question for sam the skunkman on the original haze

[TheDarkStorm]

I remember Sam saying that original Seedsman Haze was 1:1 Haze selection done by Sam himself and sold to Seedsman. The open pollination aka saving ohaze genes happened before Seedsman release. Sam then selected parents to make seeds for Seedsman and Seedsman sold them out for cheap because there was very little interest, or better to say, they sold very slowly.

I also think from experience that pure NLD usually doesnt smell too strong, in the meaning you will put the bud on the table and you will smell it in the whole room as with diesel,chems,ogs. But when you squeeze the bud a little, it has intense sharp and strong penetrating smell that has very rich complexity. (not all phenos though..)

Can you remember were you seen sam say seedsman was a 1-1 breeding or maybe put up the quote...it might be of some use ....personally from the original batches and some of the work from johnny it reminds me of some of sams first haze releases in Holland...ive even seen johnny pull out some plants very very similar to wat they call sams 90's haze....eg that fasiated female of Johnny's ive seen the similar looking phenos come of the 90's haze....to me seedsmans looks like it still has the huge streachy phenos in it too with the alligator tail leaves as well as the shoter more tighter spaced internode plants..looks like its come from one of the older pure original haze batches sam must of made....if its a 1-1 the parents must of been very close to sams starting seeds..if not made from those seeds themselves
I remember wen seedsman first started selling it...some of the plants wouldn't even sex till like 8-9 weeks .

 

[elanius]

It was either here in the thread (not gonna look for it, surely you understand x)) or on another forum, but I dont remember exactly where. Maybe Sam, or others who knows will chime in and confirm.

In general and from my experience, what Johnny says its true. There is a lot of variations in the line, from wispy and grinspoon phenos to more compact bud structure, some I've seen looked similar to C5 and also similar to the 90's OHaze that Golli shared...certainly does not look like its some advance selection, but thats nothing new, haze was always known for its broad spectrum of phenos. I think its great, you can select what you want.

Btw, those ohazes I run showed sex after 9 weeks, so this is still a thing

 

[LostTribe]

Regarding the comparison to Original Haze and Nevil's Haze. There is no comparison.

Old NH is long gone. Most don't have access to A5 or C5 cuttings, only hybrids. I ran some out and all of them were not just Hay but like Tea Hay maybe some dead pile of wet grass. This was NH from MNS 2015. Still have about half a pack. I took one over 120 days or something. Maybe more.
NH

A5s1 this needs another try so I won't elaborate on that.

Todd's Original Haze is beating all expectations. It does not have a "strong" smell that will over power you when you walk into a room like a diesel, OG or smelly skunky varieties, but the smell itself can be very very nice. Of course I am not quite dry on my early nug but the plants smell much nicer and herbal spicy and ginger.

Some may question flowering OHz as quickly as 12/13 weeks but the majority of seeds starts are looking more like 13/14. This is also only 5 plants. I have a pack of original Tom Hill Haze on deck for even more comparison.

I initially chose NH as I figured the 25% indica would make them easier, wrong. The NH grew like weeds and were so bad I tossed the lot. I smoked a little but it was like Hemp. The Original Haze is not a dense and not as wild (at least this time) and I can't wait to smoke some.

OHz

I may even crack another NH to see how it starts but don't have a problem putting it out of its misery if its not going to satisfy.

I also like the OHz more that the Purple Oldtimers but only had one female. Oldtimers is also very wild growing and tricky but I did enjoy the smoke. Its more of a landrace though, still better than what I know as NH.

Might also have to try some of the f2's or the regular Oldtimers still have a pack.

Just my 2 cents
LT

 

[JohnnyChicago]

Can you remember were you seen sam say seedsman was a 1-1 breeding or maybe put up the quote...it might be of some use ....personally from the original batches and some of the work from johnny it reminds me of some of sams first haze releases in Holland...ive even seen johnny pull out some plants very very similar to wat they call sams 90's haze....eg that fasiated female of Johnny's ive seen the similar looking phenos come of the 90's haze....to me seedsmans looks like it still has the huge streachy phenos in it too with the alligator tail leaves as well as the shoter more tighter spaced internode plants..looks like its come from one of the older pure original haze batches sam must of made....if its a 1-1 the parents must of been very close to sams starting seeds..if not made from those seeds themselves
I remember wen seedsman first started selling it...some of the plants wouldn't even sex till like 8-9 weeks .

Sam has told me the same, that he thinks my fasciated female must have been direct progeny of his mother.

