Was Karl Marx a racist?

[mean mr.mustard]

Wait, what?

 

[armedoldhippy]

it's "Karl," dimwit. thereby proving you know fuck little other than you don't like his philosophy for reasons which you don't understand and you can't explain. if you are going to express an opinion, it is best to research & learn some facts about that which you want to complain.

 

[buzzmobile]

Carl sez:

 

[entropical]

it's "Karl," dimwit. thereby proving you know fuck little other than you don't like his philosophy for reasons which you don't understand and you can't explain. if you are going to express an opinion, it is best to research & learn some facts about that which you want to complain.

His name was not Carl or Karl, it was Chaim Hirschel Mordechai

 

[Cannavore]

His economic analysis was so correct that it predicted how capitalism will consume itself and create it's own dissidents and opposition. That's all that matters.

Karl was right.

 

['Boogieman']

“The Jewish nigger Lassalle who, I’m glad to say, is leaving at the end of this week, has happily lost another 5,000 talers in an ill-judged speculation. The chap would sooner throw money down the drain than lend it to a ‘friend,’ even though his interest and capital were guaranteed. … It is now quite plain to me—as the shape of his head and the way his hair grows also testify—that he is descended from the negroes who accompanied Moses’ flight from Egypt (unless his mother or paternal grandmother interbred with a nigger). Now, this blend of Jewishness and Germanness, on the one hand, and basic negroid stock, on the other, must inevitably give rise to a peculiar product. The fellow’s importunity is also nigger-like.” Karl Marx, 1853

Sounds like Karl Marx and Hitler had a few things in common.

 

[Cannavore]

good thing karl marx wrote books about and is known for economics and capitalism and not race.

and now black americans are some of the most anti capitalist group of americans in the country. there are marxist parties in the continent of africa.

sweet.

 

[entropical]

His economic analysis was so correct that it predicted how capitalism will consume itself and create it's own dissidents and opposition. That's all that matters.

Karl was right.

Plotted is a better term. It is not like Chaim, or Karl as you like to call him, was a prophet or anything. He merely planned for his cousins and their friends in usury/banking to finance a red revolution against the Monarchy of Russia and establish a state with their own central bank, like their US counterpart. The dissidents and opposition they founded in masonry. All communist idols belonged to this bourgeoisie fraternity.

Nothing but a bunch of devil worshippers. Your ”Karl” was a racist.

 

[Cannavore]

Class traitors who favor the mass of humanity are cool in my book. The USSR was not marxist as we understand marxism today. It'd be like saying the capitalism of 1790 is the capitalism of 2022.

Marx was racist, as pretty much every famous figure was from that time period, since topics like eugenics and phrenology were taken as valid science, no shit lol. Most leftist "idols" are no different lol. That doesn't mean they didn't lay important groundwork for modern leftism today. His economic analysis benefitted the "negro" just as much as the white man as modern marxist interpretation in the US focuses around the democratization of capitalism and has nothing to do with state/govt ownership.

 

[GOT_BUD?]

After doing some reading it appears that Carl Marx is most definitely a racist, especially by the standards put forth by the left. Let's take a look at some of the things this commie said.

“The Jewish nigger Lassalle who, I’m glad to say, is leaving at the end of this week, has happily lost another 5,000 talers in an ill-judged speculation. The chap would sooner throw money down the drain than lend it to a ‘friend,’ even though his interest and capital were guaranteed. … It is now quite plain to me—as the shape of his head and the way his hair grows also testify—that he is descended from the negroes who accompanied Moses’ flight from Egypt (unless his mother or paternal grandmother interbred with a nigger). Now, this blend of Jewishness and Germanness, on the one hand, and basic negroid stock, on the other, must inevitably give rise to a peculiar product. The fellow’s importunity is also nigger-like.” Karl Marx, “The Russian Menace to Europe,” 1853

Tremaux “proved that the common Negro type is the degenerate form of a much higher one … a very significant advance over Darwin.” Karl Marx, letter to Friedrich Engels, August 7, 1866

“Without slavery, North America, the most progressive of countries, would be transformed into a patriarchal country. Wipe out North America from the map of the world and you will have anarchy— the complete decay of modern commerce and civilization. Abolish slavery and you will have wiped America off the map of nations.” Karl Marx, “The Poverty of Philosophy,” 1847

So if George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Ulysses S. Grant, and Theodore Roosevelt must fall, why not the fathers of communism, Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels?

