Defoliation: Hi-Yield Technique?

[Bassy59]

It took me about 1 hour per plant at this point to totally defoliate and my plants are only about 30" tall for some stupid reason (I think I Topped too early?) I sure hope all of the time was worth it. To me it does make sense, all the bud sites are getting BLASTED with light now.

Not the best pics, but I've attached a couple of after shots.

You can see the 2nd pic how transparent the plants have become with my vertical bulb setup.

30" is a nice number. Did you hit them while they were still in stretch? If so, from what I have seen, that will literally shut down stretch. Which can be good if you reach the desired height before stretch is over.

Also, Not flipping them to 12/12 until after they have re-vegged fully. If they are still on releaf mode when we flip after a strip I think it really slows them down. I could be wrong, but I really saw a difference this grow waiting one full week after I stripped in veg before flipping to 12/12.

Yours appear to be a bit slender. Maybe it's just the pics. Did you strip in veg also?

 

[Bassy59]

Posted these in my thread but figured they could be posted here as well.

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This was taken right after defoliating for about the third time. 15 days into flower.

Was your grow from seedling paperchase?

The nodes seem a bit far apart. Or maybe sativa dominate? I have a grow in flower now at 40 days on a 56-63 day schedule from seed, and they are much tighter nodes spacing. I stripped mine twice in veg. As well as topping.

Just curious.

 

[paperchaser825]

Was your grow from seedling paperchase?

The nodes seem a bit far apart. Or maybe sativa dominate? I have a grow in flower now at 40 days on a 56-63 day schedule from seed, and they are much tighter nodes spacing. I stripped mine twice in veg. As well as topping.

Just curious.

Yes, they were from seed. The one in the back right has a lot more nodes than the other 3. They came from a mixed bag of feminized seeds so no telling what they are.

 

[Dickkhead]

this is complete nonsense I tried it and my buds are thinner then the ones I didnt do it to

 

[Bassy59]

this is complete nonsense I tried it and my buds are thinner then the ones I didnt do it to

1. did you read the thread in detail? Including the pdf located on the 1st post?

2. At what points did you defoliate?

3. Did you defoliate during stretch or after? what about in veg?

4. Did you bend to open the canopy?

5. It's pretty hard to claim "complete nonsense" when people have shown yields of 10 oz or more, up to 19 oz, per plant while using this technique.

6. Lest we forget, k33f (the op of this thread) points how it's important this technique is used by experienced growers that have their regular methods down pat, and with success. It's extremely important there are no other issues. It can be extremely easy to blame poor results on a new technique when one had an issue of some other sort during the grow. Things like temps, proper light (no less than 50w sf), good air intake, water temps(hydro), quality nutrients at proper feeding schedules, proper medium size ( I dont think this is designed for 2L hempy, but that's just opinion) so roots are not bound, etc, etc.

But hey, you may be right. All these people getting massive yields may be wrong.

I am 2 weeks from chopping my best grow yet. Buds have been rock hard for 2+ weeks already, stink to no end, and just sticky as all get out. Maybe it was all because of my water and defoliation had nothing to do with it.

 

[Dickkhead]

1. did you read the thread in detail? Including the pdf located on the 1st post?

2. At what points did you defoliate?

3. Did you defoliate during stretch or after? what about in veg?

4. Did you bend to open the canopy?

5. It's pretty hard to claim "complete nonsense" when people have shown yields of 10 oz or more, up to 19 oz, per plant while using this technique.

6. Lest we forget, k33f (the op of this thread) points how it's important this technique is used by experienced growers that have their regular methods down pat, and with success. It's extremely important there are no other issues. It can be extremely easy to blame poor results on a new technique when one had an issue of some other sort during the grow. Things like temps, proper light (no less than 50w sf), good air intake, water temps(hydro), quality nutrients at proper feeding schedules, proper medium size ( I dont think this is designed for 2L hempy, but that's just opinion) so roots are not bound, etc, etc.

But hey, you may be right. All these people getting massive yields may be wrong.

I am 2 weeks from chopping my best grow yet. Buds have been rock hard for 2+ weeks already, stink to no end, and just sticky as all get out. Maybe it was all because of my water and defoliation had nothing to do with it.

Maybe ur right and didnt defoliate at the right time I'll give it 1 more go
Just to clear things up what are the techniques you use correct me if I'm wrong but I was gna defoliate at day 21 of veg and every 2 weeks after and then again after the stretch and leave them alone. Till there done

 

[St3ve]

Maybe ur right and didnt defoliate at the right time I'll give it 1 more go
Just to clear things up what are the techniques you use correct me if I'm wrong but I was gna defoliate at day 21 of veg and every 2 weeks after and then again after the stretch and leave them alone. Till there done

Close but no.

Start after about the first full week of veg when they are going strong.
Then ONCE per week.
The last time, about a week before stretch.
Then, once around 21-25 days after they are DONE stretching.

Then I usually only pull a leaf here or there that is shading something pretty bad.

 

[Dickkhead]

Close but no.

Start after about the first full week of veg when they are going strong.
Then ONCE per week.
The last time, about a week before stretch.
Then, once around 21-25 days after they are DONE stretching.

Then I usually only pull a leaf here or there that is shading something pretty bad.

Ok Im gna give it a shot
Thanks

 

[punjab420]

Would this be beneficial for outdoor growing aswell?

 

[St3ve]

Would this be beneficial for outdoor growing aswell?

It depends on if you plant has unlimited room to grow or not. If it DOES.. and can just grow as big as it wants then NO I would not use this technique.
If the plant needs to stay smaller for one reason or another, then yes I would say it would help.

