several times to remove all of the residue. If you take half a brick and soak it at home, you will be able to gauge the expansion. I used a large cooler filled with water to wet mine and it when breaking it up, I still found dry chunks in it.

The shit I got is supposedly washed ahead of time to wash away much of the salt content.

It's supposed to expand 8-10x it's size, but even at that expanded size it's still less than a third of my holes.

 

[DuskrayTroubador]

Hey there fellers,


I might have access to some chicken manure for this season. In other words, I may have the privilege of cleaning out a friend's coop.


I've tried to stay away from hot manures in the past -- which is why I've shelled out money for goat and rabbit manure. Can I just take chicken manure, throw it in a pile for a month and then throw it on top of/mix it into my holes and let it sit for another month before I plant?


I plant germinated seeds directly into their final holes. No solo cups, no planters or pots -- straight from germination machine to final holes and I'm worried about a manure so hot burning seeds/seedlings.

 

[pipeline]

I used to plant directly. The best thing to do is put about a quart of seedling media in the center of the fertilized hole so they have good root conditions until they get older. The issue is usually light when they're really small. That's why its good to get them going in a sunny location and transplant if possible.


Some of the manure is probably broken down, but some will need to compost to be good. Mix up the manure a time or 2 to give it air and speed up decomposition. In the fall, you could possibly use hotter stuff, but i would think its getting a little late now. I've always read compost/manure needs to be fully composted before using it.

 

[DuskrayTroubador]

Thanks, pipeline. I'm going to forget about using the chicken shit, then. I'm gonna stick with mushroom compost as my main soil amendment.


...but I also just found out a friend of a friend has giant piles of several-years-decomposed woodchips on their farm. Literal tons of the stuff up for grabs.


So my main soil amendments will be mushroom compost and decomposed woodchips.


As far as starting outside, I'm going to take your suggestion of putting seedling mix in the middle of the holes. My plots are all pretty sunny, the big issue that hit me this past year was that I got a late start -- which meant the surrounding vegetation got too big of a headstart on my plants and kept them too shaded when peak vegging time was upon them.


As long as I start on time, I think my plants will be able to get the jump on the surrounding vegetation enough for their size to secure them the sun they need in late June through July and August.