Who grows in plain jane potting soil and just adds liquid nutes during feed?

[stoned teacher]

If this isn't doable I'm going to hydro. I don't want to have to make teas and mix 4 different things (some not found at local stores) in soil then blend 4 things together during feeding. I just want to use soil (bagged promix), maybe add some peerlite for drainage/aeration, and feed.

I read sproutco's post that said the floranova nutes would work this way, but I haven't read of anyone that is doing just that wih success, and later read a post that said that Sproutco hasn't even done this himself (no offense to anyone...I just want experience from growers).

So can you just use plain potting soil mix and one of the hydro system nutes, and just mix that approprietly for watering and thats it?

If so, what nute system do you recommend?

I already have the BC Grow/Bloom/Boost 3 part nute system and have just started using that after mixing more crap in soil and mixing crap for feeding has again left me with plant problems. I'm sick of it. Haven't been doing it long enough to notice the plants getting better, but they haven't gotten worse eiher.

Come on someone...gimme your SIMPLE SIMPLE potting soil and simple feeding advice!

 

[cough_cough_eer]

I used to grow with just regular soil and in veg I ferterlize with perters 20 20 20 and in flower I used miricle grow. had real good results, and I was only using shoplights.

 

[stikky budz]

Hey Teach,,, have you considered COCO ? ~ best of both worlds,,,soil and hydro.
Usuable straight out the bag, no "extra's" such as perlite needed, and with coco specific nutes you cant really go wrong.
I believe hydro nutes would work well too if thats what you already have. I'm sure someone down the Coco forum will know about the BC nutes you have ~ i dont. I'm a Canna man.

just a suggestion

 

[Durty]

All I use is Ocean forest soil and pure blend pro nutes. Usually dont need any nutes in veg at all. When in flower they get some PB 2 out of 3 waterings and some Liquid karma once or twice and thats it. Easy man

 

[Guest]

Your can achieve decent result with Alaska fish ferts 5-1-1 and Alaska morebloom 0-10-10 + epso grow. These products are probably the easiest to find. Cost $ 8-10 per bottle. Lowes, Home depot...


Good luck!

 

[Guest]

howdy

lets see, i use promix add some perlite, some blood meal, some bone meal (Scotts brand) from the local H. depot. the blood meal is water soliuble and i think the bone meal is as well, but i would have to ck that. then i mix up epomsalts in water and water each pot. i do keep on hand cal mag, fish food and mychrozime(not sure if i spelled it right)and a bloom fert.
on a norm i dont need to feed till i flush the pots when i put them in flower then i hit them with with a liquid bloom fert (scotts bloom plus) at the last week i flush again before chopping.

im not sure if this helps but thats how i do it. now when i do have a problem its because of the distilled water changes ph and i forget to ck it.
now i will not say i have never had a problem. although right now i have a black cherry that got burnt bad because the mix must have been to hot and that was my fault, i tp into the main soil to soon before they was ready and the bone meal the wife got me had N in it and i had mixed it the same way as normal so like i said it was my fault.
98% of the time i dont have a problem, but like any thing else their is always a % that goes wrong.

the only other suggestion i can give is to stop growing and support the local street sealers..not............... as you can see these plants are doing ok.
(abg)

zigg

 

[Jesusbuiltmygro]

Well let me tell you, hydro is no easier. You will still be mixing up 4 things when your adjusting your hydro rez, but with hydro you will also had additional problems.

Basically in hydro you have all the problems of soil and then a few more like high PH sensitivity, water hardness/softness, leaks, expensive meters needed, high water temps causing root rot.

Pro Mix is great stuff, but in my opinion you should have use a simple pre mixed organic soil like Fox Farms or Mircacle Grow Organic. Then you could do what you say and just add liquid fertz like fish emulsions without mixing. Teas don't have to be complex, they can be as simple as a teaspoon of fert in a gallon of water, shaken and then dumped on the plants. The elaborate processes are for people who want the most out of their tea, but they are no necessary to feed the plant.

You can use any hydroponic nutrient solution mixed in the correct proportions to feed soil plants. However, I would recommend dilluting the mixture a bit.

BC nutes are fine for soil and should work well enough as long as you nutes aren't too old. Nutes do go bad after years of storage. So thats one potential problem.

