Air cooled lights: the right way

[Guest]

Badmf, you will have to further educate me abit, that is if you want to.

So basically fan's are test the same, open area on both end's, and then they are rated as to the air flow they move???

I think I am lost on what static pressure truely is. Or what I think of as static drag on air flow is the same as what you call static pressure, but again I have never seen a fan rated for static pressure. To deal with the drag on the air flow one just up grade's the size fan they are using, and basically that is all I am seeing, you found a better quality fan, run's on higher amp's, this is a higher Rpm on most motor's, and in turn the motor can maintain it's RPM's, air movement, with some drag put behind it with out hendering the fan to move a certain amount of air.

This is not argueing the point, it is me trying to understand what is being said and what it all mean's.

What is the term "static pressure" mean, I find static and it's definition and with that to me static pressure is air flow drag from obsticale's and ducting which cause more stess on the motor, if low amped, well it will operate below it's rating's, move less air, so again a better designed motor that can take the drag will still move more air compared to the other fan.

Set me straight on what "static pressure" is as this may help me understand it all.

Happy Holiday's

realhigh

 

[one_eyed_jack]

Hmmmmmmm i'm not sure this is right but i'll take a stab at it based on my meager understanding..........high static pressure fans are what you'd use to move a lot air into or out of say your light or maybe even in an air replacement role..........it seems that if you have a long run to make with your ducting you need to use a high static fan as it has the power to move the air down the length of the run.....and as a air exchanger for your room the high static is needed to replace the volume of air in the room at a reasonable rate.........something like how much air it move's in 5 minutes or something like that.the low statics seem to be used for much shorter runs or maybe as intake fans at the bottom of your chamber..........right now i'm using a pair of those can typoe fans at the bottom of my chamber and another pair at the top it's like a poor man's convection venting set up..............................i also run an 8 inch oscilating fan and a 6 inch stattionary in the room itself to help with surface temps and humidity control..........so far my little 2X4 space is at 78 f constant daytime at 55 to 65 percent relative humidity night time i let the humidty drop to around 35 percent and the tepms range from 65 to 70............................hope some of this helped someone..........................

One eyed Jack Reckem

 

[badmf]

Okay I think this may help; Axial flow fans pass air straight through the fan parallel to the fan blade drive shaft. Axial flow fans are designed to operate at low static pressures. They are good to bring air through the wall without ducting.
circulation fans are used to help improve air distribution, reduce temperature stratification, increase air velocity in the grow zone, and eliminate dead air spots. Circulation fans usually operate at zero to low static pressures. (typical floor fan)
Centrifugal fans are quieter and can operate at much higher static pressures than axial flows can. Centrifugal fans bring air in through a center inlet, the air makes a right turn and is discharged perpenticular to the fan axis.(There are in-line models too) Centrifugal fans operate by throwing the air away from the blade tips. Use for handling relatively clean air because dirt accumulation on the blades affects the fans efficiency and airflow capacity.
Duct drag is friction or resistance to the air flow. With a higher pressure fan, it overcomes this without sacrificing airflow. The more expensive fans give you more than just a cooler light but operate quieter, in temps up to 140F and can handle humid environments, better. The difference is best expressed in placing your hand over the end of a duct and actually feeling the pressure differences in the fans output. One of the reasons I mentioned the placement of the fans importance, is to design a better duct flow to increase the movement of air over the bulb, which will reduce temps the most. So if you took seemingly equal cfm ratings, from different types of fans, you'd see a major difference in temp reduction. Although the fans initial cost is higher, it lowers the overall hood enough to give you the lumens you are paying for. The length of time the fans last is easily off set by this and lower a/c costs as well.

 

[Guest]

Okay, now I am still high, so no change there, LOL, but I am totally understanding your word's this morning. Like wake up and smell the rose's!

Cool, what matter's is I understand what is being said, and totally agree, I believe I had term's swimming in my head to cause confussion, or I was being a hard headed stonner again, LOL

Merry Xmass to all.

I have accumulated different style motor's, fan's, blower's, and I have noticed the difference in design and air flow on the same duct work and hood's.

Now to re read and find the link to the better fan's. I know my area does not stock them, as I have searched, and they do not like to do special order's, so I do get alot from the net.

Thank you for taking the time and re explainning it, I know it is what you were saying all along badmf, just all sunk into my brain this time, LOL

If you do have the time and ease, can you direct me to were I can find these fan's, I am burnt today.

grow safe.

realhigh.

 

[badmf]

No problem as many stock them, I use a friends hydro shop. His store has a couple types Dayton, Elicent and Hurricane. The Daytons 265 will work for 600's and under, they are a little noisier but much cheaper. They can be hung with bungee cords or others to minimise the vibrations too. www.hydroasis.com I buy most of the Elicents off Ebay for extreme discounts. A 500.00 1198cfm was had for 125! I looked recently and there are some good deals there, but be aware that some may be sold as results of grow busts so use a safe addy as always.

