The how to and why fors of CO2 supplementation for growers

[sparkjumper]

God I love co2 enrichment I really do.I have 20 NL #9 that are just 3 weeks in and the flowers look like 5 week flowers.Then of course near the end when you have to do something to support them of the branches will be laying and falling all over the place.Its one of the first things I noticed when I finally started using controlled co2.Very early flower development and plants that would fall over from the weight of the resins while the non-enriched would have a tad of a lean,thats about it.Dont give up on co2 but if you're not willing or just cant get a controller I wouldnt bother until I could

 

[MrWeekend]

hey lazyman, if you got the time check out my thread. Just setting up a new 6k room with co2(first time), and im hitting 78deg, & 41%hum on a 3hr test with no plants.....did the test with 36 buckets half full of water also. Do you think ill be able to make it without ac & a dehuey?


http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=169301&page=5

 

[Lazyman]

Nope, after 12 hours of runtime with no ventilation, your room will be too hot. Remember, your room should not exhaust or leak one bit of air when the lights are on. I've never seen a sealed grow that could work without AC or a dehuey, they are standard equipment for a reason. When the plants are in there humidity will spike after lights out, and without a dehuey nothing can fix it. I'd hold off on the CO2 until you have the room well-dialed, it will just frustrate you and cost you money up front with no payoff on the first grow. I'd wait til at least round 3 before even trying it.

With 6 lights you'd need around 24K BTU of cooling, which is a 2 ton AC, 240V only. You can go to a 2.5 or 3 ton, but no smaller than a 2 unless you live near the Arctic circle!

 

[AOD2012]

hey lazy just wanted to ask you a ? until recently i was using a straight timer with my regulator going off at regular intervals throughout the day, and my tank lasted a really long time. more than a month. last week i finally got my sentinel chhc-1 back from the manufacturer, and my 20lb bottle ran out in one week exactly. the size of the actual grow space is 4x5, while the entire room is 4x 8.5. i have 20 plants three weeks into flowering. i was just wondering if this was regular usage, or do i have a major air leak? thanks for any input, it is much appreciated.

aod

 

[Lazyman]

Odds are that your original setup wasn't dispensing anywhere near 1500 ppm of CO2, or yes, you have a big leak and couldn't tell without the monitor. I'd go around the whole room with an incense stick or a fat joint and blow it at every seam and seal, window and door. You'll find it soon enough!

 

[AOD2012]

ok thanks lazy. im guessing i should do this with all the ventilation running so that the smoke will get sucked out of wherever there may be a leak right? i know prolly a stupid question but just want to make sure im doing it right. thanks a lot brotha.

 

[Lazyman]

Yep that would be a good idea, your fans may be creating some pressure you didn't know about, or negative pressure drawing smoke in instead. Keep me posted!

 

[real ting]

Great thread man!

I have a quick question for ya, what do you think is the lowest cost but still decent quality one could get away with on a co2 controller and tank setup for a small (10x15) room, with 2 small grow cabs inside of it? Only 1200 watts running at any one time.

There would be maybe 50 sq ft of floor space that inside of the grow cabs. Was thinking of sealing the room they are located in, putting the ac and co2 outside of the cabs, then having a carbon filter and fan pulling pulling through the cabs and exhausting right back into the room. The filter and fan are basically acting as a scrubber, but located at the top of the cab so co2 and a/c air is pulled from the passive intakes at the bottom of the cabs then hot air is blown out the top back into the main room.

One problem is lights would be on a flip, so the temps would have to be at one temp all the time for both. Would this be enough of an issue to not go with co2? Or is it ok to run 85 degree night temps? Maybe do 80 degrees all the time as a compromise?

Would this work? What all equipment would I need for the co2 setup?

co2 tank, regulator (what kind?) and controller? Am I missing anything?

Thanks for the help dude, it's much appreciated.

 

[louie]

Awesome thread! I have a question about AC. What size AC unit would one need to cool about 3500 watts? And what is the best type of AC to get? You suggested a mini-split AC, is this what I should go with? Is there any specific way to set up the AC so that it is not sucking Co2 outside the room when it is exhausting air? Thanks for the help.

 

[Lazyman]

Great thread man!

I have a quick question for ya, what do you think is the lowest cost but still decent quality one could get away with on a co2 controller and tank setup for a small (10x15) room, with 2 small grow cabs inside of it? Only 1200 watts running at any one time.

Cost is usually pretty fixed, and about the same whether tanked or gas-fired CO2 generator:

Controller: Min $350
Full 20# CO2 tank $100
Regulator/solenoid $150

There would be maybe 50 sq ft of floor space that inside of the grow cabs. Was thinking of sealing the room they are located in, putting the ac and co2 outside of the cabs, then having a carbon filter and fan pulling pulling through the cabs and exhausting right back into the room. The filter and fan are basically acting as a scrubber, but located at the top of the cab so co2 and a/c air is pulled from the passive intakes at the bottom of the cabs then hot air is blown out the top back into the main room.

One problem is lights would be on a flip, so the temps would have to be at one temp all the time for both. Would this be enough of an issue to not go with co2? Or is it ok to run 85 degree night temps? Maybe do 80 degrees all the time as a compromise?

