150w HPS Club and Resource Guide......

[Divine Cosmos]

Trek, can't find molasses? Just buy the darkest sugar you can get; the darker it is, the more nutrients it has to offer. However, as DB pointed out, it's more about feeding the micro-herd carbohydrates. Careful feeding any sugar/molasses during veg as it causes your N levels to drop - in fact, for this very reason, sugar is now becoming more popular as a weed killer!


Stretching can be kept to a minimum by keeping the light as close as possible, using more blue light - especially in the first 2 weeks of flower - and a 20/4 light schedule seems to be the best at slowing stretch in veg. I grew 2 White widows under cfl's and they only doubled in size after the flip, which I put down to keeping the lights 1 inch away at all times.


On a side note, is anyone using a 150w MH at any point in there grow? HPS ballast can run them, so I was wondering if anyone found any benefits in using them over hps say, during veg, or last week of flower?

 

[TraneRek]

Alright, just ordered some FloraMicro.. Seems pretty important

and I suppose I won't worry about the blackstrap then since I'm using chem nutes.

I'm also debating on a lighting issue I'll have when I start to flower.. When I ran the 150 with the 100+ watts of CFL, my temps were upwards of 90F near the light. I wasn't able to check the temps w/ the 150 on it's own, but my question is this: are the supplemental CFL's worth it if it's going to raise my temps to over 90F? If I had to guess, I'd say they're raising temps about 7-8 degrees above ambient.

Thanks again for the input everyone,
-Rek

 

[BorkBorkBork]

For the blackstrap molasses, check with your local health food stores. I found mine at Richards Whole Foods, and they had more than one kind.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Alright, just ordered some FloraMicro.. Seems pretty important

and I suppose I won't worry about the blackstrap then since I'm using chem nutes.

I don't have any proof that chemicals destroy the herd. I have read opinions that suggest chem nutes don't provide the best environment for microbes to thrive. Some folks still use molasses late in flower when plain water is all the plants get. This might be beneficial but I'm no botanist.

I'm also debating on a lighting issue I'll have when I start to flower.. When I ran the 150 with the 100+ watts of CFL, my temps were upwards of 90F near the light. I wasn't able to check the temps w/ the 150 on it's own, but my question is this: are the supplemental CFL's worth it if it's going to raise my temps to over 90F? If I had to guess, I'd say they're raising temps about 7-8 degrees above ambient.

Thanks again for the input everyone,
-Rek

Some strains can handle 90F, others get spongy buds. Your temps probably drop a degree per inch away from the bulb(s). You might find some compromise where CFLs help, better light color at the expense of penetration. Increased circulation, ventilated lights, etc might allow you to use CFLs w/o problems. A dedicated fan on the bulb is invaluable if it is not cooled otherwise.

Stretch is under rated IMO. When plants stretch it means the root ball is growing rapidly. Everybody knows big roots = big buds. I say learn to love the stretch hehe, then learn various ways to deal with it. Those big looping stems might look gnarly but the buds will be big. Some of my best rose blossoms grow on what I call the "steroid" vines.

 

[Jaxom]

Yikes! Everytime I come back "home", I'm totally amazed at how much this "club" has grown.

I've been trying to get my own version of pipedreams grow box up and running for some time now. Life unforitunilly keeps getting in the way. But now I seem to have a bit of time on my hands, and I want to get some of the basics taken care of.

I've actually posted the complete details about what I'm building a few times already over the past year or three. So, I'm not going to bore those that have read them before by doing so yet again. I just need to tweak some details and bring myself into some more current upgrades due to progress while I haven't been growing.

First detail I'm concerned about. Power. My wife and I have an attic suite. In the bedroom portion is our computer/av system (computer with tv card and 32" flat screen connected to sat reciever), a 55gal fish tank, we need to use electric heater during the winter and absolutly require an airconditioner for the summers. There's two 20amp circuts to the room now, should I or do I need to run a thrid? I'm iffy on this, because I did once have a box with a 250w hps, and all of the above as well. And I never popped a fuse, but I'm not sure how close I was... Last thing I want is a fire.

For personal reseason I really want to go with a digital ballast. I use to have a link to a place that sold ones for a 150w hps, I went back to that site just now and I can't seem to find one there anymore. Suggestions?

Oder is a major concern of mine. That first grow box smelled like a full herd of skunks had been ran over by a semi!!! I'm thinkin along the lines of a small Ozone generator that's placed inside the grow box, so that it can deoderize both the growing plants and the ones drying. Is that safe in a room you're sleeping in?

