Sam_Skunkman said:
Exactly what I was going to say.
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Cannabis Connoisseurs' Obsession with Potency?
- Thread starter Dignan
- Start date
Exactly what I was going to say.
G
Guest
Smoking for medical reasons I can still say that some pot although it makes you high, I won't smoke. A pal brought me some bud while I was in hospital . The bud was awful.... mouldy chemmy and uncured. I declined. Maybe we are all connoisseurs to a degree.After all would you smoke salt soaked pot or pot that tasted of plastic to get high?
effect versus potency
comparing wine connoisseurs to cannabis connoisseurs is valid in many respects but like comparing apples and pears in others . Equating cannabis connoisseurs with "people (that) are far more concerned about smoking weed that blows the top of their skulls off." confuses things further ,not to say that some cannabis connoisseurs dont smoke , grow and breed entirely for this pupose and some wine Connoisseurs are alcoholics , but not all alcoholics are wine Connoisseurs .
Some members bring up interesting points when they mention the indica versus sativa effect phenomena .
Can we agree that most people find indicas provide a body stone , couchlock effect and sativas a more heady , racey high ?
Although i have smoked with and have also read accounts of people that find indicas too heady .
With alcohol , some people report a different sort of hit
dependant on what they drink . gin makes them sad , whisky puts them in a fighting mood .
Personal disposition seems to have an influence on effect ,
as im sure set and setting have as well .
Most alcohol we buy has a percentage proof or equivelent displayed and home brewers roughly know the alcohol content of their brew or can measure it , whereas marijuana breeders very rarely provide THC levels of seed parents and even if they did , different growing envioroments and techniques could effect THC levels , cure and storage would also play apart in final THC amount , plus its nigh on impossible to have the final product
measured .
One of the few breeders that does provide THC levels claims to have an
Afghan Kush @ THC Level: 21.6% , a Pakistan variety @ THC Level: 21.2% and a Thai variety @ THC Level: 22.3% .
What would the "people (that) are far more concerned about smoking weed that blows the top of their skulls off." consider the strongest and prefer to smoke ?
strength is not a measurement of power
regards
petal
comparing wine connoisseurs to cannabis connoisseurs is valid in many respects but like comparing apples and pears in others . Equating cannabis connoisseurs with "people (that) are far more concerned about smoking weed that blows the top of their skulls off." confuses things further ,not to say that some cannabis connoisseurs dont smoke , grow and breed entirely for this pupose and some wine Connoisseurs are alcoholics , but not all alcoholics are wine Connoisseurs .
Some members bring up interesting points when they mention the indica versus sativa effect phenomena .
Can we agree that most people find indicas provide a body stone , couchlock effect and sativas a more heady , racey high ?
Although i have smoked with and have also read accounts of people that find indicas too heady .
With alcohol , some people report a different sort of hit
dependant on what they drink . gin makes them sad , whisky puts them in a fighting mood .
Personal disposition seems to have an influence on effect ,
as im sure set and setting have as well .
Most alcohol we buy has a percentage proof or equivelent displayed and home brewers roughly know the alcohol content of their brew or can measure it , whereas marijuana breeders very rarely provide THC levels of seed parents and even if they did , different growing envioroments and techniques could effect THC levels , cure and storage would also play apart in final THC amount , plus its nigh on impossible to have the final product
measured .
One of the few breeders that does provide THC levels claims to have an
Afghan Kush @ THC Level: 21.6% , a Pakistan variety @ THC Level: 21.2% and a Thai variety @ THC Level: 22.3% .
What would the "people (that) are far more concerned about smoking weed that blows the top of their skulls off." consider the strongest and prefer to smoke ?
strength is not a measurement of power
regards
petal
Interesting responses. Thanks everyone.
I've read posts and received PMs from a very large number of people whose message is, "Of course potency is the important thing… why do we smoke? To get ****ed up, of course." That surprised me. I knew there were folks who smoked for that reason, but I didn't realize how many fell into that category.
I smoke cannabis for the buzz mostly, but I definitely don't smoke to get wasted (other than on rare occasions when I'm feeling particularly self-destructive). I have to be honest- I don't really relate to that mentality, regardless of the drug in question. But! Different strokes for different folks.
It sounds to me like many heavy users are explaining that they need potent cannabis to break through their high tolerance. I wonder how that tolerance affects a person's ability to perceive the other subtle nuances of cannabis, like flavors, aromas, hightypes, etc.