 

[TheDarkStorm]

Regarding the comparison to Original Haze and Nevil's Haze. There is no comparison.

Old NH is long gone. Most don't have access to A5 or C5 cuttings, only hybrids. I ran some out and all of them were not just Hay but like Tea Hay maybe some dead pile of wet grass. This was NH from MNS 2015. Still have about half a pack. I took one over 120 days or something. Maybe more.
NH
View Image

A5s1 this needs another try so I won't elaborate on that.

Todd's Original Haze is beating all expectations. It does not have a "strong" smell that will over power you when you walk into a room like a diesel, OG or smelly skunky varieties, but the smell itself can be very very nice. Of course I am not quite dry on my early nug but the plants smell much nicer and herbal spicy and ginger.

Some may question flowering OHz as quickly as 12/13 weeks but the majority of seeds starts are looking more like 13/14. This is also only 5 plants. I have a pack of original Tom Hill Haze on deck for even more comparison.

I initially chose NH as I figured the 25% indica would make them easier, wrong. The NH grew like weeds and were so bad I tossed the lot. I smoked a little but it was like Hemp. The Original Haze is not a dense and not as wild (at least this time) and I can't wait to smoke some.

OHz
View Image

I may even crack another NH to see how it starts but don't have a problem putting it out of its misery if its not going to satisfy.

I also like the OHz more that the Purple Oldtimers but only had one female. Oldtimers is also very wild growing and tricky but I did enjoy the smoke. Its more of a landrace though, still better than what I know as NH.
View Image

Might also have to try some of the f2's or the regular Oldtimers still have a pack.

Just my 2 cents
LT

Nh is still about...nevil himself made another generation with it theres afew different versions he did of it....although its quite rare....
What you had does sound really bad tho...and your not the only person who has said that.

 

[OldCoolSativa]

There's a recent thread on a nice NH grow on MNS forums by Musashi. Sure looked good to me, and he reported excellent potency from most of the plants. I have a couple packs in the freezer and I've always wanted to run it, but honestly I'd prefer to grow pure sativas.

 

[OldCoolSativa]

Also, since Todd released his Ohaze seeds back in April, the people who jumped on them and first grew them out have completed their grows by now. Given the general consensus that only 5-10% of OHaze plants are truly outstanding, can anyone here say they've found one yet? I'm not trying to foster NH vs OHaze tribal warfare, I'm genuinely interested to find out if anyone has found a really special plant amongst Todd's stock.

BTW, I roll my eyes every time I see Todd's Authentic Genetics logo where it says "Est 1984." Wow...Todd was selling OHaze seeds a year before Nevil got his haze seeds from Sam. What a crock of shit.

 

[harvestreaper]

Also, since Todd released his Ohaze seeds back in April, the people who jumped on them and first grew them out have completed their grows by now. Given the general consensus that only 5-10% of OHaze plants are truly outstanding, can anyone here say they've found one yet? I'm not trying to foster NH vs OHaze tribal warfare, I'm genuinely interested to find out if anyone has found a really special plant amongst Todd's stock.

BTW, I roll my eyes every time I see Todd's Authentic Genetics logo where it says "Est 1984." Wow...Todd was selling OHaze seeds a year before Nevil got his haze seeds from Sam. What a crock of shit.

i found decent quality in todds im an experianced high tolerance toker,,my run was terrible so kept two females to run again ,,no shaman weed yet as to my own standards i have ten more seeds to try hoping to get a decent male as i m intersted to look through the genetic and test it on crosses

 

[TheDarkStorm]

There's a recent thread on a nice NH grow on MNS forums by Musashi. Sure looked good to me, and he reported excellent potency from most of the plants. I have a couple packs in the freezer and I've always wanted to run it, but honestly I'd prefer to grow pure sativas.

Im a bit dubious wen the grow is done on the company forum by a mod...I will say though musashi seems like a good guy..but im sure ive seen him say the seeds were quite old perhaps recived in 2015-17 so made earlier...mind you looks like he grew out quite afew plants..an to me they all looked like slight variations of the same pheno..as if the line had been tinkered with and stabalized ..they were all huge yielding too...all abit odd....shantis been getting stick for knicking og raskals raskal og picture off this site to advertise his shark on insta..just recently...he has also had one picture labeled as something else then later labeled as the mother to his holy grail strain, he has another old picture thats been around a while of ash but now he's advertising holy smoke with it....still has that ssh picture promoting nh..an shanti defo knows about all this misslabling of pictures cus he anwered back to og raskal himself..people searching for plants in seeds for nearly 20 years that were easily found in seeds nevil sold him self...but there finding nothing similar after tones of grows between many people over years and years...nevils made a next generation of nh seeds himself away from mr nice an its quite easy to find keepers..even remind you of nevils old haze hybrid strains...so ...??....if you want nh in seed form look for the f1's nevil made himself...or the following generation he made himself....
How is. Tod saying he's been established since 84...he hadnt even gone to dam tIl like ten years later..he was only a kid in 84.
By the way nevil got the seeds in 84

