Dud Identification Collective Knowledge.

[xxxstr8edgexxx]

Right, what is it about that picture that confirms to you that it's a dud?

And what is the NPK ratio of the feed you're using and at what ec are you using it?

i think he already stated why it was a dud. read the dudes posts hes been posting on the topic for a while now. i dont know man, it seems like you need everything to be about nute issues so you can write about it. sometimes your pet issue just happens to not apply. you could let the thread continue if you dont have anything relevant or new to add. maybe do more than skim through before becoming the most posted member on the thread and ask real questions for the sake of listening and not ones that just lead back to your special topic it obvious that you assume that his problem is too much nitrogen and your question is hardly a question. its kind of insulting at this point. i think you are off base but maybe im wrong but you might give it a rest for a minute to allow the thread to continue by folks that have experience with this. no disrespect just a request for some etiquette.
thanks

 

[papaduc]

You're not requesting etiquette at all. What you're requesting is that I get in line and conform to what you're setting out I should think.

The only way to get to the bottom of anything at all is to isolate individual things and concentrate on them. You've made the assumption that I skimmed his posts, when I certainly did not. Why? On what basis do you make this assumption? On what evidence? That I haven't commented on anything else he has said and am asking for some information more than what he has posted? And you talk about insulting? What an ignorant and condescending way to talk to somebody.

I have just got back from spending fifteen minutes reading what stormshadow asked me to, to being told by you that I'm skimming and have an agenda. I was about to reply to him and then I saw this.

If you want to perpectuate negativity, and if it suits the theme of this thread for everyone to agree, then I only want you to know one thing - that in no way shape or form is that kind of mentality indicative of people with sound scientific or logical principles.

If you're theory is your conclusion then you are not theorising at all and you have made up your mind. And if you have made up your mind then why are you speculating about this test and that?

If there were a room full of botanists discussing what this issue was, nobody would attack a fellow member for not being inline with the general thinking. In fact they would welcome it. They'd welcome it because if everybody is driving in a different direction to isolate and eliminate possible causes then that is only a good thing. But that kind of thinking is prohibited largely when a thread gathers members who share a common idea. You want to be allowed to believe what you beleive and anyone who challenges that is deemed by you to be offensive or insulting; that very thinking is offensive and insulting in itself. To be told I am insulting people because I have asked for the NPK ratios of their plant food? Are you serious?

I'm asking you and anyone else who shares your way of thinking to step back from setting in place rigid boundaries with regards to what ideas people can have and what can be asked or discussed, if you have any ral intention of actually finding out what is going on here, or what does and what does not constitue symptoms which are possible viable examples of the problem.

Because if you are so short sighted as to take someone at their word despite a plant is showing CLEAR signs that it has been overfed a specific mineral, then you offer this particular subject very little if anything at all. And that is not directed at you personally, but anyone other free thought prohibitionists in this thread.

I didn't come here to become embroiled in a personal argument with anyone, and I have no intentions of making any of my posts personal, but some people cannot keep to the simple matter of some cannabis plants and make personal insinuations about motives and attitude when someone theorises something that people would rather forget.

If it serves the agenda of speculation and hysteria to discard any talk of boring things like nitrogen, potassium, phosphorus - regardless of whether experienced growers like myself suggest that these might be the problem - then what kind of principles are you even preaching?

This is a board about cannabis. And the irony that the views on here are so inline with the prohibitionists and institutionalised is surreal.

Be open minded and allow people to share THEIR views. Or have it that everyone should share yours. And see how far that gets you in your problem solving.

Take care.

 

[milkyjoe]

Hopefully someone is actually getting a test. Based on that test the thread can move forward. Until then people are too set in there thinking to accomplish anything except argument

 

[papaduc]

papaduc... will you please read the few pages in this link..

