Chitosan

[Terps]

Thanks for the fast response Only Ornamental FPE stands for fermented plant extract. I like to make it from steeping comfrey in water.

What kind of preservative would suffice to give it a longer shelf life?

 

[Only Ornamental]

I assumed you'd ask that question *g*.
Now, the choice depends on several factors (this late at night, I might forget half of 'em):
- Age of plants (young, fully matured, mid/late flowering)
- Application (foliar v.s. irrigation)
- Concentration (of the stock solution and final applied solution)
- How eco-friendly it should be (synthetic, natural identical, natural)
- Price and accessibility (where to get the desired small amounts)
- Positive/negative side effects on your plants (depends also on points 1-3)
- Solvent/water quality (tap, RO, or dd water, extracts/ferments, non-aqueous)
- Other ingredients besides chitosan
- Storage (room temp, fridge)
- Desired shelf life (weeks, months)
- pH (least issue)

The easiest, cheapest, and safest version would be with alcohols/polyols which reduce what's called water activity. Requires testing if chitosan remains soluble and works best for foliar applications, though.

 

[kalopatchkid]

I'm curious if anyone has successfully used chitosan oligo. to beat Powdery Mildew in flower?

I dont have any PM to try it out on but i've used the stuff off ebay 3x on my current cycle and about 2-3 days after it looks like someone dumped powdered sugar on everything.

 

[neverforget4/20]

I'm curious if anyone has successfully used chitosan oligo. to beat Powdery Mildew in flower?

I dont have any PM to try it out on but i've used the stuff off ebay 3x on my current cycle and about 2-3 days after it looks like someone dumped powdered sugar on everything.

Ive got the ebay stuff as well. What concentration did you use? Did you mix w anything other than water?

Got a pic of those sugar coated buds?

Thanks bro

 

[kalopatchkid]

Ive got the ebay stuff as well. What concentration did you use? Did you mix w anything other than water?

Got a pic of those sugar coated buds?

Thanks bro

I use about 1 tsp per gallon and that gives me around 150ppm on my truncheon. Just mix with water, helps to dissolve in a small amount first before adding to final volume.

 

[neverforget4/20]

I use about 1 tsp per gallon and that gives me around 150ppm on my truncheon. Just mix with water, helps to dissolve in a small amount first before adding to final volume.

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Thanks man. Your plants look great. So you mix at that concentration and foliar? Do you soak them or just a light mist?

What do you think is causing purpling on those petioles?

 

[BubbaBear]

Does anyone have experience applying methyl jasmonate at the same time as chitosan? Is there any reason they shouldn't be co applied? Doesn't methyl jasmonate have a immediate effect on plants and chitosan take a few days to take effect? I tried it last week and didnt see any negative effects.

 

[Only Ornamental]

From a theoretical/scientific point of view, there shouldn't be one (that is, if you're looking for a stronger JA/ISR response which might go along with a trade-off in growth)... haven't tried it myself, though! It comes down to two things: dosage and if your plants get or already have infections with biotrophic v.s. necrotrophic pathogens.

 

[BubbaBear]

Right on OO, thanks for your input. Im also experimenting with root drenches of methyl jasmonate. The frost on my plants is insane but it seems to be delaying ripening, which isn't necessarily a bad thing if there going to keep packing on the frost.

 

[emeraldcityog]

BubbaBear, mind sharing what strength/brand methyl jasmonate you're drenching with and in what weeks?

I've always been curious about that. I know somebody who used to swear by JasRose Spray or something like that.

Thanks!

 

[BubbaBear]

http://www.planthormones.net/methyl-dihydrojasmonate-hedione/

Im using that stuff, its super cheap and cost almost nothing to use, I use it at 3 drops per quart which is about 100 PPM. Its a oily substance and they recommend using some alcohol to get it to emulsify in water, The alcohol worked just ok, Im going to experiment with tween 20 and soy lecithin next to see what works best.

I use it at flip as a foliar and root drench. Then I dont hit them again till week six of ten with a foliar and root drench. Then I do a root drench every ten days or so. You dont want to spay it on your plants the last few weeks because its basically a perfume ingredient, the shit reaks and can linger on your flowers if foliared to late. Since its so cheap I've also done a couple root drenches in veg. Im just now starting to really experiment with it so nothing I say is set in stone. You dont see anything drastic happen to your plants but science says it triggers SAR and trichome production.

