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Warehouse Design Advice

M

Minor_Obcession

Member
The Skinny: Been growing medically for 7 years. I've run most nutrient lines, most systems and methods, and have managed 21 KW flowering at a single location, but still feel like I have a lot to learn. I'm always researching new technology and actively seek to improve the garden and my skills. Need for perfection. Please chime in if you have experience and can contribute a constructive dialogue.

New scene, plenty of space for expansion. Each 14'x35' room will have the following:

-(24) Plants (1 plant per light with a 3'x3' footprint) in a soilless medium fed DTW via drip with Mills Nutrients
-(24) Gavita Pro 6/750e DE FLEX lights
-(1) Gavita EL-1 lighting controller
-(1) Quest 205 Dual dehumidifier (mounted outside the room)
-(2) 36,000 BTU Mr. Slim Mitsubishi Mini-Split air conditioner
-(1) Titan Controls 10 burner LP CO2 Generator
-(1) Can 125 carbon filter with attached 10" MAX Fan (scrubbing)
-(4) 16" wall mount oscillating fans
-(1) Sulfur burner

Now the confusing part as I do not have experience with the double-ended lamps, the Dual 205 or the Mitsubishis. On a side note, I was a guinea pig for the Quest 105 when they first came out. I ordered two units and both of them didn't work as they should have. Long story.

Does the AC, Dehu, and Carbon seem appropriately sized? The rooms have R30 Insulation and are completely sealed. Compressor to be mounted in an area that will never experience above 95 degrees.

Will these new lighting systems, dehumidifier, and AC significantly corrode if I run sulfur? I stopped running sulfur years ago, but things haven't been the same since.

High Gloss Paint over plywood or a different type of waterproof reflective material?

1200 or 1500 ppm max CO2 concentrations?

78, 80, 82, or 84 degrees Fahrenheit for flower? I've tried them all with great results, but have never ran a proper experiment.

Any ideas for nutrient tanks? These 150 gallon rubbermaid troughs are getting pretty lame. Thinking 250 gallon IBC totes, but they don't seem very easy to wash and drain completely. The Chemtainers seem handy, but the price... ouch!

How do I stop the flow on the drip lines when the height of the water in the tank is above the drip stake in my container? Can this be accomplished with a backflow valve? I've been using sump pumps and PVC. Is this type of pipe material safe for synthetic nutrients?

Drip system design help needed. I've made it work over the years, but I have never had completely even flow.

Construction begins next week. Pictures to follow.

Wasn't so skinny after all......
 
M

Minor_Obcession

Member
Anyone?

Looking into the AC/DE reflectors or the DE BOSS. Much better uniformity than the Gavita or the EP. The question is, are the lamp cords RF shielded?
 
O

onavelzy

Well-known member
Veteran
Minor_Obcession said:
The Skinny: Been growing medically for 7 years. I've run most nutrient lines, most systems and methods, and have managed 21 KW flowering at a single location, but still feel like I have a lot to learn. I'm always researching new technology and actively seek to improve the garden and my skills. Need for perfection. Please chime in if you have experience and can contribute a constructive dialogue.

New scene, plenty of space for expansion. Each 14'x35' room will have the following:

-(24) Plants (1 plant per light with a 3'x3' footprint) in a soilless medium fed DTW via drip with Mills Nutrients
-(24) Gavita Pro 6/750e DE FLEX lights
-(1) Gavita EL-1 lighting controller
-(1) Quest 205 Dual dehumidifier (mounted outside the room)
-(2) 36,000 BTU Mr. Slim Mitsubishi Mini-Split air conditioner
-(1) Titan Controls 10 burner LP CO2 Generator
-(1) Can 125 carbon filter with attached 10" MAX Fan (scrubbing)
-(4) 16" wall mount oscillating fans
-(1) Sulfur burner

Now the confusing part as I do not have experience with the double-ended lamps, the Dual 205 or the Mitsubishis. On a side note, I was a guinea pig for the Quest 105 when they first came out. I ordered two units and both of them didn't work as they should have. Long story.

Does the AC, Dehu, and Carbon seem appropriately sized? The rooms have R30 Insulation and are completely sealed. Compressor to be mounted in an area that will never experience above 95 degrees.

