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Cambodian * Laos * Thai * Vietnam * Burma & SE Asians....

led05

Chasing The Present
lol this second mutant is most likely a tetraploid. did it have a thick tumor like tap root? the red xylem is an excellent selection trait/ plant to watch. i like to germinate my seeds a little extra longer so i can see which ones sprout with the thick red stem, curved/twisted true leaves, fused cotyledons and best of all an abnormal sized endosperm cap. its significant that all instances of polyploid/aneuploid dicoveries in cannabis happen in the highest altitude regions of india/himalaya. a well known location type for natural hybrids and extreme adaptation.
for example the only natural tetraploid population so far was found in the cold desert shadow of lahu/spiti. this unique climate is known to produce polyploids in normal diploid species due to their larger cell size helping survive the brutal conditions.
the slides i just pasted are aneuploids from a study in himchal pradesh(shimla/kullu) these findings were in tune with your plant. abnormal large genomes, extra chromatin, cytomixis(another nuclei enters a cell). in some cases 7 nuclei were found fused together.
the most recent finding was a triploid male in semi feral uttakarhand. red xylem is caused by a null CAD enzyme in the lignin metabolism. the CAD enzyme is supposed to change the aldehydes into alcohols and then send them on to create lignin for cell wall strength. when the cad enzyme is null the aldehydes can no longer be cganed or used for lignin and instead the pre cursor flows into the phenylpropanoid pathway.

this pathway is responsible for synthesizing the direct pre cursor of cbga and phytohormones. even further, the null enzyme causes an abundance of hydroxycinnamates which are incorporated right into the lignin causing the "weeping" red xylem phenotype. this change means the stems take on heavy mentholated comounds, so the red doesnt just look cool its functional.
but this new red lignin has some defects- its not as tight as regular lignin and its building blocks contain errors in contruction such as the floating node extra digits etc. its very possible the cytomixis observed is facilitated by this irregular cell wall construction.
generally the darker the red the more additional phenols are present. this null enzyme is most likely passed on from a wild mulberry from yunnan- morus notabils. this is the closest genome to cannabis and has enzymes which nearly perfect match to thc synthase. so the red xylem may be at the very heart of potency/acclimation. some reading if you like. super cool man

tetraploid from cold desert https://www.eresearchco.com/article...t-higher-altitude-himalayasa-neglected-bu.pdf

uttakarhand triploid- https://www.mdpi.com/2223-7747/11/20/2736

aneuploid from shimla

View attachment 18827058

red mulberry xylem

View attachment 18827062
now you've got me wondering about the Waxy Male Gambian I've been using..... The Gambian line is extremely interesting & rare, around 15-20% of seeds have no serrations and are dead ends IMO, horrible transpiration without them serrations, I've put up pics in here....... Some love the look of them as they don't look a ton like cannabis without serrations, so in illegal places...

another 15-20% are just duds, glad I made thousands from the original bulking, which I've gone though a lot of seeds to find ONE (over a thousand) high quality and amazing male, but I did, and he's a super stud being put through the ringer around here lately & tested on many types of plants.....

Here's the Waxy Male Gambian up close, this fella just oozes the goods, so much so he's truly "waxy", for a pure NLD, that's somethin IME

1680638806753.png



I've been doing a lot of work with these Cambodians x Gambians, and have a few iterations young seedlings going now of crosses with both Gambian Male and Cambodian / Laos Male, some of the offspring are very hard to get seeds to form, others make thousands like most plants..... I selfed both Cambodian #1 and #2 and made a good amount of seeds, then crossed that to my best hazes, other NLD, but lately focus has been with the male Gambian just mentioned......

while many places keep breeding the same few plants or selfing off springs of a few, I feel like I'm swimming in endless piles of genetic renaissance, perhaps I should start making things available to more others without being so anal & perfectionist about it, after all - many of us are looking for variations of similar things and not just variations of cake.... ha

Great info & TY again, I'll dive deeper as soon as time permits, lot of plantings to do today and caring for hundreds of others up and going.... I love spring

Peace

i like it led,, great idea for thread and as always beautiful plants you showin ,,,i just bred my laos male to several females and my current fav smoke islaos x todds haze 3 will hopefully have something to show and join the party with soon

talk to me more about your Laos male, terps, effects, did you smoke him, sniff any pollen..? do you know which batch it was from, they are also from Laredo travel too, right, your Laos...?