 

[MIhomegrown]

Hey everyone, I was wondering if anyone has any experience with Nectar for the Gods new additive called The Kraken? It's a chitin product that is readily available to the plant. It's derived for crab and shrimp meal and also has some phosphorus content. Anyways just curious if any one has used it yet?https://www.monstergardens.com/Nectar-for-the-Gods-The-Kraken-Gallon

 

[kalopatchkid]

Hey everyone, I was wondering if anyone has any experience with Nectar for the Gods new additive called The Kraken? It's a chitin product that is readily available to the plant. It's derived for crab and shrimp meal and also has some phosphorus content. Anyways just curious if any one has used it yet?https://www.monstergardens.com/Nectar-for-the-Gods-The-Kraken-Gallon

I couldnt find a label or msds for this product but the website describes it as phosphorous derived from crab and shrimp meal with an npk of 0-4-0. Also, it only mentions that chitin comes from crabshells, but if my memory serves me correctly chitin isnt water soluble.

Hopefully OnlyOrnamental can chime in with some science.

I think the powdered chitosan oligo. off ebay is a better value and you arent paying for a bottle that is mostly water.

 

[Only Ornamental]

... Also, it only mentions that chitin comes from crabshells, but if my memory serves me correctly chitin isnt water soluble.

Hopefully OnlyOrnamental can chime in with some science...

True, crabshells are a main source for chitin (and hence chitosan) and it is not soluble. Also, chitin by itself doesn't stimulate the plants immune system. It needs to be broken down into either chitin oligosaccharide, chitosan, or chitosan oligosaccharide. The latter two are more or less soluble in their salt form.
Science hasn't examined every plant there is. Hence, we don't know everything and many things we do are just extrapolations and educated guesses. As a rule of thumbs regarding chitin/chitosan: First, plants which react to chitosan don't react to chitin oligosaccharide and vice versa. Second, dicots get stimulated by chitosan and monocots by chitin oligosaccharide.
Given that there is wast empirical data that hemp, a dicot, profits from chitosan means that it shouldn't care about chitin. Although, adding chitin to soil results in the formation of chitin oligosaccharide, then a certain amount of chitosan, and ultimately glucosamine as final degradation product. Glucosamine at higher amounts has pharmacological effects on plants which may or may not be positive or negative... foliar application of chitosan oligosaccharide seems therefor the best, most efficient and safest strategy.

Hope that helps!

 

[DocTim420]

Hmmm, just stumbled onto something I did not know: Bat Guano contains high levels of chitin and chitosan...chitin content of dry bat guano was found to be 28% and chitosan yield of this chitin was 79%.

https://frontiersinzoology.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12983-014-0059-8

 

[Only Ornamental]

Well, that heavily depends on the bat species the poo comes from... some bat guano comes from fruit bats (IIRC most of the sold bat guano??) and they don't eat insects (or at least not as much as the "real" bats). Unfortunately, it isn't always evident from what kind of animal the guano comes from.

 

[DocTim420]

The article stated, "Bats generally feed on terrestrial arthropods, and the external body parts of all these animals are formed from chitin."

So rather than use "species" as the determining factor, wouldn't it be wiser to identify guano that is sourced from bats that primarily feed on insects? Especially since over 70% of the world's bat species eat insects.

 

[Only Ornamental]

Bat caves in South America which are very easy to be "mined" are inhabited by thousands of fruit eating bats. The insect eating varieties often form small colonies of only a few dozen individuals living in your attic .
It would however be wise to collect the guano of the latter cause the mentioned caves are unique and very fragile micro-ecosystems with species no one has ever seen (or cared to look at).

 

[TVben]

Yo! In the interest of transparency, I work for the company I'm about to promote. That said, Tidalvisionusa.com is a sustainable, U.S sourced, U.S. manufacturer of chitosan. We sell premixed solutions with magic acid as a pool clarifier and a beverage fining agent, but its the same thing as what you'd use on your plants. We also can sell wholesale dry chitosan if you prefer. You'll pay less on shipping than with India or China and we're easy to contact. Just saying!

 

[TVben]

malic* acid, not magic. weird autocorrect