Starting with pro mix and adding all the nutes to the mix yourself with newbie experience soil growing was a mistake and that's why your having problems, not because soil is hard. Soil is the easiest way to grow... peroid. Some people are more suited to hydro, but ultimately soil is easier, more reliable, cheaper and the nutrients are of higher availabilty.

Now what you probably need to do is post your plant problems in the sick plant forum and try to get some real help. Desicibe your grow or even post pics if you can. What size containers, how often to you water, have you tested the PH of the water and the run off from the planter drainage, how old is the grow and how tall are the plants, what are the symptoms such as leaf yellowing, wilting, curling, dead tips, odd patterns or spots on the plants.
They guys in the sick plant forums can likely help you figure this out.

If your using very small contianers it's also possible your plants are rootbound which is a tricky condition in the sense that it's symptoms are varying and mimick other problems.

Most problems have to do with PH being out of whack, but with a self mixed soil the possibilities of deficiencies and toxicifications are endless.

For fast result you will want a fast release fertilizer such as fish emulsions. If there is any ONE fertilizer that I think you could grow you entire grow with it's probably fish emulsions, but that's only if you used a premixed soil. However all is not lost, with some detailed posts the guys in the Cannabis Infirmary can probably put you on the right path.

For soil grows ideal premixed nutrients are stuff like Earth Juice, Pure Blend Pro, and the premixed Tea's. I think your just making the Tea's out to be more work than they actually are. If you get your prcocess down right it's not much work at all. I find the dry nutrients not quite as messy as the liquid ones which always want to spill as I'm pouring them. A great investment for liquid nute users are those nutrient measuring syringes. You just dunk the thing into the nutes and suck out the desired amount without pouring.

What SOME of the best soil growers around do is a combination of teas and a soil full spectrum nute like Earth Juice or Pure Blend Pro. This gives you ultimate flexibility and control over feeding. See, not matter what style you use your going to run into nutrient deficiencies so you should just use this opportunity to brush up on your plant DR skills. The PRO's use these same skills to meet their plants exact needs. Oh have a little yellowing during VEG, well it's probably low nitrogen, so hit it with a nitrogen tea instead of a full range all in one fertilizer. Many growers like extra level of zinc or magnesium in their nutrients so they will tweak these levels. Kelp meal is a great and cheap alternative to expensive liquid kelp and lasts a lot longer in dry meal form rather than liquid form.

So, while you could have made things a lot smoother with a better intial soil choice... too late now. There is no, one stop elixer that's going to save you now. What you need is growing experience. No offense, but I hate seeing people struggling with soil who think hydro will solve all their problems. You'll just learn a new set of problems like high rez temps = pythium outbreaks.

The quality of your water play a significant role in all this. If you have very high PH water you may find using gallons of filtered water to be a better bet.
If your growing without drainage then you might want to convert back to drained plant containers as this helps greatly with overall plant health. Plus seal containers have a way of capturing all your nutrient adjustments/mistakes while drained containers can effectively wash away a bad mix. Overwatering is of course a very very common problem in all soil grows, but especially non drained grows.

If your growing a lot of plants or just using large containers then I can see where making TEA's could be a pain, but with better planning you should be able to make a large batch of TEA and use it over the course of say a week. You don't have to go through the whole TEA bag process if it's too much work. Simply throwing the nutrients in the water and letting them sit for awhile is good enough.

Promix, while great stuff, is made well more for the PROs. It's very basic and requires someone with experience to mix in the suppliments.

When I would use promix I would mix togethre a big batch of soil using promix as the core. Then I add perlite to my personal tastes and then add all the ferts such as bone meal, blood meal, greensand, kelp meal, potash, iron, and all that crap. The let the soil activate for 2 weeks and use it.

However, it's simply much easier to get the premixed organic soil which comes with all that in the correct ratio and use something like Earth Juice or Pure Blend Pro. This almost guarantees you have all the micro and macro nutrients. Until you're a soil pro I can't see recommending anyone to mix their own soil.

That would be like telling someone hydro is easy, just mix up your own liquid nutrients and you're set.

At this point the plant should be telling you whats wrong with the soil. It may be telling you more than one problem at a time. Pure Blend Pro or Earth Juice or even your BC nutes should have all the nutrient the plant needs for decent growth, so I'd guess it's a problem with PH, the plant being rootbound or overwater.