What do you think ? This is just a guess, but if you haven't taken the time to read through the tread...its a quick reading and gives you some insight into one theory ...

http://www1.agric.gov.ab.ca/$Depart...14324/$FILE/au-2013-olivier-aster-yellows.pdf

I did read it stormshadow. And I was about to reply with my theory about phytoplasma specifically and whether I believe, based on the evidence and symptoms described by people in this thread, that it is a viable cause. I was about to break it down and quote pieces from the page vs the symptoms discussed. But with all due respect I am not doing that now because I am wasting valuable time and energy on this thread discussing with people who believe they are above making mistakes in judgement, despite the fact the evidence proves that notion completely wrong.

The truth of the matter is, and I might as well just say this bluntly because I'll be no better thought of if I structure it any other way, but some of the people who deem themselves to be above making basic errors in judgement with regards to basic practices such as feeding, have made posts on this website which prove, not suggest, but prove, without doubt, that they are not qualified to dictate to anyone about what should or should not been eliminated as a possible cause.

If your case is in the hands of people like this, then you better get them samples off to someone qualified.

If given the freedom to do so, at the very least, I could identify and explain away at least some of the problems of some of the plants in this thread.

I am 100% sure of it and I wouldn't say that lightly.

I could suggest some changes in their procedure and they, and in turn you, could follow their results to see if it eliminated their problem.

And if I could do that, it would at least enable you to narrow down to a select number of cases to concentrate on, rather than every plant being sent for sample or every symptom categorised as one problem.

As it is, the barriers in the way are not worth overcoming just to achieve such a small thing.

NMFM on this now.
Good luck. And take care.

 

[unitedgrooves]

Right, what is it about that picture that confirms to you that it's a dud?

And what is the NPK ratio of the feed you're using and at what ec are you using it?

Hey papa, that pic u see there is what dud plants look like about 30 days in bloom. I've came across dudded plants in the past and this is not the first time so after multiple times dealing with sick plants u just know what to look for. Some of the the early symptoms I decscribed will give you an idea of things to look for. These were fed around 700 ppm of nutrients so it has nothing to do with npk ratios or ppms. Again the rest of the strains are doing just fine with the same feed in 2 different locations and diff styles of grow, problem here is the plant. So in short it has nothing to do with basic nutrient issues.

 

[xxxstr8edgexxx]

point taken. apologies for acting as though your input wasnt welcome. maybe a little over reaching on my part and quick to assume you were just trying to lump everyone into a square hole.
youre obviously a knowledgeable grower.
more so than i it would seem. that i cant make an error wasnt my assertion. i have nothing but guesses. however, i think it had been covered already.

as to the relatively new phenomena of dudding
my main issue with the posts was that if it were a nutrient issue we would have been seeing this for a lot longer than we have. it appeared to me that you were assuming that this was just another manifestation of the common issue of overfeeding. something i am as guilty of as anyone on here. yet it is not an outcome i see with chronic overfeeding,which i agree is rampant.as you know i am actually relearning and experimenting with unlearning the snakeoil regimined growing style and going to more simple and science based feeding program.

i had read in an earlier post that you were skimming through posts and not reading them all. it sounds as though that isnt what is going on. please dont let my chipped shoulder dissuade you from participating. if you are on to something tell me to back off and lay it down. im far from an authority on the subject nor am i in charge of the thread.

this has broken into squabbling a lot in the preceding months and i was seeing you as part of it.

so with apologies out of the way how do you see this as a nutrient issue? why do reckon it is so new given the long history of feeding cannabis inappropriately?

i can be dick as a lot of folks can at that time of day. i have appreciated many of your posts here and else where but i was seeing things fall into squabbling again. if that isnt your intention please accept my apology. i dont want you to fall in line with anything. i want to know what this is and isnt and have no favorite solution or hope that this theory i lean towards is right. i actually hope ypou are right i just cant see how that could be it. but if you are right it would be simple.feed differently. unfortunately it goes with this pattern, cut duds, cut replaced suddenly it performs, same nutes, how is it the nutes?

sorry for dickishness,
xxsexx

You're not requesting etiquette at all. What you're requesting is that I get in line and conform to what you're setting out I should think.