Cheers & TY buddy
 
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harvestreaper

Well-known member
Veteran
talk to me more about your Laos male, terps, effects, did you smoke him, sniff any pollen..? do you know which batch it was from, they are also from Laredo travel too, right, your Laos...?

Cheers & TY buddy
i may be ahead of myself in calling mine laos it came from vientiane but was sold as mango thai by rsc from what i gather it was regarded as one of the less desirable batches but i liked the females i got ,i bred them to two males both males showed a couple of hairs they were in far from ideal conditions so i bred them on ,,i later went thru my last seeds from original batch an found a solid male ive tested him hard in the way of hermi an i have faith hes solid ,,ive not smoked him he has mango type terps on stem rub an passes it on ,i intend to breed him to females from f2s an go from there ,,,i also bred him to lime madness ,crystal paradise ,,sk x nl ,,thh and todds haze ,i liked that he throws the high and terps early days not grown em all out yet but the two most intersting prospects so far are the l x lm2 and lx todds haze 3 ,,,,,being a cultural barbarian i thought laredo was in tx or somwere lol yours look definatly diffrent to mine with those classic alligator tails
 

led05

Chasing The Present
i may be ahead of myself in calling mine laos it came from vientiane but was sold as mango thai by rsc from what i gather it was regarded as one of the less desirable batches but i liked the females i got ,i bred them to two males both males showed a couple of hairs they were in far from ideal conditions so i bred them on ,,i later went thru my last seeds from original batch an found a solid male ive tested him hard in the way of hermi an i have faith hes solid ,,ive not smoked him he has mango type terps on stem rub an passes it on ,i intend to breed him to females from f2s an go from there ,,,i also bred him to lime madness ,crystal paradise ,,sk x nl ,,thh and todds haze ,i liked that he throws the high and terps early days not grown em all out yet but the two most intersting prospects so far are the l x lm2 and lx todds haze 3 ,,,,,being a cultural barbarian i thought laredo was in tx or somwere lol yours look definatly diffrent to mine with those classic alligator tails
Thanks for those details...

Laredo is a European members handle at varying forums, he's traveled to SE Asia nearly 50 times IIRC, at another forum he traveled a few years back across Laos documenting his travels, sending back seeds, pics of those seeds growing in-situ of plants from 7 or so different "lots" / growers... a handful of people got them, some are members here.... few have grown them, I grew all the seeds I got from two lots, have been working them along with the Cambodians....... I still have a few other lots I've yet to touch....

Very little of the gear I run is from seed-banks, I'll identify when it is, otherwise it's not, almost always, not :)

Peace
 

Chi13

Well-known member
ICMag Donor
Great to see these varieties and you'd have to be one of the best indoor sativa growers. Your outdoors are excellent too considering you aren't in the tropics.
I had a great smoke in Laos that was super euphoric, happy, uplifting, rocket ship take off, and strong. Like Thai stick without paranoia.
Have you found anything like that?
 

led05

Chasing The Present
Great to see these varieties and you'd have to be one of the best indoor sativa growers. Your outdoors are excellent too considering you aren't in the tropics.
I had a great smoke in Laos that was super euphoric, happy, uplifting, rocket ship take off, and strong. Like Thai stick without paranoia.
Have you found anything like that?
Yes - but also some heart pounding chest thumping chaos as well… and thank you
 

harvestreaper

Well-known member
Veteran
I've been testing quality of pollen (plant), in part this way for more than a decade, I wasn't joking - now, I'm not sure how much emphasis I put upon it, but you have a bunch of males, it's one of many ticks on the T-ledger to utilize IMO/E
you mean sniffing or smoking the pollen ? ive done both myself in past but not on this male and i cant say i was being scientific more cheechanchongic lol
 

harvestreaper

Well-known member
Veteran
Thanks for those details...

Laredo is a European members handle at varying forums, he's traveled to SE Asia nearly 50 times IIRC, at another forum he traveled a few years back across Laos documenting his travels, sending back seeds, pics of those seeds growing in-situ of plants from 7 or so different "lots" / growers... a handful of people got them, some are members here.... few have grown them, I grew all the seeds I got from two lots, have been working them along with the Cambodians....... I still have a few other lots I've yet to touch....

Very little of the gear I run is from seed-banks, I'll identify when it is, otherwise it's not, almost always, not :)

Peace
i hear you,,,,,, sounds like they found there way to the right place look forward to seeing your selections
 

Piff_cat

Well-known member
now you've got me wondering about the Waxy Male Gambian I've been using..... The Gambian line is extremely interesting & rare, around 15-20% of seeds have no serrations and are dead ends IMO, horrible transpiration without them serrations, I've put up pics in here....... Some love the look of them as they don't look a ton like cannabis without serrations, so in illegal places...

another 15-20% are just duds, glad I made thousands from the original bulking, which I've gone though a lot of seeds to find ONE (over a thousand) high quality and amazing male, but I did, and he's a super stud being put through the ringer around here lately & tested on many types of plants.....

