The Big L.E.D. Driver Discussion -

[Neferhotep]

What is the typical voltage of the strips? You have some in series?
Why would the XLG-100 be better that the ELG-100?

 

[Aristoned]

What is the typical voltage of the strips? You have some in series?
Why would the XLG-100 be better that the ELG-100?

EB Slim Gen 3 - 560mm - 18.4V-19.6V @ 350mA-1050mA respectively, 19.1V @ 700mA being nominal drive current.

I actually posses an ELG-100 as well, it was a failed attempt to control the 4K Vero independently from the 3K Vero’s.

I didn’t inspect the data sheet as closely as I should, the ELG is de-rated @ 120V AC.

Now, the three Vero’s are in series to a XLG-240 driver. I did this knowing I would only achieve ~210W out-put but I did not want to purchase another HLG driver if I can over-drive on the XLG and the XLG costs 1/2 the price in some instances.

There are various types of XLG drivers so you have to be very specific as to which amperage you require as the voltage quickly diminishes as amperage capacity increases for a given wattage. I prefer series or parallel series over parallel for safety, if one of my strings goes down in parallel series the other side just runs a bit warmer until I fix it, no fire hazard.

The driver gives us an island of compatibility which allows us to under-drive or over-drive based on LED count. For instance, if I used only 12 strips on the 240W driver each strip would run @ 20W as the driver would adjust voltage AND current to achieve 240W. Now, if I saddled 15 which is almost the maximum allowable voltage for every component (288V) and it should also be deadly, so that’s nice, each strip would operate @ 16W which is only slightly over-driven.

If I were to take 12 in series and make a parallel series of 12 then each strip would operate @ 10W which is an under-drive and if I added 15 to the other 15 then the 30 would operate in parallel series @ 8W each, under-driven.

Efficiency is good enough for me coming from HPS and the drivers aren’t under-rated on 120V AC which is beneficial to 99% of us.

The Meanwell XLG drivers are truly revolutionary.

Cheers!

 

[Aristoned]

Because ppl like you make this thread a sticky when there isn't anything of value in it
When U know nothing of the Subject matter you wish to discuss
Even don't know the name of the thing the thread is about

How will u edit it when U don't know what is bullshit and what is true?
How will u be sure the final info is correct? U won't

You could have simply asked those who know to contribute and we can make a great thread with good content and value

BUT instead we have the start of a looooooong thread that will be filled with discussion mostly subjective from ppl who are regurgitating misinformation and I don't wish to add value to it for you lot to monotise

The reason I replied was to help that grower out

He got the info already so no point in leaving my posts there


I would suggest U delete this thread and start one with a bit more thoghht, like get the name of the device U wanna talk about right
Figure out what exactly U want to discuss here
Maybe we could start with a chart showing the most common drivers?
Discuss the A vs B vs AB meanwell dimming options
Wiring dimmers
Dimming multiple drivers ect


But this is just going to turn into a cluster fuck of bad info and nuggets of wisdom scattered in that the noob won't be able to tell the dif

Also because led drivers are the most simple and easy to understand part of building an led so really there is nothing BIG to discuss here



Of course there is also the point that my thread should have been sticked years ago and I needed help with formatting, the info I laid down there was years ahead of the curve , things like environmental temp, the spectrum scam ect only now we are getting proper research papers that support that info

And all the while I get verbal spankings for calling out led sellers spouting lies with claims that I'm trolling your sponsors

Yeah I'm hurt, when I got out of jail and saw that koondense was the only one here still trying to make the led section good after all these years it broke my heart

Icmag could have been the place to go for led Info

We have so many growers from all over the world we can help


The led market like this don't help


I only ever had 1 goal when I joined this forum, to help growers get good lights

so that it can be a valuable resource for growers,

I'm more than happy to help

But I do not want to contribute to this thread as it is now so I will respect you and refrain from posting here

Infact almost every sticky in the led section is outdated and not useful/incorrect

Icmag led section looks like the special needs class

And that is the reason no serious led company would ever advertise on icmag

It would be a discredit to Thier reputation

If you would perhaps entertain the idea of a collaboration I would be glad to be apart of removing any and all bullshit from the LED section.

I do not tolerate deceit.

Cheers!

 

[Rocket Soul]

Maybe we could start with a chart showing the most common drivers?
Discuss the A vs B vs AB meanwell dimming options
Wiring dimmers
Dimming multiple drivers ect

A/B/AB - dimming:
A- onboard dimming,generally both voltage and curren. A bit uncomfortable since you have to access the dimmer with a screwdriver on the driver itself and its very hard to fine tune, you dont really know where you leave the current dial. The voltage dimming/regulation is a massive boon: you can dial up your voltage slightly which means many times a 48V driver is enough to reach a 53V board. This gives the driver a little more output. You can also use this to set a maximum current per board in parallel setups, which can then protect your leds if you were to lose one parallel string: turn current up to desired max, then dial back on voltage control until you find the point were it will start dimming the light.
B-dimming: connect a 100 (or even if you can find a 110) kOhm resistive pot to dim + and - leads. Youll either find 2 connectors or 3, if 3 make sure one of youre wire goes in the middle connection. Second connected lead controls which way dims,clockwise or counterclockwise.
Multiple drivers : same thing but your pot should be 100 Kohm/number of drivers you want to control.
AB: has both internal/screwdriver type and leads for external dimmer, but these driver usually dont have voltage regulation.

