Snow High Seeds' Double Acapulco Gold

[Hempy McNoodle]

I'm really starting to feel I've been ripped off with these, so-called "Double Acapulco Gold" seeds.

(UPDATE: It is now the future (Aug 3, 2021) and I no longer think I was ripped off)

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

The leaves do overlap a little bit and look like a Pakistani Hindu Kush plant more than a landrace Sativa.

RingtailCanyon, you mentioned that the leaves look similar to a Guerrero x Blueberry plant that you grew? That would be a hybrid right? What is Blueberry? That is a indica leaning hybrid, isn't it? Because if that is the case, I am thinking I got ripped off. As I mentioned earlier, these are the most expensive seeds I have ever bought. It's a little embarrissing to say, but these cost me $320!

 

[yesum]

^^ The Blueberry used in the Guerrero x BB was sativa leaning or one of them was. The regular BB is indica leaning I would say. B130 or something like that was one of the main BB used. Sativa leaning.

I would wait till you are close to flower or in flower to worry on the genetics involved with the 2x AG. If it does not work out contact Snow, I doubt you will need to. I have some Manipur growing and the leaves are not narrow. I have no worries on it being real and not mixed. The AG I grew from Snow was clearly sativa. Did not try the 2x AG.

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

Thanks for the feedback Yesum! Maybe I should hold off before slandering Snow High prematurely. He may deserve far better than that. I should give him the benefit of the doubt for now. I'll take your advice and just see how things end up.

 

[RingtailCanyon]

I think they will look narrow as they mature. They always do. My buddy pinkus says that a plant’s leaves have a code for veg and a code for flower and it’s a mistake to cull based on early leaf morphology.

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

Right on, Ringtail! I wasn't planning on culling any. I only culled the deformed seedlings. I recall that there was a person last year who posted that they had some old AG seed stock that was like 40+ years old. He showed pics of his plants and they look like my wider leaved plants. I commented that I thought they were hybridized. Shows what I know... Unless they are hybridized, lol. I'm going to continue to follow thru with my plans to pollenate the lowers and hopefully keep the tops seedless.

By the way, I set them to 12/12 two days ago. They seem to be stretching a bit more quickly. Especially the taller two.

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

EDIT / UPDATE (August 3, 2021): While I previously had doubts about the authenticity of this line, I now feel that they are definitely pure sativa. Sorry for causing any doubt to fall on Snow High.

Greetings All!

Well, it's been a little while since I've done an update. It is now day 36 of the Snow High "Double Acapulco Gold" grow and we are in day 15 of the flower cycle. I started the flowering photoperiod at 12/12, but yesterday I switched to 11.5 (hrs light) / 12.5 (hrs dark) to hopefully speed up the flowering. All 6 plants have now shown their genders and I have 3:3 in exact reversal of my attempt to sex the seeds visually. So, this was completely consistant with the original video that I've linked on gender determination. I will continue to study this phenomenon in all grows going forward.

As for the question of whether these are authentic AG or not... I am now very convinced that what I have here is FOOL'S GOLD.

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

EDIT / UPDATE (August 3, 2021): While I previously had doubts about the authenticity of this line, I now feel that they are definitely pure sativa. Sorry for causing any doubt to fall on Snow High.


The Pic above is my sativa male next to my indica male. Of course I should not have any indica males...

There are many possible explanations why there is such a clear difference in structure with these plants. I'll list some of them in no particular order:

1. Snow High Seeds may be reclessly crosspolinating their plants stock by accidental carelessness (which would mean that the prices paid are highly over inflated and potentially fraudulent)
2. Everything we know about cannabis population physiology is bunk and snow never told us.
3. An employee at the Oregon seed bank where I bought them swapped some out for themselves (meaning Snow is not to blame)
4. Snow was duped into accepting an indica hybrid as either a 1968 or a 1972 AG and innocently bred them and unkowingly sold them for absolutely top end prices (if this is the case he has not the expertise or experience to justify his sales).

Are there any more scenarios that I may not have thought of??

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

Here are all three males together

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

And the females

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

Here are the two sativas (female, Male)

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

The Pic above is my sativa male next to my indica male. Of course I should not have any indica males...

