Electricity Usage and "Cops"

[PistachioNut]

All of this arguing seems a little silly to me....why doesn't someone with experience growing give a rational answer to this problem. Obviously there are some risk, but what is the truth here if you stay at a decent amount of electrical usage? Just trying to learn as much as possible!

 

[Pythagllio]

Perhaps we used the wrong word then, in Canada if Leo wants to see my electric bill they need a signed warrant from a judge before this information is turned over to them.This info is considered private and if this warrant is issued without proper grounds,the case against the accused can be thrown out. Which I have seen court documents show.
Now I can't speak for where ever your from but that is how it is here.

Yeah, but then they got that fire inspection thing to get around that, at least in BC no? I know that it was ruled a Charter violation for the Mountie to accompany the inspection team, and that you can refuse. But it still shuts down your grow.

Anyway, I was just commenting on the difference between a subpoena and a warrant. I really couldn't say there's any sin in confusing the two as I did so myself until I was working at a place which was in the sights of a SLAPP lawsuit and a bunch of my colleagues had their ISP records subpoena'd. Yes, I admit I was shocked that it was so easy to issue a subpoena. Of course with a civil subpoena you have a time period to get a lawyer and make a motion to quash. Everyone in my office was given 2 weeks. But you're not going to get notified if just a subpoena is necessary for your electrical records. Special rules for criminal investigations you know. You don't get the opportunity to challenge a warrant before it's executed.

Anyway, aside from Canada there is no uniform rule for this among the various US states either. Somehow I'd bet that AK has a really tough standard considering their State Constitution's privacy rights. There may even be different rules between different jurisdictions in the same state depending on whether the utility is publicly owned or not.

 

[macmiddle]

Hi everyone

Im Uk, i cant see how cops would come doing knock and talks for anything under 10kw in any house. Over here the average family bill seems to be about £50 - £100 per month.

However electric radiators use 2000w and are usually on timers, there must be hundreds of people in every city using excessive power on a day to day basis

I can see why someone in a house who, say, runs 30 or 40 lamps gets busted cos their bill would be thousands and would be investigated

I use £300 per month (6 * 600w), a friend uses £500 per month(10*600) - both amounts at least 3 times the norm. Never any probs, however there are still the same rumours of power bills and the police over here in the uk. Everyone seems to know someone who got busted for power bills. and every few years there is a story in the news about this. The last story in the uk was off a coppers house gettin busted cos they did a flir flyover and it was glowing

Turned out, she lived in a barn conversion, and had no insullation. I didnt believe a word of it, it seemed like a publicity stunt to me, especially since she was a copper anyway. If it was genuine, some of her co workers would have just gone round one night to see . The papers said it was a 20 man bust - haha - i call bullshit

However, ive never seen anyone get busted JUST from power. Its always after the initial tip off that they get the power records ( it just confirms cultivation for them if its very high)

sorry if this isnt that relevant, just thought id give a point of view from the uk

 

[JJScorpio]

The request for the Subpoena has to have the authority of the Court. In other words, there has to be a reason to have one. They usually involve compelling a person to appear in Court, or to produce documents.

In order to use electrical usage against someone in a criminal case, a Judge would have to issue a warrant. And in order to issue a warrant a Judge has to have probable cause to believe a crime is being committed.

 

[I N Hail]

OK well after reading, I'm thinking sense there would be such a wide range of total usage between houses would vary alot.(example,,, dif.items in each home, dif setting in a/c ,heating, some cut every thing off some don't)

SO i'm leaning toward's it's the light schedule, so i was thinking if we were to turn off the lights for say 30 min. or 1hr in the middle of light's ON would this break the count and then wouldn't show a strait 12hr.

Just a thought ,NO fact's gathered,No data compiled,



I N Hail

 

[Pythagllio]

The request for the Subpoena has to have the authority of the Court. In other words, there has to be a reason to have one. They usually involve compelling a person to appear in Court, or to produce documents.

No, they can't issue subpoenas willy nilly. There is a canon of ethics and the Bar does discipline lawyers who abuse their discretion.

In order to use electrical usage against someone in a criminal case, a Judge would have to issue a warrant. And in order to issue a warrant a Judge has to have probable cause to believe a crime is being committed.

How do you reconcile that with the fact that so many warrants are issued with electrical use listed as one of the elements establishing probable cause? It's not required to establish probable cause in order to establish probable cause. No warrants would ever be issued were that the rule. Aside from using electrical usage as an element of probable cause I've never seen it used as evidence in court.

I want a natural gas generator! They never check people's gas bills.

 

[JJScorpio]

No, they can't issue subpoenas willy nilly. There is a canon of ethics and the Bar does discipline lawyers who abuse their discretion.



How do you reconcile that with the fact that so many warrants are issued with electrical use listed as one of the elements establishing probable cause? It's not required to establish probable cause in order to establish probable cause. No warrants would ever be issued were that the rule. Aside from using electrical usage as an element of probable cause I've never seen it used as evidence in court.