The only way to get to the bottom of anything at all is to isolate individual things and concentrate on them. You've made the assumption that I skimmed his posts, when I certainly did not. Why? On what basis do you make this assumption? On what evidence? That I haven't commented on anything else he has said and am asking for some information more than what he has posted? And you talk about insulting? What an ignorant and condescending way to talk to somebody.

I have just got back from spending fifteen minutes reading what stormshadow asked me to, to being told by you that I'm skimming and have an agenda. I was about to reply to him and then I saw this.

If you want to perpectuate negativity, and if it suits the theme of this thread for everyone to agree, then I only want you to know one thing - that in no way shape or form is that kind of mentality indicative of people with sound scientific or logical principles.

If you're theory is your conclusion then you are not theorising at all and you have made up your mind. And if you have made up your mind then why are you speculating about this test and that?

If there were a room full of botanists discussing what this issue was, nobody would attack a fellow member for not being inline with the general thinking. In fact they would welcome it. They'd welcome it because if everybody is driving in a different direction to isolate and eliminate possible causes then that is only a good thing. But that kind of thinking is prohibited largely when a thread gathers members who share a common idea. You want to be allowed to believe what you beleive and anyone who challenges that is deemed by you to be offensive or insulting; that very thinking is offensive and insulting in itself. To be told I am insulting people because I have asked for the NPK ratios of their plant food? Are you serious?

I'm asking you and anyone else who shares your way of thinking to step back from setting in place rigid boundaries with regards to what ideas people can have and what can be asked or discussed, if you have any ral intention of actually finding out what is going on here, or what does and what does not constitue symptoms which are possible viable examples of the problem.

Because if you are so short sighted as to take someone at their word despite a plant is showing CLEAR signs that it has been overfed a specific mineral, then you offer this particular subject very little if anything at all. And that is not directed at you personally, but anyone other free thought prohibitionists in this thread.

I didn't come here to become embroiled in a personal argument with anyone, and I have no intentions of making any of my posts personal, but some people cannot keep to the simple matter of some cannabis plants and make personal insinuations about motives and attitude when someone theorises something that people would rather forget.

If it serves the agenda of speculation and hysteria to discard any talk of boring things like nitrogen, potassium, phosphorus - regardless of whether experienced growers like myself suggest that these might be the problem - then what kind of principles are you even preaching?

This is a board about cannabis. And the irony that the views on here are so inline with the prohibitionists and institutionalised is surreal.

Be open minded and allow people to share THEIR views. Or have it that everyone should share yours. And see how far that gets you in your problem solving.

Take care.

 

[papaduc]

It's ok brother don't worry about it.

 

[Elmer Bud]

Originally Posted by papaduc View Post
Gaius,

Mate, I know there are some complete dickheads on these boards and others who just flat out refuse to acknowledge what people are trying to tell them. I'm not one of those people and I'm sure you're not either. Which is why I can't understand how you can't see that I am not categorising the people who you are referring to, with those who posted pictures in the beginning of this thread.

If you can't take my point in it's proper context then I'm just going round in circles. I'm not labeling anyone a shit grower or disrespecting any of the people who you are referring to when you talk about respected growers because I have not even once commented on what their issues are.

You're right, it's not hard to grow herb. But every single day you will see people who fail to do so because they don't understand the most basic aspects of growing. It's not because they're ignorant or stupid, but because like all of us at some point, they have never grown a plant and have not even the most basic gardening knowledge.



What you're basically saying is that because there are healthy plants in the pictures, it's impossible for the grower to have mistreated another one. That's completely flawed logic based on the numerous amount of people with sickly individual plants.

Before a clone properly re-vegetates 0.6ec of grow feed will turn it waxy. If it's sister re-vegetates before her and starts growing properly, she can take 1.0ec after a week or so and be fine.

