Are ACE 'pure' strains really pure?

[DenverVaultBoy]

Problem is that most landrace varieties are very much wild plants, they're not viable for commercial cultivation, and often times will need to be cross bred with a stable commercial line just to "tame" those wild genes and produce a line that the average grower can appreciate, sometimes this takes several generations, resulting in a plant that genetically bears only a slight resemblance to the landrace you started with.

 

[therevverend]

What definition are you talking about? I haven't posted anything coming close to that (because that's not what I think) and OG Kush or NL certainly are not landraces (OG Kush is chemdawg x (Lemon Thai x Pakistan Hindu Kush), no Afghani genetics).

Chemdawg is Afghani. NL is landrace Afghani x landrace Thai. You can look it up. They are 'descended from landrace genetics'. Which makes them landraces by the same definition Ace uses for strains like Kali China. Kali China is listed as landrace genetics and a 'pure stabilized' strain. Even though it's a multi-strain hybrid.

Serious Seeds lists Kali Mist as an F1 Hybrid 'mostly sativa'. Very vague but they aren't claiming it's a landrace or even a narrow leaf strain.

Strain descriptions are quite clear, and for non-hybridized varieties it's basic cycles of selection/reproduction. Why would "indica" or "afghani" be bad words? Where does that come from ? Nonsense

Maybe because they're left out of the descriptions of certain strains? Kush was certainly left out of the description of Bangi Haze. No one wants Afghani genetics in their pure cannabis.

 

[Rastafarout]

The strains that Ace have are definitely worked ... For the better or worse? That would be a personal choice .
I know the Lesotho and Transkei are worked because I hand collect landraces that are pure
Been living in Transkei/ Durban
So can see what's been bolstered
That been said you do really need a good number of beans when hunting through landraces to find that something special
But it's a lot of work ...

 

[therevverend]

I know the Lesotho and Transkei are worked because I hand collect landraces that are pure

I would love to see pictures and read about the African strains you've had experience with.

I've never gotten an early flowering Durban I've been happy with. The entire time I've been growing maybe 2 or 3 times I've smoked South African cannabis strains that have impressed me. They really impressed me but they are rare on the West Coast of North America.

 

[Rastafarout]

I have a lot of photos of landrace from Transkei in the wild but busy growing a big number indoors to sift through , just to see how they go inside
Haven't topped them so I can see wha they do ... When they going hard I would say easy an inch + a day in growth
So having a wee bit of trouble lol ... Busy upgrading the groom
I will start a thread as this is not the place ��✌��️

 

[willydread]

let's go guys! Everyone knows that pakistan chitral kush is present in the Congo ACE / CBG, and they have never hidden it, indeed, they find everything on theirs. site ...
Returning to the initial question, are they landrace? Yes and no, they are landrace worked, without herms and plants with low thc content and resin ... (who has real landrace in today's market ??)
Are they pure? Yes, they are not hybridized with skunk and Co. except where specified ...

 

[Rastafarout]

There definitely is pure mate , you just need to know where to look, but with greenhouse's
Evil plan taking full affect soon come there won't be
I would say 90% of it is gone in South Africa depending exactly where
But Southern Africa is huge
Buying the worked landrace will save you plenty time ... But something you are personally looking for might have been bred out ....
On the other hand something someone else likes might have been bred in
All boils down to preference

 

[MJPassion]

Fact:

In case you people don't know by now.

If you took plants from one or more locations and grew them long enough in another location for
something like over 50 years. They then become a new Landrace adapted to their new environment.

Read this and you'll understand more.

Toward an Evolved Concept of Landrace

I would consider those plants HEIRLOOM and NOT landrace.
Of course that depends on the growing conditions as well, imo.


Heirlooms are selected varieties that breed true for specific traits while landraces are wildly variable in their expressions.


Thanks for the read.

 

[MJPassion]

Problem is that most landrace varieties are very much wild plants, they're not viable for commercial cultivation, and often times will need to be cross bred with a stable commercial line just to "tame" those wild genes and produce a line that the average grower can appreciate, sometimes this takes several generations, resulting in a plant that genetically bears only a slight resemblance to the landrace you started with.

Inserting genes from another variety is the fast way to stabilizing a trait or two but certainly NOT the only way and forget about purity.

1:1 breeding of several landrace plants can achieve the same goals while keeping the lines PURE. Granted, some genes WILL be lost, but that's the price of working such small populations. If you are creating several line from pure stock they can then be interbred and still be pure.

The fact of the matter is that NO breeder is making crosses/varieties that they do not want to sample. In this way, they are breeding what they, themselves, like. If other folks like what they've done... AWESOME!

 

[MJPassion]

let's go guys! Everyone knows that pakistan chitral kush is present in the Congo ACE / CBG, and they have never hidden it, indeed, they find everything on theirs. site ...
Returning to the initial question, are they landrace? Yes and no, they are landrace worked, without herms and plants with low thc content and resin ... (who has real landrace in today's market ??)
Are they pure? Yes, they are not hybridized with skunk and Co. except where specified ...

If a variety has genes mixed in from another variety how can it be considered pure?


I don't get this thinking.

 

[Infinitelight5D]

I didn't know of the pck in bangi haze. Now I know though. Thanks guys

 

[Hydro8]

If someone sold “pure” landrace sativas most people would hate them and not buy them again. Most pure landrace sativas are 13ft plants that take for ever to flower and the flowers are branch with stringy airy buds attached to them. The high is many times not that great, paranoia and very heavy come downs are common.

With “pure” landrace sativas people would probably spend 6-9mo growing a massive plant to get a couple of Zs of pot not many people would want to smoke.