I guess I would argue that not many heavy users are actually connoisseurs and that a person can't be a connoisseur if their perception of those nuances has been dulled to such a degree. This has helped me to refine my own personal definition of a cannabis connoisseur. A connoisseur, to my mind, would be someone with a very broad exposure to a very large number of cannabis varieties, and yet who has chosen to limit their consumption to more moderate levels so that they can fully experience each variety.
I personally am no connoisseur. I am moderate in my usage, but unfortunately without the pleasure of having been exposed to a good portion of the planet's finer cannabis offerings. We're all working on that though, eh?
Thanks for all the opinions. Peace-
Dignan
I've read posts and received PMs from a very large number of people whose message is, "Of course potency is the important thing… why do we smoke? To get ****ed up, of course." That surprised me. I knew there were folks who smoked for that reason, but I didn't realize how many fell into that category.
I smoke cannabis for the buzz mostly, but I definitely don't smoke to get wasted (other than on rare occasions when I'm feeling particularly self-destructive). I have to be honest- I don't really relate to that mentality, regardless of the drug in question. But! Different strokes for different folks.
It sounds to me like many heavy users are explaining that they need potent cannabis to break through their high tolerance. I wonder how that tolerance affects a person's ability to perceive the other subtle nuances of cannabis, like flavors, aromas, hightypes, etc.
I guess I would argue that not many heavy users are actually connoisseurs and that a person can't be a connoisseur if their perception of those nuances has been dulled to such a degree. This has helped me to refine my own personal definition of a cannabis connoisseur. A connoisseur, to my mind, would be someone with a very broad exposure to a very large number of cannabis varieties, and yet who has chosen to limit their consumption to more moderate levels so that they can fully experience each variety.
I personally am no connoisseur. I am moderate in my usage, but unfortunately without the pleasure of having been exposed to a good portion of the planet's finer cannabis offerings. We're all working on that though, eh?
Thanks for all the opinions. Peace-
Dignan
i would have to disagree with you, seeing you are guessing if heavy smokers are not able to pick up on "subtle nuances, as you put it... the more strains you smoke, the more you are able to pick up on these aroma's , flavor's, and realms of the high's affect on you mentally and physically.
such as the first smoke of the day it is very easy to pick up on these things, so i can see what your saying if you were to smoke 6 strains all in one day and try to pick up on their subtle traits that would be difficult..
which is why most break up their testing of smokes into day period and see which best suite their time to be smoked, at different times.
so people who have low tolerance can appreciate a weak smoke for its high which is just fine, but for the heavier smoker there needs to be a well rounded smoke for potency, flavor and general hitting quality.
anyways interesting hearing different responses as well, there is great benefit to having different highs for different times.
such as the first smoke of the day it is very easy to pick up on these things, so i can see what your saying if you were to smoke 6 strains all in one day and try to pick up on their subtle traits that would be difficult..
which is why most break up their testing of smokes into day period and see which best suite their time to be smoked, at different times.
so people who have low tolerance can appreciate a weak smoke for its high which is just fine, but for the heavier smoker there needs to be a well rounded smoke for potency, flavor and general hitting quality.
anyways interesting hearing different responses as well, there is great benefit to having different highs for different times.
I LUV SOUR
New member
The potency of the pot is just one part of the equation that determines the overall quality the strain itself. There are many variations of strength and effect hence the multitude of different strains. But bottom line I smoke for the experince and quality herb offers varrying experinces and thats excluding the tase and aroma aspect and other sensory experinces(man i love pot). Other wise we would just smoke flavored tobbaco or ... crack.
Dignan said:Interesting responses. Thanks everyone.
I've read posts and received PMs from a very large number of people whose message is, "Of course potency is the important thing… why do we smoke? To get ****ed up, of course." That surprised me. I knew there were folks who smoked for that reason, but I didn't realize how many fell into that category.
I smoke cannabis for the buzz mostly, but I definitely don't smoke to get wasted (other than on rare occasions when I'm feeling particularly self-destructive). I have to be honest- I don't really relate to that mentality, regardless of the drug in question. But! Different strokes for different folks.
It sounds to me like many heavy users are explaining that they need potent cannabis to break through their high tolerance. I wonder how that tolerance affects a person's ability to perceive the other subtle nuances of cannabis, like flavors, aromas, hightypes, etc.
