1st Grow - Kovenant's story

[kovenant]

hello all. i've read quite a few great threads on here to help me prep my grow room and decide on a system that works for me. i'm using a bedroom & closet in a partitioned setup allowing me a continual harvest.

the room is 12x10' and i have a 10x8' area set up for flowering with two 600W HPS air-cooled lamps vented into the ceiling. i left the two windows open and tarped the windows up to a constructed air-tight system that houses doubled-up airconditioning filters along with a thin patterned tapestry against the window & screen so as to lot look too conspicuous, with a triple layer of black netting over the filters on the inside - which make it pitch black with the lights off. (btw, i had circuit issues so my electrician buddy ran a dedicated circuit off my panel to the room for the lights. the rest of the equipment uses next to nothing, and functions off the rooms existing outlets.)

im on a 'limited' budget but dont mind spending extra where i think it will make
the most difference. the reason i left the windows open with this venting solution is because of the free O2 and CO2 outside - the temperature is pretty steady in the high 60s to mid 70s... 80s in the mid-summer (so cal beach city.)

the room (tarped walls), lights, venting, and windows are all finished. my clones are rooted and ready to transplant, but it will be about 5 days before my hydro setup arrives (i tried to do as much research on the system i felt was right for me - and finally decided today.) my plan was to grow the legal limit under my circumstances, which is 18 plants... however, after researching and reading several really good threads on the ways i contemplated growing, i began to feel that 18 plants may be too large for my flowering room (light wise i am fine... 9 plants per light) but may not have room to move about, inspect plants, etc, so i have considered dropping to maybe 12 or 15. either way, i purchased the 18 cell Living System for a DWC setup. and figured i can see how i feel as i go along... maybe start with 18 (since i might as well try to maximize the plants im legal to grow, and have the equipment for) and can always drop the count down later - or next grow.

the other 2x10' of the bedroom is a 'hallway' from the door to the closet, so that i can easily interact with the closet where my mother(s), clones, and veg stations are being set up (i am planning on veg'ing in the flower room for the first go around.) the closet is a 2x5' area. the current design i am going to try an implement over the next few weeks is keeping my mother(s) to the left side, in a 1x2' area that buts up to a coffee table size stand that occupies the other 2x5' portion of the closet. the veg station is setup on top of this table/stand under one 400W MH veg bulb, and beneath the table will be two or four 4' floro 40W bulbs over domes for my cloning. not sure if i will air-cool the 400W in the closet, i will try without and see how it affects the environment.

i want to use this grow story thread as both a journal of my experience as well as a medium to gain further knowledge from experienced and other beginning growers. i also plan on Low Stress Training my girls as they veg, using a spiral training method around the
top of the buckets to maximize yield.

there are a few preliminary questions i want to ask, while im thinking about it.

1) how does this setup sound?

2) is it possible to use a reptile-style 'moon' light in the flowering room, in case access is required - or is it absolutely never recommended to disturb plants during sleep periods (even without 'light' disturbance)??

3) i am wondering if 12-18 plants in a 'free air' environment require additional CO2 feeding, and what the various opinions are. i realize that it can be done without, and will benefit if i add CO2 - but under a great temp, DWC, LST, good nute regiment i think i will be okay. feedback please.

thnx a ton, i look forward to sharing my adventure with you! now for the pictures...



the entrance to what will be my mother/clone/veg room. currently just two grow domes (18 trainwreck ladies, 1 romulan) under an 8' 40W floro with two bulbs.



the 8' floro will be removed and a 2 1/2' frame will be built 4' (3/4 the length of the closet) to house the vegging plants. two 4' floros will be mounted under that frame for the clone domes below it. and 1 or 2 moms can fit on the right side & still catch good light from the 400W MH that will be in the room. i may make the MH able to swing from left to right - so it can be above the moms the majority of the time, and then swing to the right to veg for a couple weeks when ready.



entrance to my flowering room. 10x8' area. will get a tarp-zipper and modify the 'door' but until then just pulls from the wall near door. the tarp divider here will prevent light from hitting my sleeping flowering plants when i must access my mom/clones/veg area.



was going to use this 20 gal sink as a res, and hand feed... decided to do the DWC buckets, so may remove it if i dont need it (or if i need the room to move around)



another shot of my flowering room. buckets will be returned to store. cabinet holds my nutes and equipment. one rotating, standing fan in corner.



downward angle to show off the grow space. not as large as i originally intended and 18 plants may outgrow this area and make it extremely difficult to maneuver in mid- and late-flower.



the 2nd half of my clones (1 1/2 weeks old) are looking good and will be primed to transplant in 3-5 days when the watering system arrives. see the sole romulan peeking from the left under the taller trainwrecks.