With a renewed concentration to get this box up and running finally, I just purchased some digital meters. Now the ph meter is pretty straight forward, but I'm a little confused with the ppm meter and how to use that. Is there a sticky I can read that will help explain this? (Note:my first box, I just changed the ferts once a week, so I was basically ab libing it for the proper amount of ferts).

Speakin of ferts, I use (and like) GH products. I do realize from experience they don't have everything required. I had to add some MG and ph down to my water, or my plants suffered. Anyways, I don't know what the heck I did with my "recipie" for these was. I had it printed out from the old OG days, but for the life of me I cannot find that paper anywhere!

Then there's a few construction issues I need to sort out as well. The grow/flowering chamber of my box will be 2'w x 2'd x4' tall (give or take an inch or so). I'm debating if I want to make the light adjustable or not. While it is my intentions to go scrog in this box, and I actually want the plants to streach, I don't want loose, lanky buds either! So I'm not sure if I want to lower the lamp down at first and slowly raise it as the tops grow up through the screen.

If I do perminantly mount the lamp near the top. How close is too close? I don't need the wooden box to burst into flame because the lamp is too close. Even if I do fashion a reflector out of some sheet metal. I noticed Pipedream's box, the lamp is only inches below the inside top of the box. I was just wondering how far it was...

And finally cooling... I had planned on using a series of muffin fans. That is until I went back to that site I mentioned once had digital 150w balasts. They carry a 10" 550cfm muffin fan that runs at 120v! 57dbl at 1 yard isn't bad for sound either. My issue is part of my efforst to keep odor under control is I was going to make a frame with some nylon batting and activated charcoal. Air would come in from the bottom of the box, then exit out of the grow/flower chamber through this diy filter then pass over the ozone generator then out the back, perhaps passing through one of those scented furnace filter things.

Is that fan big enough to keep the 150 cool? And still draw sufficent enough air flow through the diy filter then out the back?

And finally, I'm not going to ask what I will be able to harevest out of this, quantity wise. I've been out of the loop for a while admittedly. Last I spoke to anyone here, folks were striving for a 3oz per sq ft mark. Where is everyone else at these days? This is a very subjective question, I do realized it depends on strain, growing expertise, ect. I'm just curious....

Thanks all,

Jaxx

 

[jasonk]

Welcome back Jaxom! By no means am I a guru at this at all, I'll just try and answer to the best of what I've learned.

There's two 20amp circuts to the room now, should I or do I need to run a thrid? I'm iffy on this, because I did once have a box with a 250w hps, and all of the above as well. And I never popped a fuse, but I'm not sure how close I was... Last thing I want is a fire.

I doubt you'll have a problem at all with a 150W light. 150W/120V = only 1.25A on a 20A circuit, plus whatever else you have on it. I'm not sure about electric, but magnetic ballasts without a capacitor can use maybe 2-300% of power during start-up, so 3-4A would be a safe number to use.

Then there's a few construction issues I need to sort out as well. The grow/flowering chamber of my box will be 2'w x 2'd x4' tall (give or take an inch or so). I'm debating if I want to make the light adjustable or not. While it is my intentions to go scrog in this box, and I actually want the plants to streach, I don't want loose, lanky buds either! So I'm not sure if I want to lower the lamp down at first and slowly raise it as the tops grow up through the screen.

Depending on how good your how-to skills are, an adjustable light is usually a waste of time IMO. It's much easier to control the height of each plant individually by putting boxes or something underneath it.

If I do perminantly mount the lamp near the top. How close is too close? I don't need the wooden box to burst into flame because the lamp is too close. Even if I do fashion a reflector out of some sheet metal. I noticed Pipedream's box, the lamp is only inches below the inside top of the box. I was just wondering how far it was...

I've never heard of a box catching on fire, but it never hurts to play safe. And I guess it would depend on your materials. I think at most an inch of airspace is all that is really necessary. But please someone, correct me if I'm wrong. A fan blowing directly on the bulb would help any direct heat build-up.

And finally cooling... I had planned on using a series of muffin fans. That is until I went back to that site I mentioned once had digital 150w balasts. They carry a 10" 550cfm muffin fan that runs at 120v! 57dbl at 1 yard isn't bad for sound either. My issue is part of my efforst to keep odor under control is I was going to make a frame with some nylon batting and activated charcoal. Air would come in from the bottom of the box, then exit out of the grow/flower chamber through this diy filter then pass over the ozone generator then out the back, perhaps passing through one of those scented furnace filter things.