 

[Jesusbuiltmygro]

also since promix is on the acidic side a bit of dolmite lime might be in oder but the plant infirmary is the place to ask that IMO

 

[stoned teacher]

Thanks for everyones input.....

Promix has a litle lime in it. Last grow I had problems because I added a little more in it and had problems keeping the ph down. PH is definately not the culprit this time. It's definately a micro nute problem, but it seems to be one after another. Definately not a rootbound problem. I'm ok with at least hat aspect of growing (recently transplanted).

I had forgot, I actually ordered the flora novas and got them today. So now I could choose from that or the BC grow/bloom/boost system.

Sticky budz...I may have to look into coco if I can't get the soil mix thing worked out.

Durty...that seems like just my speed. I was using the pure blend (not pro) nutes according to Bog's soil recipe originally, but ended up with nute problems. I guess the pure blend pro has all the micro nues in it? It's an all in one hydro fert like I'm talking about and like the ones I have, correct? Does the Ocean Forest soil come with anything in it or is it just plain, unfertalized, poting soil? I haven't used ocean forest because it seems to be only sold in specialty hydro stores, not your basic home depot/lowes or corner gardening store (from my experience).. It sounds like you and cough err are the closest to having done what I'm talking about.....

Zigg...I've used blood and bone in my Promix before as Bog had instructed. Ran into micronute problems using pure blend as he instructed. Still seems like a buncha mixing that you get involved in. I wanna keep it as simple as possible....

Jesus built my grow. thx for the in depth post. Seems like I should be able to get away with using one of these hydro solutions, huh? One thing I HAVE learned is not to overwater or over fert, so I'll definately begin mixing lightly. Like I said, it's definately not PH this grow. It was in the past and I've overcome that barrier. I've been putting in water at ph 6.0 and that's what's been coming out of the runoff too. I definately don't overwater and have recently transplanted. Can you explain which nutrients these soil mix's you recommend over pro mix have? Is it micro nutes or npk that they're coming with that should help me? My goal was to start with nothing and get a premixed fert that will provide approxomate correct rations of everything out of the bottle, bu I'm open to changing soils if there going to be better for me without mixing and with some complete nute solution... When I thought of teas, I was thinking of he people that compost and literally use that to make teas, not people that simply start with water and add a teaspoon here or there of a nute solution (how I want to do). My pots do have holes on the botom so they are draining and the soil mix is drying completely every few days as it should. I'll definately take your advice and stay away from hydro now. I just want to simplify what I'm doing in soil mix's....

Sorry if this is rambling. I appreciate everybody's feedback and help. I love growing marijuana, even as the results I've gotten have been marginal. I gotta find a simple way to drastically improve results.....

 

[Brastaman]

teacher,teacher;

I ran into lots of problems when I started adding supplements such as bone meal, bat guano, dolomit lime etc.... into my potting soil mix. The medium was never balanced after the mix so when I would use nutrients it threw everything off during growth, uhh, or not growth I should say.

I eventually kept is so simple.
Soil + Fox farm nutrients + pH & TDS combo meter = success!

Whitney's Farm produces excellent potting soil for our gardens. And it can be found at any Nursery in the local area.
Personally, I have since traded in Whitney's Farm for Fox Farm Ocean Forrest.

Also, look for nutrients that have a buffer in them that should pH balance your feed solution.








one.

 

[stoned teacher]

Brastaman: thanks...this is the kind of feedback I'm looking for.....Whoat do these soil mixes contain that promix doesn't??????

Never heard of Whitney's Farm potting soil, but I'll check a few places locally and see what I can find. Foxfarm makes all in one nutes too, huh? I think I have a bottle of big bloom down there somewhere, but thats all I have from therm. I wonder how different their stuff is from the floranova I just got, the pureblend pro ohers are recommending, and the BC soluion I also have. I believe the floranova stuff does have a ph balancer....but is it to 7 or is it under like "we" like?

If these soil mixes are doing something my promix isn't and thats a big reason I'm running into trouble, I'll certainly switch, even if it means I have to drive to the hydro store (45 min- an hour away to get to mdhydro) and get the Foxfarm Ocean forest in bulk...enough to last a few grows at a time. I've never seen that stuff local....

