Boosting Terpenes! What Organically Sourced Product do YOU Use for Greater Quantity/Flavor/Aroma/Complexity of your Terpenes?

[Douglas.Curtis]

Has anyone used Microbe Hydroponics "Terps Plus?" I'm curious because I'm not finding many reviews and it's listed as a "Natural" product.

I was hoping you were using leaf mold or similar. I've noticed some folks using EM-1 and it's really not necessary and rather expensive. 6 months is a very long wait time for me. heh

 

[xtsho]

Has anyone used Microbe Hydroponics "Terps Plus?" I'm curious because I'm not finding many reviews and it's listed as a "Natural" product.

I was hoping you were using leaf mold or similar. I've noticed some folks using EM-1 and it's really not necessary and rather expensive. 6 months is a very long wait time for me. heh

EM-1 is just lactobacillus casei. It is easily made by merely rinsing rice and using that water to colonize bacteria already present in the environment. You then add milk as a food source for the bacteria to feed on. You can stabilize it by adding sugar or molasses and it will last about a year.

I'm not paying $30 for a pint of something when I can make gallons for a few dollars. None of these products are anything special and in fact have been around and have been used for decades in cheese making as starter culture.

As for waiting 6 months, if you're doing an outdoor grow then use the trim from your harvest for next years batch.



Lactobacillus casei can be purchased as a probiotic for human consumption for much less than some product marketed to cannabis growers.

​

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Right on point, I've been making cultured rice wash for a few years now.

 

[F_T_P!]

I've added bokashi (fermented vegetable scraps) to my grows for the last couple of years. I think it benefits terpene production but haven't done comparisons.

I use lots of L.A.B.s ferments, I don't know if it is like bokashi or not but the plants love anything I give them. I used to make anaerobic banana ferments back in the day that always made the finished product pop with flavor and potency. This round I made different Lacto ferments from Red Snapper, green beans and seabird guano, bananas, alfalfa with rice hulls. I feel I can boost plants during any stage with this combo. For seedlings and clones I just use whey (1oz per gallon) and water for feed and media soaks, apparently the roots love it.

 

[F_T_P!]

Has anyone tried companion planting to boost terpene production? Chamomile and yarrow are always mentioned but i never tried on my own. Sometimes (holy) basil is mentioned.

The problem with this is different viruses and diseases can be transferred between species ie; hop latent viroid. Not saying it is a bad idea just something to think about. There has been a recent outbreak in some pepper disease in cannabis because people in Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico were using pepper plants as companions and it spread the disease they were carrying to the cannabis.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Great stuff... and I need to source a new keyboard for long responses. More in a few days.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Turns out my keyboard did NOT die. Yaaaay! Somehow the usb dongle for it ended up in the dongle slot of a wireless mouse. LOL

EM-1 is just lactobacillus casei. It is easily made by merely rinsing rice and using that water to colonize bacteria already present in the environment.

While it's a bit more than just casei, you can indeed make a very similar product using rice wash. What I find interesting are the reports of folks often having better results with local leaf mold. It makes sense, because the local microbiota are much more adapted to the local environment. EM-1, though being slightly less effective, is very convenient time-wise. lol

There has been a recent outbreak in some pepper disease in cannabis because people in Colorado, Arizona and New Mexico were using pepper plants as companions and it spread the disease they were carrying to the cannabis.

Well that truly sucks. They should feed rabbit poop to their plants, thereby increasing the natural immunity of their plants. When a plant has all of the elements it needs for full health, the majority of diseases are easily cured and or avoided.

 

[acespicoli]

Increasing Inflorescence Dry Weight and Cannabinoid Content in Medical Cannabis Using Controlled Drought Stress​

• May 2019
• HortScience 54(5):964-969
• 54(5):964-969

DOI:10.21273/HORTSCI13510-18

Deron Caplan1 , Mike Dixon, and Youbin Zheng2
School of Environmental Sciences, University of Guelph, Guelph, Ontario, N1G 2W1, Canada

Additional index words. Cannabis sativa, marijuana, deficit irrigation, plant water potential, medicinal crops, volumetric soil moisture content