Is that fan big enough to keep the 150 cool? And still draw sufficient enough air flow through the diy filter then out the back?

550 cfm is quite a bit of air movement, plenty for that area. Depending how that style fan works fighting the back-pressure of the carbon filter you should have no problem. Too much ventilation is better then not enough, you can always get a speed control to dial it down and keep it quieter. I've never had to build anything to control odor yet, but I'm not sure an ozone generator and scented furnace filters is necessary. A well built carbon filter should do the trick alone.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

..... They carry a 10" 550cfm muffin fan that runs at 120v! 57dbl at 1 yard isn't bad for sound either.

You only need about 100 to 150 CFMs to pull a decent 150HPS size scrubber. I've got a Hydro farm 95 CFM blower and wouldn't want to go any lower. 550 is overkill IMO. 57db at 1 yard is very loud. My HF blower is 29db at full speed and probably half that on low speed

 

[catman]

Bubble Gum

Still pushing out flowers half way through week 7.

Northern Lights

 

[labtec]

damn catman nice looking girls

 

[SC_KillaKali]

Pics are looking great catman I hope my babies look as good as yours in week 7.
This is my baby at the beginning of week 5
Pure Kush x Sour Diesel

And one of the Bubba Kush

First grow and things are looking up. Its getting frostier in my cabinet everyday.Whens a good week to start sampling? lol

 

[Divine Cosmos]

Damn this club is kicking off!

wish I could upload pics but ran out of batteries Buds are looking swollen and sugar coated, with only a couple days to go Chopped one small cola and the high was ridiculously strong; going to have to take it easy with this stuff.


Catman, looking great man, what are the trichomes like?


SC_KillaKali, really healthy looking plants, keep it up!

 

[rebo]

I just harvested an LR2 from my 150w hps cab.. it was only about 18 inches tall at harvest.. but really sticky and stinky and looks like it'll be about 1/2 zip dry. I'll upload some post harvest pics once I pull them off the camera.

I've got 3 more plants going..(auto AKxBB) 2 are at about week 6 or 7, and 1 is at about week 4.

The pics are the plant I just harvested and one of the auto AKxBB that I'm LSTing to expose more budsits to the light.

 

[Pipedream]

Welcome back Jax, and good answers Jas.
Since you didn't address the Ozone Generator question, I'll throw in my standard sentiments if you don't mind.....

According to Consumers Reports®, many of the Ionizing air cleaners now on the market, produce an excessive amount of ozone as a by-product. This is likely why many growers feel ionizers work to eliminate odor.

Recent independent studies show that, unlike ozone in the upper atmosphere, which helps shield us from harmful ultraviolet rays, ozone near ground level is an irritant that can aggravate asthma and decrease lung function. Ozone in concentrations of greater than 80ppb for 8 hours can cause coughing, wheezing, chest pain, and deaden your sense of smell. Additionally, it raises sensitivity to pollen, mold, and other allergy triggers, and may cause permanent lung damage. Ozone also reacts with the terpenes in lemon and pine scented cleaning products and air fresheners, creating formaldehyde, a known carcinogen.

This info is from Consumers Union, Robert Wood Johnson Medical School, and Yale University’s school of Environmental Studies.

So am I saying that ozone should not be used? No, what I’m saying is, that if you choose to use it, be very conscious of the amount you are generating, your period of exposure, and where else in your home it may be migrating to.

Edit: added after additional experience…..in a post I mentioned I was going to build an ozone generator. Sometime later, I was asked how it went. Here’s my reply…

HEED MY WARNING !

Oh I built it alright, and it worked for sure. It even looked fairly cool as well. However, I'll never recommend them again. Here's what happened.....

Whenever folks brought up the topic, I warned them about using them in the living area of homes because of the health risk. But, I said they were fine in a separate isolated space. Well, I took my own advice and figured since my box was in the garage it would be fine. Fat chance! Ozone is one of the strongest oxidizers out there. And, if there is any moisture in the air and ferrous metal nearby, you have a formula for disaster. It only took about two weeks till everything in the garage started to pit and rust!!!!! Luckily I caught it early and nothing of value was affected. Those items closest to the generator got it the worse. I’m glad that they were only garden tools and other junk of little value.

