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Newbie grow room setup questions: hydroponics, grow mediums

tuna

New member
Hi. First time grower here. I've read through Jorge Cervantes' bible, and everything I could find on the internet. I've got 10 Nirvana Seeds AK48 in the mail. So I've got it down to this:

-I want a perpetual grow, so I'm going to have one grow tent thats 39.5"x39.5"x80" with a 400 watt MH conversion bulb setup for mothers, cloning, and vegging.
-I'll have another grow tent thats 56"x56"x80" for flowering. The tent company recommends a 600watt bulb for that tent, but its over 4'x4', so I'm thinking 1000 watt HPS? I can use a ducted reflector and pump air through it to keep the heat down if thats the issue of concern. I'm just thinking, the tent is over 4.5 ft x 4.5 ft and I'll probably have at least 16 plants flowering at the same time- from what I've read 600 watts wont cut it.
-I want to use hydroponics. I'm smart enough and when you really get into it, you start to realize that hydroponics arent that complicated. I've figured ebb and flow for the flowering room, unless someone can tell me why I should use another method, but for the vegging tent where I will have mothers, clones, and vegging plants that all require different amounts of nutrient solution, I should probably use a top feed drip system. Which is fine, from what I understand I can build it to be the same basic setup as an ebb and flow system, just the pump will run to drippers instead of flooding a tray.

As far as grow mediums, Jorge raves about rockwool for how easy it is, how its impossible to over-water your plants with it, etc. But then I've read a lot online about people who hate it. Apparently, from what I've read online, your PH will slowly creep up, and that you're supposed to flush rockwool every once in a while- does anyone know where detailed rockwool instructions are? How about coco coir, is it any easier to use? I'm looking for something forgiving to start my seedlings, clones, and vegges in.

So far, my plan is to start seedlings and clones in 1" rockwool plugs, stick them in 3" or 4" rockwool cubes for vegging, and then use hydroclay from there in the flowering room. In the flowering room, should I just fill the whole flood tray with hydroclay and stick the 4" rockwool cubes around in a grid pattern? Or should I pot the rockwool cubes in individual netted pots filled with hydroclay? If so, what size netted pots are we talking about? I don't really undertand the pros and cons of either option. I watched the video I Grow Chronic where the guy just fills his entire flood tray with hydroclay, but then I've seen a lot of pictures of ebb and flow SOG grow room setups where every plant has its own netted pot.

Also, I'm trying to grow as much as possible given my space limitations of those grow tents, and I'm also trying to keep this low maintenance, so I'm thinking a SOG setup in the flowering room. From what I understand, that just means starting the entire flowering room at the same time when the clones are only 6" to 8" tall and cramming all the plants in there so you're only really harvesting the tops. Is that correct? Also, some online resources I've found stated that each plant in a SOG should get 1 square foot, and that any less will result in less total bud. However, on this website I've seen pictures of HUGE SOG setups by people who obviously know what they're doing, and it looks like they just cram as many netted pots onto their ebb and flow table as they can. And it doesnt look like those pots are more than 8" in diameter. So whats the answer?

Please, help out a newb, any answers to my questions or critiques of my plans would be appreciated.

A couple more details:
-each grow tent will have its own carbon filter and its own inline fan to draw out air. I dont forsee a need to have any CO2 supplements because I've read that your fan should be able to completely exchaneg the air in your grow chamber in 5 minutes- my fans should be able to exchange the air in the tents in less than 1 minute.
 