Abstract. Controlled application of drought can increase secondary metabolite concentrations in some essential oil-producing crops. To evaluate the effects of drought on cannabis (Cannabis sativa L.) inflorescence dry weight and cannabinoid content, drought stress was applied to container-grown cannabis plants through gradual growing substrate drying under controlled environment. Fertigation was withheld during week 7 in the flowering stage until midday plant water potential (WP) was approximately L1.5 MPa (drought stress threshold). This occurred after 11 days without fertigation. A well-irrigated control was used for comparison. Leaf net photosynthetic rate (Pn), plant WP, wilting (leaf angle), and volumetric moisture content (VMC) were monitored throughout the drying period until the day after the drought group was fertigated. At the drought stress threshold, Pn was 42% lower and plant WP was 50% lower in the drought group than the control. Upon harvest, drought-stressed plants had increased concentrations of major cannabinoids tetrahydrocannabinol acid (THCA) and cannabidiolic acid (CBDA) by 12% and 13%, respectively, compared with the control. Further, yield per unit growing area of THCA was 43% higher than the control, CBDA yield was 47% higher, Δ9 -tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) yield was 50% higher, and cannabidiol (CBD) yield was 67% higher. Controlled drought stress may therefore be an effective horticultural management technique to maximize both inflorescence dry weight and cannabinoid yield in cannabis, although results may differ by cannabis cultivar or chemotype.

Conclusions​

This study suggested that controlled drought stress can increase the concentration of the major cannabinoids THCA and CBDA and the yield of THCA, CBDA, THC, and CBD in chemovar II cannabis without reducing inflorescence dry weight and irrespective of decreased Pn. These results were achieved by gradually drying the substrate over 11 d until plant WP reached approximately −1.5 MPa during week 7 in the flowering stage. Comparable results can be expected using leaf wilting as a drought-stress indicator with fertigation triggered at a leaf angle 50% higher than in its turgid state.

This method for administering drought stress and the results of this study should be applicable for similar varieties of chemovar II cannabis;

Additionally, withhold light... keep them in the dark for three days!!! NO light at ALL prior to harvest

Odd that this product is not available n the USA. I wonder why?

Chitosan - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Chitosan was first registered as an active ingredient (licensed for sale) in 1986.[17]

Improvement of the antioxidant activity, phytochemicals, and cannabinoid compounds of Cannabis sativa by salicylic acid elicitor​

Food Sci Nutr. 2021 Dec; 9(12): 6873–6881.
Published online 2021 Oct 25. doi: 10.1002/fsn3.2643 <<< Click,
PMCID: PMC8645707
PMID: 34925815
The name is from Latin salix for willow tree, from which it was initially identified and derived.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salicylic_acid


Willow Bark (Salicin)The white willow, known as Salix, contains a chemical known as salicin in its bark, which is a rich source of tannins and flavonoids. Salicin is the precursor of salicylic acid, comprising about 1% of the white willow bark extract, whereas other glycosides comprise about 12%.

Formula: C₇H₆O₃ -
Molar mass: 138.12 g/mol

 

[xtsho]

Turns out my keyboard did NOT die. Yaaaay! Somehow the usb dongle for it ended up in the dongle slot of a wireless mouse. LOL


While it's a bit more than just casei, you can indeed make a very similar product using rice wash. What I find interesting are the reports of folks often having better results with local leaf mold. It makes sense, because the local microbiota are much more adapted to the local environment. EM-1, though being slightly less effective, is very convenient time-wise. lol


Well that truly sucks. They should feed rabbit poop to their plants, thereby increasing the natural immunity of their plants. When a plant has all of the elements it needs for full health, the majority of diseases are easily cured and or avoided.

I was just going by what they list on the label. It's possible they have unlisted ingredients which is why I don't use any of these fancy overpriced commercial products. I like to know what's in anything I use.

Guaranteed Analysis
Active Ingredients: Lactobacillus casei (1,000,000 CFU/mL)
Total other ingredients (inert): (water, organic molasses) 99.99%

Leaf mold also has numerous different microorganisms not just one. Youngsan Cho the founder of JADAM talks about it in one of his lectures. "Selectively using bacteria that are said to be beneficial creates an imbalance of soil nutrition." Which makes sense. You want a variety as they work together. Inoculating with one specific microbe doesn't really make sense. It's no different from what many do when they get into flower and cut off all nitrogen and add a bunch of P/K ending up with yellow plants that are unable to efficiently photosynthesize which reduces the energy the plant can create to use towards flowering.

My niece has a PhD in Soil Microbiology and I've discussed this topic with her quite a bit. She says you want microbial diversity.

 

[Rocket Soul]

Somebody posted me this on another forum:

Frontiers | The role of red and white light in optimizing growth and accumulation of plant specialized metabolites at two light intensities in medical cannabis (Cannabis sativa L.)

