What Type of Panel Is This?

[Hammerhead]

he uses 4 or 3 depends on what voltage you want to run. this is the proper way if your using 120v as well. if you only need 240v then 10-3 is fine red,blk,grd. If you decide to have a custom controller made make sure to tell him to use the proper breakers,wire and receptacle's. None of this 240v 15a garbage... I just got done rebuilding the one I bought. It had a 30a breaker in it going direct to the 240v 15 receptacles. I changed all of the receptacles to 6-20 and replaced the 30 with a 20. I also added another 20a breaker to the panel. I used 8-4 power line to the controller. This will run 32a safely with the 80% rule. The line is rated for 40a

 

[joe fresh]

Thanks for the help guys. Just what I needed to know. A proper upgrade would be nice. Would the electrician need full access to the home and all rooms? The electric company would need to turn power off at the home as well I bet.

The dryer is 30 amp 3 prong 240 volts. I'm assuming its on 10 gauge wiring. Not sure if those power thief boxes are 3 prong or 4. I'd like to run 7 600 watt lights total (veg/flower) so 30 amp 10 gauge should be enough i'm thinking. I figure I could run fans,pumps, t'5 off of normal outlets.

it depends, the electrician can just replace that fuse box with a breaker panel and reconnect all the existing wires and just run a new wire to the grow room, this would be the cheapest and the electrician would not need access to the whole house.

but if you want to replace all the wiring in your house it will cost alot more and he will need to be in every room. and it will take a while

 

[blazeoneup]

Thanks for the help guys. Just what I needed to know. A proper upgrade would be nice. Would the electrician need full access to the home and all rooms? The electric company would need to turn power off at the home as well I bet.

The dryer is 30 amp 3 prong 240 volts. I'm assuming its on 10 gauge wiring. Not sure if those power thief boxes are 3 prong or 4. I'd like to run 7 600 watt lights total (veg/flower) so 30 amp 10 gauge should be enough i'm thinking. I figure I could run fans,pumps, t'5 off of normal outlets.

It all depends on your current service and whats gonna be installed. If your not upgrading the actual service just updating it. There wont be no need to have the power shut off or anything.

The electrician will remove the meter and kill the power, update the main panel, reinstall the meter and get out of there.

If your upgrading service then you will end up needing a new meter and new lines from the weather head to the meter and from the meter to the main panel.

The electrician shouldn't need to access any room but the room which houses the main panel. Unless he finds wiring to be faulty or not up to code he won't need to get to any other room. If he finds the wiring isn't up to code he will inform you that he would need to run new lines to replace whatever isn't up to code and then he would need access to other rooms.

 

[Grizz]

if you have gas supplyed to your dryer area get a gas dryer and use the power that was going to your dryer, either get the plug in and play or run new wire from your grow room to the old panel to the dryer fuse, how big is the breaker in the old box for the dryer ?

 

[Hammerhead]

There are no breakers just fuses in his old pannel

 

[Grizz]

There are no breakers just fuses in his old pannel

yep, ment to say fuse but said breaker instead.

 

[watts]

Hey guys please excuse the delay. I got a few more pics here.

It says 150 max amp on the door. Everything is electric except the gas heat. I'm assuming the dryer is on a 30 amp 240v fuse block. The dryer plugs into a 3 prong 240v outlet. The block that the central AC on is big, i'm assuming it's 40-60 amp. There's another box next to the panel for the electric water heater. What I don't understand is why the door says "Spare". The left side has what's on the round fuses and the right side says what's on the block fuses. If you can't read what it says on the right side of door, it says: Oven, Cooktop, Dryer, AC, Spare. In that order. I guess the very top block is the fuse block that controls the whole panel?

 

[joe fresh]

wish i could help more but i really dont know much about these old fuse boxes, got them in my garage as a sort of junction box with a lever switch to turn power on/off but i dont know much about them

 

[blazeoneup]

Hey guys please excuse the delay. I got a few more pics here.

It says 150 max amp on the door. Everything is electric except the gas heat. I'm assuming the dryer is on a 30 amp 240v fuse block. The dryer plugs into a 3 prong 240v outlet. The block that the central AC on is big, i'm assuming it's 40-60 amp. There's another box next to the panel for the electric water heater. What I don't understand is why the door says "Spare". The left side has what's on the round fuses and the right side says what's on the block fuses. If you can't read what it says on the right side of door, it says: Oven, Cooktop, Dryer, AC, Spare. In that order. I guess the very top block is the fuse block that controls the whole panel?

What is it exactly that you need to know? The main pull fuse at the top would be where the main line comes in from the meter.

 

[watts]

Hmm, just showing more pics of it all and wondering why it says there is a "spare"... looks like everything is full to me. Guess i'll go with the dryer option somehow or upgrade it all.