 

[punjab420]

yea space is limited, I've been looking in to this and different techniques trying to figure out what is best. Its hard to make a choice.
I like this because it also helps disguise the plants a bit

 

[St3ve]

then yes absolutely I would do it.

 

[Field&Stream]

Talk about scary, I want to try this because I'm growing some indica dominate strains right now with alot of big fat leaves blocking major budsites. I'm on day 19 right now and I have been bending the tops to allow more light to penetrate.

I know I haven't been doing it since veg but do you still think I should do it? I mean I normally pluck a fan here and there and any leaf that looks like its shading everything to much but plucking off all of them is scary to me lol. It's because I never done it and it's different, but I probably felt the same way the first time I pinched a branch and had it collapse, or topping, FIM, ect, ect.

Another thing on my mind is how stressful is it? Does anyone get more hermies with this method? The reason I ask is because when I've done lollipopping sometimes the plants hermied shortly after because I think some plants react to the stress of the severe pruning.

 

[magiccannabus]

I've been defoliating all my new veg plants. My current ones in flower got it a little, but not in veg. My current plants have had problems, but it turned out to be a root pest leading to pythium, and they're doing better now. I really thought at first it was the defoliation, but I was wrong. All my new veg plants are really happy, full of closely packed nodes. This method makes vegging take longer. I haven't noticed any real delay though on the growth. You pluck the big leaves and the plant immediately starts growing the next set up the shoot. It really just stunts that vegetative growth from that internode to the next one up the shoot, so when you pull that fan, that's about as long as that stem section is going to get. It will stretch with the rest of the plant, but the internodal space will be much smaller. If you have the extra veg time like in a perpetual setup, this method absolutely rocks. I am so glad I kept an open mind about it.

I should also add that someone said earlier something like "we're trying to grow buds, not leaves", and I totally agree. I've designed enough solar arrays to know that stacking them and crowding them into sub-optimal conditions can be worse than unproductive. The plants seem to do just fine. They need at least a few layers of leaves to cover the penetration of the light into the canopy, but indoor plants under artificial and stationary lights often are grown to densities and profiles that are not natural. This makes way more leaves than the plant really needs. I think late in flower you should not take them off as they are feeding the buds, but in in veg I am completely convinced they are fair game. I would let them grow back from it just a bit before flipping to 12/12. Unless you're trying to halt stretch completely. I defoliated right before flip, and my plants stretched about 20%, and I'm almost on day 60. I also use side-lighting, so that is a factor obviously as well. Still, the lack of stretch is truly strange and others have reported the same so I would avoid it right before the flip. Just my personal experience, hope it helps.

 

[dtrain01]

Lol I totally agree! This is amazing stuff.

 

[G.O. Joe]

It's pretty hard to claim "complete nonsense" when people have shown yields of 10 oz or more, up to 19 oz, per plant while using this technique.

Not everyone gets these yields of dry well-trimmed buds in their hands with their strains, while using this technique. People should be allowed to state truthful results, whichever they are.

 

[Bassy59]

Nobody is being stopped from stating their actual yields. Taken in proper context on my post above, the point is being made to those that flat out say defoliation doesnt work and emphatically say how bad it is for the plants. Yet probably 100% of those naysayers have never tried the technique either. Certainly not in the same fashion as described in this thread.

I'm probably about 1 week away from harvesting my 2nd attempt on defoliation, and first attempt going completely from veg with each plant in individual 5g buckets. (1st attempt was multiple plants in tubs-not suggested).

I had some serious light issues at early flower for about 3 weeks. And I now also believe (as our op originally told me in fact) that 4 plants is too many in a 4'x4' tent. Three would be much better. So I am sure I overcrowded the tent with just 4 plants. But I think I'll probably see 14-16oz of very tight good buds. I wont complain one bit as I'm still learning the technique.

I'm growing fewer plants and yielding more.

My next grow is in veg, Kosher Kush, has been defoliated once so far, but the nodes aren't as tight as the Master Kush from my current grow. Yet the plan is to either buy a new tent at 5'x5' and grow these 4 out, or only run 3 of the 4 into flower using the technique. Saving the 4th for a mother and getting some clones going which should give me tighter nodes too for the following grow.

It's all a process. It takes time to learn, even for the more experienced growers. For us newer growers, this requires much patience to learn and experience. Figure out what to do that could improve what your asking the defoliated plant to do, etc. For me, I added more light, and I am reducing # of plants so the crowding isnt there. **Not crowding or shading budsites and allowing light to get everywhere is what this is all about in the end after all.

 

[SneakySneaky]

Bassy, doesn't matter if it's 3 or 4 plants in that tent as long as they create your desired canopy size. It's all about how you grow your plants and some strains grow bushy some straight like a stick. I know people that use 16 plant sog to fill a 4x4 where I use 1 big plant screened down. Like they said in the very beginning this technique is for more experienced growers and I understand why. For example: Og, bubba, and cheese are 3 completely diff growth types, lanky, squatty, bushy. Only through experience can a grower know how to utilize each plants unique growth pattern to still create the same exact size canopy. Don't disregard the op's advice though, overcrowding lowers yield considerably. Just make the canopy the final goal when your vegging them, whether you need 1 or 4 plants to achieve it depends on strain and veg style.

 

[Blaz3]

are these too small to defoliate?

 

[St3ve]

If it was me, I would defoliate the larger ones and leave the smaller ones alone. This will stunt the larger ones a little also and give the small ones time to catch up. Then in a week or so the smaller ones will be there and you can defoliate them together as needed.