Need some help here.. First timer..

[redpenguin01]

This is my first grow.. been having a couple issues that I need some help on. I have a soil, peat moss, perlite mix.. It appeared to be a K and Mg deficiancy so I gave them a good flush about 4 days ago (was showing brown spots and slight yellowing). After I flushed them, the bottom leaves started yellowing more.. so I waited a few days to try out my new nutrients and to water once again. The top leaves on my bigger plant started to curl upwards in the last two days as well..

I was originally using Miracle Grow plant food, but I decided to grab some organic nutes a few days back. I ended up getting some Liquid Karma, Bio-Grow, Bio-Bloom, and TopMax Bloom stim. I added some LK, BG, and some Epsom salt to my water when I fed them yesterday.

The PH prior to the flush was 6.2-6.5, right now it's at 6.9 and 7. Temperature range during the day is 68.9F-84F as well.

Any tips would be much appreciated.. Here's some pictures.

 

[dre86]

The roots probably didn't got enough oxygen because of the flush,what led to the yellowing of the bottom leaves. (=overwatering signs). What I would do at this point is spread out the watering frequency and give them little ferts. How many gallons is that container btw?

 

[pieceofmyheart]

You said it looked like a deficiency, so you flushed? I thought a flush was for overfert, not under. I think they need to dry out too, and be careful with those ferts, it is too easy to overdo it.

 

[redpenguin01]

The containers are 5gal buckets.

 

[redpenguin01]

You said it looked like a deficiency, so you flushed? I thought a flush was for overfert, not under. I think they need to dry out too, and be careful with those ferts, it is too easy to overdo it.

The thing is, I didn't know if I have a def or not.. that's what I was trying to figure out. I thought I did overnuted a bit and had a slight K Mg def.. Thought it couldn't hurt to flush since I was getting some good nutes.. guess I was wrong.

If you have a suggestion to how I should feed these and fix this.. that would be great. I was hearing with BioBizz you could use a little more than the recommended and have good results.. this not the case?

I'm a newb to growing so cut me some slack..

 

[sproutco]

Is there dolomite lime in your soil mix? Ph should not really be higher than 6.5 even in soil. Directions for testing soil ph are in my signature below. Mg plant food is sorta bad in that it is mostly ammonia or urea nitrogen (which can lead to toxicity) and its source of potassium is potassium chloride.(chlorine yuk!). Glad you got new nutes. Maybe things will improve.

 

[redpenguin01]

No, I haven't put any dolomite lime in it yet.. I bought it after I made the mix so I wsn't sure if I should mess with it. Should I add some to the top soil.. if so, how will that effect the PH?

Thanks.

EDIT: I got some PH down with sulferic acid.. would that work fine? I also picked up a bunch of 5in1 strips and a water PH test as well.. definately works better than that rapitester I had.

 

[CaptJamesTKirk]

Find a local grow/hydro shop and get a bag of Fox Farms Ocean Forest (while your there get Big Bloom, Grow Big and Tiger Bloom - and - depending on your tap water - some PH down) and go to Home Depot and get a bag of Pearlite. mix between 60-40 and 50-50 and use it.

That soil is $24 a bag here - if your close to Cali - it gets cheaper,, but believe me,, i used to think it was expensive - not any more - it worth twice that much just don't tell them that.

You need to check your water PH - I'm betting it's 7.0 or above, plants like 5.8-6.0 best

Disreguard the nutes - I'm back reading now. - I'd still get the soil - they probably have it where you got the nutes. If you can afford it - a digital PH meter is so much more accurate than strips - you can be off several tenths and with a diggy tester you can be assured - again - it will pay for itself. - check on eBay once you learn what is needed then you wont need the tester, but your only guessing otherwise.

And yes you can top dress the lime in on the ones already potted

 

[Blackmelo]

hiya red,
good thing you got yourself some bio-bizz.

I am extrememly happy using their nutes. And yes it is very hard to burn with these.

In case you are interested I have come up with ideal amounts to feed for cannabis. You'd just need to get yourself a pk 13/14 nute ontop of what you have got.

You'll get nice results growing with their recommended ammounts of course but those ammounts are designed for houseplants and cannabis is not a house plant.
It can and will yield much better if you feed them their exact nutrient requirements instead of just feeding alot of N to keep the leaves looking green.

PS: your pics show a magnesium deficiency.

 

[redpenguin01]

Thanks for the responses.. that feeding schedule really helps out Blackmelo.

I brang the tap water down to 6.5 PH.. added 1tsp/1liter BioGrow, 1/2tsp/1liter LiquidKarma, and 1/4tsp/1gallon Epsome salt. They both are starting to show signs of preflower (white hairs on both).. but I am going to veg for 2-3 more weeks to get some more growth. Hopefully the yellow will stop progressing once these nutes kick in.

~RP

 

[Blackmelo]

err, isn't that mix a bit strong red?
As far as I know 1 tablespoon is 5 ml. I only feed 1ml/liter, not 5.

