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Revival of the Ultimate Sativa Thread
- Thread starter motaco
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Great looking plants Bushweed hope the weather holds for you. Aloha
Professor77
Member
Hey Kanga & BW, You have the touch - you grow amazing beautiful big trees my friends.
Be Good, P77
Be Good, P77
I read an article a while back but I can no longer find it. It was basically a negative rant on all the sativa/indica cross breeding that's gone on here in the US over the last 5+ decades. The author blamed these hybrids for all the nasty side effects folks get from cannabis consumption...including, but not limited to head aches, nausea, insomnia, various and asundry body aches and pains, anxiety, paranoia, chest pain, difficulty breathing, heart palpitations... The author strongly encouraged everyone to stop smoking hybrids and switch to pure land race strains, primarily sativas.
Over the past several years I have all but stopped smoking pot (except when I've had a few drinks and can't help myself LOL) because I experience a number of these side effects when I smoke. I'd be suprised if I smoke more than 0.25g/week. A time or 2 I've had heart palpitations so bad I thought I'd have to go to the ER. I don't believe this was related to anxiety. When I started growing 6-7 years ago I went through a variety of techniques and mediums, but switched to all organic soil grows 3-4 years ago w/little or no change in the effects I experience.
I'm wondering if 1: the articles author is correct, or full of BS. 2: If anyone else experiences these side effects from smoking hybrids. 3: If so, does smoking land race strains or sativas aleviate these side effects? 4: Could these side effects just be related to my changing body/metabolism as I've gotten older? 5: I'm looking for suggestions as to what I should try to grow and smoke. Finishing times and space restrictions are not a consern ATM. 6: If haze is a good option for me, which of the readily available haze strains should I try &/or avoid?
Thanks in advance for any help I receive
This is probably the article you are looking for.
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=173727&highlight=indica+madness
I don't personally believe any of that though. Paranoia, head aches, a "racy" feeling, nausea, and especially insomnia are more of the trade marks from a sativa, not an indica or hybrid.
I wouldn't expect switching to landrace strains or sativas to alleviate any of that. I don't know what to recommend.
yea i hawe made the same exp. thinks need there time to feel good
(Kariba Report)
(Kariba Report)
LOL, the size of some of the plants in this thread is mind boggling. Absolutely delightful thread.
In any event, hello everybody
I know some of you have been waiting to hear about the Kariba x NH3, especially you NYC uptown haze heads, so here's some feedback.
(3 different types tested)
Tastes just like old school dark spicy uptown haze. The taste is stellar.
Whether it's the NH or the Kariba or a combo of the two shining through ... I couldn't tell you, but of 3 diff samples, they all have that old school dark spicy haze taste which I personally haven't tasted in years. Never got that from the 6 samples MNS NH or 1 GHS NH or Female Seeds NH(which did smell a lot like frankincense but smoked like dog crap) I tested and tons of other haze and haze/hybrids that were supposed to be "it" but weren't. Haven't tried ACE or SAMS or THill yet.
One Kariba/NH3 is stringy and not much to speak of in terms of "nice nugz".
The other two were dank drenched and solid for sativa. Certainly sativa buds, but quality thick firm foxtail formation. No shyness to lights, they packed it on in the last weeks lovely. Not huge yielders but no where near small yielders. Worth the space indeed.
Now perhaps phenos is key with this line but I don't get exactly frankincense tones, but close. Definitely not much fuel in these 3. One had a fuel tone for a week or so early on but not at chop or after cure. They are all however very close to frankincense and we're only talking 3 different samples of kariba/NH3.
Another point: Nevil told Dr. P not to even sample his grails until at least 6 week cure.
I sampled each every week from chop until now at the 6 week mark.
Boy, was Nevil right, and I'm glad Dr.P mentioned that because at the 6 week mark you have a completely different animal than before cure.
Let me take that a step further.
From week 5 to week 6 there is probably the most change, it is apparent. Anybody not curing 6 weeks or longer is making a mistake.
The incense qualities, the frankincense tones, the spice comes out after 6 weeks cure. No doubt as these tones weren't present before week 5.5
One has the NYC haze high, but again it took the 6 weeks cure before the high had it's character. Moreover, I imagine week 8 is when you could say it will be right for a proper taste test.