This is what happens when you teach mythology and not history.

We've so put the Founding Fathers on such high pedestals the mere inkling of a thought they could actually be not such great people drive people into an absolute tizzy.

 

[armedoldhippy]

good thing karl marx wrote books about and is known for economics and capitalism and not race.

and now black americans are some of the most anti capitalist group of americans in the country. there are marxist parties in the continent of africa.

sweet.

when you have no choice but to participate in a game designed to keep you on the sidelines, enthusiasm for playing tends to wane...

 

[Montuno]

After doing some reading it appears that Carl Marx is most definitely a racist, especially by the standards put forth by the left. Let's take a look at some of the things this commie said.

“The Jewish nigger Lassalle who, I’m glad to say, is leaving at the end of this week, has happily lost another 5,000 talers in an ill-judged speculation. The chap would sooner throw money down the drain than lend it to a ‘friend,’ even though his interest and capital were guaranteed. … It is now quite plain to me—as the shape of his head and the way his hair grows also testify—that he is descended from the negroes who accompanied Moses’ flight from Egypt (unless his mother or paternal grandmother interbred with a nigger). Now, this blend of Jewishness and Germanness, on the one hand, and basic negroid stock, on the other, must inevitably give rise to a peculiar product. The fellow’s importunity is also nigger-like.” Karl Marx, “The Russian Menace to Europe,” 1853

Tremaux “proved that the common Negro type is the degenerate form of a much higher one … a very significant advance over Darwin.” Karl Marx, letter to Friedrich Engels, August 7, 1866

“Without slavery, North America, the most progressive of countries, would be transformed into a patriarchal country. Wipe out North America from the map of the world and you will have anarchy— the complete decay of modern commerce and civilization. Abolish slavery and you will have wiped America off the map of nations.” Karl Marx, “The Poverty of Philosophy,” 1847

So if George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Ulysses S. Grant, and Theodore Roosevelt must fall, why not the fathers of communism, Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels?

Yes, I believe that Marx and (more) Engels shared the dominant Eurocentric racism of the time. It is a well-known cliché, discussed and criticized by later Marxism.

That did not take away, that in spite of all the racist comments and jokes behind his back, Marx accepted willingly in his house and gatherings a half Spanish born in Spanish Cuba, whose both maternal grandparents, a Jamaican Amerindian and a miserable black Haitian day laborer, had emigrated to Spanish Cuba in search of a better future.
(White, black and Amerindian at the same time; what we say "Having the 3 Races", here).
And who would end up being Marx's son-in-law, btw.

Pd: Picture "The 3 Races, or Equality before the Law" (Francisco Laso) :

 

[Montuno]

An easier game to play would be to ask who WAS NOT racist in the 19th century.

And let's not even get into homophobia: I don't think much thought was given at that time to the rights of non-heterosexuals....

 

['Boogieman']

Yes, I believe that Marx and (more) Engels shared the dominant Eurocentric racism of the time. It is a well-known cliché, discussed and criticized by later Marxism.
That did not take away, that in spite of all the racist comments and jokes behind his back, Marx accepted willingly in his house and gatherings a half Spanish born in Cuba, whose maternal grandparents, a Jamaican Amerindian and a miserable black Haitian day laborer, had emigrated to Spanish Cuba in search of a better future.
In Spanish "racial jargon", a "cuarterón" (son of a white and a mulatto).
And who would end up being Marx's son-in-law, btw.

Racism doesn't always mean not liking all ethnic groups. I know white people who really dislike black people, but consider mexicans hard working family people, and think Asians are smarter then everyone. Either way I don't give a fuck about Marxism, it's not even close to something I would be interested in learning about. This thread was intended to point out hypocrisy, not a debate about Marxism itself.