 

[sproutco]

QUOTE]I found this about magnesium weights:
http://userwww.service.emory.edu/~j...dry pmdd.html

Dry Dosing PMDD by Brian Revennaugh

Magnesium Sulphate (MgSO4): (1 teaspoon of MgSO4 weighs 5.4 grams or 5400 mg)
9.9% Mg 9.9% of 5400 mg MgSO4 = 535 mg Mg.
(535mg Mg/3030 mg desired Mg)x100=18% of the desired Mg or 0.88 ppm Mg
(Not enough, so the remaining Mg must be obtained by adding more teaspoons)
39.0% SO4 39.0% of 5400 mg MgSO4 = 2106 mg SO4.
51.1% H2O 51.1% of 5400 mg MgSO4 = 2759 mg H2O

1 teaspoon epsom in a gallon of water

5.4 grams in a teaspoon epsom divided by 3.8 liters = 1.42 grams in a liter

1.42 grams = 1420 milligrams

1420 x .099 to change the number to just magnesium = 140 mg magnesium in a liter

1000 mg in a liter = 1000 ppm

140 ppm magnesium in a teaspoon of epsom salts per gallon of water

Normal range is 30-50 with up to 75 ppm magnesium so you can see adding 1 to 2 teaspoons like this chart says is a recipe for disaster. The magnesium level would be more than potassium. Your not increasing calcium along with such a high level of magnesium. End result calcium and/or potassium deficiency.

 

[redpenguin01]

Should I add some dolomite lime then to correct this? What exactly should I do?

Blackmellow.. those measurements done were before your response.. I don't think it's high, it's what's on the bottles. 2-5mL per Liter Bio-Grow, 10mL per gallon Liquid Karma.

 

[redpenguin01]

BTW, I actually put a pinch of epsome in a liter (1/4tsp was an estimate).. just tried it and it took 6 fat pinches to get a full tsp.. So I'm more along the lines of 90ppm(+/- 10) which is still a little high.

Sorry for the confusion.. I just want to get an accurate diagnosis to get this stuff under control. Really a big help, thanks.

 

[moonymonkey]

wen u flushed the next time u watered,u should have reduced the AMONT of water,cuz of he reaction of plant.normally u can buy potng soils and most of them there ph is 6.5,if u were using tap water,mines 7.4, and that balances it,if u watch ur amonts of water in ounces.alot peeps just add lime to soil,then adjust water down 6.2-6.8.also sometimes over watering can cuz ur soil ph to go outa range sometimes.kinda sounds lik u need to lay off the food for now,get ph correct and ur watering.usally peeps miss water and then think it needs food,thats were u go wrong.peace hop this helps some and wat the otheres said^^^^ i dont use lime myself,but its creates a stable ph,especially wen using alot of ferts.,under large halide lights.i dont need bunch of food to grow good weed..peace mooonnss/

 

[sproutco]

1 teaspoon = 5ml
5ml per liter used
3.8 liter in a gallon
3.8 x 5ml = 19 ml gallon
10 ml =
n 114
p 13
k 72

19ml/10ml = x 1.9 so you used:
n 216
p 25
k 137

Is there calcium and magnesium in the grow formula? What is the % of the ingredients of cal and mag compared to % n @ 216 n. We can come up with cal mag ppm rapidly if there is any in there. See how that works making a ratio to what is already know. We can come up with how much epsom salts, gypsum, etc...need to be added to make the solution more balanced.

 

[redpenguin01]

Thats the wrong ppm.. I'm pretty sure I have a different formula of biogrow. Check out this website.. it gives me different % for the same product.. http://www.gchydro.com/BioBizz+Bio-Grow.html

The LK is:
0.1% - N
0.1% - P
0.5% - K
0.01% - Humic Acid
0.01% - Aloe Vera
0.01% - Yucca

My BioBloom is:
1.1% - N
2.5% - P
2.0% - K

Total % Solution:
1.2% - N
2.6% - P
2.5% - K
0.01% - Humic Acid
0.01% - Aloe Vera
0.01% - Yucca
(~+90-100ppm Mg)

There is no Ca that I am aware of and I haven't added any Mg other than that pinch to the Liter. I only watered 300mL per plant yesterday.

 

[sproutco]

I think the bio grow and bloom are both complete plant foods. That means they contain everything including calcium and magnesium. I see what your saying about the numbers being different. You don't really just add % up to get % of your formula. You need to get the net weight off the bottle, ml the bottle contains, ml used and % of all the elements contained in the bottle. Then you can figure everything out in parts per million and be able to make adjustments. You would then be able to also compare your nutrient solution to others and suggested levels for mj. You don't want to add more calcium and magnesium if its not needed.

1 teaspoon = 5ml

Don't forget to not let your ph get over 6.5

 

[Blackmelo]

yeah bio grow and bio bloom are complete fertilizers but they still lack magnesium.

Sprout, I still think 1 teaspoon added to 10liters gives the water an MG concentration of about 30 ppm. Now I have't done any calculations on this, just from personal experience.

I tried to follow your calculation but I just couldn't figure out where you got 9.9% from. My epson salt says 100% magnesium sulphate heptahydrate. I cannot follow your chemical breakdown either I'm afraid.

Some ppl actually recommend feeding up to 3 teaspoons per gallon. IE. 7 tablespoons per 10 liters. (According to your calculation that would make a MG concentration of about 3 x 140ppm = 420ppm MG per gallon)
I don't know about you sprout but I think you made a mistake somewhere along your calculations cause that cannot be right.

 

[Blackmelo]

Red, I just read you post, yes my bio-bizz says feed 2-5 ml also but I told you, manufacturers come up with feeding plans to keep houseplants nice and green and healthy. On top of this they want you to use alot of their product so you go and buy some more sooner.

Now if you just want a green ornamental cannabis plant then stick to their growing schedule. If you are interested in yield go with a feeding schedule designed for cannabis.