3 gallon or 5 gallon ?

[Dreamscape]

Hola amigos

I was wondering if my friends here at IC could point me in the right direction ...

I've been spending loads upon loads of planning for the first set up (like you have done i'm sure) and i've come to a strange point.

I plan on planting around 60 seeds - out of which i'm hoping for 30 fems , although if it goes over 28 , i'll still keep it at 28. They would be under 4 - 600w superhortilux HPS bulbs hooked up to lumatek digi ballasts. I've got about 9x9x8 to work with (leaving 1 ft. to walk around)...

So i'm thinking , at most 7 plants under each 600w. But all 6 strains would have vegg'd for 2 months - so i'm thinking I may need 5 gallon pots , although obviously i'd prefer 3 gallon pots for fitting in more plants into one space and getting more light which may be the best way to go anyways for gpw ...

Considering the 2 mo. veg time and the space I have , would it be likely that they'd end up root bound in 3 gallon pots or should I move to 5 gallons pots straight from the 1 gallons ??

any other random advice pertaining to this situation is , AS ALWAYS, greatly appreciated friends.
Thanks
~ Dream

PS. I'm going to use Bags as opposed to pots so disregard all the "pot" talk above , no pun intended

 

[Guest]

veg 1 month 3 gallon...veg 2 month use a 5 gallon..trust your instincts.

 

[Dreamscape]

veg 1 month 3 gallon...veg 2 month use a 5 gallon..trust your instincts.

Ruby - Hi , thanks for dropping in and offering up some info ... The thing is since I have little to no experience my instincts will probably be overpowered by my highly analytical mind , although I do try to shut it off most times - when I remember of course

What would be a good "sign" that would say "i want more room to grow, put me in a 5 gallon ..."

plus it would be 2 months from seed so i'm guessing they wouldn't grow quite as big ... ?

 

[Guest]

You room is the same size as mine and you are fixin to do what I do,it took me years to get here so listen lol!Unless you are truly growing trees (6ft or larger)5 gal. is overkill.I've used them(NSI classic 2000) nursery size 5 gal.What more important than using large containers is utilizing the available media wisely,this means work.You must start in 4 inch nusery containers,1 gal is too large for what you're doing.If you start in 1 gal,the roots are going to grow along the sides and out the drainholes normally,leaving a "big empty" in the middle of the container,a poor utilization of avalable media.So start in 4 inch containers and let the rootball fill the container before transplanting up a size.My plants are around 10-12 inches before I transplant to 2 gal(NSI classic 600) containers.Always water until 100% saturation and dont water again until the roots utilize the soil.You'll noptice you are watering every 4 th day or so,then every third.When you get to where you must water every other day because the plant demands it,you know its time to transplant up.OK so now you are vegging in 2 gallon and watering every 4th day again.The plant grows and before you know it,its around 30 inches and you find yourself having to water every other day again,it's time to transplant up to 3 gal(NSI classic 1200)I veg in these containers another 4 or 5 days,pull cuts,and go 12/12.I've flowerd out many healthy 4 ft plants,true quarter pounders with trichs,in the NSI calssic 1200 3 gal pots.I've used the 5 gal on 4 ft plants and found them to be overkill.However,if you dont go through the transplanting process you had better use 5 gallon or larger for large flowering plants.Hope this helped you out.

 

[Guest]

Bigger rootmass= bigger bud potential..I try to concentrate on fewer bigger plants, then to cram a bunch together in smaller pots. especially if you are gonna veg for 2 months- usually when I do that they end up trees. So make sure to give their legs(roots) a lil room to strecth out. Its worth it.

 

[Guest]

Bigger rootmass does equal larger plants/bigger buds,but more important than container size is utilization of available media.You can plant a seed directly into a 5 gal container and get half the yield as if you planted in 4 inch.let rootball fill conatiner then transplant to 2 gal,let rootball fill container then transplant to 3 gal for a few more days of veg then flower.Your yield in the 3 gallon pot will blow away the yield in the 5 gallon pot,trust me on this.

 

[Dreamscape]

Both points make sense ... I'm assuming with the more frequent transplanting , starting in a 4 inch and moving up , that you're somehow forcing more roots out of the plant ?? For conversations sake whats the logic behind this because i'm thinking the more room you have for the roots to explore the more they would fill in , not the smaller the area before transplant the more roots you'd get ...