 

[bigherb]

Respect to all the Haze lovers and growers

I mentioned some time ago . I think Todd should only be given positive vibes , the Original Haze stock he sells should be judged honestly and set apart from him personally.

But how and what negative could you say about the fella . From I what I see he has contributed much to the community and should be respected for his achievements and long fight for our community

As to any doubt on the authenticity of his Haze , I’m sure Sams would have spoke up if there was mis truth. Sams has spoken when necessary to correct the Haze Histories

From recent grows , she has shown some lookers and I’m curious what will be found in the future

Btw I don’t see any established in 84 , i do see mention of first growing in 84 . It doesn’t seem odd . I was a young teen when I touched my first green lady

1luvbigherb

 

[TheDarkStorm]

Actually more power to him for putting out the haze....atleast more people get to check it out
Did you gett any your self big herb..or hopefully you get a chance to try a few different phenotypes....seeing as you know ov the hazes in ny the past id be interested to hear your opinion on wat you think of the line...think others would be too

 

[harvestreaper]

Respect to all the Haze lovers and growers

I mentioned some time ago . I think Todd should only be given positive vibes , the Original Haze stock he sells should be judged honestly and set apart from him personally.

But how and what negative could you say about the fella . From I what I see he has contributed much to the community and should be respected for his achievements and long fight for our community

As to any doubt on the authenticity of his Haze , I’m sure Sams would have spoke up if there was mis truth. Sams has spoken when necessary to correct the Haze Histories

From recent grows , she has shown some lookers and I’m curious what will be found in the future

Btw I don’t see any established in 84 , i do see mention of first growing in 84 . It doesn’t seem odd . I was a young teen when I touched my first green lady

1luvbigherb

thats pretty much how i seen it ,,i dont know todd from adam id never heard of him but the fact sam verified his stock is what prompted me to try them,,had a few people drop negatives in my ear about todd but like i say i dont know him ,,his haze seems legit to me reminded me very much of some of the early hazes i tried late 80s early 90s friends who were with me then also said the same,,all the nev vs sam bollox has no value at all in helping to find /preserve any haze but if nothing else its taught me haze is very popular with schoolgirls

 

[Hammerhead]

I just started a few of Todds OH. As soon as more room opens up ill start some of these Mango x Mango.

 

[LostTribe]

Anyone get any males out of Todd's yet?

 

[Bnyest]

Anyone get any males out of Todd's yet?

I had one really early looking male but couldnt get any pollen out of it

 

[Raho]

Hi Elanius,
With all due respect, I challenge you to find this quote.
Sometimes our memories replace what people actually said with an amalgam of other information/opinion. It happens to all of us.

Sam is naturally reluctant to give details on any of the work he provided to seedsman, as they rebrand what he sold them as their own, and he really has no idea what they do with his seeds after they leave his hands.
Quite simply, it doesn't sound like something he would say.

One thing Sam did say is that he had a particular breeding plant that he liked to use that was fasciated. This came up when Johnny found his own flat stem pheno in the large selection run. Sam was very surprised to see that pheno pop up, not sure but I think it was the first time he had seen it "in the wild".
Some might assume from that revelation that Sam used THAT specific pheno in a 1:1 mating for the batch of seed he sold to seedsman.
The numbers however don't support that conclusion as 1 or 2 out of 100 seeds run are not the kind of results you would expect to see from a 1 to 1 mating with a fasciated parent.

I remember Sam saying that original Seedsman Haze was 1:1 Haze selection done by Sam himself and sold to Seedsman. The open pollination aka saving ohaze genes happened before Seedsman release. Sam then selected parents to make seeds for Seedsman and Seedsman sold them out for cheap because there was very little interest, or better to say, they sold very slowly.

I also think from experience that pure NLD usually doesnt smell too strong, in the meaning you will put the bud on the table and you will smell it in the whole room as with diesel,chems,ogs. But when you squeeze the bud a little, it has intense sharp and strong penetrating smell that has very rich complexity. (not all phenos though..)