I guess I would argue that not many heavy users are actually connoisseurs and that a person can't be a connoisseur if their perception of those nuances has been dulled to such a degree. This has helped me to refine my own personal definition of a cannabis connoisseur. A connoisseur, to my mind, would be someone with a very broad exposure to a very large number of cannabis varieties, and yet who has chosen to limit their consumption to more moderate levels so that they can fully experience each variety.
I personally am no connoisseur. I am moderate in my usage, but unfortunately without the pleasure of having been exposed to a good portion of the planet's finer cannabis offerings. We're all working on that though, eh?
Thanks for all the opinions. Peace-
Dignan
Do you think that it might also be an age thing?
Just playing with some ideas. I know I never liked Olives or dry red wine when younger, now I love 'em. Maybe apreciating the finer differences comes with age.
Herbalistic said:Simpy putted: Strains with low/no cbd, but muchos THC & THCV will rock Herbalistic´s freeworld
Sam_Skunkman said:
Herbalistic said:
Herbalistic,
Do you understand that THCV is a THC antagonist? It interfers with THC"s ability to get you high. Believe me you do not want THCV. I have smoked pure THCV as well as THC/THCV, have you? THCV does not make THC better in any way, at least if you want to get high.
-SamS
bythetracks
New member
If wine commonly varied in potency between 1% and 25% alcohol, I think wine connoisseurs would care a great deal about potency.
I dont have better info about the subject than words from forummember who´s opinion I trust.
However, I definitely aint going to argue with you about this subject. I know and admit that you have huge/incredible amount of wisdom considering our belowed herb. I believe that you know what you are talking about.
All I was trying to say is that it affects on the type of high. I was at believe that it affects in a good way, but you correct me about that
Peace!!!
However, I definitely aint going to argue with you about this subject. I know and admit that you have huge/incredible amount of wisdom considering our belowed herb. I believe that you know what you are talking about.
All I was trying to say is that it affects on the type of high. I was at believe that it affects in a good way, but you correct me about that
Peace!!!
Many people still think that THCV is the mystery Cannabinoid that gives the best high. But they are all wrong....
THCV lowers the subjective effects of THC is that what you are looking for?
Yes THCV does modify the high but in a negative way to me and most smokers.
Do you also want a lot of CBD? It also modifies THC, again not in a good way for most smokers, but some people do prefer Cannabis with lots of CBD, like imported hash.
Not me, I like my THC so it makes me sweat, pass-out, soaring, euphoric, even paranoid, feel the fear, I like it.
BTW, I don't smoke herbal Cannabis mainly because it is not potent enough for me. Also I prefer smoking resin, not plants.
To me smoking plants is like sprinkling resin on a hemp cloth and smoking it. WHY?
Resin has everyting you are looking for and the purer the resin the better.
If there are really people out there that don't want their Cannabis potent they can buy swagg Mex, save money, and be happy.
-SamS
THCV lowers the subjective effects of THC is that what you are looking for?
Yes THCV does modify the high but in a negative way to me and most smokers.
Do you also want a lot of CBD? It also modifies THC, again not in a good way for most smokers, but some people do prefer Cannabis with lots of CBD, like imported hash.
Not me, I like my THC so it makes me sweat, pass-out, soaring, euphoric, even paranoid, feel the fear, I like it.
BTW, I don't smoke herbal Cannabis mainly because it is not potent enough for me. Also I prefer smoking resin, not plants.
To me smoking plants is like sprinkling resin on a hemp cloth and smoking it. WHY?
Resin has everyting you are looking for and the purer the resin the better.
If there are really people out there that don't want their Cannabis potent they can buy swagg Mex, save money, and be happy.
-SamS
Great info Sam,
thanks for share your first hand laboratory info with us. Very few smokers have the good luck or connections to try pure and different cannabinoid extracts to get an idea of their psycho activity.
I also love to smoke hash and i understand that resin has most of the cannabis psycho active ingredients, but sometimes i have found plants that produce a more complex, stronger overall better high when you smoke her flowers and not her extracted cannabis resin.