If I were Kanga I would immediately cross the Kariba or Kariba/NH3 to the SSH cut he holds. If I were Shanti, I'd put my best NH to my best SSH, call it "piff" and market it.
I've had the pleasure of finding a stellar MNS SSH, it's piff and then some.
... however, it is missing everything that the Kariba/NH3 has in taste and smell
... and the Kariba/NH3 is missing everything the SSH has in taste and smell.
Both taste exactly like NYC haze but are missing something which the other possesses. The SSH has the NYC haze and the haze taste in general, and the Kariba/NH3 has the spice and that burnt incense hues, you know that nice incense smell, very pleasing, aroma therapy smell. It cuts through the air differently than the SSH or other hazes.
After sampling a proper, hand selected MNS SSH. Characteristics being a strong bleeding through in taste and smell from the NL5C as opposed to more of the more skunk/haze side of the cross. As Nevil said the downside to SSH was the taste from NL5C got drowned out and only about 1 in 20 or so could hang with 5C and it is so true because this SSH pheno took about 20 girls to find.
So it's a thought I want to share with everyone. A NH/Kariba x SSH or NH x SSH is where it's at folks.
Incidentally, so far that specific SSH girl was mated to Canteloupe Haze and also to Sour Diesel. Always good for a rainy day lol.
If blind tested, many of you NYC haze fans would pick cantaloupe haze every time. The haze side of that strain is so beautiful and hazy it is unreal. I'd love to try cindy 99 sometime because i really doubt it is anywhere near as hazy and truly hazy as cantaloupe haze, but i could be wrong.
Any cindy 99 reports are more than welcome.
A pack of Canteloupe haze throws either melon/haze phenos, or straight dank no fruit haze phenos. I've tried tons of cantaloupe and the hazy ones are so hazy you really have to think that perhaps there is some truth to DNA's story of crossing santa cruz haze to Mexican.
Tell you what though, all the outcross progeny from the cantaloupe haze are all squat plants like the cantaloupe haze is. In other words, the short stature almost seems genetically inbred so that makes you think DNA is full of crap.But like shanti says the proof is in the seed and when i smell cantaloupe haze ... santa cruz haze certainly comes to mind. It's a great strain.
Could be variation in the f2's and if I ever get around to going through those cantaloupe f2's ill let you all know.
The best NYC type hazes I've run across so far are the Kariba/NH3, MNS SSH, GHS SLemon Haze, Canteloupe Haze, Sage, Jack Herer. If you like NYC Haze you shouldn't miss these strains.
Anyway back to the Kariba.
It's connoisseur stash as it possess an heirloom smell and taste and only the rest of the cure will truly let them shine.
None of them have the strength of smell that the uptown haze had though. But the taste is on par with old school nyc haze and a true treat and blast from the past.
I am testing a few other strains for piffiness and will report back soon on those
Kali Mist (reg)
Western Winds (reg)
Amnesia Haze (fem)
Royal Haze (fem) (heard rumors it had the church smell)
Tijuana (fem) (this is original haze x tijuana cut that circles around)
Santa Muerte (fem) (this is an original haze x mexicana which main characteristic is overpowering incense)
alright, i gotta run ... later gators.
Oh forgot to mention ... I've read lots of reports of hermit MNS ASH phenos ... i had no such issues. Beautiful strain.
(Kariba Report)
LOL, the size of some of the plants in this thread is mind boggling. Absolutely delightful thread.
In any event, hello everybody
I know some of you have been waiting to hear about the Kariba x NH3, especially you NYC uptown haze heads, so here's some feedback.
(3 different types tested)
Tastes just like old school dark spicy uptown haze. The taste is stellar.
Whether it's the NH or the Kariba or a combo of the two shining through ... I couldn't tell you, but of 3 diff samples, they all have that old school dark spicy haze taste which I personally haven't tasted in years. Never got that from the 6 samples MNS NH or 1 GHS NH or Female Seeds NH(which did smell a lot like frankincense but smoked like dog crap) I tested and tons of other haze and haze/hybrids that were supposed to be "it" but weren't. Haven't tried ACE or SAMS or THill yet.