Here's the Waxy Male Gambian up close, this fella just oozes the goods, so much so he's truly "waxy", for a pure NLD, that's somethin IME

View attachment 18827074


I've been doing a lot of work with these Cambodians x Gambians, and have a few iterations young seedlings going now of crosses with both Gambian Male and Cambodian / Laos Male, some of the offspring are very hard to get seeds to form, others make thousands like most plants..... I selfed both Cambodian #1 and #2 and made a good amount of seeds, then crossed that to my best hazes, other NLD, but lately focus has been with the male Gambian just mentioned......

while many places keep breeding the same few plants or selfing off springs of a few, I feel like I'm swimming in endless piles of genetic renaissance, perhaps I should start making things available to more others without being so anal & perfectionist about it, after all - many of us are looking for variations of similar things and not just variations of cake.... ha

Great info & TY again, I'll dive deeper as soon as time permits, lot of plantings to do today and caring for hundreds of others up and going.... I love spring

Peace



talk to me more about your Laos male, terps, effects, did you smoke him, sniff any pollen..? do you know which batch it was from, they are also from Laredo travel too, right, your Laos...?

Cheers & TY buddy
wow i really like that gambian this work your doin here is going to work out very well for sure. the recombination diversity from this type of breeding is truly incredible. seems like there are parralel universes of genotypes which are teased out when each side of the pedigree contain these initial primal gene pool and with the null CAD enzyme is not dominant in f1. if one parent is strictly green only about 10 percent will have null enzyme. however if both sides hold it or even better all 4 grandparents, that gets locked in.

cambodian is one of the last true semi feral primal nld and is probly on par lineage wise with the genotypes which founded the gambian and other africans. so by crossing the 2 together you end up seeing that grandparent generation essentially a recombined version of the line when it showed up in africa. the no serration types represent those grandparents which came from shandong or inda with the full arsenal of cannabinoids(cbg,,,cbc,cbt,cbl, cbg ether thc)

i always like the tipped purple red blue etc calyxs etc are from cartenoid production but the waxy on the non serrated takes it to a new level. the greasy leaves are caused from chromene cannabinoids, ethers and oxygenated sesquiterpenes. cbc, cbl and cbt are all derived from cbca which is actually a gum not crystal and co occurs in the stalkless pillow type trichomes. the greasy cbt cannabinoids occur really alot on the no serration waxy leaves. they must be a trait that exisitng in perrenial type ancestors these type of protection indicates going thru winter in tough conditions. these types are also produced by rhododendrons in the same areas-japan, siberia, northeast china- including cbg ether. really like the work man.this throwback thai pheno found in the mekong/g13 haze from delta9 is the type of geno
attitude-delta9-brainstormhaze2_400x400.jpg

this outlier outback vietnam has alotta of these traits just missing the tipped calyxes.
 

yesum

Well-known member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Good looking plants led05. Not sure if you have the 'Cambodian Red' there. A guy named steve? from monkeygeneticspuzzle says he has Cambodian Red. He lives in Cambodia. There are many other Cambodians out there, but the name grabs me.

Cambodian Red was the gold standard in trippy during 70's, I never had it btw. I can not get him to answer emails. hyp3rids has his CR but mixed. Any from you led05 or others that is mind blowing? I have some good Laos/Thai by way of RSC. Would like to get the real deal Red to see what all the hype was about.

dr purpur needs it too, 1977 CR still fresh in his mind. RSC Mong Hsat is very euphoric and functional in effect from first test.
 

led05

Chasing The Present
wow i really like that gambian this work your doin here is going to work out very well for sure. the recombination diversity from this type of breeding is truly incredible. seems like there are parralel universes of genotypes which are teased out when each side of the pedigree contain these initial primal gene pool and with the null CAD enzyme is not dominant in f1. if one parent is strictly green only about 10 percent will have null enzyme. however if both sides hold it or even better all 4 grandparents, that gets locked in.

