Any help installing a 30 amp Cap lighting controller?

[Snype]

A controller tutorial with a built in Ranco high temp cut off would be cool. Are the built in timers good? Easy to change out if it fails? Might be best to have an option for a 120v trigger cord to use any timer you want. Also an option to cut power off easily at the controller.

Lets see what rives says about this. It all sounds great to me. I like the idea of the high temp cut off to be used.

 

[InGhostgrower]

Damn... I bought a CAP controller about 10 days ago. Never knew was unsafe. Should of done my research. How risky are they? Should I be concerned? Ill just run 2 1000's if that will make it safer?

 

[rives]

I've never used a Ranco, but they have a good reputation. I usually just use an industrial remote-bulb thermostat, but the beauty of using a 120v-controlled power relay is that you can do whatever interlocks you want pretty easily. A trigger cable from a remote plug-in timer is probably the simplest and cheapest route rather than a panel-mount timer.

Snype, are you near a Home Depot or are you still out in the middle of BF Egypt?

The power relay that I normally recommend is in the following link. You can get them almost anywhere, but they are usually twice as expensive, at least.

http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...n-Style,_40A_(AD-PR40_Series)/AD-PR40-2C-120A

 

[rives]

Damn... I bought a CAP controller about 10 days ago. Never knew was unsafe. Should of done my research. How risky are they? Should I be concerned? Ill just run 2 1000's if that will make it safer?

If you feed it with a 15 or 20 amp breaker, you should be fine other than the junk receptacles. I would NOT feed them with anything more.

 

[Snype]

I've never used a Ranco, but they have a good reputation. I usually just use an industrial remote-bulb thermostat, but the beauty of using a 120v-controlled power relay is that you can do whatever interlocks you want pretty easily. A trigger cable from a remote plug-in timer is probably the simplest and cheapest route rather than a panel-mount timer.

Snype, are you near a Home Depot or are you still out in the middle of BF Egypt?

The power relay that I normally recommend is in the following link. You can get them almost anywhere, but they are usually twice as expensive, at least.

http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...n-Style,_40A_(AD-PR40_Series)/AD-PR40-2C-120A

Yeah I got a Home Depot real close. I'll add this relay to the list. Does this mean that I need to install a 40 amp breaker in the main panel?

 

[InGhostgrower]

Thanks rives... makes me feel a little better but will be looking for a better alternative. Looking to run 4 1000's eventually

 

[rives]

Yeah I got a Home Depot real close. I'll add this relay to the list. Does this mean that I need to install a 40 amp breaker in the main panel?

Nope, the 30a one will be fine for what you are doing. That is just the maximum capacity of the relay - they are stout as hell. *Edit* - something to keep in mind when dealing with electrical components is that you want all of the components downstream of the breaker to be rated either for the same current as the breaker, or more. This is the only way that the breaker can do it's job properly - it has to be the lightest-rated component in the circuit. Otherwise, the downstream gear blows up to save the breaker from tripping. No bueno.

Home Depots seem to vary what they stock at each branch, but I would recommend a GE subpanel if they have them there. GE's have copper busses and the breakers are cheap and reliable, and widely available.

Depending on how you want to do this, we can take a couple of approaches here. I can do some research and see if they stock a panel that the relay could fit into so that everything is contained in one enclosure, or we can figure out a separate enclosure for the controls and tie it to the subpanel with a pipe nipple. Mounting anything inside a subpanel is a code violation, but this isn't really going to be using the panel as a sub and it can certainly be done safely. A separate enclosure for the relay could easily cost more than than the other components combined, will take up a good bit more space, and really isn't necessary - if we were going with track-mount breakers, all of the devices would be in one enclosure anyway. Your call.

 

[Snype]

Nope, the 30a one will be fine for what you are doing. That is just the maximum capacity of the relay - they are stout as hell. *Edit* - something to keep in mind when dealing with electrical components is that you want all of the components downstream of the breaker to be rated either for the same current as the breaker, or more. This is the only way that the breaker can do it's job properly - it has to be the lightest-rated component in the circuit. Otherwise, the downstream gear blows up to save the breaker from tripping. No bueno.

Home Depots seem to vary what they stock at each branch, but I would recommend a GE subpanel if they have them there. GE's have copper busses and the breakers are cheap and reliable, and widely available.

Depending on how you want to do this, we can take a couple of approaches here. I can do some research and see if they stock a panel that the relay could fit into so that everything is contained in one enclosure, or we can figure out a separate enclosure for the controls and tie it to the subpanel with a pipe nipple. Mounting anything inside a subpanel is a code violation, but this isn't really going to be using the panel as a sub and it can certainly be done safely. A separate enclosure for the relay could easily cost more than than the other components combined, will take up a good bit more space, and really isn't necessary - if we were going with track-mount breakers, all of the devices would be in one enclosure anyway. Your call.

That's some great information! I'd really like it if everything can be contained in one panel. I can order a panel online if it makes the whole package look better if Home Depot doesn't have the right size panel for this application. I'd love to make something that looks real professional like it came from a store. Thanks again for all these details!

 

[rives]

I can't find an internal drawing for this panel, but I think that it will have enough room for the relay mounted in the lower right corner. You should be able to take the cover off at HD and measure it - the relay footprint is roughly 2-1/2" square and 2-1/16" deep, but you will need some room to get the wires terminated.

(2) 15a double-pole breakers will fill the panel, and will work out perfectly. (2) 1kw lights, with ballast losses, will draw a shade over 9 amps on a 240v circuit and you are allowed up to 12 amps continuous load on a 15a breaker. I've linked the 1" breakers. The 1/2" breakers will work, but you have to be careful about their placement on the buss to get 240v, and the knock-outs for the breakers will be more difficult to get right. For $8 more, total, the bigger breakers are probably the better way to go.

