Yellowing/scars problem

[Equilibrium]

Let the pics talk by themselves (it's odd... it used to have a form to fill with what kind of medium you're using and all that...):
















I'm gonna post more info a bit later, I have to run.

 

[anonymousgrower]

what are you using for lights?

and i think i see slight magnesium deficiencies

 

[MynameStitch]

How long has this problem been going on?
What STRAIN are you growing?
What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?)
What is the age of your plants?
How long have they been in the soil mixture they are in now?
How Tall are the plants?
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in?
What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc)
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot)
What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?)
What Nutrient's are you using?
How much of each nutrient are you using with how much water? *Knowing the brand is very helpful*
How often are you feeding?
If flowering, when did you switch over to using Bloom nutrients?
What order are you mixing your nutrients? (example: veg nutes 1st, bloom 2nd ect)
What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"?
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen?
How often are you watering?
When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding?
What size bulb are you using?
What is the distance to the canopy?
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity)
What is the canopy temperature?
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range)
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.)
Tell us about your ventilation, intake exhaust and when its running and not running ?
Is the fan blowing directly at plants?
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist?
Is your water HARD or SOFT?
What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water?
Are you using water from a water softener?
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched?
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when?
Are plant's infected with pest's?

 

[Equilibrium]

Well, these past days, light has been pretty weak, as I was moving them, redesigning some flaws I had with HPS installation... So yeah, they got a 125W CFL blue spectrum for 2-3 days with some HPS light...

 

[Equilibrium]

Yes, thanks MynameStitch, that's what I was looking for!

 

[Equilibrium]

How long has this problem been going on? 7 days, but it really showed up 2 days ago.

What STRAIN are you growing? Critical Mass, Shark, Green Poison. All the strains shows some problems.

What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?) Seed.

What is the age of your plants? 29 days since I've put them to germ.

How long have they been in the soil mixture they are in now? Well, I repotted them during five days, since I did not find free time (3-4 hours) to do it all at once.

How Tall are the plants? 10cm - 20cm (4-8 inches)

What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in? Vegetative.

What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc) Nothing really special. Just pots.

What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot) 8inches by 8 inches by 8 inches (20 cm). 1 subject by pot.

What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?) Well I'm using Canna Professionnal. More info here: http://www.canna-uk.com/node/14
N/P/K of the soil: 12/14/24



What Nutrient's are you using? I'm using BioSevia from GHE: http://www.eurohydro.com/biosevia.html


How much of each nutrient are you using with how much water? *Knowing the brand is very helpful*: Well, really I did nute them twice since they're born, and it was at less than 1/2 recommended strength. All others watering only contained root activator (BioRoots)


How often are you feeding? See above. I wait for the pots to be light in weight.

If flowering, when did you switch over to using Bloom nutrients? /


What order are you mixing your nutrients? (example: veg nutes 1st, bloom 2nd ect) Well, BioSevia Grow and/or BioRoots, then pH down.


What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used? I don't know.

What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"? 7.0, 7.2

What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen? pH pen.


How often are you watering? I wait 'till the soil is dry and the pots are light.


When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding? My last feeding was like.. 7 days ago?


What size bulb are you using? For now, a 125W CFL blue spectrum and a 600 HPS.

What is the distance to the canopy? 50cm (20 inches)


What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity) 55-70


What is the canopy temperature? 24°- 28° 75F-83F

What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range) Don't really know... Maybe 18°.

What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.): I did not finish to install my vent system because of recurrent problems. It should be fixed today.

Tell us about your ventilation, intake exhaust and when its running and not running ? /

Is the fan blowing directly at plants? most of the time no.

Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist? No.

Is your water HARD or SOFT? Spring/Bottled water.

What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water? Bottled.

Are you using water from a water softener? NO.


Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched? No.

Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when? No.

Are plant's infected with pest's? No.

 

[MynameStitch]

Are you talking about the white bleaching marks in the picture?
How close is your 600 watt from those plants?

