Week 7 flowering and plants dying. Photos.

[StickyFingrs707]

Hey all, first post here. Been lurking through out my entire current first grow. I am on day 47 of flowering and all plants and showing signs of severe stress from something I can't quite put my finger on. My guess is fungus gnats damage but I have rarely seen fliers and even my two healthiest plants are now following this route and they are rarely over watered.
Details:
FFOF soil with extra perlite small chunks
5 gallon buckets with ample drainage
Multiple different strains all of which have this leaf curling and dying
1000w HPS
Temps about 78-80 day n 67-70 night
Earth juice lineup with RO water.
All organic

Never any problems till one spindly looking plant came down with this about 2 weeks ago. Now progressing to even the healthiest thickest plants.

Anyone ever seen this?

 

[WeetisPotPie]

Fromthe first 2 pics it looks you may have a bug infestation. Maybe thrips or something else. Hard to tell from those pictures.

 

[Crusader Rabbit]

Possibly fusarium. So many leaves show the wilting and dessication. But it hasn't taken out any top buds yet? Picture #3 looks bad.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=300328

 

[StickyFingrs707]

Possibly fusarium. So many leaves show the wilting and dessication. But it hasn't taken out any top buds yet? Picture #3 looks bad.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=300328

Thanks for the link. I figured as much... Hasn't taken out top buds yet since the jilly bean is about 5 days from harvest and it's just showing signs. I think k I'll be fine. The train wreck is the one that looks real bad. Then I have another identical one right next to it that only just started showing symptoms.
Is it strange that the bugs didnt infest all of them at the same time?

 

[WeetisPotPie]

Not at all, they will feed on weak plants first, I've done indoor soil grows, especially in the winter out here, where one plant a small weak one was infested, checked others thought they were okay and killed the infested plant, and then the whole room broke out. You might want to just make bubble hash out of the harvest just to be safe. I wouldn't treat anything that close to being done with chemicals. I haven't done soil in years so someone else maybe able to tell you more. But you can search the threads on here and find all the info you need. Good luck.

 

[Crusader Rabbit]

... Hasn't taken out top buds yet since the jilly bean is about 5 days from harvest and it's just showing signs. I think k I'll be fine. The train wreck is the one that looks real bad. Then I have another identical one right next to it that only just started showing symptoms.
Is it strange that the bugs didnt infest all of them at the same time?

So many plants show the symptoms. It can go real bad fast. In my infected grows it would reach near the tops of a few plants, while most others would show some distress in lower leaves. Then plants that seemed "OK" would lose entire top sections to wilt and be a total loss at the end of a lights on period.

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]FFOF soil with extra perlite small chunks
5 gallon buckets with ample drainage [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Never any problems till one spindly looking plant came down with this about 2 weeks ago. Now progressing to even the healthiest thickest plants.
[/FONT]

Fusarium is a root infection, and adapted to spread through contaminated soil. Did plants have an opportunity to soak up waste water from other plants? Were the plants obtained as clones? Have you planted your tomatoes yet?

 

[StickyFingrs707]

Not at all, they will feed on weak plants first, I've done indoor soil grows, especially in the winter out here, where one plant a small weak one was infested, checked others thought they were okay and killed the infested plant, and then the whole room broke out. You might want to just make bubble hash out of the harvest just to be safe. I wouldn't treat anything that close to being done with chemicals. I haven't done soil in years so someone else maybe able to tell you more. But you can search the threads on here and find all the info you need. Good luck.

Why do you recommend scrapping the harvest? You think the ones that are just showing the first signs of this, which are 1 and a half weeks from harvest, wont make it? Only time will tell... Jc.

 

[Ziggaro]

I don't see any evidence of thrips or fusarium. If those were mine I'd assume they're getting fried or locked up. I did ffof with ej nutes a long time ago and had all kinds of problems with lockout and burnt plants..never again.

 

[WeetisPotPie]

Why do you recommend scrapping the harvest? You think the ones that are just showing the first signs of this, which are 1 and a half weeks from harvest, wont make it? Only time will tell... Jc.

If the infestation or infection is bad and has spread throughout the plant, including the flowers then you have to ask is it something you are willing to put into your lungs? Sometimes you can cut out the bad spots, but I don't believe that makes it "clean". Back in my earlier days I would've smoked it and sold it without a thought, now days we are more informed. Not judging or saying don't just letting you know it may not be be the best thing to smoke or give to others. If it is nute lock like Ziggaro said above at then you can save it. Have you identified the issue yet?