There are many possible explanations why there is such a clear difference in structure with these plants. I'll list some of them in no particular order:

1. Snow High Seeds may be reclessly crosspolinating their plants stock by accidental carelessness (which would mean that the prices paid are highly over inflated and potentially fraudulent)
2. Everything we know about cannabis population physiology is bunk and snow never told us.
3. An employee at the Oregon seed bank where I bought them swapped some out for themselves (meaning Snow is not to blame)
4. Snow was duped into accepting an indica hybrid as either a 1968 or a 1972 AG and innocently bred them and unkowingly sold them for absolutely top end prices (if this is the case he has not the expertise or experience to justify his sales).

Are there any more scenarios that I may not have thought of??

EDIT / UPDATE (August 3, 2021): While I previously had doubts about the authenticity of this line, I now feel that they are definitely pure sativa. Sorry for causing any doubt to fall on Snow High.



Just incase it is scenario #3, I will be removing the indica hybrid males. I have no use for them. I will only be doing a very minimal pollination as seeds are no longer as important since who knows what I've got here. I didn't really grow them in a way that will maximize flower production. So, I sure hope the flower is top notch or else I am at a total loss here. The structure of the hybrid plants is nice and could be useful if I ever get into breeding. But I already have hundreds or thousands of random miscellaneous seeds. Maybe the two sativa phenos are "the real deal" but I certainly have my doubts at this point.

By the way, the indicas had basically no stretch just like an indica would. These honestly could have been a "lowrider" crop. FOOL'S GOLD!

I plan on contacting the seed bank I purchased them from.

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

 

[Nexus7]

I sprouted a Snowhigh Golden King (pure Colombian heirloom) not so long ago.

Seeds were unsually pale and large for a pure Sativa was a bit disappointed on arrival but ...

they were pure NLD from the get go no sign of any width about the leaf early on, large nodes, large long thin leaves and even longer flowering than MadMac OHzs1 and USC '72 Gold!!!

Must have got the '68 commune Haze pheno!

 

[RingtailCanyon]

Kudos for growing them out this far. Those definitely look like there’s some hashplant genetics in there.

 

[Humple W.]

Personally, I am wholly unconvinced that the width of the leaves (especially on young, immature plants) is a reliable indicator. Ace's Panama is a good example. Wider leaves when immature, but looks pure NLD when it grows out. I know there are those who think Panama has been crossed with some indica, but I think that's ignorant speculation (see the Panama thread in Ace's forum for a detailed explanation from Dubi, who addresses this very issue - if you're inclined to hunt for the post, which was reasonably recent). As if anyone has grown every possible type of "sativa" (a dubious designation to begin with)? There are pics of some broader leaved Panama from the late 70's and early 80's, before everything was hybridized, and there are reports in early Cannabis botany books (R.C. Clarke's, for example) which clearly state that some of the Mexican sativas have broader leaves. I think this narrow leaf mania is based in fallacy.

Now that I've made my own (ignorant) case, I'll add the caveat that I'm as far from an authority as it gets, and this is purely my opinion, based on my own reason's interpretation of the data I've consumed. I'm no veteran who's been growing since the 60's, so armchair opinions are all I've got.

 

[Hempy McNoodle]

EDIT / UPDATE (August 3, 2021): While I previously had doubts about the authenticity of this line, I now feel that they are definitely pure sativa. Sorry for causing any doubt to fall on Snow High.



You may be right Humple W, but I'd say it was the stretch, or lack of stretch that convinced me along with ratios of plants 1/3 Sativa, 1/3 Hybrid looking, and 1/3 indica. Also, the indica leaning plants were the ones with fastest and earliest male flower development. And of course the short height of the plants, other than the two taller ones. I did end up removing the two questionable males. I hope it wasn't a mistake, but all things considered, I thought it was appropriate. One of the hybrid leaning females has a few male looking flowers, but it's hard to tell for sure right now.

 

[RingtailCanyon]

I’m thinking it’s the structure and stretch combined with the broadleaves that makes it look hybridized.

i do agree that there is a narrow leaf mania that is based on misconceptions, but I am one of the proponents of the narrow leaf. I have yet to find a broad overlapping leafed plant that grows as big and stretchy and flowers for 16+ weeks and has a stimulating high like haze.

 

[Tlatoani77]

Hi Hempy, how are you?

Really it's a shame that Snow sold those hybrid beans. They don't seem true Acapulco plants, less a sativa. You must to claim to the vendor.
This is a true sativa plant:
​​​

 

[Tlatoani77]

https://ibb.co/GcqMmL0