 

[karl420]

this room kickass! i suggest you to never disturb plants when they are sleeping. do you have an intake? you should make one and hook up the hoods on it with a Y with 2 timed automatic draft-stopper and add a A/C + CO2 burner soo you wont exaust the CO2 all the time. my 2cent

~staysafe
-karl

 

[kovenant]

thanks for the intel karl! feels good to hear the setup is appreciated. i've definately put some time and money into it.

i would only disturb them as last resort (if there was water or plugged valve problem, etc) and thought if i at least had some type of light that would not affect them - i could leave it on (like a red or black 'night' lamp for reptiles or photo developing rooms.) anyone know if they work during 'night' time for plants?

also, i do not have an intake fan - only an exhaust which pulls air through both lamps. the first lamp is open on one end so that the exhaust fan also pulls room air through - forcing outside air in through the open windows.

i will get anything else that i find is 'required' but other than that i have tapped my expense and cannot add AC, CO2, or much more - at least until my first harvest. again, if i obviously have a heat problem and venting fresh air isnt enough - then i will have to find a small AC. i really just dont have the finance for it (or i'd really have this place decked out!! )


---edit---

i have to work out something for my mother/clone/veg space. i had something planned out that does seem like it will work with the DWC bucket system i have opted to use. i was planning on putting my ladies to veg in small (3 or 4") square pots and using a 4'x3' tray to drain feed them in. however, since i will be going to the buckets in flower - it would seem that i need a smaller scale system that works the same way, so that they will be easily transfered/transplanted to the flower room. any ideas on how (for as cheap as possible) i can do this? i dont have the space (nor do i hope to spend another $500) to duplicate the DWC bucket system in the flower room - although that would be awesome... then just pull the lid w/ plant out of the veg and set on the flower. needs to accomidate the smaller veg room though. please forward me any ideas. much thanks!

 

[mrgrowmez]

damn that is a nice room kovenant!!!!!

 

[Dwight Schroot]

Great room... so much space compared to my PC case.

As for the light... plants do not respond to green light. Chlorophyll is green because it absorbs red and blue spectrum and reflects the rest to keep its light/heat intake down to only what is necessary. If you kept a dim green light to do some midnight chores you should be fine.

As for A/C its not necessary unless you have issues but lowering temperatures to even in the 50s during late flowering (people are going to say I'm crazy for that but the temperature resistance is strain dependent) will create more THC as that is the plants natural defense.

And about the mothers, I would recommend a drip irrigation system or an ebb & flow system. The only parts required are a single tub for the plants, rockwool obviously, tubes, a small water pump and reservoir. That way you can keep their nute intake down so they stay small and its easy to set up.

Sorry if that's long winded, I got all excited at the size of your space. Hope it helped, best of luck, I'll be keeping an eye on this one.

 

[kovenant]

thank you growmez and dwight! i've put a substantial amount of time and money into it, so im very excited to see it at least looks good!! lol... hopefully its as functional as i hope it to be when all is said and done.

i have most of the supplies for my recirculating DWC bucket system. i decided to definately go with blazeoneup's DWC system. great tutorial. fantastic setup. in fact, today my water chiller arrives along with my CO2 regulator and a humidifier. for the DWC system I am waiting on some 3/4" ID tubing, and a 100 gal resevoir (didnt want to take the 'used' one from the local shop)... but i have most of the parts and will be assembling it over the next few days.

i began to LST half of my ladies yesterday evening. i may do the rest tonight, i was going to keep a normal - controlled - group and the other have use training... so i could compare the difference in the end. remember, this is my first grow so while i am all about maximizing my yield, i am also wanting to experiment with a few things. even 6 hrs after performing the LST i noticed the plants thriving and reaching back up for light... so it made me want to do the whole batch! the only one i wont train is my roomies Romulan... its an indica and will probably still be shorter in flower than my trained TrainWrecks. i snapped one of the 'runt' ladies during the LST so im down to 17 TW + 1 Romi

i will not be flowering the romi and 1 tw to keep as mothers (i will not be LST the TW mom-to-be either.) i also took 9 cuttings off an outdoor Hog mother and have them in a grow dome (about 3-4 days now... sorry, im at work and cant look at my journal!) the days keep flying by. today is already day 12 of veg and i was only 'planning' on vegging these TW for 2 weeks. i may let them go 3 though and take my time at setting up the bucket system without stressing as much (there's been alot of stressing over getting the room ready with everything i need... so im trying to just pace myself and keep the 'fun' aspect my primary goal.)