These are key variables you are disregarding in order to come to that conclusion and are indicative of the kind of flaws in logic that are prevalent in the whole debate.

The accompanying text means absolutely nothing if the grower doesn't know what he/she has done wrong. I've lost count of the times a magnesium deficiency is misdiagnosed with pictures to prove it.

I hope you can better understand my point because this is not, and never is, a personal crusade against any individual. I enjoy growing plants and if what I say turns out to be factually correct then what that will mean is that throughout this entire, sometimes frustrating discussion, all I have tried to do is explain, for the benefit of the people reading, that what is at the beginning of this thread is certainly not some inexplicable phenomena.

You are free to disregard everything I say, as is everyone else. I am bound by what is logical, by what makes sense.

If you submitted these theories and this thread to any botanist I would imagine they would have no word to say against anything I have set out here because all I am saying is there is no scientific basis for these claims and no pictographic evidence which can't be explained quite easily. If that's the boring view to take, so be it.

I posted this in the GG4 thread the other day and this pretty much sums it up from me.

Based on what I said to dank frank, it's obvious I'm open minded to the possibility that there is something wrong with the specific cuts you are dealing with.

But I do reserve the right to be skeptical and have my own opinion. You're American right? Don't you agree with free speech and freedom to think and speculate?

The only two cases I've pointed out which I think are nitrogen toxicity are kushconnoisseur and stormshadow.

You're talking about experienced growers, well I'm an experienced grower myself and I'm asking you how you can look at those two cases and not see what is an obvious problem with either N toxicity, or overfeeding in general.

Look further into both those cases before you make snap judgements regarding what I'm saying about them. And if you want my opinion on this dud thing, look at my posts before that.

I am skeptical. I admit that. I am not dismissing anything out of hand. I'm not ignorant and I wouldn't do that. But because I'm not ignorant and because I like to remain open minded with regards the possibility of things, I am not going to believe that what is occurring is a rare genetic phenomenon which I, or anyone I know, have never seen once. Ever.

If this was a thread about ghosts, would I be equally unwelcome to stress the point that it might have been something more logical which could explain it?

I believe so many malpractices are a common part of indoor cannabis cultivation, and I believe this because a lot of people who do this have no previous gardening experience.

You only have to look at the market. I mean step back for a minute and just analyse the fucking nutrient market and then think to yourself, why?

Would these products be pushed onto the gardeners doing the flower shows?

Can you see monty don promoting the next bottle of magic potion bullshit with a garbage pail kid sticker on the front on the next episode of gardener's world?

No. Because they're not aimed at kids with no general horticultural knowledge whatsoever who are sold on gimmicks.

And why am I making this point?
Because you can apply this point to every single aspect of indoor marijuana horticulture.

On this site somewhere is a guide to keeping bonsai mother plants. It's written by one of the most knowledgeable growers I've spoken to online. His name is Oldtimer1.

In relation to potting up practices, using perlite etc, he was talking about the culture of cannabis growing in the states and how it started out.

Back in the day when people started growing their own herb, they had no knowledge of basic gardening, and it reflected in how they started their seeds.
What people would do is take a massive pot of dirt and stick the seed in the middle.
The seed would dry out too quickly because of the surrounding dirt, so they soaked the whole pot. But then the soil turned anaerobic and stale and the seed would usually rot. To combat this they added perlite, then more perlite... and more. Until the seedling could be watered without rotting. What they ended up with was a massive pot of mostly perlite with a tiny seed in the middle.

They had no concept of the idea of potting up, a basic gardening practice which had already been in practice in the UK and elsewhere for a long time.

Slowly, but surely, people began to cotton onto to the fact that this was obviously the way to go.

Now you won't see many people starting seeds that way without someone popping in and telling them `hey, that's too big a pot`...

It took a long time. That was more than a generation ago.

Now, calmag has replaced perlite. And fulvic, humic, enzyme, vitamin b, carbs, amino acid, bacteria, silicon... have replaced basic plant food.

