Ceramic Metal Halide (CMH)

[JohnnyToke]

here are a few shots of my current NL scrog under 2 x 400w cmh. my 1st attempt at a scrog. Im liking it so far.

these are on day 31 of 12/12.

in addition to the cmh's, I also have an hps added in there for some additional red spectrum. I originally had it right between the cmh reflectors and it seemed the plants were all leaning to the middle towards the hps. I moved the hps to the back wall last weekend and angled it out over the scrog. now all the buds are standing at attention to the cmh's.

regards,
JT

 

[MPL]

Goddamn that is some nice bud development there. I love your avatar too.

Here's some CMH eye candy for you guys, 800W, day 38 of flower...

They are all ICE except the last one is White Widow.

 

[Herbal Kint]

I dont get it why CMH the full spectrum, arent we looking for pure red spectrum for best reaction of plants in flowering?

 

[FreezerBoy]

We're trying to bring the sun into the house. The sun is full spectrum. It never goes red. With a full spectrum, the plant can take what it wants and not what we stick it with. Do you have some information that says the other five colors are bad for the plant?

 

[smoketrichs]

Can I use this 70w MH electronic ballast: (http://cgi.ebay.com/Metrolight-MH-E...ryZ58145QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem) to fire this 70W ED-17 CMH bulb?: (http://advancedtechlighting.com/mhced17.htm) Also, should I go w/ the 3k or 4k spec for my veg space?? gonna get the protected either way. Thanks.

 

[FreezerBoy]

Check the ANSI code for proper ballasts. Yours says CMH but it doesn't match up to the numbers on the bulbs ANSI code.

In this case M143 http://www.powerselectinc.com/pdf/PS13D39L_PS13D70L.pdf

or M98 http://www.advancedtechlighting.com/m0070-71c-511.htm
or http://www.venturelighting.com/VLPS/Opti-Wave70W.html

Can't help but notice that advanced doesn't sell electronic ballasts for that bulb.

I'd say 4K. The 3K has a tiny bit more blue than HPS but, not much. The 4K mimics the retro whites spectrum which is what got us all excited in the first place.

 

[smoketrichs]

cool, thanks. Guess I'm going with the 4K. As it turns out, it will work; it's a M98 ballast. So what else do I need? E26 medium base socket, anyone know what type of timer and wires i should grab? Thanks. Also, does anyone have any wiring diagrams, never done this before and I don't wanna fry myself.

 

[messn'n'gommin']

I have copied this entire thread and have been updating every couple of days and I don't remember anyone asking this, but, I am going to put a pulse start 50w MH ballast and CMH lamp in a stealth PC mom/clone cab and my question is this. Is it possible to install an igniter to a quality ballast that wasn't specifically manufactured with one? Am hoping someone knows the answer as I seem to be having some problem with finding a 50w pulse start ballast.

Namaste, mess

 

[FreezerBoy]

50 watt pulse start ballast http://www.venturelighting.com/VLPS/Opti-Wave50W.html

 

[FreezerBoy]

As it turns out, it will work; it's a M98 ballast.

Whatever the eBay ballast is, it's NOT an M98. The eBay ballast is electronic ("Metrolight Smart Electronic Ballasts for HID"); The M98 is a magnetic core, cap and ignitor.

 

[smoketrichs]

my mistake. On the spec sheet on the site it says it follows ANSI standards or something like that, and for the 70w it says M98. What to make of that, will it work? Screw it, found they got 70w ballasts on advancedtech. just gonna grab that one and be safe.

 

[simba]

ill answer the full spd later

as far as ballasts.. adv tech has both 50-1000watt MH(probe and pulse star) and for HPS bulbs ..
they do carry Advance's and VS electronic ballasts. (they are like 3 times the cost as a magnetic core.. so for the 1 ballast user its not efficient in the long run.. if the price where lower id push them.. but cost vs savings uhno..
from adv tech you get a schematic from the Ballast MFR>>
super easy to do..
adv ballasts match to the CMH bulbs..
get the 4K and your golden..
also the 70watt is the most effieciant out of 50-150 watt i think.. ill double check..


stay with mag core there cheaper and less hasllte smoke trichs..and if u ever have prob u only need to get the cheap part that failed not be out a whole ballast for a while..

