Orient Express & more from the Buddhist Arc

[Satyros]

The Kush x Skunk is a male, so I pulled that one. Doesn't seem to be anything that suggests any extra effort in trying to preserve. You'd expect it to be similar to Edelweiss (Kush x Skunk x N. Indian), and, I suppose, morphologically it's pretty similar, but again, from three weeks younger, outgrew it and started branching.

Of the younger set of plants, the Afghan is certainly most vigorous in growth. No signs of flower yet, so I topped it.

Normally you'd expect sativas to be slower in bud development and make fluffy ones, but, so far, the Mekong is actually competing with Kiss Dragon to show her nice roundies. The other ones are still pretty sparse. I suppose most people are picture fiends; some things I don't have are a camera, or nice indoor equipment. I can probably borrow the former in a couple weeks when some of these things should become quite photogenic.

New feedings for this phase are a serving of goat manure and some blackstrap molasses. Might need a little extra something before long, but for the most part, everything is looking happy.

 

[Satyros]

It's taking shape.

Seeing eight plants with well defined budding sites that can be seen from a distance. Only one strain with a duplicate female so far (Kiss Dragon).

The holdouts are:

Himalayan Gold. It's been sitting on "a few pistils" for a couple weeks, and only now is putting out a few more.

Afghan. It has plenty of distinct pre-flowers, but no sign of sex yet.

Orient Express #3. Although it continues to live, it's so slow and miniature that whatever it may do, is not going to amount to much. I've started clipping branches from the adult male.

Sexbud #2. I think I muffed this one and probably stuck the wrong seed in the pot. What's coming up is a fairly broad leafed indica of a lighter color, so I'm really starting to doubt it's a Sexbud variant, and pretty sure it's something else.

As the last feeding, I got an Espoma liquid mostly for kelp & bone meal, I think it's the one they call Start, but as a 1-2-2, it most closely resembles the ideal flowering ratio, which I took as 1-3-2.

Still favorably impressed with everything. There has been an average amount of lower/inner leaf loss, which is probably fine unless it spreads through the whole plant. Aside from the early attack on Orient Express, there has been a minimum of chews by grasshoppers, caterpillars, or whoever. Also a very minimum of leaf tip burn or other signs of stress. Even the Edelweiss, it never actually looked overheated, I'm just throwing that guess out towards its slow growth. Others have been able to get it solid and bushy, although I've only seen that from indoor growing.

So yeah. This gang rocks the socks off nearly 20 years of bagseed grows. Conceivably, it may even smoke better. It actually is true that...a bagseed plant...flowered indoors under "less than ideal" lights can produce dense, sticky bud that is much better than the bag it came in. This method only really works for the tops of plants, which I usually did in twos or fours, although it did generate a single cola the size of a human forearm when I tried it that way.

 

[Satyros]

"It" shows some pistils now. Best guess is I mixed up the second Sexbud with Nirvana's Swiss Cheese, Swiss Miss x Cheese, something like a pile of Skunk crossed to a Nepali. This one has fairly broad-ish leaves with some deep indentations, which seems to match at least some pics of Swiss Cheese, so, pending further development, it's most likely I made a mistake with a label when planting, and this is pretty obviously no Sexbud.

That just leaves the Afghan as yet to reveal its gender; it's getting close, but, if female, needs to start soon, to stand a chance at beating the cold. They probably are a bit resistant, but you don't want to experiment much with frost and freezing if avoidable. Next few weeks should be some spiffy growing weather, but it does eventually stop.

Hopefully those few weeks will start filling with shiny stuff & scents

Edit: mini-Orient Express has pistils. If "cutting the stem completely" is not an environmental stress that produces more males...well...I dunno, either way this thing is pretty durable. However, not sure I want to hold it for a couple more months so it can produce one joint.

 

[Satyros]

Moving into the final phase here, since there are now trichomes on both Kiss Dragons. I think even the Afghan might be female, but give it a few days to be sure.

So just a few notes on growth habits. With small plants, I usually try to go for two or four tops, but that didn't happen with all of these.

