Cloning Feminized Autos and Reversing the Sex on the Clones with STS for Pollen

[gorilla ganja]

When are you taking a clone from the donor auto-flower?

As soon as a suitable branch or top is ready for cloning. 3-4 weeks from sprout.

I meant using the same plant for both the pollen donor and the female to pollinate.

I've gotten a few seeds this way as well. Usually spray the top of the plant and leave lowers to catch pollen.
The seed plant has to be taken long past the usual harvest time for this to work.

 

[Ringodoggie]

Well, it's been over 2 weeks since the last STS application and the clones have, pretty much gone back to female. I am still getting some pollen sacs here and there but most of them are empty or just turn brown and fall off.

Perhaps I should have continued to spray them for a little longer. I didn't get much pollen. When I saw a sac open completely, I would put a piece of foil under it and then pick it off with a pair of fine tweezers. Then, I would dust fresh white haired buds with the pollen and whatever fell on the foil got tapped onto whatever fresh looking bud was available. it was very scientific and controlled.................... caveman style. LOL

Anyway, it looks like I might have been lucky because I see what I think are seed clusters forming. With any luck I might actually succeed.

I did notice 2 sources of pollen. One was the standard pollen sac and that's a good thing. But, there were also a fair amount of 'nanners' present on some buds. I'm not sure if those were a valid part of the reversal or if those plants got stressed and hermied. In which case, the seeds would likely be hermie seeds.

Here are a couple updated pics. That first lady looks like she is sporting seeds but the second one, I'm not so sure.

Another weird thing. The mother plants are starting to sprout white pistils again. I know plants do that on occasion but I wonder if the presence of pollen made those plants extend their flowering time in hopes of being pollinated. Little white nipples popping right out of the top of the main cola. See pics 8 and 10.

 

[Timj]

Looking good @Ringodoggie. It will be interesting to see how your feminized auto-flower seeds turn out using STS.

 

[Ringodoggie]

I am still not seeing any brown seeds yet, but I am hoping all these green pods are seeds inside.

I assume about 4 weeks from pollination to mature seeds???

Just for timeline's sake, these clones were taken when the mothers were 3 weeks from sprout. The clones are now in week 8 since cloning and week 11 since sprouting from seed.

From what I can tell with this test, the clock does indeed reset when they are cloned and starts again after roots are formed (about 2 weeks). These clones look every bit like an auto in week 6.

STS treatment was started 2 days after cloning and stopped 4 weeks later after 7 treatments.

Most of the trichs are clear or cloudy. No real amber presence yet.

 

[gorilla ganja]

I assume about 4 weeks from pollination to mature seeds???

Depends on light hrs. I usually do 4 minimum, 5 is better. Pick one out and make sure they are nice and developed before harvesting the plant.

 

[Ringodoggie]

Cool, thanks. I wasn't quite sure how to harvest the seeds. One by one as they ripen or the entire plant all at once.

I'll pick them out and inspect them one at a time until it seems like most of the plant is ripe. Then, go for it.

Thanks again. I am pretty excited. These are the first seeds I have produced since about 2014 when I started buying commercial seeds.

 

[Ringodoggie]

Depends on light hrs.

Good point. I am still at 19 hours on as is recommended for autos. However, since we are in seed mode, might 12 hrs be better?

Thanks for mentioning that.

 

[gorilla ganja]

I am pretty excited. These are the first seeds I have produced since about 2014

Best of luck. If you can feel them in the pods you have seeds developing.
I would stay on 19hrs of light. I just meant the more hrs of light the fewer days it takes for seeds to be ready. For example 4 weeks of 24hrs= 8 weeks of 12/12 for growth.
If you just pollinated once or a few days apart the seeds will pretty much be ready at the same time.
As they age you will see some seed pods split open and you will be able to see the mature seeds. Most seeds will darken as they mature, but I have a few strains that produce lighter tan-coloured seeds.

 

[Ringodoggie]

Have a cigar, I'm a Daddy.... LOL

I saw a seed laying in the dirt that dropped out all by itself. I inspected the plants and most all have a zillion green seeds and pods but only a few brownies are emerging. Another week or 2 and I should be pulling out some nice seeds.

These seeds rolled right out of the bud into my hand except the obvious immature one. I felt a little 'pluck' when I pulled it off the bud so I knew it wasn't done yet.

Last time I put fresh seeds into a plastic vial I got mold on them so I am using little paper envelops for now. Once they dry a little I can move them. Sound right?

The one seed pic is with and without flash for color clarity.

 

[Timj]

Have a cigar, I'm a Daddy.... LOL

I saw a seed laying in the dirt that dropped out all by itself. I inspected the plants and most all have a zillion green seeds and pods but only a few brownies are emerging. Another week or 2 and I should be pulling out some nice seeds.

These seeds rolled right out of the bud into my hand except the obvious immature one. I felt a little 'pluck' when I pulled it off the bud so I knew it wasn't done yet.

Last time I put fresh seeds into a plastic vial I got mold on them so I am using little paper envelops for now. Once they dry a little I can move them. Sound right?

The one seed pic is with and without flash for color clarity.


View attachment 18867625

With my auto-flower cross I harvested only the seeds that were ready to fall out. My seed harvest lasted around 3 weeks. I dry my cannabis seeds the same way I do my flower and vegetable seeds. I lay out paper towels and make a single layer of seeds. I dry them for around 2 weeks in a room that is kept around 50% RH. My auto flower seeds lost their strips just like yours are. But, I did have a few germinant as early as a few days after harvest. I think I linked you to my journal on GC in a PM. It is all well documented over there.

