So no silica is needed in coco?
Damn there goes another additive down the drain(Aptus fasilitor) LMAO.
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A question for the growers using Jacks 5-12-26
- Thread starter Jabapc
- Start date
So no silica is needed in coco?
Damn there goes another additive down the drain(Aptus fasilitor) LMAO.
clown baby
Active member
The guaranteed analysis on Jacks doesn't show any silica
SuperWeed
Member
It used to be the 13th item listed. Potassium Silicate. Even the msds has a warning for silica dust.
I will email Krystal and see what she says. Now I have to know for sure.
SuperWeed
Member
Good Info!
clown baby
Active member
The current analysis doesn't show any silica. And I think I say the THFarmer post you were referencing, and in the very next post, dizzle follows up and confirms that jacks doesn't have Si.
A weight of 5:5:1 of jacks:calcinit
otassium silicate yields a N-P2O5-K2O-Ca-Mg-Si ratio of 1.7-1-2.7-1.6-0.5-0.9. That's a K-Ca-Mg ratio of 5-3-1. The standard K2O-Ca-Mg ratio as 3 parts jacks to 2 parts Calcinit (by weight) yields a 4:2:1 K-Ca-Mg ratio.Looks like at 5:5:1, you don't throw off the KCaMg ratios toooo much. At least with recirculating topfeed (no coco) it hasn't been a problem yet. At ~1.2-1.4EC this ends up being roughly 1ml/gallon of potassium silicate at 1.5#/gal (mixed slightly stronger than protekt).
SuperWeed
Member
The current analysis doesn't show any silica. And I think I say the THFarmer post you were referencing, and in the very next post, dizzle follows up and confirms that jacks doesn't have Si.
A weight of 5:5:1 of jacks:calcinit
Looks like at 5:5:1, you don't throw off the KCaMg ratios toooo much. At least with recirculating topfeed (no coco) it hasn't been a problem yet. At ~1.2-1.4EC this ends up being roughly 1ml/gallon of potassium silicate at 1.5#/gal (mixed slightly stronger than protekt).
I appreciate you looking that up. I have sent the email and will let you know what she says when she replies.
agent dank
Member
Mine mixes up green.
Still havent found a good ratio for veg. Currently feeding 1.3EC on 16 inch tall plants and still running into yellow tips. This,time they are twisting though.
Should I back,off,nutes?
Feeding 9g mix per 3gal of water in my dwc buckets. 3g mgso4 and 4g cano3.
This brings my .2EC tap to 1.5EC
Still havent found a good ratio for veg. Currently feeding 1.3EC on 16 inch tall plants and still running into yellow tips. This,time they are twisting though.
Should I back,off,nutes?
Feeding 9g mix per 3gal of water in my dwc buckets. 3g mgso4 and 4g cano3.
This brings my .2EC tap to 1.5EC
SuperWeed
Member
The current analysis doesn't show any silica. And I think I say the THFarmer post you were referencing, and in the very next post, dizzle follows up and confirms that jacks doesn't have Si.
A weight of 5:5:1 of jacks:calcinit
Looks like at 5:5:1, you don't throw off the KCaMg ratios toooo much. At least with recirculating topfeed (no coco) it hasn't been a problem yet. At ~1.2-1.4EC this ends up being roughly 1ml/gallon of potassium silicate at 1.5#/gal (mixed slightly stronger than protekt).
No email after two days, I called in. I left a vmail. I will let you know what she says.
clown baby
Active member
Not saying for certain that the yellowings related to your feed schedule, but:
You're feeding 9g jacks, 3g mag sulfate, and 5g calcium nitrate???
Jacks already has a shitload of magnesium, like 6%. You might be getting a calcium deficiency with that ratio.