I managed to squeak out four on Sexbud and Mekong High, which both made a pleasing candelabra shape. Orient Express only has two tops, and those extended well beyond the rest of the plant; the tops are at least twice as long as the main stem. With most plants, it's the first branches beneath the tops that grow big and tall; the Mekong is a little different in that the *second* set of branches from the cut, are the ones that reached the canopy.

With the single-top plants, these are the reasons and the apparent progress. Kiss Dragon #2 simply flowered too quickly, then it stretched considerably beyond all its contemporaries, and looks like it is filling in with a great deal of flowering.

Edelweiss never grew that much, so topping was never really an option. It stretched an average amount, and, after a couple weeks of flowering, there are still only a few sites and those are still pretty small. When comparing information that says it does well outdoors in "long warm Mediterranean summer", and that, in actual practice, that seems to mean Switzerland, I just wind up guessing that it would probably do better in a northern environment, planted prior to July.

Nemesis survived my attempt to kill it with a flimsy cup, so, in this case, the grower knocked off about three weeks of its development. It stretched an average amount, so, although shorter than Kiss Dragon, it looks like it will flower almost that much. Really not bad for a comeback, and a good example of why not to throw something away because it looks bad.

The last Orient Express, well, it's almost silly, looks like a three node seedling with a flower on top. Not sure what to do with this. But, as a testament to Ace, with their regular seeds, that was 3/3 germination, and two females, with one female remaining that way, despite being bitten in half. Had it been bitten earlier in the year, it would have had a chance to do some regrowing, but at a late stage, mere survival is pretty impressive. Just not very productive.

I did not top Himalayan Gold since its wild growth pattern did the equivalent thing automatically. Although its information explicitly states, suited for cool mountain air, I don't see it as being in any way impeded by heat. It's a bit on the slow side of flowering; but the backside of that, given some additional time, perhaps it becomes the heaviest yielder. At least, information from others says it's the kind of thing to bulk up so much, it can't support itself. I think it's the only one of these strains with that kind of reputation.

 

[Satyros]

Trichomes starting to run across the field, good times. Kiss Dragon #1 becoming shiny/frosty. I'm still favorably impressed by this obscure strain; the only potential drawbacks are:

Super stretchy. Definitely a "size doubler". General info says there is nothing you can do to keep Mekong High or Himalayan Gold under five feet tall, but, so far, that hasn't happened; this one easily exceeds them. Since it's not indoors, I don't care about stretch that much, however, the first Kiss Dragon with two tops and long branches, I would have to say it's not really filling in the extra space like a lot of other things do. The tops & branch ends look great, but the "inner stuff" is conspicuously absent.

In that sense, the single top version will probably have a more pleasing/fuller look to it. Instead of long, mostly empty branches, it's just flowering right at the nodes, and will probably wind up becoming a stalk of continuous bud. I don't know how that compares to its Black Domina parent, and neither one of these fit the "so dark, almost black" trait that is apparently highly sought in that line.

So it may not be the heaviest yielder, and perhaps unlikely to sport the Black Domina grail, but clearly the leader in the flowering charge of this batch of stuff. Which, in and of itself, doesn't make the smoke any better or worse than anything else...just most likely the first we'll get to try.

Afghan would probably be the last, it's stretched to be as big as anything else, but so far has refused to budge from pre-flowers into the real thing. Although it does make the concept of "hybrid vigor" almost invalid; well, that's not really an accurate comparison, but this turtle easily overwhelms the hybrids. Planted last, and some of its leaf stems are about as thick as the whole Edelweiss.

 

[Satyros]

Out of these things, it looks like Nemesis is the least stretchy.

It's not really even as tall as the Edelweiss. That Edelweiss is...strange, it had an early rush of trichomes and the pistils have shrunken down already. It looks almost finished, or at least the fastest developing flowers, just...on a tiny scale. I could smoke it in one night, if not at once. It's just a top and a decent node and a few miniature specks lifted relatively high on a stretchy stem. So it's quite fine looking, as a fairy wand.

By contrast the Nemesis has six or seven meaty nodes that almost disappear into the soil. For a small plant, it's fully loaded, resembles a club or shillelagh. I've never grown one that came out so compact. It, and most of the rest, aren't into trichomes yet (mainly just Edelweiss, Kiss Dragon, Sexbud).

