Pure Thai Sativas

[bushweed]

TB, Elmer - my apologies for being so contrary and nitpicky. I wasn't reading between the lines and feeling the spirit of what you guys were saying. You are absolutely right, great results can be achieved indoors with any strain. I'd love to see more people growing Thais in any setup and documenting it here. Like Pantagruelion above..

There is still some question in my mind about the ability to maintain a breed's potency in an indoor environment. I have not been able to do it. But I think it is possible that the limit of the numbers to select from has been the biggest significant factor.

Agree 100% this is why so many legendary strains aren't a shadow of what they were 15/20/30 years ago. There exists a natural entropy, a progression away from potency in cultivars taken too long from their natural environment, and in particular from the great horticultural God, the Sun. The entire cannabis industry is plagued by it. Not one line has ever been maintained without a decline in psychoactivity in artificial commercial setups. Just an opinion of course.

G`day Bushie
Well ... I did mention consistency .
Ask Don about his harvests after a cyclone or 2 .
No I haven`t grown Thai indoors .
Risk vs reward is not in its favour in my circumstance.

Well ...I did say a friendly pissing contest [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]

[/FONT] But you're right. Every year I lose plants to the weather, same as Don and Kanga.

 

[Hmong]

finally I got them back to a healthy green after all the root aphid fuckups. we'll see how my soilmix is going to work out, its my first time in organics, i had to learn everything from zero just for my girls <3

a few cell pics from tha jungle, just to keep the vibe going



the internode building is really really good for only a 250W MH
they seem to love the 4500K spectrum. I expected them to strech much more even in veg. but surprisingly they are even tighter than my hybrids.

 

[#1cheesebuds]

So it looks like no one wants to try to scrog/bush out their pure thai sativas.
I would if I hade one growing.

 

[Donald Mallard]

So it looks like no one wants to try to scrog/bush out their pure thai sativas.
I would if I hade one growing.

the ones im growing it wouldnt be that easy to do,
they dont bend at all ,
they snap if you try ...

best results is from cuttings , they grow into a bush instead of a tree ..

 

[Elmer Bud]

G`day Bushie

I know its apples and oranges but ...
When I was in the Low Lands last year I saw how the boys over there keep up the vigour of NVL`s old cuts .
They take cuttings in Spring and put them out in the veggie garden till autumn . Then take a new cut and keep her as a mother indoors till the next spring .
The cuts I saw in their gardens were the most vigorous I`ve ever seen .

I think selections for yield have effected the gene pool as well . Guy`s like yourself who grow for personal consumption are less worried about bread .

NVL talked about people saying give us the pure strains . When he explained you will get 1/2 the yield they quieted down .

Having a pleasant few hundred mil of rain here ATM ...

Thanks for sharin

EB .

 

[Thule]

The feeling when you spend what feels like an eternity writing a reply, and then erase it by pressing back space at the wrong time... grr! Let's try that again. Shorter.

I've seen a few succesfull indoor Thai grows over the internet. The variety known as Mekong (Red Thai, Mango Thai) seems work ok. A grower called Squeasel at an uk forum even managed to make it look easy, and he was using coco. Ptg also had an inspirational Double Thai grow a few years back, and the end result knocked his socks off.

 

[bushweed]

Some Thai 82 with quotes from the breeder of the now defunct Green Hornet in Switzerland. This one was reproduced and shared by scrubdog, and is also present (I'm told) in some recent crosses by Reeferman as Lemon Thai. It displays occasional purple traits which is rare in Thai strains...

The Thai, Vietnamese, and Cambodian seeds all came from the same source. I met a guy who had travelled extensively in Asia and India in the late 70's and early 80's. during this time he collected many seeds and he gave me his collection. The seeds were very old and despite this some of the Thai Vietnamese and Cambodian grew, from these plants I made these seeds.

All of the Asian Sativas are prone to hermaphrodite. I used only the stable males and females to produce seed. Despite this there are still some Hemaphrodites present.
Thai 1: these are long and fine with typical sativa leaves, very thin and narrow with light green color. The flowers grow like cotton candy and have a sour taste similar to a Haze flavor. These were very difficult to get to finish indoors. They kind of flower forever. I had a reasonable result in about 4 months.
Thai 2: similar to Thai 1 but the flowers were more compact and they had red stripes on the stalk.
Both Thai strains seeds were made from the same male as there was only 1 good male there wasn't much of a choice. The male had red stripes corresponding to Thai 2.

This is a very rare and special landrace strain and worth more to me than all the fancy hybrids on the market. It is very similar to pure Haze except it is pure landrace Thai.

 

[curbiechris]

questions for all experienced with thais...

When growing Thai's indoor would you keep the relative humidity in the high 70s to match what would have been their natural enviroment?