At a 3:2 ratio of jacks to calcinit by weight, you get a a 4:2:1 K:Ca:Mg ratio. (well, K2O:Ca:Mg)
But if I got your feed correct above (9g jacks, 3g mag sulfate, 5g calcinit), you're feeding a 2.8:1.1:1 ratio. That's about 1:1 Ca to Mg, while most lines are between a 2:1 to 4:1 Ca:Mg ratio.
google calcium deficiencies and see if that looks familiar. My OG crosses have problems even at a 2:1 Ca:Mg ratio. Had to bump it to 4:1 and they look better.
SuperWeed
Member
From the lovely Krystal Snyder at J.R. Peters:
"There is no Silica in Jack’s, at this time there is no soluble silica that can be added to the bag of fertilizer. But I attached the label for you. That should have the % and PPMs of each element"
5-12-26 Hydroponic
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS F1313
Total nitrogen (N) …………………………………………..…….. 5%
5.00% nitrate nitrogen
Available phosphate (P2O5) ……………………………………... 12%
Soluble potash (K2O) ……………………………………....…….. 26%
Magnesium (Mg), .......……………………………..………..…….. 6.3200%
6.3200% water soluble magnesium (Mg)
Sulfur (S) …………………………………………………………… 8.21%
8.21% combined sulfur (S)
Boron (B) ………….……………………………………………....… 0.0500%
Copper (Cu) ……………………….……………………………...… 0.0150%
0.0150% chelated copper (Cu)
Iron (Fe) ………………………………………………...…..…....…. 0.3000%
0.3000% chelated iron (Fe)
Manganese (Mn) ……………………………….…………..….….... 0.0500%
0.0500% chelated manganese (Mn)
Molybdenum (Mo) …………………..……………..………..…..….. 0.0100%
Zinc (Zn) ………………………………………..………….………... 0.0150%
0.0150% chelated zinc (Zn)
Derived from: monopotassium phosphate, potassium nitrate, magnesium
sulfate, boric acid, iron DTPA, iron EDDHA, iron EDTA manganese EDTA,
zinc EDTA, copper EDTA, ammonium molybdate
Potential Basicity: 211 lbs. Calcium carbonate equivalent per ton.
Information regarding the contents and levels of metals in this product is
available on the internet at: http://www.aapfco.org/metals.html
WARNING: This product contains Molybdenum (Mo) and may be
harmful to ruminant animals foraging on grass where applications
have been made.
Follow these steps to obtain a precipitate free solution
1. Dissolve 130 ounces of 5-12-26 Hydroponic in 1000 gallons of final feed solution. You will obtain the
following elemental PPM concentrations:
Element N P K Mg SO4 Fe Mn Zn Cu B Mo
PPM 50 52 215 63 246 3 .50 .15 .15 .50 .10
2. Dissolve any additional Epsom Salts desired into the above 1000 gallon solution before proceeding. For
most crops 50 PPM Magnesium is an adequate level in solution. To increase your Magnesium levels
dissolve 10 ounces of Epsom Salts in 1000 gallons of final feed solution to obtain 7.5 PPM additional
Magnesium.
3. Dissolve 86 ounces of Calcium Nitrate into the above 1000 gallon solution to obtain a total nutrient
concentration of 150 PPM Nitrogen and 116 PPM Calcium.
E.C at 100 ppm N = 2.10 Limit of Solubility= 3 lb/gal.
"There is no Silica in Jack’s, at this time there is no soluble silica that can be added to the bag of fertilizer. But I attached the label for you. That should have the % and PPMs of each element"
5-12-26 Hydroponic
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS F1313
Total nitrogen (N) …………………………………………..…….. 5%
5.00% nitrate nitrogen
Available phosphate (P2O5) ……………………………………... 12%
Soluble potash (K2O) ……………………………………....…….. 26%
Magnesium (Mg), .......……………………………..………..…….. 6.3200%
6.3200% water soluble magnesium (Mg)
Sulfur (S) …………………………………………………………… 8.21%
8.21% combined sulfur (S)
Boron (B) ………….……………………………………………....… 0.0500%
Copper (Cu) ……………………….……………………………...… 0.0150%
0.0150% chelated copper (Cu)
Iron (Fe) ………………………………………………...…..…....…. 0.3000%
0.3000% chelated iron (Fe)
Manganese (Mn) ……………………………….…………..….….... 0.0500%
0.0500% chelated manganese (Mn)
Molybdenum (Mo) …………………..……………..………..…..….. 0.0100%
Zinc (Zn) ………………………………………..………….………... 0.0150%
0.0150% chelated zinc (Zn)
Derived from: monopotassium phosphate, potassium nitrate, magnesium
sulfate, boric acid, iron DTPA, iron EDDHA, iron EDTA manganese EDTA,
zinc EDTA, copper EDTA, ammonium molybdate
Potential Basicity: 211 lbs. Calcium carbonate equivalent per ton.