Despite its preflowers, the Afghan is outpouring a shower of what I would call vegetative growth more than stretching, getting more branchy and making a coat of leaves that, yeah, it's kind of like a big turtle. Maybe the equinox will trigger it. Don't really want it to keep increasing!

 

[Satyros]

Haha well, apparently Afghan answers to speculation, and whipped out a couple sets of pistils. Not bad for a free regular seed. And that was the last one that needed to flower, so it's all gravy from here.

Most of the other strains do have trichomes upon close inspection, but only a few are noticeable from a distance. And those are all still thin and mostly clear, but I think we can safely estimate that the frosty ones will be taken first, and the Afghan last.

 

[Satyros]

Looks like, due to a room cleaning maneuver, the potential pollen has been ousted, and I may have already hacked that male too much for him to do any more. So the feeble attempt at breeding is probably nixed.

That's unfortunate because the Mekong High is quite an impressive plant.

I guess it's down to experiencing strains and maybe find some favorites. Who am I to judge anything that might be world class, or close, or whatever, if I really don't know what they are to begin with?

I thought breeding was Dutch, and only recently found out it's more from California. Ok...well in "early times", there was Haze, which, I don't believe I've ever smelled anything that resembles fruit...also, Skunk, which was the only thing I heard people talk about.

In my rubish terminology, Skunk is simply anything with that smell. I can't say if it has anything to do with Skunk #1, or something far from it that has enough Afghan to generate the pungency, but I do remember finding it a long time ago.

One of the first times I was able to buy it, turns out that one of those guys' dad sold crystal meth to Mikhail Baryshnikov (the dancer). Weird, but ok.

Spain was nothing in those days. One of the only chicks I've ever known to get a breast reduction, which was understandable, cause hers pretty much stacked on her belt, had been in Spain for about a year in the mid 80s. Said there wasn't actually cannabis, but people rolled hash into cigarettes. So I doubt strains were particularly well known in Spain at that time.

Bit further along, I remember skunk from New York twice--once from a guy who randomly came through a car wash. Another was from the skins, and here's what happened with that stuff. Kreator came through, I can't remember what tour but around 1990-91 and...well, the bag's effect on me caused me to pursue a skirt, which is what I went off and did. My friends stuck around and were able to go on the bus to smoke out Mille and the band. The German world-touring opinion at the time, was: "We love American weed, it's better than hash!"

Hard to draw a direct conclusion, but, at least, it points in the direction that, whatever we would have considered good quality back then, would have been impressive anywhere.

The last time I had a really good skunk smelling thing, it was in a bag, in a bag, in the glove compartment of a car with the windows rolled up. I could smell it unmistakingly as soon as I stepped outside. It was like a gob of white goo with bits of green and purple stuck to it. It came from that well-known cannabis hotspot, Utah.

Extremely strong, it was almost literal paralysis. Maybe the strongest I ever had in this country. I've had California and Colorado "something", and, yes, a lot of downer weed makes you feel like not doing much, but the Utah was more like, you put the bowl down and you're finished. You just stop moving. Staring at the wall is fine, because you're too out of your gourd to have any idea that you are staring at the wall. A small activity like reading, or paying attention to something, is out of the question. You'd have a better chance of counting to one sometime later on. None of that bothers you, because it feels so great, nothing like a mind or an activity could possibly make it any better.

I rarely got any sativa. One of the last times, I met someone new at a public place and while I was waiting...out of nowhere, the Strawberry Cough guy zings around the corner and drove right to me. Tried to sell me a selection of things other than weed, so, that was the last time we spoke. I wound up getting a bag of lanky, fluffy buds that were so light, a quarter filled the bag with only the flap folded over. I suppose that was some kind of sativa.

So even though I...can't legitimately attach a name to anything from the U. S. in over thirty years, I understand potency/effects at least a little bit, or enough to try to sort them.

 

[Satyros]

How's this for a psychic connection....

I had a dream that goats were out of their pen eating cannabis.

Then I woke up, and goats were out of their pen eating cannabis.

Fortunately, it looks like they had only some leaves from Afghan & Himalayan Gold, but they also had two tops of the "supposed to be Sexbud". So that one is only half of what it was.

