seedlings seem like they are wilting.

[Joey56789]

SOIL:

How long has this problem been going on?
3-5 days

What STRAIN are you growing?
silver pearl x unkonwn male/males

What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?)
Seed

What is the age of your plants?
1 week

How Tall are the plants?
2-4 inches

What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in?
seedling

What Technique are you using?
planning on LST

What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot)
1 per 18 oz solo cup

What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?)
straight Black Gold

What Nutrient's are you using?
None yet

How much of each with how much water? How Often?
I only watered once with RO water. I got the soil wet with tap water when I planted them.

What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
n/a

What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"?
not checked yet

What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen?
n/a

How often are you watering?
I will water again when they need it, i.e. when they are about as light as a cup with dry soil (I have a cup of dry soil in there to compare)

When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding?
none

What size bulb are you using?
4 27w 6500K CFL

What is the distance to the canopy?
1.5-2 inches

What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity)
low, 16-20%

What is the canopy temperature?
between 70-82F

What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range)
it goes down to about 72 at night

What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.)
No fan blowing on them, just the one cooling fan that sucks from the bottom to the top. About 60cfm

Is the fan blowing directly at plants?
no

Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist?
no

Is your water HARD or SOFT?
RO water

What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water?
RO water

Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched?
no

Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when?
no

Are plant's infected with pest's?
no





The seedlings came up between 5-7 days ago. They were under weak light until their new home was ready, 5 days ago. The ones that sprouted first had some stretching, probably due to the weak light. They have stopped stretching since they were put under 4x 27w 6500K CFLs. I needed to use toothpicks to get them to stand up as some were falling over. It now seems like some are wilting a bit. I'm not sure why. The two in the back middle seem the worst. In some of the others, the leaves stand straight out. I plan on putting more dirt in there to keep them standing up next time I water. I am just convened about the wilting. I need to get a PH test kit. All I have now are some strips, so I did not try and measure run off when I watered them. I have a cup of dry soil straight from the bag to compare weight for watering. They seemed like they were almost as light as it when I watered. Should I be concerned about the wilting? Am I worrying too much?

thank you!

 

[crankndapot]

too much water maybe in the wilted ones.. i dont really know. but they are looking pretty good except for a couple that are kinda wilted

 

[Weedhound]

could be overwater. I'm not familiar with Black Gold so I can't tell if you the soil you are using is too strong for new seedlings. What kind of drainage do you have going on in those cups?

 

[Joey56789]

I guess I could have watered too soon. It was 5 days after the first ones sprouted though, and like I said, they felt about as light as the cup of dry mix I compare it to. The ones that wilted seemed like they were the lightest as well, but that is probably coincidence.

I hear that Black Gold was very popular till FFOF came along. It lists 0.13-0.05-0.10 on the bag. Perhaps it is a little strong, but it doesn't look like nutrient burn I see pictures of. They are a nice green color.

I put 4 3/8" drainage holes on the sides right at the very bottom of each cup, and it drains very well, so I don't think that's a problem.

Any other ideas? Thanks!

 

[Weedhound]

Does it list on the bag the ph of the Black Gold? I'm just curious.

Brand new seedling are easy to overwater. But they're also very easy to overnute and they'll shrivel quicker from problems than an established plant would. I'm going to go look up Black Gold.

 

[Weedhound]

Ok, simply glancing at the company that makes it and the fact they make a "seed starting" version of it I have a feeling your soil may be too hot. Watch them carefully.

Good luck.

 

[drtask]

looks like a tiny bit of over watering on the ones that are kinda wilted. the rest look fine.

 

[Joey56789]

Thanks gents!

It does not list PH on the bag. It does say

...is a blend of 40-50% canadian sphagnum peat moss, composted or aged softwood bark, (and one or more of the following: compost, composted rice hulls, composted peanut hulls, pumice, cinders, or horticultural grade perlite), composted worm castings, and a controlled release fertilizer.

I watered #1 #2 and #7 again today (the ones with dirt up to the rim). I weighed them this time. The cup with the same amount of mix straight from the bag was about 120 grams. The plants I watered were between 140-155 grams. They weighed almost 400 grams after I watered them (with RO water again). I also filled them up to support the stems though. Should I wait longer to water? They were really dry!

