Wiring Diagrams? 4000watts on Heavy Duty Appliance Timer

[Guest]

This timer, http://www.barbecues.com/web/catalo...es-23779&cid=576FFCBB89315E2660D7F465BBB1A9B3

* Automatically controls 240 volt air conditioners, heaters, heavy-duty appliances and lamps
* 5,000 Watt capacity
* Plugs directly into wall outlet
* 2 ON / 2 OFF settings per day
* 3-prong 220-240 Volt grounded plug and receptacle
* Manual override ON/OFF switch

I need to control 3-4000W (220v), I have a 30, 50, and 100AMP breaker available in my box. I'm trying to figure out the easiest way to wire from the breaker, to the timer, to the lamps... Maybe something I can take with me?

Thanks.. Any visual is appreciated..

 

[Guest]

If you run 3-4K through that for any time.its gonna fail and I dont care what the rating is,I didnt even look.What you want is the intermatic WH40 "little gray box",I've run 3K on it for years now.Your second choice would be the intermatic T-103.The only difference between the two is the WH40 has an external on-off lever which comes in handy.

 

[Ono Nadagin]

Ok...

Could you pls let us know exactly what you are trying to control with is timer?... kist 3-4 qkwatt lamps?

if so tie the timer into relays that will flip the power on to the outlets you will have teh lights plugged into.

Is there anything else already running on these breakers you mentioned or are they new dedicated runs?

And Bob why do you say the plastic timer will fail and then follow that statement up with the timer you use and his are exactly the same except for an external on off switch and the casing material?

 

[Guest]

You misunderstood,a WH40 and a T-103 are identical except for the external on-off lever on the WH40 which is what I prefer.If someone prefers to use relays and plug-ins thats fine by me,its not my house lol.Seriously,if you use that timer on 3-4K of HID's get yourself some decent relays for gods sake,or do it the easy way like I did.My contacts arent even noticably burred and I did 1.6K for 2 years and 3K for 4 years on it.I'll replace it soon though,next couple years.

 

[Guest]

smilin bob, can you post a diagram on how to set up the (intermatic) timer and run the wires to 2 outlets (4plugs), for 220v? I have one, minus lever.

This timer is rated for 5000W 220v 30Amp. It's for air conditioning units. I figured it would be fine and that I could run 8ga from the breaker to an ??outlet?? plug in the timer, and maker another male outlet to 2 outlets (4 plugs) since my lamps are wired 220 on 120 plugs. The main off would be the lamp then the breaker.

The breaker's are free (1x 30Amp, 1x50Amp, 1x100Amp) there isn't damn near anything running on the whole thing (meaning actual used daily power for the rest of the place).

Ohh.. I'd only be running 3000W (3x 1K's) and a mover. I'd like the option for 4 since that is what I have available (capacity planning if you will).

Thanks I appreciate the time!

 

[Guest]

If you want the option to run four 1K fixtures on that timer here's what you do.I don't have diagrams I should MTF Sandman will post one up after this.First of all you want the option to run 4K,thats about 20 amps so your circuit will be a 30 amp #10AWG 3 wire circuit,2 hots and one ground.Take the circuit from the panel to the timer landing the two hot wires on the line terminals,the ground will go under the groundscrew.Take a foot or so of 10/3 from the timer to a 4 sq inch box.At the timer,tie the two hots to the load terminals and again the ground goes under the screw.Its a good idea to "pigtail" the ground.splicing both ends to a third green wire 6 inches long so only 1 wire is under the groundscrew.The spliced wires have to be in a wirenut of course.Now youve got the 4 sq inch box with the 3 wires in it and this gets a little hard to explain.First,use 20A commercial grade 120V receptacles not some crappy 15A resi recpts.You are going to have to make pigtails feeding each 120V volt receptacle with the two hots and a ground,it doesnt matter which side of the 120V receptacle you put the two hot wires on,ground to green of course.Thats about the best way I can explain it,thats my setup to a tee except I have the WH40 with an external on-off lever.The benefits of this mainly are deleting that cordcap splice,using the original 120V plug on the fixture allows you to go back to 120V at anytime.Plus I dont think they make duplex 240V receptacles though I could be mistaken.I've been running this way for years,I wouldnt tell someone to do it unless I do it in my house.EDIT Use a DEEP 4 inch sq box if you go with the standard 1 1/2 deep its a real bitch,also you can use 12 AWG from the load side of the timer to the receptacles,should have said this originally.Its a lot easier to work with than 10 wire when it comes to wiring receptacles.

 

[SEEDYNONO]

man i am so confused when it comes to figuring out all this stuff..

so 3 or 4 1k lights need all this crazy wiring and stuff.. what can be run in a bedroom just off of the wall sockets? only 1k or something? even if there are like 4 seperate outlets (one on each wall) so like 8 places to plug into without using any multipliers?

i guess it depends on the house but yeah sheesh i thought you could at least run 2 1k lights and timers and a fan or two and be okay. as long as there isn't like a computer and tv and stereo minifridge and microwave all plugged into the same room.

tough work..

