Bat Guano vs. Bone and Blood

[Holycrap!]

Does anyone know how fast different components become available when mixed into Promix

I've used Bone, blood,Kelp meal and dolomite lime and they seem to work fine.

The blood I believe breaks down very fast available within a week. The bone and kelp I think take longer but seem to hit right in time for flower for me.

/What about the Bat Guanos? I ran out of blood and bone and used High N and High P guano's instead in my last batch of mix.

How fast do Guano's become available?

I realize it has to do with bacteria in the soil breaking down the components, but really I've like to know the average breakdown time for various organic soil amendments.

Blood Meal - 1 week?
Bone Meal - ???
Kelp Meal - ????
Guano - ????

Any info appreciated.

 

[supermanlives]

guanos and blood meal are just about instantly available. bone and kelp meal take some time. IMHO

 

[supermanlives]

the reason i say this is i have made teas with blood and guano and had results the next day. a few times i burned them. so that tells me they are fast acting

 

[pseudopod]

What he says.

If I need a quick boost of nutes, I'll make a tea (with the exception of bone meal). I'm sure kelp/alfalfa/etc meals have different breakdown rates, but the goodies are being released to your microherd as you water.

 

[Holycrap!]

big thanks for the replies.....

I thought blood and guano was immediately available.

I have never used a tea. I might do some research there.

In truth, I think I do a good job with my garden, but I also think it could be better.

I generally harvest 3.5 to 5 ounces per plant, but I grow in 5 gallon buckets with 3-4 foot tall plants. I feel, with no real way of knowing, that if I dialed in the ferts a bit better, maybe I could get the same yield with smaller plants.

I think depending on time of year, my water supply changes PH and locks out nutes a bit for me.

Sorry for rambling, but again thanks for the replies.

aND IF ANYONE KNOWS OF A RELEASE CHART FOR ORGANIC NUTES, i'D APPRECIATE IT.

HC!

 

[WhiteWolfLC]

Ok, I prefer to make tea out of the guano's....get's the nutrients there faster....Once you learn it, you can feed at will......WW

 

[AOD2012]

whoah...totally ODed on the giant letters.

 

[VerdantGreen]

guano is very variable. some has fast release nutes, some has slow, most has a mixture of both.

 

[VerdantGreen]

here is a chart. remember that the plant controls pH in the rootzone to a large extent.
but if you feel your water source has unfriendly pH you should, imo, monitor it and adjust it. (speaking as someone who has the same problem)

 

[bakelite]

Here are the basics for the release times of various organic fertilizers. I don't agree with everything here, but it is good for a general reference. (sorry for the sloppiness, It didn't copy and paste well. I tried to correct it but to no avail).

-bakelite



Table 1. A Selection of Organic Fertilizers for Use in Growing Mediaa
Fertilizer Material Estimated Rate of NutrientRelease Salt & pH Effects
N P K
Alfalfa Meal 2.5 0.5 2.0 Slow
Blood Meal 12.5 1.5 0.6 Medium-Fast
Bone Meal 4.0 21.0 0.2 Slow
Cottonseed Meal7.0 2.5 1.5 Slow-Medium Tends
Crab Meal 10.0 0.3 0.1 Slow
Feather Meal 15.0 0.0 0.0 Slow
Fish Meal 10.0 5.0 0.0 Medium
Granite Meal 0.0 0.0 4.5 Very Slow
Greensand 0.0 1.5 5.0 Very Slow
Bat Guano 5.5 8.6 1.5 Medium
Seabird Guano 12.3 11.0 2.5 Medium
Kelp Meal 1.0 0.5 8.0 Slow Possibly high-salt
Dried Manure Depends on Source Medium Possibly high-salt
Colloidal Phosphate 0.0 16.0 0.0 Slow-Mediumc
Rock Phosphate 0.0 18.0 0.0 Very Slow-Slowc
Soybean Meal 6.5 1.5 2.4 Slow-Medium
Wood Ash 0.0 1.5 5.0 Fast Very alkaline, salts
Worm Castings 1.5 2.5 1.3 Medium

 

[WhiteWolfLC]

When you get older you'll learn to use em....Hope you don't have too...WWLCZ

 

[Holycrap!]

Thanks for the posts....

Verdant - If I am looking at that right, iron uptake drops significantly at a ph of 8? Same for Boron, Copper and Zink....

Now that might help me. I thought I was getting a low PH from the water and organic nutes, even though I use lime in my mix....But really I think I am locking out nutes with a high PH...

Again if I am understanding Verdant's chart......

Thanks a ton,
HC!

 

[ixnay007]

Don't worry too much about the chart, the d.lime is there to contrast the acidification of the organic material, peat especially, he's just recommending that if your water is way off, a bit of PH adjustment is a good thing.

You may be causing problems if you have high PH water with a lot of scale, plus d.lime.

 

[VerdantGreen]

Verdant - If I am looking at that right, iron uptake drops significantly at a ph of 8? Same for Boron, Copper and Zink....

Now that might help me. I thought I was getting a low PH from the water and organic nutes, even though I use lime in my mix....But really I think I am locking out nutes with a high PH...

yes, when you hear about 'acid loving' plants in general horticulture, they are just plants that like more iron. as you can see from the chart the best range is between 6 and 7. if you are using dolomite lime in the soil, and your water source is much above 7, then your soil pH is unlikely to go below 7 which may cause some problems.

VG

 

[Holycrap!]

Will test water this week, but I am guessing ph is over 7. I think it fluctuates between winter and summer with ph, but cannot back that up, just a gut feeling.

I use epsoma garden lime pellets. I always thought I needed a lot of lime as I use promix BX which is peat based even though it is buffered. Maybe I am going a bit too heavy on the lime as I get slight odd deficiencies. But what is odd is that I always think they look like N deficiency(maybe it's iron) and sometimes praying for MG. But it looks like N or MG are available at a higher ph. That is why I always think I am low.....

So, I guess I have some homework to do. I have some paying attention to do. The deficiencies are not really bad, slight 3/4 way through flower, but I am certain I could increase overall quality and yield if I fix the issues....

This thread has been very helpful.....

Thanks.

HC!

 

[VerdantGreen]

ok, garden lime will raise your pH more than dolomite lime so that might not be helping.

having said that by 3/4 of the way through flower the lower leaves will generally have started to fade.

the other thing to bear in mind is the plants that are rootbound will also look N deficient and yellow too.

VG.

p.s. but yes it is definitely worth knowing the pH of your water source and if possible the alkalinity (ability to neutralize acids). if its off then that is one thing that is easy to fix and eliminate as a potential problem.

 

[Mud Man]

tagged, back soon.. more cool helpful vibes from the VG...

 

[Holycrap!]

No this is not end of flowering yellowing And certainly not root bound. I have homework to do here. Problem is I changed from Blood/bone this run to Guano. So I will have to wait and see how it goes. I have a few lbs of guano I bought a few years ago. What I will likely do is see how this run goes, I have been keeping good notes again, something that fell by the wayside some years ago. Once I had it all down pretty well, I stopped taking notes, BIG mistake........Huge mistake.

So next run depending on how this guano run goes will either be guano again or back to bone/blood. Then I can monitor and dial things in. I also think I need to run 1-2 strains and not constant change.

I ran Leda years ago, I knew her well. Now I had been switching strains so much I did not know them all that well.....

More goes into all this then folks think.....

Thanks again
HC!

 

[ixnay007]

Might be because with blood you have much more N available, with guano it breaks down slower.

What kind of guano btw? Seabird, bat, penguin?

 

[Holycrap!]

Will post guano info when I can. Not home for another day.