Dr Watt

Who What
I suggest rockwool which you hand water with excess draining to waste. This is more efficient on nutrient than you'd think 'cos you don't need to water much each time... 15% runoff of water input is fine (edit NO RUNOFF works too). The next easy suggestion that delivers bigtime is DWC (deepwaterculture) where roots start in a little basket with expanded clay balls and grow into a bucket/reservoir of air bubbling nutrient water. You can have an oblong bucket with a lid to grow a number of plants. All you need is a bucket/box with lid, netpots for each plant, and an aerator pump for the water that they sit over. Finally, some people would argue soil is the easiest - but if your mix isn't good then you will get bad results :joint:
 
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Y

yamaha_1fan

I would use 1"" rockwool to start seedlings, and put in 6"net pots with hydroton to veg. I wouldnt put them in 4" rockwool. I have heard all the bad things about rockwool as well. The hydroton floats so filling the table with it may be an issue.

My clones are in a bubbler as we speak and I plan on putting them right into 6" net pots with no rockwool when they root.
 
Yes, SOG is generally considered to be anywhere from 4 plants per sqft up to 1 plant per sqft. The difference is total plant count of course, but also the amount and proper use of pruning required and total veg time.
I like 1 plant per sqft. The veg time is 'only' 14days and the total plant count is manageable. You will prune only the very bottom of the plants and retain the secondary branches as they will fill in the sqft and are definitely a bigger part of your yield than a 4 per sqft setup.
Clone in 1 - 1 1/2" RW cubes...but go into rocks from there, not bigger RW unless you are going to use only RW for the entire grow.
Use an ebb/flow with gro rocks in regular pots, not the netted ones. Either 1gal or 2gal but the 1gallons are just fine for plants vegged 14days or less. Place the pots in a tray for flooding...or use a multi-flow bucket type setup.

Alternatively...you can certainly just transplant your RW cuttings into pots of Sunshine #4 media and have a crop that is very hard to kill or otherwise totally F-up. With hydro...even the simple ebb/flow...it is possible to screw up and kill them in 24hrs flat. Something that a 'beginner' should keep in mind.
 
tuna said:
As far as grow mediums, Jorge raves about rockwool....how its impossible to over-water your plants with it,
I just have to say something about that.
BS. We don't have to look very hard at all to find water logged plants in RW.
 

tuna

New member
Thanks a lot for all the advice guys. Starting in 1" rockwool or even jiffy pellets and then going straight to another hydroponic growing medium is definitely something I could do. What do you guys think about jiffy pellets, or any other alternative for sprouting and cloning?

Anonymiss what do you mean by "rocks"? Do you literally mean gravel or some other rock-like medium, or do you mean hydroton?

If I'm going to be using pots, thats something I have to plan around because I have to build my flood and drain table to a specific height. How high do you flood til, the top of the growing medium, right?

Things are looking good. I can't wait to get those seeds.
 
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Sorry...ya, I mean gro rocks, clay pebbles, expanded clay, hydroton etc...

Jiffy cubes are great. Especially if you will be planting into a peat/perlite mix like Sunshine mix. You can use the rooted jiffies in a hydroponic system, but you have to be careful. By it's very nature, hydroponic setups require frequent watering, much more so than a pot of soilless media. If you aren't careful, you can end up keeping the jiffy cube soaked 24/7 and you will rot the plant stem right at it's base...not a pretty sight!
But you can use them quite easily in a DWC or E&F if you are aware of this...and if your water levels are correct anyways, it won't be a problem.
With DWC, your water level is only even with the very bottom of the net pot or even 1/2 - 1" below...the jiffy will usually stay dry.
With E&F...you will NEVER flood so that you actually come up to the cube you used for rooting in...whether it's a jiffy or a RW cube. I think the maximum standard for E&F flooding is 60% up the pot...but can be as little as 25...usually 40-50%.
Make your table 6-8" deep and you'll have no problems I expect. And if you look up the multi-flow bucket style and understand how that works...you don't need a flood table. They are easy to make yourself btw.

Cuttings rooted in RW transplant great into soilless...and of course any hydro system (except maybe a 'true' aeroponic system with no net pot)
 
G

Guest

Why bother with a medium at all? You don't need one....

Doh, you said ebb n flow. That might require a medium...but I bet there's a way to do that also.
 
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