I want a natural gas generator! They never check people's gas bills.

A power company contacting the police about excessive usage would be probable cause for a warrant for the records.

A snitch telling the cops someone said they had a grow might be probable cause to ask for a warrant.

The list goes on and on. A cop can't just say " I got a hunch joe blow is growing" and get a warrant. Where is the proof about all these so called power record warrants anyways?

 

[Pythagllio]

Well, I guess you guys are going to believe what you like. There's no evidence of warrants to get electric records because they use subpoenas. Calling the electric company and playing a hunch would be an abuse. BWTFDIK? I'm just relating what happened to me personally and what I've seen with my own eyes. I've had both phone and electrical records subpoena'd by LEO, and as I said above was involved in a situation where it was in my better interest to consult with an attorney and learn about it. I guess it's like the whores that advertise on craigslist and think if they put in a bogus disclaimer that they're selling time but not sex that they're protected when such a disclaimer wouldn't even pass the laugh test. It's just amazing to me how many people here think that they need probable cause to establish probable cause.

 

[Macster2]

Okay went to my favourite hydro store and got to talking about electric bill and this guys advice pay your bill on time monthly.Said a friend of his showed him his $1200 monthly bill ,been doing it for years

 

[Opaleye]

Power companies are in the business of selling power,and cops that say they got info from an electric company are most likely just covering for a snitch

The post above is true. BUT -A frind of mine was rolled a few months back and the snitch was what tipped the cops. The electric bill was the extra "proof" that a judge needed to see to issue the warrant...they go hand in hand.The warrant report stated the snitch had tipped them off, and the electric company sent a detailed list of usages versus the neighbors, they do cooperate..

Okay went to my favourite hydro store and got to talking about electric bill and this guys advice pay your bill on time monthly.Said a friend of his showed him his $1200 monthly bill ,been doing it for years

Blablablabla fucking bla, wait until someone snitches, that very bill will be his downfall...
of course paying your bill is also crucial, but it's ridiculous to think they would use Dea as collection agency if you don't pay....

 

[Macster2]

snitch

snitch

Blablablabla fucking bla, wait until someone snitches, that very bill will be his downfall...
of course paying your bill is also crucial, but it's ridiculous to think they would use Dea as collection agency if you don't pay....

The point is the investigation doesn't start because of the high electric bill. Of course the cops next step is to investigate your elect. usage. This has been stated earlier in this thread, that said paying your elect bill is just another way of staying under their radar just in case that's a factor.When you've been snitched on $100 or $600 over the norm will still be seen as evidence of illegal activity so how does it matter how much?

 

[Octothorp]

Really would be the worst way to get caught.

 

[Dr. Smokepuma]

well in my state the power company sent letter saying if anyone wants a free electronic thermostat they would install it free.with a digital power meter and it can save you money but ajusting your power usage. me no thanks. some people think its great they watching ya.they never said why or really what they are for.

 

[moses224]

you would think it would have been a small town..i know peeps that work at local power company and last thing they do is compare wattage ..you may get a call to discuss going green at which time you say you have a workshop in the garage and home computer with multiple monitors to trade forex ...but that would be a commissioned sales rep and would be rare.....

 

[whodair]

snitches are bitches yo

 

[pugnacious]

About the meter man.

If your 12/12 setup runs from 8pm-8am. When the meter man checks during the afternoon wouldnt it not show a large amount of consumption?

 

[CanaDan420]

hey pug, thats the same thing I was thinking but then again your still rackin it up

 

[pugnacious]

hey pug, thats the same thing I was thinking but then again your still rackin it up

But supposedly if youre running a grow at a private electric company. There not supposed to care.


Every grow busts I've read about or heard about was because of a snitch. Or worst case scenario stole electricity. If I lived in a town house, I wouldnt want the meterman seeing my meter running allot faster then my neighbors. If the only thing I had to worry about was the meterman, and not the electric company. Id run with it.

 

[gdup]

well in my state the power company sent letter saying if anyone wants a free electronic thermostat they would install it free.with a digital power meter and it can save you money but ajusting your power usage. me no thanks. some people think its great they watching ya.they never said why or really what they are for.

My electric company switched out all the thermostats in my area and didnt ask, all they did was send a letter. The reason they have the digital thermostats is not so much to moniter your every outlet usage (although they have the ability) but its actually so that the meter guy doesnt have to walk up to your house to read your meter. He can just drive by and it sends the information to him. Its much more efficient for the company and probably cuts down on hours. I think if you are in a house and you are running a "normal" amount of electricity for a home your size then you should be fine regardless of light cycles.

 

[Macster2]

Do you mean meter or thermostat??.A meter is what there switching out in my area and it sends usage in wirelessly,however I was told the next step is the thermostat then they can turn your air conditioning off if they are overloaded.