When dealing with hermies, do you always cull?
If i found a mother that was a keeper i think i could live a few bananas... or take the time to cut those suckers off (i've done it with other plants)

 

[bushweed]

Hi curbiechris, I have a Thai line that produces 100% females and half of those are dioecious (hermies). It's annoying because the hermi pollen will seed other plants if they are near, thus carrying the trait into the offspring. Despite this I keep that Thai around because it has a sublime euphoric high.

It is said that you can breed dioecious traits out of a strain, as the quote below attests.

Most tropical sativas (especially Thai) are naturally hermie. If they aren't hermie then they aren't real Thai.

So I do not have this obsession with hating hermies and seed that I see all over the internet. It's just one more trait to me. I have the opposite problem... trying to get enough seed from the right crosses...

NCGA (Northern California Growers Association) successfully eliminated hermies from a Thai line and I use the same method. Basically I stress the hell out of my plants by constantly altering day length and this forces hermaphrodism so I know which plants to eliminate.

Hermaphrodism is just a trait like tall or short. It's no big deal and may even be genetically cross-linked to potency.

 

[Thule]

questions for all experienced with thais...

When growing Thai's indoor would you keep the relative humidity in the high 70s to match what would have been their natural enviroment?

When dealing with hermies, do you always cull?
If i found a mother that was a keeper i think i could live a few bananas... or take the time to cut those suckers off (i've done it with other plants)

Not grown many Thais but I don't think it's necessary to replicate the original growing conditions, in fact if you want to keep the plant in any reasonable size you may want to deprive it of too much water and humidity. The more water they get, the bigger they can grow. Another factor is of course root space, smaller is better if you don't want giant plants that take forever to finish, and growing in coco ables you to restrict the availability of various nutrients, especially nitrogen.

One more thing to consider is heat. Thailand often gets temperatures of 30c and more, even the nights are warm. Indoors we don't want that as most of the stretch happens after lights out. This is where LEDs and CFLs come in handy as they emit less heat than a HPS. Especially in the wintertime it is possible to keep tropical sativas very small if you're temperature range is around 15-22 degrees c. This is only for the big stretchers though, Ethiopian Highland ended up being 10cm tall during a mediterrarean winter.

 

[Rinse]

Agree 100% this is why so many legendary strains aren't a shadow of what they were 15/20/30 years ago. There exists a natural entropy, a progression away from potency in cultivars taken too long from their natural environment, and in particular from the great horticultural God, the Sun. The entire cannabis industry is plagued by it. Not one line has ever been maintained without a decline in psychoactivity in artificial commercial setups. Just an opinion of course.

An opinion shared by surprisingly few, I don't write much on the subject as it just seems to fall on deaf ears, but for me indoor is an imitation of the real thing, even where I grow at 52N the outdoor crop is far superior to the indoor equivalent.
The resin and psycho-activity is on the next level and everyone who samples agrees.

That's not to say I haven't smoked my share of great indoor weed, even stuff that gave us giggle fits like trippy outdoor bud, but that's few and far between and mainly hybrids that can actually deliver the goods under lights...Stuff like super skunk and white rhino back in the early 2000's...Im sure they were stronger and better than the cheese and amnesia that's around today.

Indoor lines though, after not too long become fragile and perform poorly outdoors, especially in a cold or otherwise rough climate,
mold in the rain, falling over in a stiff breeze, bug attacks etc...

So can good bud be grown indoor sure,
but for full psychoactivity and gene expression (including the full spectrum of terpenes of the chemotype), plants need sun.

Last but not least, you can never beat the taste of outdoor organic pot, in my personal preference and opinion.

 

[idiit]

i'm wid rinse and bushweed.

my landraces are much more potent and better in high effects than the adam strains i switched from (i tried a lot of adam strains). i try to stick to strains that have been properly preserved for their genetic diversity and not bottlenecked too much for the most part. i do like to test drive some of the older adam varieties that haven't been overworked too much.

overall i think the outdoor grown ( organic, proper maturity) are better. i've been getting surprisingly good results indoor test runs of some landraces lately though.

 

[Elmer Bud]

Some Thai 82 with quotes from the breeder of the now defunct Green Hornet in Switzerland. This one was reproduced and shared by scrubdog, and is also present (I'm told) in some recent crosses by Reeferman as Lemon Thai. It displays occasional purple traits which is rare in Thai strains...

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G`day Bushie

Hmmmm ...
I dunno if some stray pollen got loose or the seeds got mixed up .
Those plants look like hybrids to me .
I have observed a lot of sativas since I was a teenager .[almost 30 years ] Pre the Dutch gear I never saw resin on the leaves like that on females . And the male ? Is that a Thai male ??

This is what I have seen when I looked at Thai weed .

Now after reading the seed bank description I`m even more suspicious its not pure .
90 to 100 days for purple Thai weed ! Where do I get some lol .