im currently vegging in the flower room under my 600W with a conversion veg bulb, in a recirculating ebb & flow setup that fits into its space in the veg room. the mother/clone/veg room is pretty much completed except for venting (have the supplies for this already) and trying to figuring out exactly how to grow my mothers. i will upload new pics of the veg room soon and ask for opinions about how to grow my moms in their corner...

as i said most the parts i have and will begin putting it together over the next few days (pics may come of the work in progress, or i may just post them at the end.)

my 14 year old daughter comes to stay with us next week and while we are legal caregivers and i want my daughter to know that marijuana is not the devil... she is 14 and i want to 'protect' her from knowing too much until she's older. so i hope to have the room finished so that my forrays to the room will be limited to 'minutes' of care instead of 'hours' of building.

i did manage to squeeze off a few cellphone pics of my ladies yesterday... here they are:


my ebb & flow setup for vegitative state



two TWs at the beginning of LST (this morning i put another paperclip further up the stem to continue the spiral training)



btw... i was watering about every other day. then i read some different opinions - some stating to water as often as possible to supply the nutes should the plants want them... (so i set a timer and had 5 mins of flood every 2 hours, for a full 24 hour period.) i noticed some nute burn on 2 plants and then heard contrary advice from a local grower, so i switched back to my previous watering schedule of every other day - or 'as needed'.

 

[MID TOWN]

Yea rockwool retains water VERY well. only water as needed.

Your gonna want to move those lights up along 1 wall and box them in. as you have it right now you'v got like 12 watts per square foot and you want it arround 50 watts per square foot which would be an area about 4'x6'. do no more than 12 buckets and if it were me I'd go with only 6. sorry to discourage your idea of doin a whole room with that many watts but it's just not possible.

There's no need for an intake fan, just an intake hole. the extraction fan will passively suck fresh air into the room through it. make sure to have your intake on the opposite side of the room as the extraction so that you get good cross ventilation.
if your running CO2 then your gonna want to run your air cooled light on their own circuit and seal the room. also make sure you have a co2 monitor/controller or you just don't get the advantages of the co2 and you might as well not use it.

Blazoneup's system is great, you'll be pleased with the results. here's 15 buckets in a 5x9 area and I wouldn't want them ANY closer.

hope this helps

 

[NOFpuXnk]

FIRST GROW!!!??
SHIT DOOD!
YOU AIN EVEN FUCKIN AROUND!

 

[Dwight Schroot]

Ha he most certainly isn't fuckin around. At least he did his homework, this should be a great grow. I'm anxious Kovenant, can't go two days without a post!

 

[kovenant]

sorry guys. alot has been going on. had to push picking up my daughter until tomorrow so i can get the rest of the room done through tonight. i WILL be posting new pics soon - as i know how eager i am to see them on the threads ive read too!

left town for 2 days... i had taken the timer off the water - so no water while i was gone. came back and rockwool cubes were so dry they felt weightless (even with the plants in them)... but the ladies looked great. just shows me how much they really CAN take care of themselves too - as long as they arent neglected (of course, i know once they go into the buckets that i need to stay alert and make sure everything is running properly.)

this time i watered 1x for 2.5 mins (i let the water/nute solution rise half way up the rockwool so it would not be totally saturated. thinking i may have to water again tonight since it hopefully didnt sponge up as much as before (though it probably did... since it does pretty much act like a sponge.) just me testing how the setup is working under my conditions.

Mid Town --> good looking out my man... some of these are things i know, and some i know and dont think i can change atm, and some i didnt know! some i also plan to change with my next grow as money allows. thanks for the pic too - i love seeing something so similar to mine from someone else's efforts.

im going to see what i can do as far as moving the lights now... i drew up a map of my room incase it helps to describe exactly how it lays out - and some of the reasons i made the choices i did (not that they are right or wrong, but my thinking behind them.)




ive been under the impression that 600W lamps through down a 5x5' footprint with another foot around that as secondary. ive also heard 4x4' and 6x6'... so i went with 5x5' on my planning. you can see the yellow/orange areas i laid down as my footprints. it leaves me with 3" off the wall with the tarp-zipper entrance. on the north wall with the larger window, it leaves 8" the footprint is off the wall (so the 8" falls into the extra foot of secondary light - if im understanding it correctly.) on the south wall i am 11" off the wall from the primary footprint - still an inch less than secondary. i kept the actual 'grow' space pushed more toward the south-east portion of the room to keep it away from the windows, and thought the tarp wall would be cooler (and whiter - to aid in reflecting - than the walls, which are an off-white.)

i am thinking of running some more duct from the veg room to the flower room - hooking directly into the (currently) open end of the flower room lamps (north end) so that air is being pulled from the veg room - through the flower room - and into the attic where it currently vents (the blue circle in flower room is the ceiling vent.) the two blue circles in the wall near the door are vents that would allow 'outside' air to flow from the flower room windows - through the vents and into the veg room - then into the ducting and as above, vented directly into the attic through the flower room.