One Kariba/NH3 is stringy and not much to speak of in terms of "nice nugz".
The other two were dank drenched and solid for sativa. Certainly sativa buds, but quality thick firm foxtail formation. No shyness to lights, they packed it on in the last weeks lovely. Not huge yielders but no where near small yielders. Worth the space indeed.
Now perhaps phenos is key with this line but I don't get exactly frankincense tones, but close. Definitely not much fuel in these 3. One had a fuel tone for a week or so early on but not at chop or after cure. They are all however very close to frankincense and we're only talking 3 different samples of kariba/NH3.
Another point: Nevil told Dr. P not to even sample his grails until at least 6 week cure.
I sampled each every week from chop until now at the 6 week mark.
Boy, was Nevil right, and I'm glad Dr.P mentioned that because at the 6 week mark you have a completely different animal than before cure.
Let me take that a step further.
From week 5 to week 6 there is probably the most change, it is apparent. Anybody not curing 6 weeks or longer is making a mistake.
The incense qualities, the frankincense tones, the spice comes out after 6 weeks cure. No doubt as these tones weren't present before week 5.5
One has the NYC haze high, but again it took the 6 weeks cure before the high had it's character. Moreover, I imagine week 8 is when you could say it will be right for a proper taste test.
If I were Kanga I would immediately cross the Kariba or Kariba/NH3 to the SSH cut he holds. If I were Shanti, I'd put my best NH to my best SSH, call it "piff" and market it.
I've had the pleasure of finding a stellar MNS SSH, it's piff and then some.
... however, it is missing everything that the Kariba/NH3 has in taste and smell
... and the Kariba/NH3 is missing everything the SSH has in taste and smell.
Both taste exactly like NYC haze but are missing something which the other possesses. The SSH has the NYC haze and the haze taste in general, and the Kariba/NH3 has the spice and that burnt incense hues, you know that nice incense smell, very pleasing, aroma therapy smell. It cuts through the air differently than the SSH or other hazes.
After sampling a proper, hand selected MNS SSH. Characteristics being a strong bleeding through in taste and smell from the NL5C as opposed to more of the more skunk/haze side of the cross. As Nevil said the downside to SSH was the taste from NL5C got drowned out and only about 1 in 20 or so could hang with 5C and it is so true because this SSH pheno took about 20 girls to find.
So it's a thought I want to share with everyone. A NH/Kariba x SSH or NH x SSH is where it's at folks.
Incidentally, so far that specific SSH girl was mated to Canteloupe Haze and also to Sour Diesel. Always good for a rainy day lol.
If blind tested, many of you NYC haze fans would pick cantaloupe haze every time. The haze side of that strain is so beautiful and hazy it is unreal. I'd love to try cindy 99 sometime because i really doubt it is anywhere near as hazy and truly hazy as cantaloupe haze, but i could be wrong.
Any cindy 99 reports are more than welcome.
A pack of Canteloupe haze throws either melon/haze phenos, or straight dank no fruit haze phenos. I've tried tons of cantaloupe and the hazy ones are so hazy you really have to think that perhaps there is some truth to DNA's story of crossing santa cruz haze to Mexican.
Tell you what though, all the outcross progeny from the cantaloupe haze are all squat plants like the cantaloupe haze is. In other words, the short stature almost seems genetically inbred so that makes you think DNA is full of crap.But like shanti says the proof is in the seed and when i smell cantaloupe haze ... santa cruz haze certainly comes to mind. It's a great strain.
Could be variation in the f2's and if I ever get around to going through those cantaloupe f2's ill let you all know.
The best NYC type hazes I've run across so far are the Kariba/NH3, MNS SSH, GHS SLemon Haze, Canteloupe Haze, Sage, Jack Herer. If you like NYC Haze you shouldn't miss these strains.
Anyway back to the Kariba.
It's connoisseur stash as it possess an heirloom smell and taste and only the rest of the cure will truly let them shine.
None of them have the strength of smell that the uptown haze had though. But the taste is on par with old school nyc haze and a true treat and blast from the past.