Will these new lighting systems, dehumidifier, and AC significantly corrode if I run sulfur? I stopped running sulfur years ago, but things haven't been the same since.

High Gloss Paint over plywood or a different type of waterproof reflective material?

1200 or 1500 ppm max CO2 concentrations?

78, 80, 82, or 84 degrees Fahrenheit for flower? I've tried them all with great results, but have never ran a proper experiment.

Any ideas for nutrient tanks? These 150 gallon rubbermaid troughs are getting pretty lame. Thinking 250 gallon IBC totes, but they don't seem very easy to wash and drain completely. The Chemtainers seem handy, but the price... ouch!

How do I stop the flow on the drip lines when the height of the water in the tank is above the drip stake in my container? Can this be accomplished with a backflow valve? I've been using sump pumps and PVC. Is this type of pipe material safe for synthetic nutrients?

Drip system design help needed. I've made it work over the years, but I have never had completely even flow.

Construction begins next week. Pictures to follow.

Wasn't so skinny after all......
Click to expand...

I realize I'm responding to an older thread but I though this might be of interest or use to you. i just read thru JACKMAYOFFER's 150+ page thread on his DTW canna beds grow. He grows for a large LA collective. He answers a lot of what you've asked about. there's tons and tons of info in there on creative and intelligent ways to maximize plant and space potential in a large warehouse grow: what drip system and why, how he feeds and why, cooling for closed rooms, etc. he does a lot of large side by side camparos looking at nute regimens, grow mediums, lights, etc. the best way to read it is to filter out all comments but his. hope its useful to you
 
Last edited:
G

ganjourno

Member
Your AC is way underpowered. Count on 4500btu per lamp. So 24 bulbs means ~120kbtu to be on the safe side (10 tons). I wouldn't touch mini splits for this setup, they do not move enough air and have a tendency to fail are are a pain in the ass to fuck with. Get Two 5-ton rooftop packaged units (like this: https://www.acwholesalers.com/Goodm...ER-Horizontal-Heat-Pump-Package-Unit/14857.ac) and mount them into the ceiling of your sub-room. They will heat up the air outside the room in the larger warehouse space. Ventilate that out separately with some exhaust fans, consider getting a belt-driven restaurant style extraction fan. There shouldn't be any bleed-through with a unit like this. Rig up some simple metal ducting to distribute the return air evenly around the room from the two units.

Also, no way you can use liquid nutes for an op this big. Way too expensive and you will run into supply issues eventually. Use Jacks or gro-more dry nutes (plenty of info on the forum), stock up in advance for big discounts. 5000 gallons worth of full strength feed costs about $100, including shipping, when using these great dry nutes. Compare that to around $400 if using liquid nutes.
 
S

szachtb2

Member
U need a siphon break in your res for the water issue. and the min spits are not big enough get 2 3 ton units per room. Who ever claims nutes are too expensive and go powders is in the wrong business. Any decent hydo shop can get a constant supply of nutes. Recirc nutes if worried about the price. Super effective and plant response is greater due to salt build ups being removed. I can see up to 25 percent greater yield with recirc over dtw. Y spend more money to dose out nutes automatically....Pointless imo. Roof top packages are limited. Get handler unit ac's if anything. You will spend more for an ac guy to fuck with going up and down ladders all day. Ac guys bitch about everything.
 
M

Minor_Obcession

Member
Thanks for the thoughts everyone. Good advice and a new spin on efficiency. I ended up going Gavitas, propane generator, and Quest dehums. DTW on corrugated roofing panels, Mills Nutrients, and yes a reservoir. I only fired up one room, so the next will be the lessons learned. Multiple Daikin mini splits was the ticket. Got wicked good pricing and hitting 18 SEER. things are very efficient minus the 20% runoff.

I am definitely interested in the dosers. I'm just wondering about pH control with that type of system. Is it doable Without doing a reservoir?

I would love to get off liquid nute. Pumping through 20L way too often. I checked out the dry nute line that was recomended, but they carry a shit ton of formulations. There is something to be said about nuts designed for our girls.

One issue- condensate on all hose/pipe penetrations outside causing puddles on the inside of my room and against wall in between pond liner. Not good! Flippin cold put this year.
 
M

Minor_Obcession

Member
onavelzy said:
a question for you Minor, why propane for CO2 production (vs natural gas)?
Click to expand...