 

[Equilibrium]

There has been a week since the 600W is:

1. Not on.
2. More than 20 inches away.


In this photo, it's obvious that some plants are a lot more "yellow" than the others:

I don't think that's normal:

These are not stains. I can feel them, like scars.


Look at this shit:

BOTTOM LEAVES OF A PLANT WHO'S BEGINNING TO HAVE THE SAME PROBLEMS

 

[gonzo`]

THe soil you use is weak, i.e. no nutrients. I also grow in canna soil but I use the canna nutrients and the result is always very good. I usually feed after about a week on a low dose.

I usually start veg on pH 5.6 and then move it to 5.8 when flower begins then up to pH 6 at peak flower... I may go up to 6.3 but never above that. Ignore what people say about pH 6.3-7.0, they really have no idea what they're talking about and thats why their yields are so small...

I'd get rid of the GHE and replace it with canna terra, its very simple and works very well.

From what I'm seeing its probably pH issue and possibly a lack of nutrient because like I said earlier, whats in that bag of soil is not sufficient to sustain extended growth.

 

[EvilTwin]

Hi E,
Sorry your plants are having problems. Since I do hydro, the first thing I look at is water. You said you're using bottled water. I was wondering if perhaps it was spring water rather then RO water. Spring water often has high dissolved solids. Water labeled as "drinking water" is usually tap water run through a RO filter. If you're using spring water...the high TDS could be altering soil ph and perhaps blocking proper nutrient absorption.

Hope you get back on track shortly...
ET

 

[guest1ab]

Did you water just before you took the pics? The leaves seem a little... flacid.
Also, I wonder if you've been watering them enough? How dry do you let the soil get? I wonder if that could contribute to light burn ... I realize you said you haven't been using the HPS, but still... It doesn't hurt to ask, does it? Besides it doesn't look like they're diseased or you've got a pest control problem

 

[MynameStitch]

evil twin has a good point, if your water contains sodium this is very bad for your plants.

Also when you say you water when the pots are light, how often is this?

Some of the pictures you posted are showing signs of moisture stress, the leaves cupping under.

The markings you are speaking off, look a lot like light bleaching, but you said the 600 has not been there in a week? so it can't be that even though it looks a lot like it.
How long has the whitish marks been on those leaves?
How often do you use the root stimulator?


I would back off on that for now, it's very easy to get a buildup of that stuff.


Have you searched for bugs? does it look/feel like something ate into the leaf?
Stop using the bio roots every watering. Should not be used that much even if it says you can. your pH is off too, the veins are being affected.

Why are you using pH down? How much are you using it? Do you use pH down with every watering?

 

[Equilibrium]

Woo, so much questions. Thanks for your help guys, I really appreciate it.

Gonzo`: Yes, that's what I was thinking. I clearly unfed them, I thought the soil was strong. About getting rid of GHE BioSevia, I can't for now (budget things) but I was already thinking trying new nutes, and the Canna line was one of my favorites.
A question: why do you say pH above 6.3-7.0 is bad for the plants in soil? Just to know as everything I read just says the opposite.

EvilTwin: Yes, it is spring bottled water. The weird thing is a lot of people uses the same brand around here to cultivate and they have no problems whatsoever. I live really near to the sea, I red the water near to the sea is basically crap. Someone can confirm that?
I'm gonna post the composition of my water:

• Dry residues at 180°: 347 mg/l
• Bicarbonates: 285.1 mg/l
• Sodium: 87.7 mg/l
• Chlorines: 27.4 mg/l
• Calcium: 22.8 mg/l
• Potassium: 4 mg/l
• Fluors: 0.4mg/l

Sanchez: Yes, I did water before taking the pics as they had their re potting just before. I did let them too dry at a point since it's easier to take them out for repot, but I think it was too much. And they were under the HPS at this moment. But if it was really light burn, the marks should have come a lot earlier, no 6 or 7 days after?


MynameStitch: Well yes, the water I'm using has a concentration of sodium of 87.7mg/l. I don't know if it's only trace residues or of it really matters.
About the pots being light, except for the repotting, I try to not let them go too dry tho.
Could the moisture stress be from the watering just after the repotting?