 

[Guest]

You are maximizing root mass by starting small and transplanting up in size as rootmass/plant size increases,more importantly you are utilizing all available media which results in healthier,larger root mass.When growing outside in a field somewhere media utilization isnt an issue,with indoor container growing its the main issue IMO.If you give the roots too much "room to explore" in a finite container,you may utilize 50% of the soil depending on actual container size,and the rootmass will correspond to rooted media not container size,its not only wasteful its shortchanging the plant.When you start in a 4 inch pot,let that rootball fill that container,you'ved utilized all available media.Then when you transplant to 1-2 gal containers the roots will grow out from the rootball already near the center of the container thus filling the entire container.Had you planted directly into the 1-2 gal container,the roots would have grown mainly along the sides of the container leaving a mass of unused media in the center.Thats not the way to grow rootmass in a confined area.Utilization off all available media in a confined space will result in more rootmass,logically it has to,practically it does.

 

[Dreamscape]

beautiful ... many thanks for the clarification ...

 

[Dan42nepa]

I started a seedling out in a 1qt pot once instead of my usual 4 inch pots. At first it grew like crazy but was very wide and squat. What I realized is the roots will grow to fill whatever pot you use. So the one i started in the 1 qt ended up having less growth then the ones started in a smaller progressioin of pots.. At the time of transplant for the 4 inch to the 1 qt, the plants were much taller then the one which was already rootbout in the 1 qt.

 

[Dreamscape]

thanks for the insight ... and when you said "much taller than the one which was already rootbound in the 1qt." ... i'm guessing it was all around bushier and more massive in all directions other than just a stretchy height type of thing ?

@SmilinBob - Instead of the 4x4x4 inch pots, could I start the seeds in 16 or 32oz beer cups , then go to a 1gallon bag and then to a 3 gallon bag ??

 

[Dreamscape]

EDIT : above ^^^

 

[Guest]

Try starting one in a 4 inch and 1 in a 3 gallon and grow until harvest,the reason becomes crystal clear through the results thats what I did.You think I'm gonna do all that frickin work because of what some possible schoolgirl that never grew a plant in a her 12 year old life says on the internet lol?Seriously,avoid the experimentation if you want,its been done to death

 

[T-type]

I have used grow bags before and I don't know how easy it would be to transplant a 2 gallon into a 3... seems like a ton of work.

 

[Dreamscape]

no no ... I wasn't saying that at all ... I believe in what you're saying man , totally. I just figured it would be cheaper for me to go buy beer cups , which I think are similar in size to those 4inch pots but dont cost .75cents a piece. Also I want to use grow bags since you dont have to sterilze them and also since they're cheaper as well ...

So what I was saying was could I start in a beer cup , let that fully maximize, then move to a 1 gallon bag, let that fully maximize and then move that to a 3 gallon bag.

 

[Guest]

Yup.And I transplant from two gallon(NSI classic 600) to 3 gal(NSI classic 1200)most every grow,its an increase of about 25%,plenty to veg another 5 day or so and flower the biggest of indoor plants,if you started in a 4 inch or beercup before transplanting to 2 gal.(NSI classic 600 2 gal nursery container is actually 1.6 gal,the classic 1200 3 gal holds a true 3 gal. of soil.

 

[T-type]

Smilin bob - You transplant from container to container right?

He wants to transplant from bag to bag, which I am sure isn't going to be easy in the least bit...

 

[DickAnubis]

Morning Dream. I've used 1 pint water bottles with the tops cut off and htey work great as a starter pot. They are flexible and make transplanting a sinch. But of course you don't want to compromise from the start just to save s few coppers.
Also, unless you're really thin or limber a one foot path around your farm is a mite small. I'm a big Saskwatsch so I know at some point I would go tumbling into the green. Especially if I've been enjoying the green. Just a thought.
Good luck with your grow.

 

[Guest]

I've never used growbags but the same principal should apply,let the rootball fill the two gallon growbagremove rootball from enclosure and transplant to 3 or 4 gallon growbag.If transplanted at the right time about 75% dry the rootball and medium would remain intact,I think..Knowing the saturated and dry weights of the various bags used would be real helpful

 

[Grownz]

Hello all, i didn't wanna start a new thread when this one seems on the same topic.
I have used the potting up method before i went hydro and found it to be benifical. I started in small grow bags similar to 4 inch pots. When this was rootbound i went to 1gallon and when this was rootbound they went into 3gallon for a few more days veg to take cuttings/trim etc then into flowering.
Smilin bob- You transplant from a 4 inch pot to a 2 gallon,then to 3gallon? I never thought of that. Maybe my 1 gallon to 3 gallon transplant is too much more soil mass than is needed for flowering??
I tried explaining this potting up method to my friend but as he is a SOG grower he didn't have the time for potting up and the veg time. I had the idea for him to maybe veg for a week max in the 4 inch pots (Maybe smaller) then upto a 1-2 gallon for flowering. Instead he put rooted clones straight into 3 gallon bags.
What would be the draw back of putting a rooted clone straight into a 3 gallon grow bags and pretty much going straight to 12/12?

Thanks.