Would this work? What all equipment would I need for the co2 setup?

co2 tank, regulator (what kind?) and controller? Am I missing anything?

Thanks for the help dude, it's much appreciated.

So you want to convert the bedroom into a lung room of sorts, and CO2/cool/dehumidiy that instead of the individual tents. I think it would work, as long as you have a big enough AC to run the daytime lights during a heat wave!

The temps are a concern to be sure. That's a pretty high night temp, but it should be ok. Your purple strains won't purple near as well with a high night temp though.

You'll also be dispersing CO2 24X7, so your tanks will go quite fast. I'd get two 50#'s and get one of the tee hoses to link them together.

Several companies make regulators, I haven't run one in a while so I'd do a search on IC and find the brand everyone recommends, I think Hyrofarms was OK but CAP's was crap!

Good luck!

 

[Lazyman]

Awesome thread! I have a question about AC.

What size AC unit would one need to cool about 3500 watts?

I wouldn't do smaller than a 15K BTU, which is right on the upper edge of 120V AC units.

About And what is the best type of AC to get? You suggested a mini-split AC, is this what I should go with?

If you can afford it then yes, I'd get an AC that will handle the max capacity of the room, in case you decide to upgrade later. A mini split is the most efficient AC, and does not exchange any inside air with the outside world.

Is there any specific way to set up the AC so that it is not sucking Co2 outside the room when it is exhausting air? Thanks for the help.

If using a split AC this isn't an issue, with window AC's and portables it can be an issue. Let me know what you find and decide, but I'd start at Excel Air and go to bghydro.com for prices.

 

[louie]

Thanks for the help my man! I am thinking about buying a 15,000 btu regular window unit. I would like to go mini split, but for financial reasons have to go with the window unit right now. Is there any special way to set it up so that it won't exhaust Co2 out fo the room? I was thinking about building an AC box (like the one that hoosierdady does). I was going to cut a hole in the room wall and have the AC hang out and have the box around the exhaust only to vent out heat via a ducting. What do you think? any suggestions? Thanks man

 

[Strainhunter]

Thanks for the help my man! I am thinking about buying a 15,000 btu regular window unit. I would like to go mini split, but for financial reasons have to go with the window unit right now. Is there any special way to set it up so that it won't exhaust Co2 out fo the room? I was thinking about building an AC box (like the one that hoosierdady does). I was going to cut a hole in the room wall and have the AC hang out and have the box around the exhaust only to vent out heat via a ducting. What do you think? any suggestions? Thanks man

Most 15k BTU units have two settings:

One for cooling fresh air coming in, the other for re-circulating already cooled (room) air.

What you want is the re-circulating setting.

On another note make sure you get an AC which comes back on @ the user set settings. Some models shut off or come back on @ a default temperature once the power comes back on (after it went out for whatever reason).

The one below has all you want to be looking for:

It is the largest AC you can run on 120 Volt and has something called "Eco setting" where the fan runs only when the compressor is on making it quiet while it is not running unlike others which run all the time whether the compressor is on or not.

They cost about $500.00

http://www.mysears.com/Kenmore-15-000-BTU-Multi-Room-Air-Conditioner-reviews?tab=details

 

[Hydrosun]

Well I have and LG mini-split 3x12,000 btu, but I am a stoner and not an HVAC guy. It says to clear the lines with N gas and then set it up. I don't have all these hoses and dials. Please tell me this is something even a stoner can install with out killing the $3,200 unit.

After the AC is in I'll talk to you about plumbing gas lines off the hot water heater for the CO2 burner

 

[Strainhunter]

Well I have and LG mini-split 3x12,000 btu, but I am a stoner and not an HVAC guy....

....

Unfortunately you gotta have a Pro install units such as the mini-split.

They require vacuum pumps and plumbing to be installed.

 

[Lazyman]

Look for models that have a vent you can close from inside to prevent outside air exchange, but some models do leak air regardless. If cutting the hole in the wall you shouldn't need an exhaust box, I'd think it would look suspicious anyway and wouldn't serve much purpose. Folks have AC's hanging out the wall all year, if anyone asks why it's running tell them it's a heat pump AND AC, that accounts for its year-round use.

 

[Hydrosun]

I have as in hanging out in the Holodeck an LG 3x12Kbtu

so buying a different unit is not an option. I guess I get to find a good install guy. This is where karma plays a huge role. I have a great electrician perhaps he has a chill stoner HVAC guy. That will be step one.

Lazyman any chance you are a HVAC guy and want a working vacation

 

[Strainhunter]

.......

Nice man!

Now you need a bookshelf and you're done!

 

[Lazyman]

LOL no I don't have the tools pumps and tanks of refrigerant anymore, been ages since I did it too, but it's not hard at all if you have those things. I'd ask your local hydro store if they know of a good HVAC guy, meet up with him somewhere safe and discuss a bit, see if you get a good vibe or not.

 

[ItsGrowTime]

Several companies make regulators, I haven't run one in a while so I'd do a search on IC and find the brand everyone recommends, I think Hyrofarms was OK but CAP's was crap!

Good luck!

Hydrofarm regulator is a no-no for CO2 monitors. Says so right on the box. CAP's works great on a monitor for me however. Go with CAP, Green Air, or Sentinel for a regulator.