These marks have been here 1 day before I took the picture. I use the root stimulator at every watering. They recommend it for the first 3 weeks. I'm stopping using it anyway.
I've searched for bugs, I could not find a damn thing.

Ok, why do you say that my pH is off? Just looking at the pics? Or is it a hypothesis?
I'm using pH down every watering, 1ml/5L, just to get it down at 6.5.




Thanks everyone for the help, I'm gonna post some pics.

 

[Equilibrium]

Damn, the battery is empty. I have to wait a few hours 'till I'm able to take pictures.

Sorry.

 

[Ziggaro]

# Bicarbonates: 285.1 mg/l
# Sodium: 87.7 mg/l

woah dude! thats really bad!!

sodium is OK at low levels not more than 50 PPM max, that bottle shows 87 PPM

bicarbonates are interfering with your pH thats why your runoff is high.

i agree switch water.. bottle should say RO in ingredients

 

[DocLeaf]

At present the leaf-tips look healthy suggesting they are NOT currently being over fed!

So...

1. The plants look slightly over-watered. Water-logged soil will result in macro and micro nutrient deficiencies. Perhaps allow the soil to dry and breath between watering.

2. there could be a problem with water or soil pH. check the pH

3. the soil looks dark enough (healthy) to sustain growth,, thus we would NOT start adding more nutrients yet ,,, or you could just make problems worse!

Hope this helps

 

[EvilTwin]

E,
I have a friend who's in the bottled water business so I've heard alot. How the bottle is labeled is tightly controlled by Federal law. So you'll find Spring, distilled and "drinking water". I just checked on one of my bottles (Walmart Drinking water) and it doesn't say clearly that it's RO water but it says where the city water came from and that it's run through a micro-pore system.

You can use distilled but there are no micro elements in it.

Best is "drinking' water which is most useful for plants. It'll probably be the cheapest too. So give it a try and see if that helps. You should be able to use less ph down also which is good.

And you commented on soil ph. Back when I did soil grows I never checked ph but 6.5 or thereabouts sounds pretty good to me.
Cheers,
ET

 

[NorCal Greens]

I have the same thing happening.My scares are rust in color though.

 

[MynameStitch]

Yup, sodum and bicarbinotes are bad, switch youtr water over first thing, use it to flush out any mixture that is left in the soil, may take some time for it to purge out of the plants system.

Sodium is taken up before any other nutrient, fix the water issue first and when you see a recovery, you can start using the root stimulator again.

I agree with docleaf, they are looking overwatered, but sodium can cause vigor issues, because it causes vascular problems inside the plant causing it to look like it's having problems transporting moisture inside the plant.

 

[Equilibrium]

Ziggaro: Are you sure you're not mixing PPM and mg/L?

BTW guys, what do you call runoff? The water that gets out of the plant under the pot? In that case, I never said it was "high".


DocLeaf: Yes, I try to let the soil dry between each watering, it's just that the pics were taking after a repotting.
How do I check soil pH?


EvilTwin: Thanks for the precious input as usual. The only problem is that you probably talking me about american legislation. I never saw any RO bottled water in Europe. If any european ever saw this type of water, please advise me. I will try to find it anyway.
The "drinking" water we have comes from springs, whatever the brand.


NorCal Greens: I'm really sorry about your plants. Maybe start a thread in this "Infirmary" section so people can help you?
However, I have no problem if you want to use this thread or ask any question so we can try to find a solution to your problem.


MynameStitch: Thanks for the explanation. What I can do is try to find a bottled water with near to 0% sodium in it.
The only way I have to really change my water is buying a RO unit, which is more than impossible for now.







2 questions:

• Is the water springs / public water near the sea bad?
• How do you explain that spring water comes from nature and the plants are not affected by it? I know most of the plants are fed by rain, but a lot of people take their water from rivers or lakes for big outdoors OP, right? And the plants near rivers or spring should be all dead.

Just food for thought, I'm not trying to go "in a war" with you guys about this water story. It's just that some things do not seems clear to me.