The cultivation of medical cannabis (Cannabis sativa L.) is expanding in controlled environments, driven by evolving governmental regulations for healthcare ...

www.frontiersin.org

Key points: wide red supplement hitting all chloropeaks was superior in almost all aspects. In the high intensity condition wide red sup also improved terpene content over all other spectrums tested. This confirms a lot of my suspicions: 4k +660nm is not the ideal spectrum for growing but very nice at producing highest efficiency numbers. However a well designed spectrum have higher light utilization value: same amount of light produce more bud, 10-15%.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

I was just going by what they list on the label. It's possible they have unlisted ingredients which is why I don't use any of these fancy overpriced commercial products. I like to know what's in anything I use.

Guaranteed Analysis
Active Ingredients: Lactobacillus casei (1,000,000 CFU/mL)
Total other ingredients (inert): (water, organic molasses) 99.99%

Leaf mold also has numerous different microorganisms not just one. Youngsan Cho the founder of JADAM talks about it in one of his lectures. "Selectively using bacteria that are said to be beneficial creates an imbalance of soil nutrition." Which makes sense. You want a variety as they work together. Inoculating with one specific microbe doesn't really make sense. It's no different from what many do when they get into flower and cut off all nitrogen and add a bunch of P/K ending up with yellow plants that are unable to efficiently photosynthesize which reduces the energy the plant can create to use towards flowering.

My niece has a PhD in Soil Microbiology and I've discussed this topic with her quite a bit. She says you want microbial diversity.
<video link>

Crazy... 'cause I was sure I've read multiple times EM-1 is made from multiple bacteria sources. Maybe all Casei types?? Would make sense for labeling purposes. That's actually the first time I've read the label. Ty so much for posting it. lol

It also makes sense why cultured rice rinse water is so much more effective. The diversity of it is amazing.
Your niece is right on the money.

Edit: Ignore this next bit in parentheses... all of your contributions are immensely helpful, and I greatly appreciate any information on naturally boosting terpenes.

(While the wavelength and hydration effects are very interesting, this thread really is about products. Perhaps I should have been more specific about it being nutrient related products? heheh)

 

[acespicoli]

Characterization of the Cannabis sativa glandular trichome proteome​

DOI:10.1371/journal.pone.0242633

Raffinose - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

​

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sucrose

Brix Levels: a key element for an optimal growing of the plants​

Sugar is found everywhere and in all products, from soft drinks or cakes to fruits. The same is true for cannabis plants. When you start growing, it’s important to control many factors, such as sugar distribution. In fact, Brix degrees represent the amount of glucose of an aqueous solution. If a plant produces sufficient Brix levels and distributes it correctly, it will produce higher and larger yields.
Contents

• What does sugar mean for cannabis crops?
• Brix levels: What are they?
  • What are the ideal Brix levels for cannabis?
• Refractometer: the best tool for Brix measurement
  • How to increase Brix values in cannabis

What does sugar mean for cannabis crops?​

Beyond all the necessary aspects of growing cannabis known as temperature, water or substrate, it is necessary to boost the production. This factor affects plants’ overall development, its health and yields. When plants photosynthesize, they convert the sun’s energy into oxygen and glucose.
The need for sugar depends on different factors, such as:

• The stage of the plant. Young ones need more glucose because they are developing structurally.
• Cannabis genetics and its structure.
• The flowers are those that need more sugar, also due to a higher capacity of concentration of this resource.

However, plants have a self-regulation process; resposible of the excess to other organs with deficiencies. This is channeled according to natural needs, thanks to photobiological agents that are distributed in different zones.
Rememeber that the different parts of the plant compete with each other for as much glucose as possible. Thus, the strongest organs get more.

Brix levels: What are they?​

Brix level is a measure of sucrose, a simple sugar which indicates the amount contained in a substance. In fact, different industries use it, such as food and agriculture ; moreover, it’s expressed as a percentage represeneting the sucrose per 100 grams.
To quantify it, they use the deviation of a quantity of light passing through the liquid or solid, or, in other words, the refraction of light. The sap contains many other molecules, but the glucose ones are larger. The refractometer makes it easy to identify and quantify.

What are the ideal Brix levels for cannabis?​

If you wish to harvest the marijuana, you should wait until the plants reach between 12 and 15%. Keep in mind that each genetic is different, in some cases reaching 20% or more. Vegetables with a percentage lower than 12% can suffer pests and diseases; it means that the plant is not yet mature or that they have stunted growth.