 

[messn'n'gommin']

50 watt pulse start ballast http://www.venturelighting.com/VLPS/Opti-Wave50W.html

Thanks for the quick response but, they may be out of the 50w as only the 70w and up links are viable. Aside from that, if I can buy an Advance, Howard, or Sola ballast without the igniter for cheaper on e bay, could i still install the appropriate igniter or is it even feasible? I intend to use the CMH bulb for the clones so they will already be used to the spectrum from the CMH. I would prefer the 39w, but that ballast seems to be even more problematic to find.

My apologies I was thinking of Advance, but I couldn't find any prices for Ventures ballasts. Am I missing something?

 

[simba]

advtech.. 50 watt ballast link
http://advancedtechlighting.com/m0050-23C-511-dk.htm
they dont have a good page for it so the link is not shown...

70 watt is most effeicant the 50 watt kinda sucks for LPW energy emitted vs energy used..with that said if you have a small PC a 50 watt is great..
go with 70 watt or more..
the 20-39 watt are only avail in 3k and we want 4k..

as far as tinkering with a ballast to make it work..
short answer no.. not worth the savings if you could get something rigged up..
u can score a ballast under 40.. save your tush.. go with whats made for each other..

 

[FreezerBoy]

I intend to use the CMH bulb for the clones so they will already be used to the spectrum from the CMH. I would prefer the 39w, but that ballast seems to be even more problematic to find.

If all you want this bulb for is cloning, you may be into overkill. An unrooted clone hasn't the equipment to use strong light. I use a 23 watt CFL with great success, though I rarely clone more than six at a time if that.

Don't worry about the plant acclimating to spectrum. It's heat and intensity that will harm the plant. When you switch chambers, do it in the middle of your cabs "day." With only a half day under the new light followed by a good nights sleep, the plant will acclimate with minimal stress. You may want to hang the light a bit higher for a day or two as well.

 

[messn'n'gommin']

Thank you Simba, thank you Freezerboy, you have removed a stumbling block from my path. LOL...although it wasn't what I WANTED to hear...it was what I NEEDED to hear. Thanks again.

Namaste, mess

 

[UBER21]

Well guys just stepped into the darkside of lighting and purchased my first 150w CMH with phillips bulb in 4000k....oh yeah im stoked.......

 

[MPL]

Regarding density:

Some of my buds are too heavy for the branches to hold them up, and the plant is less than 12" tall. They're literally laying horizontally in my cab. I haven't bothered staking them because the way they are laying is exposing more of the bud to light and it doesn't appear to be hurting anything.

If you squeeze the larger buds they are hard as rock.

I think people believe the CMH produces less density because it looks like there are lots of leaves (feeder leaves) and not many calyxes. Those feeder leaves, however, are collecting tons of light for the buds to use. More light = more food, more food = heavier buds.

I am at about 50/50 clear/cloudy trichomes, so I still have a few weeks left most likely.

I might be able to get some pictures up tonight.

 

[NorCalFor20]

i have a question, is anyone using the HGT supply ballast? how do you like it (400w) i have mine but its taking longer and longer to ignite the bulb everytime it strikes. aroudn 15 seconds for me now, i know a guy who says it takes around 30 seconds to ignite his cmh so i guess im not worreid about it.

 

[simba]

NorCal,
Ya some HTG had weaker ignitors (we think.. not Official)..
and nothing to concern our selfs with..
its strike time is going to very each time, your lucky if it strikes the same every time..

The main concern with CMH's failing is First Fire (first few cycles) Hence AdvTech Preburning all Products..
what the initial failure reason is is the Glues basically that keeps the arc tube together.
.it has a seal or not.. (its MH salts/gases/metals in a HPS arc tube) Corrosive as all can be..to the seals..
and the leak would happen in the first cycles.. generally (Obv there is the exception)
if the lamp works the firsst few times it shouldn't fail tell end of life..

i have seen a few cmh 250, 400 that have a electrical storm going (HV Stream bouncing around like lighting) for up to 1 minute before firing up.. and then perfect from then on.. and then some that just arc.. (if it arcs.. chances are its got a good seal.. just not hot enough to strike (obv again sometimes its the bulb seal)

I sea and hear about many hps ballasts (even OLD ones) with Short range ignitor's (standard ignitor) with 8-12' bulb cords runing cmh.. without issue..