Producing hash you get easily 3-4 times more cannabinoids concentrated than in the original flowers, but you can easily lose terpenes in the process (especially when doing bubble bag/water extractions), hash will have a very high cannabinoid concentration but effect could be not as a complex as the weed because the degradation/lost of terpenes during the process. Producing hash in a dry way (like moroccan farmers do) could reduce the lost/degradation of terpenes in the hash, making better final quality.
The stronger plant we have in clone form is a 10 year old malawi, we analysed her and had tons of the cannabinoids( not only THC, also CBD and THCV). It's overpowering medicinal pot, almost opium kind of high. I did some malawi hash extractions with bubblebag, the hash was quite strong but more menthal, not could be compared with original potency of the flower(far stronger).
It happens the same to me with extracted oil. It's funny to smoke a few, it's strong but lacks of complexity many times, you also lose many terpenes in the process.
Im sure Sam you already are completly aware of this, they were only some thoughts i had while reading your hash input.
Good day all! dubi
thanks for share your first hand laboratory info with us. Very few smokers have the good luck or connections to try pure and different cannabinoid extracts to get an idea of their psycho activity.
I also love to smoke hash and i understand that resin has most of the cannabis psycho active ingredients, but sometimes i have found plants that produce a more complex, stronger overall better high when you smoke her flowers and not her extracted cannabis resin.
Producing hash you get easily 3-4 times more cannabinoids concentrated than in the original flowers, but you can easily lose terpenes in the process (especially when doing bubble bag/water extractions), hash will have a very high cannabinoid concentration but effect could be not as a complex as the weed because the degradation/lost of terpenes during the process. Producing hash in a dry way (like moroccan farmers do) could reduce the lost/degradation of terpenes in the hash, making better final quality.
The stronger plant we have in clone form is a 10 year old malawi, we analysed her and had tons of the cannabinoids( not only THC, also CBD and THCV). It's overpowering medicinal pot, almost opium kind of high. I did some malawi hash extractions with bubblebag, the hash was quite strong but more menthal, not could be compared with original potency of the flower(far stronger).
It happens the same to me with extracted oil. It's funny to smoke a few, it's strong but lacks of complexity many times, you also lose many terpenes in the process.
Im sure Sam you already are completly aware of this, they were only some thoughts i had while reading your hash input.
Good day all! dubi
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I agree that water sifted hash is not as strong as dry sifted. Because of the terpenoid loss in the water.
But to be honest I smoke dry sift, not water hash.
I have never found a plant that I prefer the herbal buds to the cleaned up dry sift resin.
But I do hear what you say.
If you look you can find varieties that made with water the resin is almost as good as the dry sift, they seem to lose less terpenoids in the water, maybe they have less water soluble terpenoids in the first place.
-SamS
But to be honest I smoke dry sift, not water hash.
I have never found a plant that I prefer the herbal buds to the cleaned up dry sift resin.
But I do hear what you say.
If you look you can find varieties that made with water the resin is almost as good as the dry sift, they seem to lose less terpenoids in the water, maybe they have less water soluble terpenoids in the first place.
-SamS
Sam_Skunkman said:
I have found, that the key to the highest quality of water hash is to leave it in the water as little amount of time as possible, and agitate slowly and gently... This falls right in line with your terpenoid statements, Sam... When I make Ice-water hash, I pre freeze the fresh trim while the gland heads are still fully swollen... I put the frozen trim into the Ice-water and agitate by hand for under 5 minutes.
I may not get nearly the quantities of hash, but it is very pure, and very little of the flavor is lost, if any... Spending only a handfull of minutes in the water, the terpenoids don't have time to wash out...
The bubble hash from fresh trim is much more distinct in flavor and aroma than the bubble hash from dried trim, I have noticed as well...
I love dry sieve as well... Just use the Ice-water for the ease, mostly....
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Great info dubi & sam, much appreciated
C
Chamba
the less you smoke, the more you appreciate the nuances of the high and the higher you get...
after a break from smoking for several days or weeks, a small joint of average bud is overwhelming and fantastic!..that one little jay of commercial bud will keep you high for hours...while with weeks or months of heavy use, even excellent quality high potency dry sifted hash is just ok and you will be reaching for the pipe in an hour or less....wasteful really
to me the taste, flavour, smells, smoothness etc matter very little .....it's the quality of the high that I appreciate and think is all important....
to really appreciate the high and to get the maximum effects, it's important to control your tolerance at a level that gets you high.....but that's easier said than done...one way is to have a THC holiday every now and then...that's what I'm doing now as a matter of fact!