Information regarding the contents and levels of metals in this product is
available on the internet at: http://www.aapfco.org/metals.html
WARNING: This product contains Molybdenum (Mo) and may be
harmful to ruminant animals foraging on grass where applications
have been made.
Follow these steps to obtain a precipitate free solution
1. Dissolve 130 ounces of 5-12-26 Hydroponic in 1000 gallons of final feed solution. You will obtain the
following elemental PPM concentrations:
Element N P K Mg SO4 Fe Mn Zn Cu B Mo
PPM 50 52 215 63 246 3 .50 .15 .15 .50 .10
2. Dissolve any additional Epsom Salts desired into the above 1000 gallon solution before proceeding. For
most crops 50 PPM Magnesium is an adequate level in solution. To increase your Magnesium levels
dissolve 10 ounces of Epsom Salts in 1000 gallons of final feed solution to obtain 7.5 PPM additional
Magnesium.
3. Dissolve 86 ounces of Calcium Nitrate into the above 1000 gallon solution to obtain a total nutrient
concentration of 150 PPM Nitrogen and 116 PPM Calcium.
E.C at 100 ppm N = 2.10 Limit of Solubility= 3 lb/gal.
SuperWeed
Member
I thanked her and asked her opinion about what product would work best, based on Dr Bruce Bugbee's recommendation of 0.3 mM Si for recirculating hydroponic systems.
I just want to say thank you again for pointing this out to me ClownBaby and Avenger. I remember reading the post showing Silicate and I never looked back to see DizzleKush step up and correct the info. It's why it's so hard to trust info out there. It is easy to miss a post, misread a chart, etc. Always do your own homework.
Luckily, I have never needed Si. Maybe coco has some already, idk. However, I want the best formula for success and am ready to learn from you guys.
Thank you!
I just want to say thank you again for pointing this out to me ClownBaby and Avenger. I remember reading the post showing Silicate and I never looked back to see DizzleKush step up and correct the info. It's why it's so hard to trust info out there. It is easy to miss a post, misread a chart, etc. Always do your own homework.
Luckily, I have never needed Si. Maybe coco has some already, idk. However, I want the best formula for success and am ready to learn from you guys.
Thank you!
agent dank
Member
Possibly...i have what looks like Ca on the bottom fan leaves (orange dots) thats moving,up. I heard,Ca is usually,on the top leaves.
Attachments
agent dank
Member
Bottom fan leaves look,more like Mg than Ca.
But I do get the tip curl, distorted new leaves and dark green blotches.
Like it seems like the,leaf tissue around the margins are getting dark green,almost,blue.
Was wondering,if,my,P was too low.
Waxy, the 1:.67 ratio will not work for weight,....it is a ratio of nutrient solution (ppm , EC,...or what not)
Delta9nxs states on page 1 of this thread.......hi, mixing equal weight is wrong. their instructions show several ways to mix it.
they recommend equal volume.
however, as snook mentioned, the best way to mix is by ec or ppm.
you also won't need any magnesium sulfate, the base formula has over 6% magnesium.
i'm going to assume that you don't have a meter and that's why you are talking about mixing by weight.
if you take a 1/4 teaspoon plus a 1/8 teaspoon of each, 3/8 teaspoon total of each, you will get approx 750 ppm or ec 1.5. this is per gallon.
if you do have a meter, you don't need to measure water volume.