I don't have access to tanked natural gas. Maybe I do and I just don't know it. I installed a small filtered intake and exhaust to clear the room every night so I won't have to worry about incomplete combustion and ethelyne. The CO2 ppm was climbing up near 3000 every night until I installed the exhaust.
 
G

ganjourno

Member
Minor_Obcession said:
I am definitely interested in the dosers. I'm just wondering about pH control with that type of system. Is it doable Without doing a reservoir?

I would love to get off liquid nute. Pumping through 20L way too often. I checked out the dry nute line that was recomended, but they carry a shit ton of formulations. There is something to be said about nuts designed for our girls.
Click to expand...

My dosers already put out 5.9-6.1ph without any extra control at around 1000ppm. This may be slightly higher or lower depending on your water supply. I have set up systems for friends and on their water it was bang on 5.8. If you really want to dial it in add a dedicated doser for ph down. You just add a bleed-off valve before your drippers and fill up a 5gal bucket and test your ppm and ph. Make your adjustments and keep testing until its perfect.

Sorry but anyone using liquid nutes is flushing money down the drain. The powders are the exact same shit minus the water and the marketing. Super simple, you need two things:
1. Grow-more hydroponic tomato: http://www.plantsthatproduce.com/gm-5-11-26-25lb.html
$36 for 25lbs plus a few bucks for ground shipping. It's perfect for Mary Jane.
2. Greenhouse grade calcium nitrate. You can find this at any fertilizer supply place locally for less than $40 for a 50lb bag, or also order online: http://www.hydrowholesale.com/south...ticides,-inc-calcium-nitrate-15500-50-lb-5667

You take 6000grams of the grow more fert (use a scale), add it to a 5gal bucket, fill nearly to top with water, and go at it with a paint mixer drill attachment until dissolved. You then take 4000 grams of the calcium nitrate, put it in a second 5gal bucket, and mix that up till dissolved. You have to keep them in separate buckets since if mixed in concentrated form they will react and deactivate (it will clump into powder and fall out of solution). Congratulations, you just made your own two part, A&B liquid fetilizer! This is the same shit that everyone else sells in a bottle, except you only paid $25 for 10 gallons of juice.

You need three adjustable dosers (the ones that adjust between 1:100 and 1:500):
- 1 for the calcium nitrate solution
- 1 for the grow more hydro tomato solution
- 1 for phdown (again, get the dry shit and mix it yourself). I also add some H202 to the phdown solution so it keep some sterilzing effect going.

Set the calcium and grow more dosers to the same ratio. In the ratios I described above, a 1:250 ratio will get you close to 1000ppm and it should come out close to 6.0ph. Fiddle with the phdown doser to get it where you want it.

I get killer results with this and dude with the dosers you don't have to scrub rezzies, worry about pathgens, stress about ph rise, all that BS. My plants are beasts. I'll snap a pic for you tomorrow.
 
Picarus

Picarus

Member
Minor,
Glad this got bumped up. I am in a similar situation as you and looking forward to the coming journey. I can learn a lot from you so keep this thread going. Why didn't you go with the 1000 gavitas? WHat is your cieling ht? and what are the temps a few hours in to day time for the girls?
 
G

ganjourno

Member
The ladies eating up the grow-more and calcium nitrate nutes:
5eMIYpu.jpg

The feed system:
thvnqoD.jpg

More detail showing the inline water filter and booster pump:
gUHDpDh.jpg


All I need to do is replace the nutes when empty.
 
Q

queequeg152

Active member
Veteran
nice setup. what pump are you running there?

ive got a shurflo modulating pump on my setup.... and a delavan demand pump as backup... because i sure as hell cant afford to replace the shurflo with the same if it breaks.
 
Q

queequeg152

Active member
Veteran
i mean... is it a demand type? or modulated?

if so are you running a regulator?

regarding the 110 pumps
im not sure if you can get the modulated pumps in 110ac, what with them being PWM modulated.
 
Q

queequeg152

Active member
Veteran
ganjourno said:
Ahh yes it's just a demand pump - when the solenoid kicks on the pump fires up automatically.
Click to expand...
interesting.

no accumulators? pump dosent cycle at all?

if not you must run alot of emitters... or very high flow emitters?

my biggest spray stakes are like 6gph lol.
 
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