after a break from smoking for several days or weeks, a small joint of average bud is overwhelming and fantastic!..that one little jay of commercial bud will keep you high for hours...while with weeks or months of heavy use, even excellent quality high potency dry sifted hash is just ok and you will be reaching for the pipe in an hour or less....wasteful really
to me the taste, flavour, smells, smoothness etc matter very little .....it's the quality of the high that I appreciate and think is all important....
to really appreciate the high and to get the maximum effects, it's important to control your tolerance at a level that gets you high.....but that's easier said than done...one way is to have a THC holiday every now and then...that's what I'm doing now as a matter of fact!
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Love the hash discussion.
None of us here are making a habit out of evaluating hemp, just as I doubt many wine connoisseurs are out there sampling wine that has .25% alcohol.
Most of us are smoking cannabis whose cannabinoid levels are something more like 15% to 25%, which is more in line with the variation in potency that different wines exhibit.
Speaking of nuances.
I wasn't asking, "Why don't cannabis connoisseurs just smoke stuff without any potency?" But rather, "Why do we put so much more emphasis on the intoxicating effects of cannabis than connoisseurs of wine do?" (And the discussion has been very informative, thanks in large part to you, Sam. )
Not at all. In fact, nobody around me seems to care how much or little I smoke... not sure if that's good sign or bad. lol
.......................................................................................................
My experience is only one man's... but the bottom line for me is that (a) I like to smoke cannabis a 4-5 times a week, BUT (b) I have no interest in being trashed on 4-5 occasions every week, whether it be on cannabis, bourbon or painkillers. Just not how I like to do things.
And so, I can take a strain with superb flavors and smells and the exquisite hightype that I prefer but that has only average potency (by our standards here at ICMag) and have a wonderful, completely enjoyable smoking experience without getting wasted. (Once a week or so, I'll load up the bowl with whatever max-potency herb I happen to have on hand and will proceed to smoke myself retarded. Recently it's been Verite's Sour Double Diesel.)
But there are a lot of foks here who do want/need to be ultra-stoned after every session and the sessions are closer together, which is fine. It explains why so much emphasis is put on the potency- it has more to do with an individual's tolerance levels and the frequency of useage than anything else.
None of us here are making a habit out of evaluating hemp, just as I doubt many wine connoisseurs are out there sampling wine that has .25% alcohol.
Most of us are smoking cannabis whose cannabinoid levels are something more like 15% to 25%, which is more in line with the variation in potency that different wines exhibit.
Speaking of nuances.
I wasn't asking, "Why don't cannabis connoisseurs just smoke stuff without any potency?" But rather, "Why do we put so much more emphasis on the intoxicating effects of cannabis than connoisseurs of wine do?" (And the discussion has been very informative, thanks in large part to you, Sam. ) Not at all. In fact, nobody around me seems to care how much or little I smoke... not sure if that's good sign or bad. lol
.......................................................................................................
My experience is only one man's... but the bottom line for me is that (a) I like to smoke cannabis a 4-5 times a week, BUT (b) I have no interest in being trashed on 4-5 occasions every week, whether it be on cannabis, bourbon or painkillers. Just not how I like to do things.
And so, I can take a strain with superb flavors and smells and the exquisite hightype that I prefer but that has only average potency (by our standards here at ICMag) and have a wonderful, completely enjoyable smoking experience without getting wasted. (Once a week or so, I'll load up the bowl with whatever max-potency herb I happen to have on hand and will proceed to smoke myself retarded. Recently it's been Verite's Sour Double Diesel.)
But there are a lot of foks here who do want/need to be ultra-stoned after every session and the sessions are closer together, which is fine. It explains why so much emphasis is put on the potency- it has more to do with an individual's tolerance levels and the frequency of useage than anything else.
Well said Chamba, this is what im after when I smoke!!! The aromas & flavors etc. can be very tempting, but if the strain produces "boring high", I pass it, or smoke it just before I go to sleep..Chamba said:
Im with you with this one also. However, since I grow myself and have delicious herb available constantly and my current women is pro-pot, I smoke every evening. I try not to smoke in days, only at evenings. I think we all should have good break from smoking, so our tolerance will reduce and we can really get high!!!Chamba said:
Dignan said:
"by our standards at ICmag" Thanks for the laughs man