While de-escalating the situation, I noticed the Afghan is flowering at the tops, so it's all in the final phase now. The apparent reason for the escape is that the pen door was open.

We do have a 10 x 10 fence cube (i. e., has a roof) that would be goat resistant; I didn't use this because it would be impossible to conceal. If you wrapped it with tarps, then you'd have something that looks suspicious and might be putting the plants in shade. If I could do this openly, it would be perfect, but those days are yet to come.

 

[Satyros]

As another tangent, from showing this genetic library to someone who saw the 80s greenhouse op I've been talking about, which one looks most like the "Hawaiian"....and...big surprise...Afghan. I guess a lot of people, myself included, never really knew what they had.

The nice thing now, is that, a *lot* of the tops are looking less like a 1/8th, and more like a 1/4. Starting on the older plants, with the onset of Autumn, there's a swoosh of yellow going across them, and it's likely that by harvest, which is probably when I will photo them, they will just be stalks of flowers. Nearly perfect ripening weather now...dry, sunny, and around 80ish for the foreseeable future.

Some of those plants probably could give you that sharp, 30 minute, character-less buzz, but I don't really want to rape this stuff too early. Since what might have been my pollen seems to have gotten blotted by a dog-hairy pillow, then, some of the lower branches and popcorn might be debatable. If so, snatching them soon would probably allow a few weeks' additional energy towards the main parts of the plants.

Kiss Dragon is maybe a little weird. Its lowest branches actually have some modestly plump tops; there just isn't much additional budding on the inner part of the plant. Although it is quite stretchy, the branches are very upright, so it winds up with a narrow chimney-shaped footprint.

 

[Satyros]

Since the demise of the pollen, I decided to sacrifice some lower branches, to conserve energy for the rest of the plant. I left them on Kiss Dragon, since those are slightly bulky; but, as mentioned, there is not really any interior budding on this plant. Especially compared to Orient Express and Himalayan Gold--those seem particularly generous in covering their branches with bloom.

Mekong High is pretty frosty at this point. Orient Express is a bit on the slow side of trichome explosion--it may be producing the greatest quantity of flower clusters, as a trade for going slow in development. The feminized version would probably behave a little differently; at any rate, this one conformed to expectations--a couple weeks' delay compared to its contemporaries, both in terms of hitting a vegetative boost, and then on the trichomes. So it's no speed demon unless compared to a true equatorial sativa.

I have a feeling that the faster developing kinds are on their way to a final feeding and then just some water until they are finished. If counted as flowering (emergent pistils) around 8/26, then I guess they are about six weeks into it, and none of those are ones I'd attempt to carry until a heavily-ripened stage of substantially darkened trichs. Edelweiss maybe should go that way, but since it's developing the fastest, then it shouldn't take much longer. It just...I don't know...might crank out 1/8th or something actually useful...I can't quite call it a "runt" since it was the first thing that popped, but, considering it was grown in the same conditions as everything else and never had any problems, I really don't know why it's so small. With my luck, that implies that it will be the absolute bestest and most favorite one of them all.

I've experienced enough sativa to at least recognize the creeper/soaring/psychological sort of effect, and I gather the thing to watch for is swollen, milky trichomes. Now as far as a 50/50 hybrid--something that has that effect plus a noticeable body stone--I kind of have doubts if there is truly such a thing; or, to the extent I have experienced it, the things that can do it, seem to have been less potent than things that are firmly on one side or the other. Kiss Dragon is the attempt to be that bridge (I think). Whereas Himalayan Gold should lean towards indica and Nemesis should be towards sativa, in terms of effect, even though they would be considered 50/50 in terms of their parents.

Although I've done a bunch of bagseed runs that gave plenty of yield of a mostly couchlock nature, usually by this point, there were a lot of burned leaf tips, and, because indoors, spider mites. These are all still quite free of those issues, and, I also noticed that when a bagseed plant sheds a leaf, it just takes one light touch and they drop. However, on these plants, yellow leaves stick to the plant as well as green ones for many days. They have all been superior in every way, and zero of the "oh no what's wrong" problems that could be difficult or time-consuming to repair.