1. She's alive. My first tester seed from the Critical Purple auto-flower. This seed was 24 days old from the point I removed the male. It took 4 days to break the soil surface. I started another seed today that is 31 days old.

   

   
   

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   TimJ, Aug 30, 2022
   

   Update on my Critical purple cross. Seed #1 is now 4 days old.

   

   Seed #2 is just about to break the surface. Seed #2 germinated one day faster.

   

 

[gorilla ganja]

I'm a Daddy

Congrats.

I agree with @Timj A couple of weeks at least of drying before storing in vials/plastic bags.

 

[Ringodoggie]

What is the best nutrient routine during seed production?

Heavy flower nutes? No nutes?

Thanks

 

[gorilla ganja]

What is the best nutrient routine during seed production?

Heavy flower nutes? No nutes?

Thanks

Good question. I don't know what is best, I just try and keep them happy. Just follow the regular flowering routine and adjust if needed to keep them healthy.
Mind you I have harvested healthy seeds from less-than-healthy plants many times as well.

 

[Creeperpark]

A good rule of thumb is healthy plants make healthy seeds. Keep your plant happy and healthy and she will give the best she's got.

 

[Timj]

I grow my seed plants in the same living organic medium as I use for everything else. I cannot offer any suggestion as to adding nutrients based upon experience.. Having said that, it is a flowering plant trying to finish it's life cycle and carry its genetics over to the next generation. So, if I was using bottled nutrients I'd keep feeding light flowering nutrients until I harvested my seeds.

 

[Ringodoggie]

Wow, I'll bet I'm going to get a thousand seeds. These tiny clones are spitting out seeds like a Space Invaders game. LOL I have close to a hundred seeds already and that's just what falls out in my hands when I inspect the plants.

I think we are getting close to harvest time. Although, I still see new and undeveloped seeds coming in new all the time.

How long will a plant produce seeds? Is there an optimal harvest time? Can seeds get "too ripe" on the vine?

Damn, I am dumber than I thought. LOL

Plus, I think this giant mother/donor got pollinated as well.. She is in week 14. Way too long for an auto.

My genetics choices on this experiment were just random. And, with 4 types of pollen and using my shotgun approach, I have no idea what these seeds will produce (if anything).

But, I sure am going to have a shitload of them. LOL

This experiment was really just on sex reversal. Next time, I'll actually look at breeding.

Thanks to all for the guidance and help along the way.

Some updated pics.....

 

[gorilla ganja]

How long will a plant produce seeds? Is there an optimal harvest time? Can seeds get "too ripe" on the vine?

Outdoors I have had seeds actually sprout while still on the mother plant. High humidity and rain caused it.
So yes I guess you can leave them too long.
On an autoflower, most seeds are ready 5-6 weeks after pollination. Sometimes as little as 4 weeks and they are done. Yours look done. There will be some duds, but time will not help them.

 

[Ringodoggie]

Well, the harvest is in. I cleaned most of it and let it sit for a few days while I laid a new floor in my man cave. About 600 sf so far with about 400 more to go. Fucking Pergo is a pain in the ass to lay. You need to hammer every piece into place with a rubber hammer. I hit my fingers so many fucking times. My back is aching. LOL Labor is really hard to find around here and when you do, they do shitty work for high mooney. Fuck them.

As for the seeds, I don't know what's going to sprout from these seeds but based on quantity alone, I am pretty happy with this experiment. I am going to separate the best seeds and put them in envelopes of about 10 each.

I'll update in a few weeks when I see what sprouts. I put about 12 seeds into dirt today so.........

to be continued.

 

[Timj]

Well, the harvest is in. I cleaned most of it and let it sit for a few days while I laid a new floor in my man cave. About 600 sf so far with about 400 more to go. Fucking Pergo is a pain in the ass to lay. You need to hammer every piece into place with a rubber hammer. I hit my fingers so many fucking times. My back is aching. LOL Labor is really hard to find around here and when you do, they do shitty work for high mooney. Fuck them.

As for the seeds, I don't know what's going to sprout from these seeds but based on quantity alone, I am pretty happy with this experiment. I am going to separate the best seeds and put them in envelopes of about 10 each.

I'll update in a few weeks when I see what sprouts. I put about 12 seeds into dirt today so.........

to be continued.

Awesome seed harvest @Ringodoggie .

 

[Ringodoggie]

So, this is what your tent looks like when you have a near unlimited supply of free seeds, eh? LOL

I planted 20 of my offspring seeds from this experiment just to see if they were fertile seeds. 18 grew into nice plants. I really only have room for about 10 or 12 plants so I felt the only thing to do was..... plant more seeds. LOL

I have no idea what I am going to do with all these. LOL I have room in the tent for 6 large or 8 small plants. I have some room on my patio but with my HOA on their own little war against drugs they will probably stop my patio growing.

The back 2 rows are the first batch and were planted August 9th. The same day I harvested the seeds.

The rest were germed in paper towels (which I usually do not do) and were planted around August 21st through the 24th.

Should be a fun crop. I am curious to see what type of plants these will be. I had 3 or 4 different strains all blowing pollen to every other plant. Shotgun breeding. LOL

Another neat experiment was the test tube. It's a plastic tube with a hole in the bottom and in the lid. Tossed in a little Happy Frog, put a seed in and a little more Frog. Soak and set aside. Worked pretty neat. The seedling seems to have some nice roots. I'll let it go for a week or so and see what happens.