If I lived in the equator with a lager yard I would have them all over. I do love good landrace stavias when you smoke a good one it is amazing.. They are also special and unique. I have also smoke lots of landrace sativas that were not that good at all.

I've never grown ACE stuff but it seems like they have spent sometime picking and breeding stuff that the grower will like and buy again. I would love to grow some but these type of sativas are not practical for my situation. If I move to the tropics I will be all over some verity packs.

 

[GatorGumbo]

Problem is that most landrace varieties are very much wild plants, they're not viable for commercial cultivation, and often times will need to be cross bred with a stable commercial line just to "tame" those wild genes and produce a line that the average grower can appreciate, sometimes this takes several generations, resulting in a plant that genetically bears only a slight resemblance to the landrace you started with.

I agree, except the part about "only a slight resemblance". Why would you start with a landrace only to work away from its unique qualities. Just because it doesn't take 24 months to finish and yields like a drunk driver at a crosswalk, just like the original ditchweed, that doesn't make it valuable. It's the art of refining the unique desirable traits so folks can get the same or better experience the strain is useful for.

 

[willydread]

If a variety has genes mixed in from another variety how can it be considered pure?


I don't get this thinking.

Honduras, Guatemala, Lebanon, pckure landrace(or heirloom) worked/selected, not hybridized ...
Ethiopian(& Malawi?) pure, worked, selected, not hybridized..
Bangi Haze :Congo x (Congox pck)) x Nepal highland
Nepal highland:coming from referman, maybe a indi/Sat landrace
You can also dont love their product but its all under the sun...

 

[Emperortaima]

Ace is in my opinion reliable/highly credible from my personal research many lines they have including their own hybrids appeal to me. Dubi is an outstanding dude and deserves to be revered for his contributions

 

[DenverVaultBoy]

I agree, except the part about "only a slight resemblance". Why would you start with a landrace only to work away from its unique qualities. Just because it doesn't take 24 months to finish and yields like a drunk driver at a crosswalk, just like the original ditchweed, that doesn't make it valuable. It's the art of refining the unique desirable traits so folks can get the same or better experience the strain is useful for.

Still, after the plant has been through several generations of selection for commercial qualities, you're usually left with a plant that expresses far more genes from the commercial genetics that were introduced than from its regional ancestors. It'll be a healthier line with more genetic diversity present in the plants actual genes, but that diversity will usually only be visible in very watered down ways, a certain smell or taste, a certain growth pattern, tolerance to a certain climate, etc.

 

[therevverend]

I've never grown ACE stuff but it seems like they have spent sometime picking and breeding stuff that the grower will like and buy again. I would love to grow some but these type of sativas are not practical for my situation. If I move to the tropics I will be all over some verity packs.

I'm in a similar situation, 47 degrees N so not a lot of their stuff finishes this far north. But I have had success growing a couple of their strains. Bangi Haze is the obvious one I was very happy with it. Once it cured for a few months it had a wonderful Himalayan ganja flavor. It did get hit by stem rot so watch out for that.

I grew Mextiza from Cannabiogen this year it's the perfect Narrow Leaf sativa variety for temperate climates in my opinion. Finished in the first and second week of October. It's (Oaxacan 79 x (Nepalese x Jamaican). Ace offers Nep Jam which doesn't have the Oaxacan. Mextiza's grey mold resistance was excellent. The one weakness the strain has is a susceptibility to powdery mildew. PM got me hard around Oct 10 when the weather got foggy.

They've got other strains that do well in temperate climates depending how far north you are. Bubba Hash should finish early October if you like hashplants. They've done a nice job of diversifying their strain list in the last few years. Some of their hybrids have October finishing times. I've complained about Kali China as far as claims about it being a landrace but it should finish in the first half of October and have unique terpenes and effects. It'd be near the top of my list in strains I'd like to try.

 

[Thcvhunter]

If a variety has genes mixed in from another variety how can it be considered pure?


I don't get this thinking.

I agree buddy.
Lots of misinformation around.

I grew out Egyptian landrace and made a next generation of seeds.
I dont agree with claims like Willy’s that there are no pure landraces on the market and I dont agree ACE is anything near the best option.

If ACE does not label Bangi Haze(Whote Congo) as having NL and White Widow, how are so many people insisting on trusting and supporting ACE?

 

[Ignignokt]

This thread has turned out nice
Lots of good information.

 

[Thcvhunter]

If someone sold “pure” landrace sativas most people would hate them and not buy them again. Most pure landrace sativas are 13ft plants that take for ever to flower and the flowers are branch with stringy airy buds attached to them. The high is many times not that great, paranoia and very heavy come downs are common.

With “pure” landrace sativas people would probably spend 6-9mo growing a massive plant to get a couple of Zs of pot not many people would want to smoke.

If I lived in the equator with a lager yard I would have them all over. I do love good landrace stavias when you smoke a good one it is amazing.. They are also special and unique. I have also smoke lots of landrace sativas that were not that good at all.

I've never grown ACE stuff but it seems like they have spent sometime picking and breeding stuff that the grower will like and buy again. I would love to grow some but these type of sativas are not practical for my situation. If I move to the tropics I will be all over some verity packs.

The Egyptian landrace I bred with this year started flowering early/mid-June. Done by mid-August.

I pose another option to your statement that ACE worked the pure lines to make quick and productive plants — they hybridized them with BLD hybrids. Like when they couldnt find a male in Malawi so they used PCK. Hence ‘Killer Malawi’ and the fact that all their Malawi work is heavy and narcotic.