cambodian is one of the last true semi feral primal nld and is probly on par lineage wise with the genotypes which founded the gambian and other africans. so by crossing the 2 together you end up seeing that grandparent generation essentially a recombined version of the line when it showed up in africa. the no serration types represent those grandparents which came from shandong or inda with the full arsenal of cannabinoids(cbg,,,cbc,cbt,cbl, cbg ether thc)

i always like the tipped purple red blue etc calyxs etc are from cartenoid production but the waxy on the non serrated takes it to a new level. the greasy leaves are caused from chromene cannabinoids, ethers and oxygenated sesquiterpenes. cbc, cbl and cbt are all derived from cbca which is actually a gum not crystal and co occurs in the stalkless pillow type trichomes. the greasy cbt cannabinoids occur really alot on the no serration waxy leaves. they must be a trait that exisitng in perrenial type ancestors these type of protection indicates going thru winter in tough conditions. these types are also produced by rhododendrons in the same areas-japan, siberia, northeast china- including cbg ether. really like the work man.this throwback thai pheno found in the mekong/g13 haze from delta9 is the type of geno
View attachment 18828065
this outlier outback vietnam has alotta of these traits just missing the tipped calyxes.
Thanks for another informative post… The 15-20% Gambian entire plant has no serrations…. Let me find a pic - quick search here’s a young one but you get gist

1680889860763.jpeg


These simply don’t grow / transpire right thus I don’t use them but they flower out & for clandestine growers…. Perhaps could offer something

Good looking plants led05. Not sure if you have the 'Cambodian Red' there. A guy named steve? from monkeygeneticspuzzle says he has Cambodian Red. He lives in Cambodia. There are many other Cambodians out there, but the name grabs me.

Cambodian Red was the gold standard in trippy during 70's, I never had it btw. I can not get him to answer emails. hyp3rids has his CR but mixed. Any from you led05 or others that is mind blowing? I have some good Laos/Thai by way of RSC. Would like to get the real deal Red to see what all the hype was about.

dr purpur needs it too, 1977 CR still fresh in his mind. RSC Mong Hsat is very euphoric and functional in effect from first test.
TY

Cambodian 1 was more gold, #2 was more red…. X’s of the Cambodians x Laos & some Laos on their own are wild, scary - same with the SE Asians x Gambians - wild, powerful scary shit…. Very accumulative cannabis like nothing I’ve ever experienced before…. I’m working them all towards a few different paths mainly one trip / scare face off other no sedation bliss…. Would love to get rid of the heart palpitations bit but not sure it can be done wout eliminating raw horsepower…

In 30+ years of smoking never have I even a hint of palpitations - some plants of the Cambodian x Gambian make the ol ticker thump (granted I eat an ungodly amount of oil daily and was only using the SE Asians for months) , not an enjoyable experience but it’s extreme power & rest of its quality can make a fella - Soldier on through ;)

Peace buddy - none of these things I’m playing with came from seed banks or breeders, gifts from friends

Cheers
 
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harvestreaper

Well-known member
Veteran
sounds like rocket fuel led i heard good things about gambian in past i have some of cannabiogens version in fridge never tried em tho ,,scary is something i search for only happened to me once on an unknown sativa the heart palps ive had a few times ,,you got something there when you have a luxery problem like how do i reduce palps lol palps prove power its the triple p effect lol
 

led05

Chasing The Present
sounds like rocket fuel led i heard good things about gambian in past i have some of cannabiogens version in fridge never tried em tho ,,scary is something i search for only happened to me once on an unknown sativa the heart palps ive had a few times ,,you got something there when you have a luxery problem like how do i reduce palps lol palps prove power its the triple p effect lol
I wonder if Charlies are the same, source I got it from was in Vibes, as was Charlie.... I'm sure ones he sold via Cannabiogen were bulked / reproduced and such, so obviously different but perhaps same starting points....

"hey Bro; what's that new strain that's been released, and why the Fk do they call it Palps" .....
 

harvestreaper

Well-known member
Veteran
I wonder if Charlies are the same, source I got it from was in Vibes, as was Charlie.... I'm sure ones he sold via Cannabiogen were bulked / reproduced and such, so obviously different but perhaps same starting points....

"hey Bro; what's that new strain that's been released, and why the Fk do they call it Palps" .....
thanks for the info sounds like there could be hope for my beans if they germ ,, the palpz should have someone getting carried off on a stretcher on seedpack with an only for the hardcore warning lol
 

Piff_cat

Well-known member
I think the no serrations glossy types require actual jungle Temps (95 with 85 rh) to thrive or they could just be non vigorous genotype. Bit they exist across landraces this breeder terpyz has studied them and bred a line called swag
 
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