Here are some pics from today. I watered about 12 hours ago.



Here are the two I was worried about from before.




The one on the left looks fine, but the other is still a bit curly. Is this an indicator of a problem? Could it just be genetics?

Also, I tried to test runoff. I would say it was 6-6.5. This was just testing with strips though. I will get a drop kit soon.

Thanks!

 

[Weedhound]

i still think your soil is too hot for the seedlings. That's my best 2 cents. Good luck.

 

[Joey56789]

Thanks again Weedhound. I will research the subject. Hopefully they will keep going till they are big enough to take the hot soil.

 

[crankndapot]

if the soil was too hot wouldnt there be some type of yellowing or necrosis? i think they are looking healthy and doing great.

 

[Weedhound]

baby seedlings (and clones) pretty much react to most problems by drooping first. That's why it's hard to pinpoint issues in them. Hopefully they will outgrow the hot stuff (and it depends on the strain as well) but a few strains such as white widow will die off pretty quick if germinated in a soil that is too hot for seedlings. That's why you have to try things one at a time until you figure out the issue......many symptoms mimic each other..... again more common in new seedlings and new clones.

good luck.

 

[moonymonkey]

one thing u can dois stick your finger in dirt and see how far down its dry,an compare that to dry weight measureed amount.i dry plant in a cup with plant can weigh thesame as a dry cup of soil with no plant an still b little to damp to water or maybe right.check how far down damp wen slight wilt too and idont know if the soil is hot for seedlings? hope this helps..peace

 

[RockyMountainHi]

those cups are pretty big for seedlings. - I start everything in 8 oz styro "coffee cups".

Small plants in large pots are usually a death sentance for me.

Watering - sticking your finger in the soil isn't good for mother nature and tiny root structures and - fingers.

Hard part is, when there is water at the bottom of the cup and no roots, so what you want to do is water ingradualli increasing volume and area around the plant - just till it gets it's feet firmly planted ---- so to speak. It's improtant for the soil around the roots to get pretty dry in beteen waterings - a splash a day or two too soon can be a killer.


About the soil - if you can find it near you - Fox Farms Ocean Forest and Light Warrior and Pearlite about Mix about 1/3-1/3-1/3 maybe a little lighter on the Ocean Forest.


OF is about $24 a bag here - I used to think it was a waste of money - till I tried it.

Mix it about 50-50 with pearlite - toss in a couple tablespoons of Dolomite lime per gallon of soil mix and go grow some dank.

 

[csharper]

your plants look excellent, just overwatered. from your pictures, the soil is perfect, not "too hot" at all.

Since you only have them under cfls - they can easily go 5-7 days between waterings. Do not mess with any other variables, just stop watering them. In 1-3 days they will be perfect looking. To speed that up, get a heating mat to help your cups dry out.

3-5 days after that they will start to look sad from the lack of water - that is when you want to water them and they will perk up within an hour.

 

[moonymonkey]

cud even be the amount of water..never had a problem checking mine lik that,i lik to know wats going on at all times..i can usally get away with 2 ounces or little less in 8 oz cups...at that size..da

 

[MJane'spoontang]

yup i agree with everyone else. TOO MUCH WATER, just chill out for a while.

Also, when using the Black Gold, make sure to add SHITLOADS of perlite. I've used that stuff before and it got sooooo compacted the plants hardly grew at all, and then when it came time to transplant, a lot of the roots got damaged.

 

[RockyMountainHi]

WHOAAAAAA
NEG REP FROM Joey56789

WTF FOR?

 

[Joey56789]

whoah rocky, that was supposed to be a positive rep! I'm truly sorry man! I must have misclicked doing it a little buzzed. Is there any way I can fix it?

I'm still wondering why people are saying over watering. Those pots were REALLY light, and the dirt was pretty crusty on top. The smallest plant looks like it has a little yellow on one of the leaves, so soil that is just a little hot is a very good possibility. They are growing quickly and vigorously though. New growth on the curliest one is not as curly.

Thanks for the input guys. I meant to give everyone who gave their input positive rep.

 

[RockyMountainHi]

I guess it may be pretty hard to figgure out, if your a dip-stick.


You get 2 choices

I approve

I disapprove

and the approve is already checked - so you have to click on disapprove


Frankly - you reap what you sow.