(hope that makes sense!)

in affect... outside air enters the room through the windows. the only place it can vent is back out one of the windows or into the veg room. from the veg room it gets sucked into the 400W lamp - through vents back through the 600W lamps in the flower room - and directly out to the attic. the concept sounds great to me. but any opinions and advice would be greatly received.

i do not have an intact fan, as i felt there was no need as well. i do have intake - i have 2 open windows - one is 1'7" wide and the other is 2' wide with 6" of it on the veg side of the tarp-wall that divides rooms. each window is the same height - about 2'. the smaller window is able to be open/closed but it has been left open since project started (i did this incase frost or out-of-the-ordinary cold weather were to hit.)

i *could* close the small window perminantly (probably really dont need both) and cover that window with white tarp... move the lamps toward the WEST wall. that would help my entrance be easier to get in, later into flower and kind of "box" them in like you mentioned. but then the west side would be very far from them and they would get no reflective light on that side.

i was thinking of leaving more "as is" this grow and maybe add lamps next round to flower next grow or two. i believe you are probably correct in that i should go no more than 12 buckets. it just sadens me cause i was hoping for 18!! lol. because i have put alot of time and money and research into this project i wanted to reap the most benefit (while remaining legal)... but i know that in reality, as my setup stands, that 12 plants will probably be healthier and get better light than throwing 18 in... the yield will probably be the same, but with less adult plants to take care of. i can still veg 18 plants and keep my best 12 for flower.

i will be running CO2. I have my regulator and AC/RH/CO2 controller (with photo censor) already and will be picking up CO2 tank today. the controller will shut the CO2 down when lights are off, and when vent fan is on. (maybe another reason to close the smaller window anyway - so that normal draft doesnt suck the CO2 out... with one window would be alot less.)

NOFpuXnk & Dwight --> thanks! im glad to have people interested in my progress and ready to give advice and watch these lovely ladies grow with me. i will do my best to report as often as possible

well. i took some pictures earlier as i was getting all the exact measurements for the room map i made. hopefully this will keep you until i can get this room completed and take some better ones of MY progress instead of just the ladies

its Day 15 of veg. here are 2 ladies continuing growth about 3-4 days after LST began...







Rommy Day 15 of veg



Hog Mommy (my only outdoor grow - will probably flower her outdoor at the end of this season.)



Hog clones




thanks for visiting and please continue to contribute to my project... it means alot! time to toke it up and try to get some work done!

 

[MID TOWN]

A 600 watt lamp will cover 4x4 at the most. Any more and your gonna get realy scraggly buds. and if possible I would definately box em in somehow or you DO lose a lot of lumens. I don't even like having my 1 open wall where light COULD be reflected.

"i will be running CO2. I have my regulator and AC/RH/CO2 controller (with photo censor) already and will be picking up CO2 tank today. the controller will shut the CO2 down when lights are off, and when vent fan is on. (maybe another reason to close the smaller window anyway - so that normal draft doesnt suck the CO2 out... with one window would be alot less.)"

your right on the money there. your gonna want to close up the room so that your not loosing co2. make sure you seal up your hoods realy well too. youll be shocked at how fast your co2 runs out if your room isn't sealed properly.

I didn't fully understand your exhause explanation but what I woud do is have a window open in the veg room and then like you said connect your veg light to your flower lights and leave the one end of your veg light open that way you have 1 fan doing everything for you. it will be cooling your lights without sucking any co2 enriched air out of the flower room and drawing needed fresh air into the veg area.

I didn't notice earlier but are you using AC. If you arent then your probably gonna want to add another extraction fan in the room and hook it up to your controler so that whenever the temps get too high it will turn onn and turn your co2 off like you said.

 

[green_grow]

mid town is right .... you are going to have to either get a LOT more light or greatly reduce the size of your room . 50 watts per sq. foot is the goal, more is better . if you choose to reduce the size of your room rather than increase your wattage, you are STILL equipped to grow a LOT of herb, IF all goes well . is this your first grow ?