The worst aspect of the grow is that there is only one level row. Some of the plants grew on a slight slope, so they're not exactly vertical. Once a few older ones are harvested, then with some free space, I could rig some stuff to keep them from flopping over if need be.

 

[Guest]

That's a great journal!Your narrative skills (and stories)make up for the lack of pictures!Damn,it'd be nice to have a smoke with Mille
Orient Express is probably my favourite strain!Hope you'll like it,really exceptional effect.
Greetings from the land of Satyros

 

[Satyros]

Ah, Orient Express, a favorite? Any particular reasons? After buying it, and reading more about what Ace has, some of their stuff like Malawi and Panama also sounds great. The reasons I'm not in a huge rush to try those, are, the outdoor situation...sure it's better here than in the Netherlands, but it's still a far cry from the equator, so they might not work. Also, those kinds of things seem to frequently be credited with edginess/raciness, while Orient Express is not.

I had no idea that my friends got on the bus with Kreator; found out about it a few days later. But it was some really good NY seedless skunk. On that note, I also cannot say I ever experienced anything with the scent of diesel or any kind of fuel. That actually sounds a bit unappetizing. I'd probably try burning it, but would be less resolute about raising a plant for a few months based on that.

Some of the only famous people I ever met were Tom and Martin from Celtic Frost, but that's just because they did a meet and greet, wasn't a free invitation from having a bag of smoke. And since that was 2007-ish, it's probably safe to say there was potent cannabis all over Europe, and nobody would be easily impressed by whatever Americans had.

It's probably fun to be trendy with the pictures, but I think I will just wait to do some profiles and top down views as I bring stuff inside to chop. Looking at the Edelweiss today, it has zero extended pistils, they are all withered down, so it's nearly done.

Maybe on that one I will just do close-ups so it looks bigger than it really is...

 

[Guest]

Hehe,Tom and Martin,looks like you must have been in awesome concerts I can only dream of...

The effect depends on the pheno,but is similar.Potent but not racy."different than usual" high you will get what I'm saying when you try it,one of a kind.Can make you feel very happy or balanced depending on the mood.It is an all-day smoke to me,it is great before bed,too.Very clear high with mellow comedown.The taste/aroma is also unique.Great yielder.I will have to buy the regular version to make some f2 s and crosses,love that herb.

 

[Satyros]

Lol, right now I have a black eye from someone's skull at the Venom show (Mantas version). Through the years, I have made it to a fair number of shows, but never very often and usually inconvenient. It's hard to imagine ever stopping, about the same as weed.

Nice praise for the OE. I don't know the phenos very well, but, the regular seed is supposed to be more sativa, and to all appearances, it's the most sativa-looking of all these plants. Really looking forward to trying it now; if it's slow to ripen, sounds worth it.

 

[Guest]

Hehe...I've had a black eye from a skull in a motorhead concert in1998 tour in Athens.
My last metal concert was the 'big 4' about 5 years ago...It was great but i was disappointed they didn't have alice in chains with them in my country.My best metal gig ever must have been Trouble i think...

Yes,it will be great,vietnam black dominants have the clearest happy effect.

 

[Satyros]

Ah yeah, Trouble is a really old band, from what I recall, one of the first to go into the doomy sludge sound, maybe along with St. Vitus. Hadn't heard of them being known for a spectacular show, so that's interesting.

In terms of development, the first plants, Kiss Dragon, Edelweiss, Sexbud, and Mekong High have yellowed over pretty much all their fan leaves, so they must be nearing the end. However, the Orient Express of the same age, is still very green. So, I can't speak as to the feminized version, but the regular seems to be the closest one to a traditional, long flowering sativa. I've seen a couple debates about the Mekong High, the breeder claims it to be on the faster side, some growers said theirs needed longer than the claim.

The Mekong buds are a bit fatter, a little bit indica style. OE still has that long look, but even if they don't plump up very much, it's so prolific, it might give the biggest yield. I think that would be worth an additional two or three weeks. The plants are basically dictating the terms of their ripening--nothing I can really do to prolong the finishers, or accelerate the OE. Final feeding and "flush" on those first four seems to be in order...not that you really flush organics, just that once those leaves are gone, the plant can only thrive as bud stalks for a limited time.