Refractometer: the best tool for Brix measurement​

Brix is measured with an optical or digital refractometer. These use the way light passes through a substance and bends, to find out the amount of sugar dissolved in a liquid. Once the measurement is done, it can be correlated to characterize many different substances. This apparatus is small and easy to transport, allowing to carry out measurements anywhere. There are two types of refractometers:

• On the one hand, optical refractometers rely on the eyes themselves to determine the shadow line in the viewfinder. In consequence, the sample is applied and held against the light after applying the sample and seeing where the dark line falls.
• Digital refractors, on the other hand, can contain built-in measurement curves for different types of samples, providing greater accuracy, the person will do the reading and directly provide the result. Therefore, some, such as the Milwaukee Digital Brix refractometer, are ideal for this type of measurement.

How to increase Brix values in cannabis​

Many times, low Brix levels point to a lack of some of the key growth factors: air, light, temperature and nutrients.

• The amount of light must adapt to each stage, as it allows photosynthesis to take place and therefore helps the plants to renew sugars. Because of this, it’s important to choose the right light for the growing room.
• Maintain appropriate climatic conditions for each stage of the crop, controlling temperature and humidity levels, as well as adapting the watering schedules of the plant.
• Different trace elements can make a difference between the amount of sugar, that’s why nowadays there are various supplements in order to help crop’s nutrition. Among them are humic acids, fulvic acids and amino acids, which influence the way nutrients such as iron or calcium are absorbed.
• Keep the growing space clean.
• Prune cannabis plants, with techniques such as SCROG or Supercropping to concentrate glucose production at the top during flowering.

Brix levels indicate the sugar contained in a solution. It is possible to measure in a simple way using a refractometer; the aim is to know the crop’s state and if any factor should be improved.

Erik Collado
With over ten years of experience in the cannabis industry,
his experiences and learning are the basis for GB The Green Brand's success.



Front Plant Sci. 2022; 13: 895971.
Published online 2022 Jun 23. doi: 10.3389/fpls.2022.895971
PMCID: PMC9262383
PMID: 35812929

A Temporary Immersion System to Improve Cannabis sativa Micropropagation​

shows some growing with 2% sucrose added to the media

Honey - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

@Douglas.Curtis thats all I got brother lurk mode activated
Will try to post some frostys along they way

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

Awesome!! Ty so much!!!

 

[Bmac1]

Some good reading. Thanks for posting.

 

[Gooseman23]

Nice to see some talk about jadam. Also knf is good. I’ve done both. Now a days I have a little bit of a mix of different types of organics. But people sleep on the real natural fertilizers. It’s simple concept that people don’t grasp. If you have a plant that needs all these nutrients. Then you have to understand that means the plant itself is made of all those nutrients. So if you brrak those plants down they can then be fed as nutrients again. Really simple which plant would have the best nutrients for your plant? The same plant. So essentially if you grow cannabis then a cannabis plant has everything a cannabis plant would need. So if you make a fertilizer with it it has it all. Jadam is putrification. Knf is fermentation. Both just different ways to break down and extract these nutrients from the plants. This has been know for thousands of years. It’s how forests feed themselves. In the fall the leaves fall off and then they break down on the ground by all the fungi and microbes. Which turn those leaves back into fertilizer for the trees. Same exact concept we all see every year. But for some reason people are so far gone they believe they have to buy nutrients to feed the plants. Plants were here before us. They don’t need us, we need them. Remember that.

 

[Gooseman23]

But yea back to the actual topic. Micronutrients I would say have the impact on terpenes. An more specifically micronutrients from organic sources. So for me I feel like I’ve noticed the most flavor when I add organic sources that are rich in micronutrients. Like kelp, fish fertilizer, etc… these organic sources are rich in micros and I do believe this gives that extra flavor and terps.

 

[moose/MI]

Amazon is dropping off a quart today to take my girls to the finish line.
I'm in living soil but just wanted to be sure.

 

[Gooseman23]

Amazon is dropping off a quart today to take my girls to the finish line.
I'm in living soil but just wanted to be sure.
View attachment 19074025

Neptune is good brand. I used to use the one that is fish and kelp together. Now I make fish Amino acid my self and add in some soluble sea weed. But either way it’s good shit just cheaper if you make yourself. That one you have is fish hydrolysate. I always recommend the hydrolysate or either fish amino acid over the emulsion which loses quite a bit during the process of making it.

 

[F7OWiD]

Organic maple water (sap) + super low minreal artesian spring water, which we're using for the entire run anyway. Some of our key ingredients end of flower -refining the overall aromatics, not changing them.

Don't tell anyone though ! ; ))

 

[Rocket Soul]

Organic maple water (sap) + super low minreal artesian spring water, which we're using for the entire run anyway. Some of our key ingredients end of flower -refining the overall aromatics, not changing them.

Don't tell anyone though ! ; ))

Please develop this a bit, of running organics i assume?
Would exchange spring for rain?