When grown in an indoor garden, the cannabis grower would expect that the flowering period takes just about 13 to 14 weeks. Prior to this however, farmers are advised to limit the vegetative period to just about a week

If it is uncrossed seed , it is a variety very different to the generic, that I`ve seen before .

Thanks for sharin

EB .

 

[ThaiBliss]

Uh Oh... Here we go.



No matter, I love all the Thais people have been posting!


ThaiBliss

 

[Hmong]

When growing Thai's indoor would you keep the relative humidity in the high 70s to match what would have been their natural enviroment?

Only if you want them to become huge.
The more temp and rel hum the faster they will grow.
I have only 24°C and 42% and they do well.

 

[bushweed]

Hmmmm ...
I dunno if some stray pollen got loose or the seeds got mixed up .
Those plants look like hybrids to me .
I have observed a lot of sativas since I was a teenager .[almost 30 years ] Pre the Dutch gear I never saw resin on the leaves like that on females . And the male ? Is that a Thai male ??

This is what I have seen when I looked at Thai weed .

Now after reading the seed bank description I`m even more suspicious its not pure .
90 to 100 days for purple Thai weed ! Where do I get some lol .

If it is uncrossed seed , it is a variety very different to the generic, that I`ve seen before . EB .

Hi Elmer,

If the seedbank description says 90 to 100 days for the Thai 82, which is 13-15 weeks then that's definitely borderline, although for the progeny of parents selected for fast finishing, coupled with the normal exaggeration we expect from any seedbank that isn't run by a Mallard or Garcia, it may well fall within the parameters of what's possible. A reference might help.

Those plants were grown in NZ, and in the same way as indicas will betray more sativa like characteristics when grown in the tropics, so to do sativas take on indica like characteristics when grown in temperate climates. The reason this occurs is because what laymen call sativas and indicas, are in fact the same species - cannabis indica. The accepted understanding among cannabis afficianados is that Thais derive closely from chinensis varieties which consumers like you and I call indicas.

To your points regarding the pics above, I can understand your reservations. The leaves are a bit wide and there is some resin there, which the uninitiated don't associate with generic Thais, with generic being the operative adjective, because they certainly exist. These misunderstandings often arise because most people aren't aware that there are many different Thai types, not just the light green bamboo looking Laos border types that you've posted above. Resin traits are common enough in Thais, although some like Kanga's MM contains none. Here's some resinous bud shots from the 20+ week GN Thai stick mother Kanga gave me ...

And here's a resinous wider leaf Thai '78...

Here's some wide leaved pure Meao Thai courtesy of the Spanish forums..
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And to finish the conjecture off, here's a Thai shot from Kanga that baffled me early in my career, but bares out the point about sativa/indicas containing both broad and narrow leaf genetics
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Like I alluded to earlier, seedbanks don't have a good reputation for honesty, so your reservations may be spot on. But overall your doubts appear to be based more in armchair speculation than fact, so I hope I've refuted them to your satisfaction

 

[bushweed]

Here's some shots of Charlie's pure Meao Thai from the Spanish forums...Charlie reported that there is some variability, some show serrated leaves and bigger calyxes but normally they always smell kinda lemony or woody, not super intense. Good thing is that the line is clean from hermies. They normally finish at the end of December in northern hemisphere. He also said that the effect is similar like caffeine; it doesn’t come all from a sudden but progressively, you think you are ok but when you try to do stuff or talk then you realize you are so high.
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[/FONT]Here's some of that inconvenient resin again....
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Olé!

 

[Donald Mallard]

i am seeing resin the same on the thai im growing ,, was pretty surprised how resiny it was while dusting a bit of pollen over her ,
kanga mentioned some buds with a bit of chunk and resin on them vs the spindly style we often see on same variety ,
im pretty keen on a test smoke , patience with these types ,, lol ...

 

[Elmer Bud]

G`day Bushie , Don

The education is appreciated .
I was guarded about being critical and saying that`s not f-ing Thai lol .
I could get my head around the female being rare a variety .It can see similarity in the examples though not as extreme . But that male ???

How did the leaves on that fat leaf Thai look when it was mature ?
I have seen plants go from fat leaves to very thin as the plant put on mass .


That Nth Central Thai, Kanga and now Donald grow is a rare beast, in that it has extreme vigour and early finish . Mr Tiva`s were finished in early April ??
So would have begun flowering in days longer than 12 and up to 13 hours .
Which is the daylength at Donalds all year round .

How far along are yours ATM Don ?

There is much to learn .

Thanks for sharin

EB .

 

[bushweed]

Hi Elmer, you're referring to Prof's stupendous Hmong?? I'd also love to get an update off Donny boy and ah, eh ahem some fresh seeds of it too... Kanga uploaded this shot of a truncated Hmong, his last ever shot to MNS in mid May... might have been a clone, but definitely earlier than many, but perhaps not too dissimilar from BLBs, which seems pretty early to me too...