The most annoying thing was the way I discovered the problem. I’ve been working on restoring an antique motorcycle for almost 7 years now. (yeah, I know I’m slower than shit). I had the gas tank sitting on the work table right next to the grow-box. I had finished all the metal work on the tank and sanded it down to clean bare metal getting ready for the primer. I didn’t go into the garage for 4 or 5 days, and when I did, the tank was covered with thin coating of red rust dust. I don’t know if you’ve ever worked with bare metal where you wipe it with a damp cloth and then hit it with a torch. You get an instant flash coating of rust in a matter of a second or two. Well that’s just what it looked like.

I don’t know, I might have just made it way too powerful, but I really don’t have any way to test Ozone PPM concentration in the air. Oh well, live and learn. I guess its time to build a new carbon scrubber.

 

[Divine Cosmos]

 

[Divine Cosmos]

Sorry about the quality - 2meg pixel :'(

Sorry about the quality - 2meg pixel :'(

 

[Jaxom]

Thanks folks for the quick answers to my questions. So the general consensius is to nix the ozone generator. I wasn't planning on using a huge unit, just one of those "bathroom" sized ones. I think I seen on on Ebay that had a max of 200ppm per hour. Either I could stick that on a timer and have it run less often, so I get below that 80ppm an hour rate or concentrate on a decent carbon filter.

About the carbon filter. I need some suggestions on how to build one. I have seen the atypical one's being built using some wire mesh and a foot or 3 of 4-6" duct work. But in my application this will not work. I need something rectangular, and have the ablity to open it to replace the activated charcoal from time to time.

To better understand this, I'll give just a brief explaination of just a portion of the box I'm building. Air flow of course will enter the grow/flower chamber via the bottom. At the top of the box in the wall between this chamber and the next I'm going to have yet another series of vents. It' on the opposite side of this "wall", that I wish to place the the carbon filter. In this chamber I was where I thought I would place the ozone generator as well. But if you all feel that a carbon filter can handle the stench from growing and drying primarily indicia's... (seeds on hand are snow white "fem", hashplant and Afghani #1)

So I'm thinking of a filter that's say 8"w x 18"l. Just how thick it needs to be in order to be affective as well as being able to open and close is beyond me. Funny, if ya think about it, I can design the whole cabinet, but the filter has me stumped.

 

[DiscoBiscuit]

Latest harvest:



A couple (OG Kush x Sour Diesel IBL) x Deep Chunk
Day 12 in flower:



Divine Cosmos, you're really utilizing the space there!

 

[TraneRek]

Hey all,

So it's been about 10 days since my beans popped. How much longer should I wait till I can start feeding nutes? They seem a bit yellow to me, and I'm not really sure why. I'll post some pics when I can.

-Rek

 

[Jaxom]

TraneRek,

Oppions vary as to when to start using fertilizer. There's so many different varibles involved, such as method of growing, what brand fertilizers. So on and so forth. Personally, when I use to grow sog, I'd start out using a very mild fertilizers with the seeds to begin with. I use GH 3 part, and would use 5ml for each of the grow, bloom, and micro, per gallon. Also note, I used that same formula for keeping my mothers healthy and in my cloning bubbler too.

I've also just use straight tap, with no fertilizer and had equally as well starts. Mind you, until the second or third set of true leaves, the plant is actually using up stored nutrients from the seed.

Whether from seed or clones, I personally believe the most important issue is keeping them moist, but not soaking wet. Light intensity is next most important. The only time grow lights are useful imho, is while germinating seeds or while cloning. You don't want the lights so far away that they streach too far then suddenly keel over and die on you. Nor do you want them so close they burn.

About the yellowing. If you're using distilled or R/O water, I haven't a clue, but if you're using tap, check your ph levels.

Good luck, show us your pics!

Jaxx

 

[TraneRek]

Thanks for the reply Jaxom,

As soon as I get my FloraMicro I'll make a 1/2 strength solution and start using it right away. What have you all found to be the best watering/nute schedule? Every other watering, twice a month, what?

As far as the yellowing.. I'm using distilled water (from a brita filter) so I dunno what the yellowing is.. nute def already? Here are some pics:










As you can see, they're all a bit on the yellow side, and some-what droopy (one more so than the rest..). I've been allowing the soil to get pretty dry in between waterings to prevent them from rotting, but they still don't seem to be doing as well as I'd hoped. Any suggestions?

-Rek