Go to the sick plant forum. See how many pages you can look through before a miscalcuation of calcium deficiency is diagnosed. And I'm not talking newbs either. I've seen enough so called vets on here making bad and wrong diagnosis of magnesium and calcium deficiency, in fact it's become part of your general culture over there to apply these two things to your daily schedule. In the uk you might not be able to find a grower who's ever seen a bottle.

Is the water so much different?
Or is it a matter of basic practice and where, or rather who, we get our information from?

Ask yourself, and be honest. Be as open minded and critical as you're asking me to be.

In fact go to the flower shots forum.
If you say you know what N toxicity/overfert looks like, you will find a shot on nearly every page, and I'm not exaggerating. Maybe more than one per page.

I've got one cut now out of 15 which sprouted massive long internodes and stretched up like strings of spaghetti. Why did the others not do this but that one did?

I'll tell you why.

When a clone takes root, it's above ground growth is almost like a frame, stuck in stasis. At a certain point, it resumes growth, safe that it has a certain amount of roots to sustain itself.

If, at the point when it resumes growth, the cut is fresh and green, the clone can resume growth like it would if it was still connected to the mother plant.

But if the growth which is already there has lignified, what essentially happens is the new shoot is almost a separate growth emerging from a piece of woody bark. In that case you will see shoots spring from it just like they would a revegging clone.

If you take a fully formed bud and you root it, like I have here https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=263772 what emerges is a spindly little shoot which has no connection to where it came from other than that it is attached. The bud itself is no longer alive and will die off. Unless you've seen it or have experience of doing this you will have no idea what I am talking about.

With those cuts you are talking about which stretch further than the others, if you cut them right back to a nice healthy shoot, and hit them with proper light, I will almost guarantee the resultant growth will be much stronger than what was there before.

Is this because it went through and came back out of a genetic trance? Or is it something explainable by basic plant physiology?
It's a physiological response you can disregard to call it a dud if you want. But it's one which I am well familiar with and am absolutely certain has nothing whatsoever to do with it.

We can all believe what we want at the end of the day, and I am definitely not going to be swayed by public opinion which I see first hand on a daily basis every time I log onto these boards is wrong a lot of the time.

You can bang on all you want about why I should listen but first you need to address the very prevalent errors which are a significant part of the community. When people understand about general gardening and understand techniques and principles to navigate basic situations, then, and only then, can you expect people with that knowledge to put faith in their judgement.

But while there are so many completely fucked up if not at least a little dodgy practices going on, it's hard for me to discount the possibility that something else might be wrong. I would be stupid and blind ignorant to do so based on the evidence on these boards.
the funny thing is that you think your telling me things i don't know about growing.

anyway, i'm not into repeating myself and going on and on back and forth, i've said my peace and nothing you've said has changed my mind.

the issue this thread is about, is not grower error related. sure some might mistakenly post pics here, or misdiagnose dud-ism, but that isn't to say that the main topic of the thread is about a grower error related problem.

what exactly the issue is, remains to be seen, i'm hopping the testing that's been initiated and will be done in future, will clear things up. thats what this thread is actually for, it's to share results or direct experience with this particular issue, what ever it turns out to be. this thread is a collective effort to find out exactly what it is and what can be done to stop it etc.

this thread is not about problems that are grower related, this is about those situations where it happens under perfect conditions, only to some plants, or even to individual branches of a plant.

You're not requesting etiquette at all. What you're requesting is that I get in line and conform to what you're setting out I should think.

The only way to get to the bottom of anything at all is to isolate individual things and concentrate on them. You've made the assumption that I skimmed his posts, when I certainly did not. Why? On what basis do you make this assumption? On what evidence? That I haven't commented on anything else he has said and am asking for some information more than what he has posted? And you talk about insulting? What an ignorant and condescending way to talk to somebody.

I have just got back from spending fifteen minutes reading what stormshadow asked me to, to being told by you that I'm skimming and have an agenda. I was about to reply to him and then I saw this.

