Nitrogen/other deficiency?

[MynameStitch]

I would try to bring them back to life, cannabis is a very resilient plant and they can live and go through very tough times, but when they are small and starting out, they are like newborn humans and if they get sick or injured chances are they are toast, but I would try to save yours if I were you.

 

[phattybudz]

Thx for the super quick response!

I will do my best to save them...it's about 20 gallons of water in the system, so I should add in 300ppm power plant and... how much cal-mag or epsom salt? I'll post updated pics and status tomorrow and say a hail mary for em.

 

[MynameStitch]

cal mag is better than epsom salts, liquid form you get it quicker. would not use epsom salts if you are using cal mag and I would not use more than 3 or 4 ml of the cal mag, per gallon. If you want to add sulfur to your mixture add epsom salts but add 1/2 teaspoon or 1/4 teaspoon per gallon of epsom salts.

 

[phattybudz]

Ok guys, here are pics of the plants, after one week of abuse (me taking care of them...) including not being fed for 2 days.

I just mixed my nutes to Stitch's specifications (I think...my 20 gal. of tap water was at 200ppm, I mixed 50ml calmag, like 25ml epsom salts, and then 300 ppm of power plant, and now my ppm is at like 940... this seems high and scary to me and I'm hoping I haven't already screwed up again...I guess I can add more water if that's too high? I'm going to feed them after this fully mixes, and I will update how they handle it in a few days.
















I don't believe in god but I'm praying for these babies...

 

[Guest]

Whats the label say about iron for that product...

Botanicare Power Plant???

I also note with some interest the label says it contains magnesium sulphate...

epsoms salt....

 

[phattybudz]

.5% magnesium, nothing about iron. Are you thinking there will be too much mg?

 

[Guest]

Did you use cal mag in your original mix???

 

[MynameStitch]

I still say it's a sulfur deficiency...... also try epsom salts or something else with sulfur, it's worth a try, because I want to see if canna is correct or wrong...... the only way to find out is if we try a sulfur based product only.......

 

[phattybudz]

I did not use cal-mag in my original mix. Someone else left a tip in my grow diary to "DUMP OUT ALL WATER NOW!
NEXT refill and let them be in just tap water
for 2 weeks to heal them if possible?????
THEN after they look better,and have healthy roots(WHITE)
go easy with food and no need for salts and shit????
remember my tip is GO EASY!
FEED LIGHT,good luck......"

What do you guys think about that?

I think the roots are white still though... I've got epsom in there, so we will see what happens...

 

[Guest]

Its not going to be that easy....

calmag plus contains iron....

Thats the reason I asked if he used calmag in the original mix...

 

[Guest]

Thats seems like it should tell you a little something....

magnesium sulphate contains more sulfur than magnesium....the plant needs less....

The original mix does not appear to have an iron source....

Calmag would provide that...

and it looks like iron def to me....

What I would like to have for a more rational approach is...

the label information from both calmag plus and botanicare power plant...

that includes the elements(npk and micros) and the derived by part of the label....

 

[phattybudz]

Power Plant:
total Nitrogen: 3.0%
.1% ammoniacal nitrogen
2.5% nitrate nitrogen
.4% other water soluble nitrogen
Available phospate (P2OS) 1.0%
Soluble Potash (K2O) 4.0%
Calcium 1.0%
Magnesium .5%
non-plant food .1% sodium silicate

Derived from: ammoniacal nitrate, ammonium molybdate, potassium nitrate, calcium nitrate, ferric nitrate, cupric nitrate, manganese nitrate, zinc nitrate, potassium phosphate, potassium borate, magnesium sulfate


Cal-mag plus

Total nitrogen 2.0%
1.94% nitrate nitrogen, .06% water soluble nitrogen
caclim 3.2%
magnesium 1.2% water soluble
iron .1% chelated from fe

derived from: calcium nitrate, magnesium nitrate, iron edta



Is that what you mean?

 

[Guest]

Yes perfect...
Power plant contains magnesium sulfate(epsoms salt) this would clearly lessen the chance for a sulfur def... contains sulfur and magnesium.....

But there is no source for iron that I can see.... it was suggested by me and another person it looks like iron def... cal mag contains enough iron to avoid a def if thats it....

Im going to keep this as simple as possible...

Here is what I think you should do....

Dump it again....
Use only cal mag and power plant.....

MIx up a spray bottle of epsoms salt and water....

Let your plant try to recover using cal mag and power plant....

If it doesnt that would probably prove its not iron....

if that doesnt work then use the foliar spray of epsoms salt.... with the same reservoir ferts.....

if that works you know its a shortage of sulfur.....


Since power plant contains only .5% magnesium it must be supplemented with something else...in this case the best choice is cal mag.....

The bottom line we are trying to isolate the problem between iron def and sulfur def....

If we add calmag plus we would not be adding sulfur...only iron.... so this should be a good way to determine which is the problem....

 

[phattybudz]

erg...ok...that sounds like it makes sense, it sucks that I've wasted all this power plant and cal-mag already, but oh well I guess...not TOO expensive of a lesson. I will have to let more tap water sit out so they will be starved until tomorrow morning, or i could buy a trashcan to mix my new nute solution in (which I need to do anyways,) and leave them feeding until tomorrow morning...

should I starve em till then or feed em what's in there until morning?

 

[Guest]

You should never starve them except at the end....

the thing about hydro is you can always dump it and start again at a point of moderation.....starving them doesnt make any sense to me...


By the way....IMO your ph never needs to be lower than 5.8


a range of something like 5.8 to 6.3 is ideal....

 

[phattybudz]

OOOOOOOOOOk, I am about to redrain and fill up with 300ppm power plant and 4 or 5 ml calmag per gallon... how long should it be before I see any changes, like 5 days?

I guess I should have asked this sooner since I'm about to refill, but hopefully somebody will respond quickly... what ratio should I set up the power plant to cal-mag? Because I'm not sure if it's supposed to be 300ppm power plant + calmag or 300 ppm total... Thanks for all the help guys!

 

[Guest]

Yup that should do it...


You need to see some new growth...


For hydroponics, use between 1/4 ounce and 1 ounce of Power Plant per gallon of water, depending on stage of plant growth. When replenishing nutrient reservoir, add Power Plant at 1/4 strength. Change nutrient reservoir every 2 weeks. If using reverse osmosis or growing in coco peat, use 1 teaspoon per gallon of Botanicare Cal-Mag Plus in addition to Power Plant.


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This suggests that half strength is about right I think...

You want 300ppm of power plant then add the half teaspoon of cal mag per gallon......

 

[phattybudz]

Alllllllllllright, there is now 300ppm power plant and 80ppm cal-mag (55ml).

Let's see what happens! Thanks again.

edit: So, are those yellowed leaves gone forever then? And will damage like this affect yield if they recover? Sorry for the barrage of questions, I'm just so new at this and want to learn everything I can.

 

[Guest]

First a question for you....

how did you determine botanicare power plant was your fert???

 

[phattybudz]

A friend who help me get setup recommended the botanicare line, and I knew absolutely nothing about it so I listened.