 

[Donald Mallard]

I remember Sam saying that original Seedsman Haze was 1:1 Haze selection done by Sam himself and sold to Seedsman. The open pollination aka saving ohaze genes happened before Seedsman release. Sam then selected parents to make seeds for Seedsman and Seedsman sold them out for cheap because there was very little interest, or better to say, they sold very slowly.

I also think from experience that pure NLD usually doesnt smell too strong, in the meaning you will put the bud on the table and you will smell it in the whole room as with diesel,chems,ogs. But when you squeeze the bud a little, it has intense sharp and strong penetrating smell that has very rich complexity. (not all phenos though..)

Hi Elanius,
With all due respect, I challenge you to find this quote.
Sometimes our memories replace what people actually said with an amalgam of other information/opinion. It happens to all of us.

Sam is naturally reluctant to give details on any of the work he provided to seedsman, as they rebrand what he sold them as their own, and he really has no idea what they do with his seeds after they leave his hands.
Quite simply, it doesn't sound like something he would say.

One thing Sam did say is that he had a particular breeding plant that he liked to use that was fasciated. This came up when Johnny found his own flat stem pheno in the large selection run. Sam was very surprised to see that pheno pop up, not sure but I think it was the first time he had seen it "in the wild".
Some might assume from that revelation that Sam used THAT specific pheno in a 1:1 mating for the batch of seed he sold to seedsman.
The numbers however don't support that conclusion as 1 or 2 out of 100 seeds run are not the kind of results you would expect to see from a 1 to 1 mating with a fasciated parent.

i dunno why i added your quote raho , haha ,
but maybe due to the first sentence with regards to folks saying indica plants smell more than sativas ,
memory is playing tricks ,
to be fair the strongest smelling is the combination of sativa and indica , aka hybrids ,
not pure indicas or sativas ,
both have samples that smell strongly , its not exclusive to indica or sativa ,

if you havent found this , you simply need to grow more weed to find it ..

the combination of sativa and indica certainly has given us some lovely aromas , some delicious looking buds , and some large yields ,

things that either varieties would not do on their own so readily ,
this is why we hybridize in the first place ...



there are certainly plain smelling indica plants , and sativa plants , with selection we can find great smells in both , and combining them can sometimes increase the aromas even more than in their pure forms ...

 

[JohnnyChicago]

Hi Elanius,
With all due respect, I challenge you to find this quote.
Sometimes our memories replace what people actually said with an amalgam of other information/opinion. It happens to all of us.

Sam is naturally reluctant to give details on any of the work he provided to seedsman, as they rebrand what he sold them as their own, and he really has no idea what they do with his seeds after they leave his hands.
Quite simply, it doesn't sound like something he would say.

One thing Sam did say is that he had a particular breeding plant that he liked to use that was fasciated. This came up when Johnny found his own flat stem pheno in the large selection run. Sam was very surprised to see that pheno pop up, not sure but I think it was the first time he had seen it "in the wild".
Some might assume from that revelation that Sam used THAT specific pheno in a 1:1 mating for the batch of seed he sold to seedsman.
The numbers however don't support that conclusion as 1 or 2 out of 100 seeds run are not the kind of results you would expect to see from a 1 to 1 mating with a fasciated parent.

I do remember an 1:1 too somewhere.
But I think it was a response to a question on the missing colorful phenos in OH.
And you are right there on the numbers I guess.
The doubt he has or had, is if Seedsman had done a new batch of OH seeds from his seeds. But I do believe that then it would have looked differently. TFD's or Todd's are good exemples.

And when you rate Todd's work. Only don't forget he got exact the same seeds from the 70s, Nevil did get from Sam

 

[star crash]

Hi Good Morning Johnny ! all the way from the East Coast USA they root easily in rapid rooters & going to flower out the female clones >>>

 

[TheDarkStorm]

I do remember an 1:1 too somewhere.
But I think it was a response to a question on the missing colorful phenos in OH.
And you are right there on the numbers I guess.
The doubt he has or had, is if Seedsman had done a new batch of OH seeds from his seeds. But I do believe that then it would have looked differently. TFD's or Todd's are good exemples.

And when you rate Todd's work. Only don't forget he got exact the same seeds from the 70s, Nevil did get from Sam

I thought he said nevil only got clones....bit like a whole generation that think they have 5ac x ohz when they dont....oh well...important thing is alot of people get to try the ohz that haven't...its not been readily available for quite some time