 

[Guest]

Well I have a couple Dayton blower's already, and I would be more interested in getting one first, compare to what I have, if all work's well, then I would search out more as I needed them.

Thank you for your help,

Merry Xmass to All.

realhigh.

 

[Guest]

static pressure

static pressure

A low static pressure fan would be likened to a 20" boc fan, moves alot of air with a low amount of pressure. A high static pressure fan is like a pc fan. small size and high volume of air moved in a smaller space. For cooling lights you want a high static pressure fan. A 4" or 6" fan from 100-225 cfm's will move enough air fast enough to cool a 400 hps bulb. A 650 hps requires about 300 cfm and a 1000 hps requires a 6" elicient type inline fan to properly cool. Diatance from light is also crucuial. The closer you can place the fan to the source of the heat, the faster the heat can be removed. The farther away from the source, the larger the cfm to pull the air the distance. Most fans are mounted within 3' of the light. To use a scrubber, an aitiuonal fan is needed.

BTW, air is beter pulled than pushed. Try pushing string and than pulling string. Get the idea? grinning.

Avid

 

[badmf]

Say Avid; you read the thread then right? just funnin ya! but thats the basic principle. I mount fans directly on the lights, suspended to keep the lights level. So stop grinnin'

 

[Pepin]

I saw a drawing on how to cool the lights, and not really have an effect on the odor, or co2 in the room...it looks pretty simple

 

[badmf]

Good diagram, but the fans should be closer to the light and an intake fan isn't necessary. Its more productive to have one really good exhaust fan pulling, than two lesser ones. This shows how easy it is to add air cooled lights and maintain co2 levels as long as you have a handle on temps and humidity. Good lookin out, Pepin!!

 

[Guest]

There are a few way's to do anything, not all are wrong, not all are right, but some will work better than other's and some are cheaper to do than other's.

I like the drawing and thank you for sharing it. I wonder who drew it up, a sale's rep or a grower, I say sale's rep.


I do hope all had a enjoyable Christmass day and shared with friend's and family.

I hope all have a safe and happy New Year.

grow safe.

realhigh.

r

 

[Pepin]

I'd have to agree with you realhigh, only a salesman would tell you that 2 fans are needed to cool a light...

I got 2 of the bake-a-round things from e-bay. I got a great deal on them.. 17.50 for both2 of them.

 

[Guest]

Pepin that sound's like you got a good deal on them. Never heard that term "bake-a-round" and so I am lost, but it does not matter, as long as they are doing the job for you and all grow's happy.

A safe New Year's to everyone.

realhigh.

 

[Pepin]

A Bake-a-round (by pyrex) is essentially a cool tube, with out all of the light parts hanging from the glass tube.

 

[Guest]

Ok if the lifetime of the bulb is lengthened with the fans. Then if properly cooled how long would a light last before losing enough lumens to exchange for a new one? Ofcourse i am stating that the lights would only be only 12/12 flowering cycles only. Nice thread i have 6 Super cool Sun System hoods 6" all cooled with inline canfans h/o going to a charcoal filter with a 8" canfan h/o to warm my home like others in here have stated. Helps in the frozen northern US. Let me know your guys opinions.

 

[badmf]

There is no accurate formula as there are other factors that effect bulb life. Brand of bulb, temperature of intake air, purity of square wave signal etc. But the best way is to get a lumen or quantum meter and check the rating when its new to monthly periods. I check it then and use this time to clean the glass and bulbs(bulbs and glass are cool! lol) I have a small tripod to set the meter at a fixed position to give better accuracy. I made this out of a few 1x2's. Oh and another tip; many lights have a series of slats cut in where the intake/outflow ducts connect. Cut these out as they restrict air flow by a great per centage! Since the cost of bulbs aren't cheap replacing them when its time is very important. You don't want to replace them too often or too late, both are wasteful. A meter solves this.

 

[tragic1]

Hey guys great thread. I was wondering if I could get some opinions on this fanInline fan .I'm looking at the 747cfm model. I wanna cool 2 1000w hps lamps that are using this cool tube reflector"reflector"

Thanks in advance

 

[Guest]

Not that I like to waste or spend money, but I would think that the 6" dia would be one that would best fit the cool tube. I would also think that one on each lamp would prove to work and would out last the larger 8" uint.

grow safe.

realhigh.

 

[badmf]

I agree with realhigh; the one fan approach pulls the hot air from one through the other or limits the flow with a "Y", so its best with a fan on each light. I don't agree with the site that Vortex are better than Elicents though, it just happens not to be a brand they carry, however Vortex fans are very good.

 

[Guest]

Well if you got good cool incoming air i feel a fan for each light would be overkill. but better to go over then under. But 2 700+ cfm fans i think is alil too much. I have 1 700+cfm canfan on 2 1k hps's. 6" from light is 67 degrees. just checked it today. I really don't like those hoods but let me know how they work out for you. Good Luck Jubei