I am testing a few other strains for piffiness and will report back soon on those
Kali Mist (reg)
Western Winds (reg)
Amnesia Haze (fem)
Royal Haze (fem) (heard rumors it had the church smell)
Tijuana (fem) (this is original haze x tijuana cut that circles around)
Santa Muerte (fem) (this is an original haze x mexicana which main characteristic is overpowering incense)
alright, i gotta run ... later gators.
Oh forgot to mention ... I've read lots of reports of hermit MNS ASH phenos ... i had no such issues. Beautiful strain.
G`day Puday
NHz x Kariba . Yes .
Remember Kanga said the Kariba selection was hampered by harsh weather . There could be more work done with them .
Going back to the SSH would add more bottom . Your bringing NL and SK to the party .
Good building blocks for commersh plants . Prolly not where you wanna scout for the high flier sativa buzz . Are you looking for effect ? Or how it smells when burnt ?
EB .
NHz x Kariba . Yes .
Remember Kanga said the Kariba selection was hampered by harsh weather . There could be more work done with them .
Going back to the SSH would add more bottom . Your bringing NL and SK to the party .
Good building blocks for commersh plants . Prolly not where you wanna scout for the high flier sativa buzz . Are you looking for effect ? Or how it smells when burnt ?
EB .
Lightweight
Member
Amazing photos Bushweed and Kangativa. Truly amazing, thanks for sharing.
Good god, man. I wonder if I can talk the old lady into moving to Australia. You guys are awesome.
Was just thinking about how everyone seems stuck on these medical indicas nowadays. I like a good indica as much as the next guy, but it's a shame sativas don't get more appreciation. I suppose it's the amount of people growing indoors with limited space and wanting a quick turnaround. Always makes me happy to see folks conquer big sats indoors for the love of the plants. Sorry for rambling on. It's the beer.
Was just thinking about how everyone seems stuck on these medical indicas nowadays. I like a good indica as much as the next guy, but it's a shame sativas don't get more appreciation. I suppose it's the amount of people growing indoors with limited space and wanting a quick turnaround. Always makes me happy to see folks conquer big sats indoors for the love of the plants. Sorry for rambling on. It's the beer.
You know Elmer ... I look for it all. Taste, Smell, High and strength in all 3 areas.
All the top strains usually possess all three.
One of the Kariba/NH3 has a strong high. Dimension shifting. The other 2 are nice sativa smoke but nothing to write home about in terms of high. One has a wonderful strong gripping high though with plenty of body, just well balanced and potent and not the typical hybrid effect.
Taste is huge with me though. Weed that smells great and tastes the same is the cats meow.
Each day as these Kariba/NH3 cure they get better and better and closer and closer to absolutely fine smoke. Considering the best 1 of the 3 I sampled, the only knock I would give it is not a strong enough smell and the taste could be stronger too ... not better ... but stronger.
In terms of adding skunk and more NL into the mix with the SSH x NH/Kariba ... what I will say is aside from that being true, the cross of those two mentioned plants would make many NYC haze fans very happy. I'm going to make it on my own regardless, I have all of the ingredients. I just want others who possess the ingredients to consider doing the same.
Typically, I search for any special plant. Yeah I love NYC Haze but I would never overlook any plants that show promise.
My goal is always to mate high and taste together. When you have good herb that smells great, tastes great, and gets you whacked ... then you're on to something. So as rudimentary as that is ... that's my mindset.
The comedown, ceiling effect, and level of cloudiness or clarity to the high, are things I breed towards or against.
In my mind some plants should get you in the zone for a video game, some should get you in the zone for studying. Some highs should compliment a romantic evening, some highs should compliment a day fishing on the lake. And some highs should just get you plain ol f'd up and/or stoned.
Really all you can do is note the effects of a strain. If something stands out you note why and consider it and if it has possible uses.
In terms of smell ... both unburned and burned count.
Also my favorite strains tend to be strains that when you're done smoking you can still taste them long after you have been done smoking them. Now this may sound strange, but if I can taste a strain in my nose 15 minutes after I'm done smoking ... that's the type of taste effects i target.