 

[Montuno]

Racism doesn't always mean not liking all ethnic groups. I know white people who really dislike black people, but consider mexicans hard working family people, and think Asians are smarter then everyone. Either way I don't give a fuck about Marxism, it's not even close to something I would be interested in learning about. This thread was intended to point out hypocrisy, not a debate about Marxism itself.

Indeed, Marx was a hypocrite racist:

He had racist language and opinions about blacks, Amerindians, Hispanics (Basques included), Eastern Slavs...and ended up marrying his daughter to a "spawn" of white French, and half black & half Amerindian Spanish (which in local slang would be "Spanish Zamba, aka Loba, aka Garifuna").

By the way:
Dear fellow guest, allow me the audacity to inform you that, even though we are of different culture or political ideology (joking: although I don't remember if it was you who told me in public that you were the son of a Mexican Amerindian and that we were "half cousins"; forgive me if I am mistaken), I belong to your same species, and therefore, "my people" share the same miseries and greatness as "your people".
Of course, that also happens here, and everywhere. Do you think "we" are of a different "moral color/race" than "yours"? Well, no; gray is also the dominant color here, and everywhere: pure "black" and "white" are not "moral colors" proper to Humanity...
Here too (read "here" as Hispañistan or Leflistan or Marxistland or...never mind) there are even those who think that blacks are inferior... with the exception of their wife/husband and children.
Or the "I am not a racist, but... but, here, before, there was me"...


Likewise, I remember in the suburb of Tarragona where I spent my childhood and the last decade of the fascist dictatorship, how, within the tiny black minority at that time, the mulatto sons of Spanish and USA Afro-American military used to be seen above the "local" blacks (of Equatoguinean origin, there and then).
Or as the dictatorship told us at school (I went to "La Salle") that any kind of discrimination against blacks (of Equatoguinean origin in that case) was a sin, while in the current Equatorial Guinea the natives were second class citizens: they had to arrive in the "metropolis" so that the same State that discriminated against them in their "native provinces", would proclaim and defend their equality... Don't tell me that it was not also hypocritical, even twisted...

Or in Marxist Cuba, the concepts of "taking a racial step forward: empathizing with white Spanish blood" and "taking it backward: with black blood" still exist.

It is clear that there may be differences in the degree of intensity of our "miseries and greatness", but only due to historical, socio-economic, cultural factors...

 

[GOT_BUD?]

Racism doesn't always mean not liking all ethnic groups. I know white people who really dislike black people, but consider mexicans hard working family people, and think Asians are smarter then everyone. Either way I don't give a fuck about Marxism, it's not even close to something I would be interested in learning about. This thread was intended to point out hypocrisy, not a debate about Marxism itself.

Maybe you should. Then you'd be able to determine for yourself if all those people who you trust who call something "communist" or "Marxist" or "socialist" are lying to you or not.

Just a thought.

 

[h.h.]

He should study Marxism so he can get his linguistics right? Only marxists know the truth? I doubt anybody here is that deep into it. It just sounds good to those who feel oppressed for one silly reason or another. Mom made them get a job.

 

[Montuno]

Y ni entremos en homofobia: no creo que en ese momento se pensara mucho en los derechos de los no heterosexuales....

Another example of hypocrisy and "stale thinking" in the left of the past can be found in the fight against the fascist dictatorship in Spain, led by the Communist Party of Spain, which did not allow its self-declared homosexual members to engage in "armed struggle" or risky actions, because they believed that homosexuals would not withstand the torture of interrogation as well as heterosexuals, if captured.

(In Cuba, it was MUCH WORSE).

Of course, in the end, in Spain it was the left that legislated in favor of all kinds of equality, of course.

 

[GOT_BUD?]

He should study Marxism so he can get his linguistics right? Only marxists know the truth? I doubt anybody here is that deep into it. It just sounds good to those who feel oppressed for one silly reason or another. Mom made them get a job.

I'm not quite sure how you got that out of what I said.

Knowing about a subject so you can't be lied to about said subject seems like a pretty good way to separate bullshit from fact.

But if you prefer to rely on feels instead of knowledge, knock yourself out.

 

[comfy markoth]