Resistive dimmer pots break down commonly. You can also do PWM dimming.

 

[Neferhotep]

The voltage dimming [....] You can also use this to set a maximum current per board in parallel setups

I don't think so. Maximum voltage is what it is; you can not limit current with that pot.
With parallel lights and failure of one, more current is available for the remaining lights. So eventually, with rising temps or so, they may accept the available current.

This is why I have 11 100 watt strips in parallel on a 480 watt driver.
If one strip disconnects it's still impossible to blow up the other strips

 

[Rocket Soul]

I don't think so. Maximum voltage is what it is; you can not limit current with that pot.
With parallel lights and failure of one, more current is available for the remaining lights. So eventually, with rising temps or so, they may accept the available current.

This is why I have 11 100 watt strips in parallel on a 480 watt driver.
If one strip disconnects it's still impossible to blow up the other strips

Youre correct that the voltage regulation doesnt control the current directly, but it does control it indirectly in that with limited voltage the strip cannot draw more power (except that little bit thats down to lowering forward voltage due heating up )
My advice is to try it, if you have A-type dimming hlg drovers available; if you dropp one strip the current wont go to the rest as they are throttled by low voltage

 

[Ca++]

Youre correct that the voltage regulation doesnt control the current directly, but it does control it indirectly in that with limited voltage the strip cannot draw more power (except that little bit thats down to lowering forward voltage due heating up )
My advice is to try it, if you have A-type dimming hlg drovers available; if you dropp one strip the current wont go to the rest as they are throttled by low voltage

So you have set the current limit for your lights, in a typical fashion. Then lowered the voltage pot to the point where it just about starts to also function as a limit to available power. And so, you are using both current and voltage methods of regulation. So, should a parallel board pop, then the others don't have the voltage to go any higher

 

[Rocket Soul]

So you have set the current limit for your lights, in a typical fashion. Then lowered the voltage pot to the point where it just about starts to also function as a limit to available power. And so, you are using both current and voltage methods of regulation. So, should a parallel board pop, then the others don't have the voltage to go any higher

Bingo

 

[Neferhotep]

I did three tests:

1. both pots to 100 %
2. I-pot down to 8.21 A
3. V-pot down 8.21 A 746 mA/strip
4. disconnect 2 strips: 7.66 A 851 mA/strip

1. both pots to 100 %: 11.04 A
2. I-pot down: 9.02 A
3. V down: 8.99 A 817 mA/strip
4. disconnect 2 strips: 8.97 A 997 mA/strip

1. both pots to 100 %: 11.03 A
2. V down: 11.09 A 1008 mA/strip
3. disconnect 2 strips: 10.06 A 1118 mA/strip

It's not reliable. You shouldn't tell people that they can set max current with a voltage pot.

 

[Ca++]

I might need a coffee to pick at this one. I have just deleted about 1000 words.

 

[Rocket Soul]

I did three tests:

1. both pots to 100 %
2. I-pot down to 8.21 A
3. V-pot down 8.21 A 746 mA/strip
4. disconnect 2 strips: 7.66 A 851 mA/strip

1. both pots to 100 %: 11.04 A
2. I-pot down: 9.02 A
3. V down: 8.99 A 817 mA/strip
4. disconnect 2 strips: 8.97 A 997 mA/strip

1. both pots to 100 %: 11.03 A
2. V down: 11.09 A 1008 mA/strip
3. disconnect 2 strips: 10.06 A 1118 mA/strip

It's not reliable. You shouldn't tell people that they can set max current with a voltage pot.

I know, its not a 100% precise. But in your 1st and 3rd test you can actually see the effect im talking about (not sure what happened in test nr 2)
Both tests you see a lower total current out of the driver after voltage throttling and removing strips ( 8.21>7.66 and 11.09>10.06A). If you werent voltage throttled the total current out would stay the same and not go down. This trick is really more useful when using 2-3 boards as the current would go up much more (50-100%) per board.
Youll see a more clear effect if you voltage throttle down a little further from your current regulation.
Thx for taking the time for exact measuring Ive never actually done current testing on this, i only tried with 2 boards, dropping 1 didnt change the light intensity.

 

[Neferhotep]

Every voltage pot is a current pot if a linear device is connected. But diodes are not linear devices.
So what you can do with the voltage pot is set the voltage. It's a sort of last resort safety measure for trying to keep the lamps in one piece.
However it will not limit current. Only the current pot will.

But, I have the feeling that some thermal runaway has happened to no one here. From that standpoint, turning the voltage pot down is a good measure. I don't do it myself however because I have shitloads of LEDs