I like the full effect. Bag appeal, nose appeal, mind/body appeal and the after effect where the smell lingers with/in/on you and you know you have just smoked some fire.
Anyway Im blabbing ...
On a side note ... the cambodian lines interest me. I've heard rumors that cambodian is in amnesia and also in kali and western winds.
I do know that sagarmartha crossed a cambodian to the western winds and call it stone hedge .... I def want to try some of those.
Also reeferman and a few others have some cambodians and i'm eager to taste those lines but reefs gear always seems sold out... and isn't he a racist? Well racist or not ... lol ... I'll still grabbing a few packs from you reef. I know I know he's changed his ways.
Also shanti put out tons of great lines which I am working through.
Haven't found a keeper Mango Haze or Nevil Haze yet ... and still gotta go through The Doors, ASH, Skunk/Haze, Nevilles Skunk, Angel's Breath, found the ssh already thankfully and a few others.
There are probably keeper plants to be found in just about any pack of seeds out there ... it comes down to numbers, selection, and luck.
The more reputable the breeder, the more likely you'll find something to cherish. Keep in mind though ... a wonder plant could come from any cross really.
In closing I would say this ... if I could only use one word to describe my ideal strain it would probably be "elegant"
Anyway I've totally enjoyed this thread, keep up the great work and fun everybody ... If i started complimenting all of you who have posted your gorgeous plants on this thread I would be here typing until tomorrow. Just know I've seen all of the posts and enjoyed them all and I thank you all for sharing and contributing ... it's been fun.
Cheers!
just tested this kariba/NH3 again ... good stuff, strong ... and as I said one stands out above the others. Nice taste, smooth spice and haze. All possess the taste and smell.
They smell very close to frankincense. Ironically, closer to frankincense than to incense itself. The high is as i said earlier ... stellar. Not the typical haze hybrid, very nice smoke and missing from many of the typical coffee shop menu and most if not all of the smoke that circulates anywhere.
Another side note: I can't help but wondering if Nevil ever did cross or somebody cross the 5c to the straight A haze.
I'm pretty sure Nevil said he never did and that he never gave that plant out, but when you taste the MNS lineup and now these Kariba/NH3 grails ... if I were Nevil, my Nevil's haze recipe would be NL5C to HazeA ... absolutely, no doubt about it.
I wouldn't have breed the lineup towards HazeC due to better progeny percentage of keepers, rather I smoke for me,, not to make money, or to make seeds, ... I just want connoisseur smoke.
With all of what we've all read these years online and my own tasting ... 5c to HazeA would be the shit!
That's where Shanti's Doors strain comes in. I'm surprised more people didn't jump at those.
Regardless ... the Kariba grails are awesome.
Are they my end all be all strain ... no
Is SSH just as good ... yeah, but the Kariba high is dynamite and the Kariba has a taste(and smell) that doesn't circle different strains, whereas the ssh taste is more familiar to the masses.
Is there potential for one of these Kariba/NH3 to have phenos that devastate the SSH strain ... you bet your ass there is. Kanga and Nevil, whoever worked on these did a great job, hats off to you and whoever else helped ... I love you guys.
Are these Kariba/NH3 "piff" "puday" 'uptown haze"? ... no, but i feel they are much closer than Nevil's Haze is alone.
For me if I could taste l33ts incense pheno of Nevil Haze that would sum up a lot of what the NH strain offers.
Could a NYC pheno be found in this Kariba/NH3 line ... definitely!
These Kariba/NH3 have characteristics that I haven't tasted in tons of other hazes. They have a delightful spicy edge.
hmm I'm trying to think of the type of spice ... not exactly oriental but not like hot spice, rather a smooth palette friendly spice, with elegant elements to it.
anyway wish you all well, cheers.
BIG HERB, don't miss this strain bro, it has many of the missing elements you're after if not all of them. Handles the cold ridiculously well ... cold and damp could be another story but the taste hits those taste buds that the original puday did ... not all of them, but one puff and you'll realize that nothing has tingled those taste buds in years
and I speak of 3 different samples ... that's not even selection. I smoke for myself you know lol. I know a few med patients in cali that ran the 3 cuts and had the same results and really they feel both of the two non lanky phenos were great. Like I said though, one stands out in terms of high above the others in my opinion.
