Whorled Phyllotaxy - Info please?

[Guest]

Hi fellow growers,

I have just recently started a grow with a few untested strains. Among these I have VeryBerry (Blueberry x Strawberry) from Green Hornet Seeds. They are two days old today. I planted three, all of which germed with some strange kinks, two of which have seemingly begun a normal growth pattern. The third is clearly a whorled phyllotaxy. Below is a pic of her yesterday just germed. Tomorrow I'll take another pic, but she has quite a different aspect today, three well defined leaves and three dicotiledons. Here she is:

I'd like to ask some of you more knowledgable growers and breeders more information regarding this "mutation". First off...is it desirable? I've read threads here and there, some of which claim yes, some claim no, some people say the male/female ratio is heavy on the male side, some say its a characteristic which makes for excellent breeding, others stating they are heavily prone to hermies, others saying they are difficult to grow to maturity.

Can you guys help me out? When you didn't take marijuana botany 101 in college and have limited knowledge of the whole genetics deal all this conflicting info can get your head spinning.

Thanks for the help all!

 

[Harry Gypsna]

i think the three leaver is called a "Tri-foliate", and i think its neither a good, nor bad hing, just like when sum1 is born with an extra toe or finger.

 

[KRS Juan]

I have had a couple trifoilates among different strains, all ended up female. One ended up topping itself, the other was very stretchy. In my opinion it's just a mutation and has no effect, either way, on any other characteristics of the plant. On the plus side they are really cool looking in early growth.

-KRS Juan-

 

[Okie grown]

I have one

I have one

I have a sour bubble that puts 3 stems out at every node.Its 6 weeks into flower now.If you look close you can see it.I also grew a couple nl #5 x blue berry plants that had leaf mut. but never hurt growth.Thay just had wavy leaves kinda twisted.

 

[Guest]

Thanks for the input guys! Okie that Sour Bubble is awesome...but I've probably already told you that!

Here's a pic of my baby, three days old today...I must say she is looking quite gorgeous...

 

[KRS Juan]

Very nice BV! Here's my MiniKush tri in early veg:

-KRS Juan-

 

[Guest]

they are sweet when they're little aren't they? Looks like anything but marijuana . Thanks for sharing KRS

 

[wickyd]

Is there a website for Green Hornet Seeds?

 

[Guest]

Here you go wickyd:

http://www.greenhornet.ch/

Please note that Green Hornet has already put up for sale their seeds, but some strains are still undergoing testing. This is true for both the Cash Cropper and the VeryBerry, for which Cannaddicto and I are doing testing (with relative threads). I couldn't tell you whether the other strains on their website have already been through testing or not.

 

[Guest]

Whorled phylotaxy is mostly an aspect of revegetating plants from what I have seen. After the initial stage of new growth, the smooth single blade leaves, normal single blade serrated MJ leaves emerge. When these grow out and progress to three bladed leaves, they begin to show lots of the whoroled phenomenom. I think it has something to do with the transition to full veg growth since most leaves are growing out with trichomes on them.

George Cervantes claims trifoliates are genetically weak leading to less yields and loss of potency. Read that in his book while in Borders the other day.....

 

[Guest]

Interesting Caprichoso, thanks for your input...I don't have any of the Cannabis literature and I do most of my research in the forums and on the net. I found some information on OG, but needless to say its all conflicting.

 

[Guest]

Here is a pic I found of what I'm talking about in revegetated plants. This girl was a small bud cloned just before harvest and is now full of circular leaves from being back on 24 hour light. If you look just to the left of the remains of the bud, you can make out half a leaf that is almost a full circle. This is what I thought whorled phylotaxy was

 

[Guest]

Hi Caprichoso, I understand what you are saying. This is a little difficult to explain. Start from the basics:

Definition of whorled phyllotaxy from the Oxford English Dictionary

"a set of leaves, flowers, or branches springing from the stem at the same level and encircling it."

I apply this to my plant as cannabis normally has two sets of leaves. This one has three..."springing from the stem at the same level and encircling it". Which I read as a set of leaves at each node, thus on the same level, which surround the stem 360° thus encircling it.

I've never revegged a plant, so have no idea what to expect. From what I've gathered from your picture the leaves curl under on themslves, forming a sort of cylinder? In this case the term IMO isn't applicable. What your leaves are doing is a result of stress, and not a genetic mutation, which as I understand is exactly what whorled phyllotaxy is.

I would love to hear from some other gurus here on the subject!

 

[Guest]

Cool, thanks for the info. I should probably stick my head out of the marijuana world at least once or twice. Someday.

 

[wickyd]

thanks for the link, I always like strain searching!

 

[Guest]

welcome guys...have a nice day!

 

[BushyOldGrower]

Jorge may be right in many cases but...

Jorge may be right in many cases but...

This growing variation is not a mutation in my opinion. Since it happens usually the same way it seems odd to me that it is a random mutation. Some say they are polyploids with duplicate sets of chromasomes and some say that plants with double or triple sets of chromosomes are super. Ya know there are really no absolutes in life?

I have had triples as I call them that stayed very vigorous through flowering and the trait made the plant more compact with a great yield. I don't say this is usually the case but any plant that seems to grow well is worth checking out before chucking anyways.

This isn't a trait I breed for or try to eliminate but my strains do it a lot. Perhaps it is a genetic defect in the bubblegum used in everything I have or perhaps it is just a sign of the growers good karma. I say, "don't believe me but see for yourself".

They can be just fine... BOG

 

[Guest]

Thanks BOG, your input is much appreciated . I also agree it can't be a random phenomenon. It happens too often. Mine was curiosity, the little baby intrigued me and I thought to find out more about her. It interested me that information was so contradictory. My plant is so pretty I assure you, I wouldn't dream of chucking her out, on the contrary, she's been babied .

 

[chr0nix]

always neat seeing these plants

 

[Sam_Skunkman]

They are whorled phyllotaxy, I made a cross of a male Whorled Phyllotaxy, which I seem to find more of, and a female Whorled Phyllotaxy and got no whorled offspring.
I like the way they look. Do people see more males or females with this?
I kept several females around they are still whorled.
I would like to see ones that had whorled Tri stems on not only off the main stalk, like is common, but also then again on the sets of branches off the first tri stems, and again from the 2nd that are on the first. So it is tri whorled on tri whorled on tri whorled branches. Never seen it, I have seen a few tri seconday branches just a few.

-SamS