 

[MTF-Sandman]

lol...Bob, quit making me use google

Basically your power goes in to the timer on posts 1 & 3 and comes out on 2 & 4. The ground wire will attach to the ground screw. Screw "A" is not needed for 240v only circuits with 2 conductor wire.

Take the hot leads from 2 & 4 and just run them your outlets. It's perfectly fine to use the 120v outlets (just mark the face place "240v" with a sharpie so that you don't ever forget).

Lemme whip out some m@d Skillz in paint for ya real quick

Should look something like this...


Multiple edits for grammar/spelling

 

[MTF-Sandman]

man i am so confused when it comes to figuring out all this stuff..

so 3 or 4 1k lights need all this crazy wiring and stuff.. what can be run in a bedroom just off of the wall sockets? only 1k or something? even if there are like 4 seperate outlets (one on each wall) so like 8 places to plug into without using any multipliers?

i guess it depends on the house but yeah sheesh i thought you could at least run 2 1k lights and timers and a fan or two and be okay. as long as there isn't like a computer and tv and stereo minifridge and microwave all plugged into the same room.

tough work..

Probably 80-90% of home circuits are ran with 15a breakers...and they usually don't dedicate a breaker to each room - So that means you can run 1k per 15a circuit as long as there's no other high draw devices on that circuit. Running 2k off 1 circuit won't happen unless you got freakishly lucky and they installed a 30a/120v circuit for your outlets...but that's highly unlikely.

Basically any time you want to run more than 1k (or 1200w if your using 600's) you're gonna need to drop a circuit in to do it safely...and that's why most 2k+ setups are ran 240v - so smaller gauge wire can be used while still providing the amps needed.

 

[SEEDYNONO]

man tricky tricky.. i need to start doing lots more homework then if i want to get another light.. i have a 600w hps cab going only..

is it even possible to 'drop a new circuit' in a rental.. like is it simple enough to undo?

 

[hazeywonder]

seedynon - if your running 600's you can fit two on a 15 amp circuit. what your going to need to do is use a power cord from another room to power all the extra stuff...

 

[MTF-Sandman]

man tricky tricky.. i need to start doing lots more homework then if i want to get another light.. i have a 600w hps cab going only..

is it even possible to 'drop a new circuit' in a rental.. like is it simple enough to undo?

It's definitely possible, but you're gonna need to do some work to get it done safely. Check out one of the home wiring books at HD or Lowes and it'll give you a better idea what your in for.

 

[Guest]

Sorry MTF,I've been googlin myself silly here lately lol.Yea T104,where the hell did I get T-103?Isnt the 103 240-277V? Never mind I'll google it lol.Ya cant go wrong with the WH40 thoughEDIT Seedynono,sounds like a big project,unless you run into problems,it isnt,it just sounds like it lol

 

[EZB581]

Gents, I recently did this exact thing, with the help of Sandman Smilin bob & others. It was a hella lot easier than I 1st thought it would be.Check out this thread or put "T104" in the search box. Lots of good info

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=53318

 

[Guest]

Did you end up mounting the timer directly over the box EZ?

 

[EZB581]

No, I ran #8 wire from the garage thru the attic and into the room. with a junction box at each end. I then wired in a dryer plug at the garage end. In the room I ran #10 wire from that junction box to the timer & down to the recepticles. Lot of connections I realize but I wanted to be able to change it.
I hope that makes sense I can't explain things as well as Ya'll.

 

[Guest]

It makes sense,but I was under the impression you had a 3 wire 30A dryer circuit right there,I guess tthere was a reason to run another but 8 wire?What are you up to kiddo lol?

 

[EZB581]

It was growtime who had the 30a dryer recepticle right there. I just high jacked his thread. OhYa! Glad I remembered.When the timer kicks on I see an arc behind the plate. I assume thats not good. Lately I been battleing high temps & trying to keep up with a bunch of thirsty ladies. The window AC is workin hard at mid day. Room design phase 6 or 7 I forget which,is already to go LOL!

 

[Guest]

You assume incorrect bro,its totally normal.You're not going to energize HId's instantaneously without a bit of arcing on the contacts,it's 100% normal.Though the timers rated at 40A,I personally wouldn't run more than 41K fixtures at 240V on any one intermatic water heater style timer.

 

[EZB581]

You assume incorrect bro,its totally normal.You're not going to energize HId's instantaneously without a bit of arcing on the contacts,it's 100% normal.Though the timers rated at 40A,I personally wouldn't run more than 41K fixtures at 240V on any one intermatic water heater style timer.

Well, Thats good to hear about the arc. Every once in a while things go your way! I running 3 1Ks at the moment
For you folks considering it. Everything is working just fine.