They smell very close to frankincense. Ironically, closer to frankincense than to incense itself. The high is as i said earlier ... stellar. Not the typical haze hybrid, very nice smoke and missing from many of the typical coffee shop menu and most if not all of the smoke that circulates anywhere.
Another side note: I can't help but wondering if Nevil ever did cross or somebody cross the 5c to the straight A haze.
I'm pretty sure Nevil said he never did and that he never gave that plant out, but when you taste the MNS lineup and now these Kariba/NH3 grails ... if I were Nevil, my Nevil's haze recipe would be NL5C to HazeA ... absolutely, no doubt about it.
I wouldn't have breed the lineup towards HazeC due to better progeny percentage of keepers, rather I smoke for me,, not to make money, or to make seeds, ... I just want connoisseur smoke.
With all of what we've all read these years online and my own tasting ... 5c to HazeA would be the shit!
That's where Shanti's Doors strain comes in. I'm surprised more people didn't jump at those.
Regardless ... the Kariba grails are awesome.
Are they my end all be all strain ... no
Is SSH just as good ... yeah, but the Kariba high is dynamite and the Kariba has a taste(and smell) that doesn't circle different strains, whereas the ssh taste is more familiar to the masses.
Is there potential for one of these Kariba/NH3 to have phenos that devastate the SSH strain ... you bet your ass there is. Kanga and Nevil, whoever worked on these did a great job, hats off to you and whoever else helped ... I love you guys.
Are these Kariba/NH3 "piff" "puday" 'uptown haze"? ... no, but i feel they are much closer than Nevil's Haze is alone.
For me if I could taste l33ts incense pheno of Nevil Haze that would sum up a lot of what the NH strain offers.
Could a NYC pheno be found in this Kariba/NH3 line ... definitely!
These Kariba/NH3 have characteristics that I haven't tasted in tons of other hazes. They have a delightful spicy edge.
hmm I'm trying to think of the type of spice ... not exactly oriental but not like hot spice, rather a smooth palette friendly spice, with elegant elements to it.
anyway wish you all well, cheers.
BIG HERB, don't miss this strain bro, it has many of the missing elements you're after if not all of them. Handles the cold ridiculously well ... cold and damp could be another story but the taste hits those taste buds that the original puday did ... not all of them, but one puff and you'll realize that nothing has tingled those taste buds in years
and I speak of 3 different samples ... that's not even selection. I smoke for myself you know lol. I know a few med patients in cali that ran the 3 cuts and had the same results and really they feel both of the two non lanky phenos were great. Like I said though, one stands out in terms of high above the others in my opinion.
Here's a mutant Thai82 x Brazilian Green. This plant started heading a month into its existence in 13 hours of sunlight. Its been slowly flowering ever since in the monsoon. I've pretty much neglected it, due to its bonsai size, but i recently hiked to where it is and was pleasantly surprised by the strong fragrance of sour tropical fruits & citrus...
It's not something a commercial breeder would hang onto lol...
I took an immature sample.... observe the odd leaf structure...
Thai82 originating from Green Hornet in Switzerland and kept by Scrubdog, and the Brazilian Green from Luiz Friedman.
It's not something a commercial breeder would hang onto lol...
I took an immature sample.... observe the odd leaf structure...
Thai82 originating from Green Hornet in Switzerland and kept by Scrubdog, and the Brazilian Green from Luiz Friedman.
Ace Purple Haze x Meao Thai around 7 weeks.
Pure Purple Haze at the same duration of flower.
A Haze hybrid - Tangerine Haze. Deliciously citrusy with a very nice back drop of cat piss aroma.
Very nice. Keep the amazing pictures and conversations going everyone! One of the best threads on any cannabis forum, let alone icmag
K
Kangalunacy
Gday Bushy,
nice to see the bg x 82 ,
very odd leaf structure , with that offset of the leaf blades
and also a surprise that a citrus smell has appeared
all the best
KL
nice to see the bg x 82 ,
very odd leaf structure , with that offset of the leaf blades
and also a surprise that a citrus smell has appeared
all the best
KL
K
Kangalunacy
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