 

[Hotgurl]

Flora nova does not get any simpler as far as feeding. 1 bottle of grow and 1 bottle of bloom. Since it contains alot of calcium and magnesium for hydro use, you would want a low amount of dolomite lime in your soil mix. So...don't add addtional dol. lime to what is already there. Do add alot of perlite. After you add the floranova to the water, adjust the ph to about 5.8-6.2 Doing this does not make you so dependant on dol. lime doing your ph regulation.

Good luck with your grow!

 

[stoned teacher]

Hotgirl...Is this what you do? What type of soil mix do you use???? And with no additives????I read floranova is the easiest and thats why I got it.

 

[Hotgurl]

Cut something like promix by 1/3 with perlite

 

[stikky budz]

Sticky budz...I may have to look into coco if I can't get the soil mix thing worked out.

I swear to god (not that i believe in the fuckwit) that most soil growers who tried coco would never look back.
Take the plunge fella, you wont regret it.

 

[Hotgurl]

Couldn't you add some perlite to the coco as well?

 

[stoned teacher]

Are we talking about coco as a medium or those coco blocks? I looked around the coco forum just a little (didn't find the "unofficial" thread that many were praising) and the coco looked like a soil mix, in a similar pot, some mixed with peerlite....so whats the difference? Got a link that covers the basic basics of coco growing.

I'll try whatever....the simpler the better....

Can you only get coco at "hydro type grow shops" or is the stuff available at local places?

 

[stikky budz]

Hotgurl : yeah, you can add perlite. I'm using 20% perlite in my mine but switching to 100% coco in the future.

stoned teacher : slabs, the loose stuff in bags or the blocks that need soaking first,,,,, any on those would be a good start though i prefer the bags myself. Straight from the bag and into a pot. I like being able to move each plant individually if need be.

The unofficial coco thread is in the "growers forum",,, not the coco forum. Its been running a while,, long before the coco forum arrived.

Can you only get coco at "hydro type grow shops" or is the stuff available at local places?

You can buy coco at normal Gardening centres,,, but the stuff from hydro shops ~ usual named brands such as canna and b'cuzz ~ will more likely be pretreated especially for use with MJ plants,,, trichoderma for example.
Its about £12.50 or $25 for a 50 litre bag.
Normal garden centre coco will probably need a good fluhhing before use to remove salts etc.

 

[stoned teacher]

Found the thread and am going through it now. I see that at least some of the growers have used the floranova's, but it seems like the simplist or most foolproof way of doing things is to use a fert made for coco.

You do transplant from smaller to larger pots using coco just as you do soil, correct?

the reading has definately peaked my interest. Seems like a few people say it's simple and foolproof........supposedly 10% more growth, no risk of overwatering.....

 

[Guest]

Hi Stoned Teacher, I've been using a basic Promix based soil mix that was published in the Overgrow FAQ. I done 4 grows now and have it dialed pretty well.

The basic soil mix is 2 parts Promix, 1 part Vermiculite, and 1 part Perlite. The Vermiculite holds water and the Perlite is for drainage. This mix is very forgiving as it can be flushed out to correct for pH problems and overfertilizing.

Promix is mostly peat moss with a bit of lime added to it. The pH will drop as the peat moss continues to compost but most of the pH problems come from using salt based fertilzers. The plant takes up the mineral component of the fertilizer leaving behind an acidic residue. As the pH drops, the plant will develop Magnesium deficiencies due to lockout from the low pH which occurs below 6.0. This can be treated by flushing and Epsom salts 1 tsp/gal.

I've been using Shultz 12-15-12 liquid plant food. It's can be found in the grocery and department stores. I've been adding 1 tbsp/gal of Blood Meal for a slow release Nitrogen source and 2 tbsp/gal of Bone Meal for a slow release Calcium source. I have finally found some Dolomite lime and am currently using 1 tbsp/gal as a pH buffer.

I'm lucky that our local water is pH 7.0 and I test the runoff water with an aquarium water test kit every 2nd waterings or so. I'll treat the water with Epsom salts when the pH drops below 6.5 and will flush when it gets close to 6.0. This only happens a couple of times throughout the grow so it's not a big deal.