I'd have to guess that a regular Orient Express seed is very, very close to a Vietnam Black landrace, and that if planted earlier in the season, it would have gotten even bigger. The two main tops on this one are approaching the largest, forearm-sized single cola that I ever created. The difference is I made that first one intentionally, versus all this stuff is what the plants normally do on their own.

 

[Satyros]

Race to the finish--

Some of these plants don't participate in a race. Orient Express is really just now starting to load with trichomes--although that includes the 6", one bud plant that was bitten in half.

As for the faster ones, starting week 7 of flowering, if counted from when the pistils emerged. I think the Sexbud literally ripens the fastest. I scoped it, and it showed about 10% amber. I decided to test its smallest bud, because we don't want this one inducing lethargy, or resembling indica.

It had no lethargy, and it was a fairly unique buzz in my experience. Pleasant, calm, anti-anxiety, somewhat along the lines of sub-lingual vitamin B. I'll guess that 1-2 weeks can get it a little stronger, but any longer would probably risk changing its character.

The fast developing indica hybrids, Edelweiss and Kiss Dragon, still *don't* have any amber, which they probably need. Kiss Dragon should come out as a 50/50, whereas Edelweiss should feel about 80% indica. There isn't enough Edelweiss to test it, so we'll have to do a visual guess on that one. Kiss Dragon might offer a test bud, plus, it has a second backup plant. On those younger, single-stalk plants, Kiss Dragon and Nemesis are both squeezing out about the same amount of bud. The difference being Nemesis is very compact, and Kiss Dragon stretched almost twice as tall--if I made a gif of their alternating pictures, it would look like a bouncing slinky of weed.

Even the Afghan starts making narrow leaves around its new flowers. I don't think it could actually be watered by rain, which is coming soon for the first time in like a month. Never having flowered outdoors before, I've browsed around to see what rain can do to the flowers. Light rain...pretty much nothing, makes sense. A lot of times, it's said, don't worry, THC is not water-soluble. This seems irrelevant? The issue would be whether there is enough physical punishment to burst the glands. If so, then your THC wouldn't dissolve, it would stick the the plant and start degrading.

Frequently, our rains are somewhat violent storm fronts. It doesn't usually last very long, but it usually blows in on a fairly hefty wind and pours pretty hard. That gives me about 48 hours to evaluate whether this stuff needs protection.

If it doesn't get creamed...so far I can't criticize the flowering at all. I haven't found any "nanners", and I haven't seen any of those weird blunt/rounded leaves, both of which were pretty typical of indoor bagseed. Overall, it mostly looks like an inverse proportion of the amount of yield vs. the speed of ripening.

 

[Satyros]

So far, the rain was just showers. Probably nothing damaging. However, in terms of, can the water weigh something down and make it bend...yes, only the Orient Express. So much for the two...it's more like four of the largest colas I ever made. That one will certainly be on the upper side of yield; Himalayan Gold and Afghan might pursue it, but they aren't there yet. Mekong High buds are a little fatter, but they don't quite cover the stalks to the same extent as Orient Express.

Stronger storms are in the forecast for the next couple of days; I'm still not sure whether to take evasive action. A clever, experienced person could probably propose a limit for wind speed & doppler intensity of rain that can threaten cannabis.

I did try a test of the lowest branches of Kiss Dragon, and, it seemed like a more "familiar" buzz than Sexbud, but it also said "give me a couple more weeks before I'm ready". This is about the beginning of week 7 for the first wave of plants. The temptation of scarfing little stuff is, admittedly, strong. You only get a premature sneak peek, but it eliminates the plant sending energy to newer or lesser growth, and it will have to go to the tops. So no-touchy the pinecones, but a little more popcorn might be on the fast track to our bloodstreams.

As an avid flower smoker, that does have its merits over the time/money to scoop up someone else's commercial product.

 

[Guest]

Nice to hear OE is bulking up!
I don't fulfill the requirements to suggest a wind speed limit ,but I'm sure you know you'd better have them staked and it would certainly help to cover them.
I have already prematurely harvested half a plant so I would have something to smoke and not mess around with commercial.And it is better(at least in my opinion) than the commercial there is around at this time(albanian brickweed)...