 

[chefbudz]

have you looked at soil and leaves under microscope or jewelers loop to check for critters?

i would stop watering and harvest few days early before their to badly effected. i would still smoke them, but i just smoked a big bowl of spider mites lol...

 

[StickyFingrs707]

If the infestation or infection is bad and has spread throughout the plant, including the flowers then you have to ask is it something you are willing to put into your lungs? Sometimes you can cut out the bad spots, but I don't believe that makes it "clean". Back in my earlier days I would've smoked it and sold it without a thought, now days we are more informed. Not judging or saying don't just letting you know it may not be be the best thing to smoke or give to others. Have you identified the issue yet?

Yeah I feel that. This was only for personal too, which is unfortunate. And I believe I s bugs of some sort but I've only seen a few fungus gnats flying. I assume it has to do with over watering, since they have been on a tested nutrient schedule and have been healthy for 3plus months.
I'm not planning on smoking the highly affected plants but there are 2 that are just starting to get affected near bud sites. It is almost entirely on fans I'm trimming off. If it's not visible on the close trim.... Then it should be okay right? The leaves are just dying from lack of something, not from a foreign substance deposit in the leaves, correct?

 

[HUGE]

Burn/lockup

 

[StickyFingrs707]

Burn/lockup

Even with tips and edges turning completely necrotic and crispy while the centers and veins remain green?

 

[Crusader Rabbit]

Burn/lockup

Even with tips and edges turning completely necrotic and crispy while the centers and veins remain green?

Actually, this description sounds more like burn/lockup than fusarium. Fusarium will kill entire leaves.



Fusarium wilt is a combination of wilting from plugging of the plumbing by fungus, and the release of toxins from the same. In my plants there was misshapen leaves from wilting and wilted petioles, lot's of drooping. Is this only affecting the ends and outer portions of leaves? Are they wilting or crisping? Is this only affecting older leaves?

You can't remember any change up in nutrient mixing or pH adjustment? Could you have spaced and mixed a double dose?

 

[Vanilla Phoenix]

I think it's burn/lock up too. Almost positive.

We're you still giving them full strength nutes?

 

[Heavy Chevy]

Yeah I'd have to agree with burn/lockup. Have you checked the pH of your runoff water?

 

[StickyFingrs707]

Well guys looks like you were right when you said it was burn and lockup. Took them outside today for first time and looked at them in daylight. Deep dark green leaves on the jilly bean with burned crispy brown edges. Assuming it's nitrogen toxicity from a dose I gave them about 2 weeks ago. In retrospect they absolutely did not need that.... It also didn't help that I wrote the problem off as bug infestation initially; neglecting the true cause of the issue.
I gave them a good flush today while they were out. They are in 5 gallon buckets with ample drainage. Soil compacted a little to tight this grow but I hit them with about 3 gallons of R/O water n Cal mag.
I feel like Flushing organic nutrients(really just microbes and whatnot) isn't exactly going to get rid of them though.
Any opinions? Thanks for the help yall.

 

[stasis]

Check OFF Broad/Cyclamen mites.....

1- pistils (hairs) burned, curled, and shriveled up.
2- slow or no growth
3- no crystal development.
EDIT ADD:
4- Twisting ends of the leaf fingers
5- tip burn on the leaves, more than the typical 1/8".
6- Cupping or "Taco-ing" of leaf fingers.

Take a 60x loupe or stronger and look on the back of the leaf, on the spines of the fingers of the leaf - and where the leaf fingers meet. If it is reddish in that spot, you prob have BM's. It is easier to see the eggs than the bugs themselves.

 

[Heavy Chevy]

If the problem is indeed lockout our pH related with organic soil there really isn't much you can do at this point. Chemical fertilizers can be flushed. As for organic not so much, they are slow release and even with flushing you might not see a noticeable change for 1-2 weeks at the most. Given that your plants are already stressed and then flushing them and bogging down the root system with water may even end up doing more harm than good. All you can really do is ride it out at this point, and chalk it up as a lesson learned. I've had issues with this myself when I first started. It's a pretty common mistake many growers make. Thinking it's some sort of deficiency so they hit their plants with nutes to only throw them further out of whack. Most MJ problems can be addressed or corrected starting with proper pH first and foremost. Always check the pH going in and the runoff pH coming out. It'll give you a really good gauge is to where to start diagnosing your problem.

 

[StickyFingrs707]

Word.
Fortunately I had vegged the 7 week strains an extra month, gave them a bit of an upper hand over the others, and it's chop time today. The flowers turned out nice. The 9 and 10 week strains I'll have to toss, they got hit hard. Live and learn aye. Cheers!