Subpanel - http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-Power...100123400?keyword=tl412r1#product_description

Breakers - http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-Q-Line-15-Amp-2-in-Double-Pole-Circuit-Breaker-THQL2115/100356525

These are the type of receptacles that you want. They are commercial grade Nema 6-15 receptacles, which means they are 240v, 15a. Neither HD or Lowes stocks them, and they are currently out of stock at AutomationDirect, but they will be available at any electrical parts house or eBay is often a source for deals on them. Stick with commercial or specification grade - they have screw connections with clamping plates and are much heavier construction. http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Power_Products_%28Electrical%29/Wiring_Devices/Electrical_Plugs,_Connectors,_-a-_Receptacles/Straight-Blade_Plugs,_Connectors,_-a-_Receptacles/BRY5662

Box for the receptacles - http://www.homedepot.com/p/qv/202056186

I can't tell if the box has 1/2" or 3/4" knockouts in it. Verify which they are and get the appropriate offset nipple. 3/4" will be a little easier to get the wire through. The locknuts will go on each end of the nipples, inside the boxes, and hold everything together. The insulating bushings then cover the ends of the nipples. -

1/2" offset nipples - http://www.homedepot.com/p/Halex-1-2-in-Rigid-Offset-Conduit-Nipple-90401/100120709

1/2" locknuts - http://www.homedepot.com/p/Halex-1-2-in-Rigid-Conduit-Locknuts-4-Pack-26190/100128709

1/2" insulating bushings (these are 100 packs and you only need a couple, I think that they have small bags with 5 or so in them but can't find a link) - http://www.homedepot.com/p/Raco-1-2...Polypropylene-Bushing-100-Pack-1402/203637441

3/4" offset nipple - http://www.homedepot.com/p/Halex-3-4-in-Rigid-Offset-Conduit-Nipple-90402/100178377

3/4" locknuts - http://www.homedepot.com/p/Halex-3-4-in-Rigid-Conduit-Locknuts-4-Pack-26197/100111071

3/4" insulating bushing (100 pack again) - http://www.homedepot.com/p/Raco-3-4...Polypropylene-Bushing-100-Pack-1403/203637442

Get 5 - 10' each of red, black, white, and green #12 wire, and some crimp terminals for the relay connections. Do you have crimpers and strippers? Some orange and yellow wirenuts will probably come in handy. You will also need a power cord for the trigger circuit between the relay and the timer, and a cord grip for the cord entering the panel. I've had excellent luck with the timer linked below - they keep good time and are battery backed.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-Indoor-7-Day-SunSmart-Digital-Timer-15079/100685884

 

[rives]

Here's a pretty good price for a box of 6-15's - http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-of-10-P...417?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item417b51fac1

 

[Snype]

Looking real good rives! I'll look this all over tomorrow and start ordering parts on Monday. Thanks again!

 

[InGhostgrower]

Just curious is it possible to modify the cap controller to make it safer? For instance changing out the outlets?

 

[rives]

Just curious is it possible to modify the cap controller to make it safer? For instance changing out the outlets?

That is certainly a possibility depending on your mechanical expertise and access to the necessary tools.

Staying with a 20a feed or less would limit the current to what the wiring and the components are actually sized for, and changing out the receptacles to specification grade ones would cure that problem. The units that I've seen don't really lend themselves to that because the receptacles were riveted in place, but the rivets could be drilled out.

If you added internal fusing and broke the circuitry up appropriately, then the current feeding the controller could be upsized safely and the controller could be used for what it is advertised. I've never had one in my hands, and don't know if there is room to add the necessary components, but I'd be very surprised if it couldn't be done.

It sounds like another potential DIY project to document here!

 

[Jhhnn]

I've never used a Ranco, but they have a good reputation. I usually just use an industrial remote-bulb thermostat, but the beauty of using a 120v-controlled power relay is that you can do whatever interlocks you want pretty easily. A trigger cable from a remote plug-in timer is probably the simplest and cheapest route rather than a panel-mount timer.

Snype, are you near a Home Depot or are you still out in the middle of BF Egypt?

The power relay that I normally recommend is in the following link. You can get them almost anywhere, but they are usually twice as expensive, at least.

http://www.automationdirect.com/adc...n-Style,_40A_(AD-PR40_Series)/AD-PR40-2C-120A

Thanks for your link to automationdirect. I'm using that very relay. The SPST model is slightly more compact. Old school bulletproof, particularly with the panel mount Grasslin timer. Pics in my albums.

I used standard parts, 4" boxes & extensions. I'd use bigger boxes if I had it to do over. That particular GE panel will only support one 240v circuit, which is fine for my purposes. My little grow runs entirely on a 15A 240v breaker.

Elec hardware selection sux at my nearby Homedepot, & Lowes as well. I found these guys online, after the project was complete-

http://www.garvinindustries.com/

Haven't used 'em, but they have every sort of standard elec box & free shipping over $50. Might be useful for similar projects.

 

[Snype]

Next week I'll buy that panel at Home Depot and give the measurements so we can see if everything will fit in the panel.

 

[Snype]

I haven't forgot about this project. Once I have all the parts, I'll come back and let you know.

 

[InGhostgrower]

Thank You!!

 

[rives]

If I should happen to miss it, drop me a PM.

 

[DAVES NOT HERE]

really looking forward to seeing this project move along. Thank you rives and Snype for everything that you have taught a long lurker. Time to come out of the dark

 

[Snype]

really looking forward to seeing this project move along. Thank you rives and Snype for everything that you have taught a long lurker. Time to come out of the dark

It'll be a week or 2 until we get started so please stay tuned until all the parts are in order.