If you want to perpectuate negativity, and if it suits the theme of this thread for everyone to agree, then I only want you to know one thing - that in no way shape or form is that kind of mentality indicative of people with sound scientific or logical principles.

If you're theory is your conclusion then you are not theorising at all and you have made up your mind. And if you have made up your mind then why are you speculating about this test and that?

If there were a room full of botanists discussing what this issue was, nobody would attack a fellow member for not being inline with the general thinking. In fact they would welcome it. They'd welcome it because if everybody is driving in a different direction to isolate and eliminate possible causes then that is only a good thing. But that kind of thinking is prohibited largely when a thread gathers members who share a common idea. You want to be allowed to believe what you beleive and anyone who challenges that is deemed by you to be offensive or insulting; that very thinking is offensive and insulting in itself. To be told I am insulting people because I have asked for the NPK ratios of their plant food? Are you serious?

I'm asking you and anyone else who shares your way of thinking to step back from setting in place rigid boundaries with regards to what ideas people can have and what can be asked or discussed, if you have any ral intention of actually finding out what is going on here, or what does and what does not constitue symptoms which are possible viable examples of the problem.

Because if you are so short sighted as to take someone at their word despite a plant is showing CLEAR signs that it has been overfed a specific mineral, then you offer this particular subject very little if anything at all. And that is not directed at you personally, but anyone other free thought prohibitionists in this thread.

I didn't come here to become embroiled in a personal argument with anyone, and I have no intentions of making any of my posts personal, but some people cannot keep to the simple matter of some cannabis plants and make personal insinuations about motives and attitude when someone theorises something that people would rather forget.

If it serves the agenda of speculation and hysteria to discard any talk of boring things like nitrogen, potassium, phosphorus - regardless of whether experienced growers like myself suggest that these might be the problem - then what kind of principles are you even preaching?

This is a board about cannabis. And the irony that the views on here are so inline with the prohibitionists and institutionalised is surreal.

Be open minded and allow people to share THEIR views. Or have it that everyone should share yours. And see how far that gets you in your problem solving.

Take care.

TLDR

G`day Papaduc

The reason people are accusing you of skimming is you don`t seem to have comprehended the thread .
Maybe its one of those " You had to be there " moments . But you are chewing up a lot of bites spinning your wheels ATM .

Or maybe like Rita said "those that know it feel it ."

Thanks for sharin

EB .

 

[RetroGrow]

 

[xxxstr8edgexxx]

a little update.
talked to the lab and they didnt have the phytoplasma tests in yet. they also said that the tmv required more leaf material than i provided and since they did find some fungus they descided it would be a better use of material to use it to culture for identification of that to rule it out as a pathogen. nothing mentioned about the verticilium or fusarium but it was a lab grunt who knew very little and said that it would all be relayed by the lab team leader tomorrow. she said she was making a leap to even read it to me because it was unfinished and no leab personel working on it were ther when i called.

on a random other test i got for tmv i ran on the leaves of the wifi that is not a dud that have that swirly marble verigation generally accused of being bms or viral, they ran 4 tests.

all viral assays.

tmv negatory
cucumber mosaic virus, negatory.
two others i didnt write down but i will get a copy of the names. identified as a number letter code for the virus were both negatory.

i know its not much news but thats all i got til tomorow.

 

[xxxstr8edgexxx]

see edit ^^^^

 

[papaduc]

you are chewing up a lot of bites
.

Then it's probably a better idea not to quote my posts than take up another page with them.