 

[kovenant]

green_grow --> this is my first grow.

i've looked at the layout of my room...

if i choose to bring down the lights from how they are mounted now - and put them along the north wall (7' 7") then i can tighten them up in a 4x7' area. the south side, however, will be opened up to the remaining room space - meaning the south wall will be 7' 11" away from the lamp footprint. the other 3 walls would be right against it.

i need to know now what to do. cause it needs to be done today.

pulling my lamps down and re-hanging them isnt much of a hassle... the exhaust is on the south side of the room to though (so... back into the attic... cut a new hole in the ceiling... ??) thats a bit more. otherwise, get 15' of duct so i can run it over to the existing hole. /shrug

would look something like this:




notice how the entire south side would be open for almost 8'? would it be better to have the 1 wall absent (or 8' away) and all other 3 walls right at the footprints? (4x7 1/2')

i could run my lamps as shown and re-run the duct work.


also. thoughts on closing the west (smaller) window and only keeping open the larger north windows for outside ventilation? i am thinking now that having 2 windows open is going to vent too much on its own when fan is off - wasting CO2. not much breeze flows through with both open - they have layers of AC filters & black tinting mesh over the open portions...

 

[MID TOWN]

That new layout looks much better. 3 reflective walls is great,if possible though you might want to throw up another tarp wall. depending on what fan you have it's probably enough to cool 1200 watts even with that much ducting but of course it would be more efficient to shorten it up. and I would close that west window.

 

[plumpm0nkey]

hey kovenant, what nutes you use?

 

[kovenant]

last night got everything moved and boxed into the corner. moved my ladies in veg into the actual veg room - now under the 400w MH (before they were in the flower room under the 600W since its a bigger lamp and nothing is in flower yet.)

west window open for the moment because the ducting is not run yet... im on my way out to pick up some duct and a few pieces i need left for the DWC system. going to put work into her all day and hopefully get her done. going to have to wait to get my daughter until next week - after the 4th - which sucks. but im pretty stoked now that the disappointment of tearing things down the way i had it is over and the new setup is nearly back up to where it was before... as far as percent complete.

i am using AN nutes as well as liquid karma, and root excelerator. not the whole line, but a decent amount to start with. in veg im using sensi grow a&b, sensi cal, root excelerator, liquid karma, an enzyme, and vho as a foiler spray (i probably am failing to remember 1 or 2, but that's the just of it.) ill list my flower mix when i go into flower... which at the latest should be next week. hopefully even sooner. i had to do more LST'ing today... the ladies are spiraling nicely around the rockwool. should have alot of bud sites on the head of these ladies once all is said and done.

picking up my CO2 today too... so i can get it started. not sure how much or how to gauge how much im adding... cant afford a monitor - but did get the controller.

ill be taking more pics soon

 

[MID TOWN]

Looks good but be carefull with using too many addatives. An's bassic nutes are supposed to be OK but don't even start trying to use all their other shit. if you havn't already bought your nutes I'd go simple with GH,hygrozime, and mabey a pk booster in flower. also If your talking about house and gardens root excelurator then you might want to use that stuff too but it's not needed.

If you dont have the co2 monitor then the co2's realy not worth using. Just make it a fresh air room if you can't get it now. I've tried it without the monitor and it hurt my yield rather than helped.

 

[plumpm0nkey]

what spiraling goin to do to the grow?

 

[RamCTD1027]

kovenant-

looking good. i will definitely be watching this one.

RamCTD

 

[kovenant]

Mid Town -> hmm... well i got the regulator, i could return it or hold on until next couple harvests to purchase a monitor. i didnt get the CO2 tank today, so not hard to just hold off... id rather not 'hurt' my ladies. you think it would be better to not use CO2 at all rather than barely have the gauge on while lights on, fan off?

i do have the basics to AN nutes with just a couple of the extras. i was in no way buying the whole line... but many locals i talk to have used it there past few grows and have been switching over to it. since i bought them, im definately going to stick with them and see how this first grow goes. if my yield isnt anything special then ill definately re-up with basics nutes. thanks for that advice

plumpm0nkey-> spiraling is one of many techniques used to LST (low stress train) a plant in veg. LST is a method of training your plant to get more yield from the 'head' or main stem(s)... in affect, instead of having 1 kola (or 'main') big bud - you have multiple head or main buds. many people (including myself) opt to go this route rather than 'pinching' the heads which causes alot more stress to the plant, causing it to reduce growth for a week or so, and/or also gives a higher chance for males (for seedlings) and hermies (for clones)... or so that was my understanding from research.

Ram -> thanks mate. pull up a seat! i hope not to disappoint any of you