600 ppm is 360 ppm jacks and 240 ppm calcinit 240/360=.67
750 ppm is 450 ppm jacks and 300 ppm calcinit 300/450=.67
900 ppm is 540 ppm jacks and 360 ppm calcinit 540/360=.67
i cannot imagine a situation where you will need a solution stronger than this.
i have grown a 22.5 oz plant in a 3.5 gal container of coco with 600 ppm for life with no displays or problems, no additives or boosters or even ph adjusters.
if you mix it properly you won't have any ph issues.
the ratio is 1/.67 jacks/calcinit
---------------------------------------------------------end quote------------------------------------
My tap water will not allow me to make the standard stock solutions, 140ppm mostly calcium, the jacks percipitates a dark ring on side of cotainer at the water line. So I make a weaker one part stock.
Into 6 gallons of water I add 145 grams of Jacks to acheive approx. 2900 ppm. Thats my tap of 140 plus 2760 of jacks.
Then 121grams of CalNit to achieve 1850 CalNit, approx. 4750ppm total.
This ballanced stock gets added to approximately 40 gallons to achieve approx 900 ppm total. OR ....You can add the stock to any given volume of water to reach your desired ppm/EC while knowing you have the desirdd ratio of 1:67.
Right or wrong, my plants are digging it.
Delta9nxs states on page 1 of this thread.......hi, mixing equal weight is wrong. their instructions show several ways to mix it.
they recommend equal volume.
however, as snook mentioned, the best way to mix is by ec or ppm.
you also won't need any magnesium sulfate, the base formula has over 6% magnesium.
i'm going to assume that you don't have a meter and that's why you are talking about mixing by weight.
if you take a 1/4 teaspoon plus a 1/8 teaspoon of each, 3/8 teaspoon total of each, you will get approx 750 ppm or ec 1.5. this is per gallon.
if you do have a meter, you don't need to measure water volume.
600 ppm is 360 ppm jacks and 240 ppm calcinit 240/360=.67
750 ppm is 450 ppm jacks and 300 ppm calcinit 300/450=.67
900 ppm is 540 ppm jacks and 360 ppm calcinit 540/360=.67
i cannot imagine a situation where you will need a solution stronger than this.
i have grown a 22.5 oz plant in a 3.5 gal container of coco with 600 ppm for life with no displays or problems, no additives or boosters or even ph adjusters.
if you mix it properly you won't have any ph issues.
the ratio is 1/.67 jacks/calcinit
---------------------------------------------------------end quote------------------------------------
My tap water will not allow me to make the standard stock solutions, 140ppm mostly calcium, the jacks percipitates a dark ring on side of cotainer at the water line. So I make a weaker one part stock.
Into 6 gallons of water I add 145 grams of Jacks to acheive approx. 2900 ppm. Thats my tap of 140 plus 2760 of jacks.
Then 121grams of CalNit to achieve 1850 CalNit, approx. 4750ppm total.
This ballanced stock gets added to approximately 40 gallons to achieve approx 900 ppm total. OR ....You can add the stock to any given volume of water to reach your desired ppm/EC while knowing you have the desirdd ratio of 1:67.
Right or wrong, my plants are digging it.
And as long as Im making long winded posts on things im only a student of....
Use your meter because the above values are approximate.
The Jacks gets a real stable number for me after about 4 hours, make sure things are mixed when you measure.
The Calnit visually disolves quicker and the ppms may look high but will drop over the course of a few hours /overnight as the solution stands. Miix well before measuring.
Mix well before measuring or before using.
The one part seems to have decent shelf life. The leftovers get watered down to suit vegging plants.
Use your meter because the above values are approximate.
The Jacks gets a real stable number for me after about 4 hours, make sure things are mixed when you measure.
The Calnit visually disolves quicker and the ppms may look high but will drop over the course of a few hours /overnight as the solution stands. Miix well before measuring.
Mix well before measuring or before using.
The one part seems to have decent shelf life. The leftovers get watered down to suit vegging plants.