Hooroo

a little update.
talked to the lab and they didnt have the phytoplasma tests in yet. they also said that the tmv required more leaf material than i provided and since they did find some fungus they descided it would be a better use of material to use it to culture for identification of that to rule it out as a pathogen. nothing mentioned about the verticilium or fusarium but it was a lab grunt who knew very little and said that it would all be relayed by the lab team leader tomorrow. she said she was making a leap to even read it to me because it was unfinished and no leab personel working on it were ther when i called.

on a random other test i got for tmv i ran on the leaves of the wifi that is not a dud that have that swirly marble verigation generally accused of being bms or viral, they ran 4 tests.

all viral assays.

tmv negatory
cucumber mosaic virus, negatory.
two others i didnt write down but i will get a copy of the names. identified as a number letter code for the virus were both negatory.

i know its not much news but thats all i got til tomorow.

Make sure when you're sending samples in that you're sending tissues from healthy looking cuts as well.

 

[RetroGrow]

a little update.
talked to the lab and they didnt have the phytoplasma tests in yet. they also said that the tmv required more leaf material than i provided and since they did find some fungus they descided it would be a better use of material to use it to culture for identification of that to rule it out as a pathogen. nothing mentioned about the verticilium or fusarium but it was a lab grunt who knew very little and said that it would all be relayed by the lab team leader tomorrow. she said she was making a leap to even read it to me because it was unfinished and no leab personel working on it were ther when i called.

on a random other test i got for tmv i ran on the leaves of the wifi that is not a dud that have that swirly marble verigation generally accused of being bms or viral, they ran 4 tests.

all viral assays.

tmv negatory
cucumber mosaic virus, negatory.
two others i didnt write down but i will get a copy of the names. identified as a number letter code for the virus were both negatory.

i know its not much news but thats all i got til tomorow.

Did you ask them to test for Hemp Streak Virus?
Just curious. That may be the same test as that for TMV. Not sure.
So they found fungi, but haven't identified it yet?
I would be surprised if they didn't find fungi, as almost everything has some fungi on it. Fusarium is fungal, so
presumably that hasn't been ruled out yet. Some of the pictures posted earlier in the thread sure looked like fusarium wilt. I guess we shall see, eventually.

 

[Loc Dog]

I do not have TMV, according to Agdia test strips!!!!!!!

Hooray for me, but the mystery goes on!!!

Initial growth was mutant, and very slow grower.

 

[Grizz]

well I have had some of DJ'a blue berrys look like total twisted up crazy looking mutant things. wouldent even suggest they were duds or infected

 

[RetroGrow]

I do not have TMV, according to Agdia test strips!!!!!!!

Hooray for me, but the mystery goes on!!!

Initial growth was mutant, and very slow grower.

One down, and a couple hundred diseases to check...

 

[Loc Dog]

My seeds were not GG4, but Adubb X GDPS, from Standard Seed Collective. Straightedge also had negative results on GG4, from a lab.

 

[xxxstr8edgexxx]

My seeds were not GG4, but Adubb X GDPS, from Standard Seed Collective. Straightedge also had negative results on GG4, from a lab.

no thats not what i said. i have never tested a gg4 in a lab.
i did test an o.g. that was dudding. long story short none of the tests

are done yet. likely tomorrow. they also tested a NON-DUDDED WIFI that had the weird swirly streaky variegation that everyone calls tmv or bms. it has neither. ran three other viruses including cucumber mosaic. all negative.

never ran a gg#4 through a lab. but i did harvest a branch today at 57 days just to look at her. im a little impatient sometimes hahah she is a dense little mama. i wouldnt call her a brick shithouse but she is dense as fuck compared to what i was expecting. little bit leggy but not like an og at all. a little more laterally inclined but definitely long inter nodal space once she starts tto climb.

 

[Loc Dog]

??

 

[xxxstr8edgexxx]

Make sure when you're sending samples in that you're sending tissues from healthy looking cuts as well.

i didnt. im not so much concerned with the control on this. if the other cuts have it too i suppose it would tell us alot about presentation on the swirly leaf thingy. the dud wasnt mine. it was mailed to me from a room that had it growing with other healthy cuts.
whats your reasoning. seems expensive and unnecessary for my purpose of mere diagnostics.
i could see it if i were conducting a more complex experiment but im just trying to sniff out a cause.