 

[blazeoneup]

Hmm, just showing more pics of it all and wondering why it says there is a "spare"... looks like everything is full to me. Guess i'll go with the dryer option somehow or upgrade it all.

You can take the cover off and see if it's wired up. The spare label could mean its not wired up. Just an empty fuse shoved into a slot as a filler. You can take the panel cover off and see if it's a spare or not.

If it's got electrical wiring ran to it it's not a spare. If it has no electrical wiring connected to it. Then I guess it would be a spare.

 

[rives]

The only way to tell if anything is really a spare is to do what Blaze said above - pull the cover off and see if there is anything left open. On those old fuse panels, the fuse block was usually flipped over and reinserted to turn it off - the stabs only engaged when inserted right side up. If one of them is installed upside down, it may indicate it is unused, but you really need to remove the cover and look.


I feel compelled to bring this one back up -

Both of you are right but not seeing eye to eye. You are confusing each other.

10awg is rated for 15 amps. 10/2 is capable of running 30 amps. Why because it has 2 10awg lines both capable of using 15 amps or 80% there of.

His math is based on a single 10awg wire.

You guys are just confusing each other and that in turn can possibly confuse the thread starter.

I think I am getting confused trying to figure out where the confusions coming from

While this may appear to be perfectly logical, it is also incorrect. 10 gauge wire is rated for 30 amps, it doesn't matter if it is a single conductor or 10/4.

Additionally, the 80% derating factor isn't applied to the wire used in the circuit, but rather it is to be applied to the circuit breaker feeding the circuit. There are actually breakers that can be run at 100% on continuous loads, but they are specially listed meaning that they have been tested and approved for that level of service.

 

[Hammerhead]

so does that mean the websites data is incorrect. I found a few that have differant # then what it should be.. I sent them a email already telling them there chart was incorrect???

http://www.powerstream.com/Wire_Size.htm

 

[blazeoneup]

The only way to tell if anything is really a spare is to do what Blaze said above - pull the cover off and see if there is anything left open. On those old fuse panels, the fuse block was usually flipped over and reinserted to turn it off - the stabs only engaged when inserted right side up. If one of them is installed upside down, it may indicate it is unused, but you really need to remove the cover and look.


I feel compelled to bring this one back up -



While this may appear to be perfectly logical, it is also incorrect. 10 gauge wire is rated for 30 amps, it doesn't matter if it is a single conductor or 10/4.

Additionally, the 80% derating factor isn't applied to the wire used in the circuit, but rather it is to be applied to the circuit breaker feeding the circuit. There are actually breakers that can be run at 100% on continuous loads, but they are specially listed meaning that they have been tested and approved for that level of service.

Thanks for the information. Well I reread my post and I get where it might sound like I was putting the 80% rating on the wire wasn't intended to sound like that.

I don't know how I got mind fucked in this thread lol. Obviously I was wrong on the rating. After thinking about your post and giving it thought I feel like a douche.

 

[Hammerhead]

I think we all understand the 80% rule.. I dont have the amperage rating memorized so I just copy and paste from Electrical websites that have the data. I guess I should not assume there data is correct..


This one is wrong as well

http://www.electrical-designer-guide.com/electrical-wire-size.html

 

[rives]

Blaze, I wasn't referring to your post on the 80% part - it had been mentioned several times above. Discard the douche feeling - I made a dumb mistake the other day that thankfully you caught, and you were very gracious about it!

HH, I don't know where the people in that link are deriving their data, but it is way off from NEC standards for any type of insulation that I can think of. I'm not home, so I don't have access to my reference materials, but I see a number of them that are way off and there is no reference to different ratings for different insulations.

 

[Hammerhead]

That definitely not good for people looking for that info.. Do you have any websites that have correct info to site when someone needs that info ???

 

[rives]

HH, just going by my memory, that second link looks accurate. They have omitted the fine print notes from the NEC that disallow the higher amperage rating in the higher temperature insulations for #10 and smaller wire, among others, however.

It is best to find a reprint of the actual NEC table and use that. I will try and hunt one up for you. There are many exceptions to things, and obviously these sites aren't touching on them.

 

[blazeoneup]

HH, just going by my memory, that second link looks accurate. They have omitted the fine print notes from the NEC that disallow the higher amperage rating in the higher temperature insulations for #10 and smaller wire, among others, however.

It is best to find a reprint of the actual NEC table and use that. I will try and hunt one up for you. There are many exceptions to things, and obviously these sites aren't touching on them.

It wouldn't be a bad thing to post that up in a new thread and make it a sticky just for reference purposes to prevent any further confusion on subjects like this which when it comes down to it. Requires valid information that has been gone over with fine tooth comb. Because electricity is dangerous and information given needs to be solid when helping others on a forum like this.

 

[Hammerhead]

That's a great Idea.. rives when you find a accurate table blazeoneup could put up a sticky for that info..