Need help with 240v outlet

[Rolando Mota]

Hi everybody, thanks for stopping by. So here's my predicament. I need to run a 400w I wasn't using in addition to the 1000 and 400 I have going already. But there's only one circuit, and when I tried adding the 400 it was too much and it tripped the breaker. However, there is a dryer outlet on its own circuit in the room. The obvious answer would be to get a 240v ballast, but I don't have the money right now. Plus I'm planning on adding another 1000 in the semi-near future and will be facing this same problem. Saw in IgrowMyOwn's grow thread http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=10360 that he had built a timer with 110 outlets out of a 240 outlet. Would it be possible for me to build something similiar sans timer? I'm no electrician, but I am fairly handy and I should be able to follow directions. Any websites I should check out, or threads that might help?

Thanks for your help!

Rolando Mota

 

[Nugs of Science]

I have a similar problem

I have a similar problem

I have 240V 400/600 watt ballasts but they are digital so I knew that buying them. I have this unit:


Takes a 30 amp 240 wire straight from the box. Since I would also need a 240 powersupply and a timer, I picked the unit up. They make 110 versions too. I have a dryer plug but it is a 60 amp, 240 line. It should still work but I am unsure. Maybe some peeps have some wisdom to share.
I heard about some place selling dryer plug adapters to hook up multiple 240 appliances but I haven't found it yet. I'll do some nore checking around to see what I could up with.

NoS

 

[HumboldtHigh]

Rolando, when I switched my power to 240v I did not need to buy a different ballast. With my ballast the wire just had to be switched but was already inside, the only thing I had to do was switch the cord to plug it in, I even skipped that for a run :smile: I was told most ballast have this option, the same guy said there is also a wire for wiring the ballast @ 208v? also on 240v. He said this makes everything run cooler and a bit' cheaper on your bill. I can testify that 240v 220v or whatever it is, really is cheaper to run. Good Luck!!! I hate dealing with power never want to burn anything up, down or fry myself Have a good one' Humboldt

 

[Rolando Mota]

Ok, didn't know about the 30/60 amp deal. How do I find out what mine is, does it say on the breaker box? Looks like I'll need to know that if I buy a 240v ballast? Thanks for the input!

 

[igrowMy0wn]

Good evening Mr. Mota

I came on to post this info for ya and saw your thread. So here goes some pics. I will try to explain them as best I can. Mabe someone a less stoned can help if they get it too...

 

[HairlessCaveApe]

--Hey Howdy Rolando Mota ! -Couldnt you take a hot, nutral and ground from the outlet and wire up a 110 outlet to it? -The hots in a 240 outlet are usually the red and black, the white is nutral and the copper is ground.

 

[Rolando Mota]

igrowMyOwn - cool, thanks for posting. The photos help, but they're going to need some explanation. You might want to start a new thread so others can find the info easier. I know I'm not the only one interested.

HairlessCaveApe - not sure. Anyone else know if that would work?

Thanks!

 

[MoeWeed]

Right on Hairless

Right on Hairless

If the circuit for the dryer is a straight run from the fuse box(breaker box) to the outlet it is probably a 2pole 30amp circuit. So it is run with #10awg wire. This should be landed on a 2pole 30amp breaker/fuse.
Usually the black and the red are used.

Step 1: Turn power to the cicuit off!!!!! This is the most important step.

Step 2: Check the power at the receptacle to make sure it is off.

Step 3: Remove the faceplate and the receptacle.

Step 4: Get a 110v receptacle and faceplate.

Step 5: Wire the black wire to the copper colored screw on the receptacle.

Step 6: Put white tape on the red wire so you know it is now a neutral.
Wire the white(red) wire to the silver colored screw.

Step 7: Wire the ground to the ground screw. Install the recptacle and the
and the faceplate.


Now we move the electrical panel.

Step 8: Locate the proper breaker. It should already be turned off.

Step 9: Take cover off the panel.

Step 10: If you have a breaker panel follow these directions.

Step 11: Remove the 2 wires from the breaker.

Step 12: Put white tape on the red wire so you know it is the neutral.

Step 13: Locate the neutral bar in the panel and land the white(red) wire on
it.

Step 14: Remove the old breaker. I cannot tell you how because there are
so many different electrical panels.

Step 15: Install the new breaker. If the wire is #10 you could use a 30 amp
single pole breaker. Or u could just use a 20 amp.

Step 16: Land the black wire onto the new breaker.

Step 17: Stand to the side of the panel look away from the panel and turn
breaker on. Hopefully there was no explosion of sparks or a tripped
breaker.

Step 18: Test the new outlet to make sure it is 110v. Put the cover back
on the panel. RE-LABLE the electrical panel.

Hopefully you will find this helpful. If you have any questions just ask.

 

[Rolando Mota]

Went down to the grow shop today and asked a few questions. They had some boxes with timers and outlets that I could plug right into the dryer outlet, but they start at $300. What ending up sounding the best was getting another 1k hps and a 240v timer. I'll have to wire it directly into the dryer outlet, but since I bought my last 1k ballast from them they'll switch it over to 240 for me and I'll be able to run both from the same timer. That takes the 1k off the 110 circuit, so I'll be able to plug in the 400 safely. I didn't need the 1k now, but was planning on getting one in a month so it's no biggie. Left empty handed because they were having a busy day and had sold out of the timers I wanted. Was funny, when I first went in and asked about a light he asked if I was the person who had just called and reserved 6 1ks! I was like no, I'm not a player! It did feel good to see all the other people in the shop and realize I'm not the only one in town by a long shot.

So does that sound like a good plan? They're getting more timers in a couple of days so I'm going back later this week to get everything. The re-wiring of the outlet sketches me out a little, but I'll give it a shot. I value the opinion of you guys so please post if you have any thoughts.


Moe - cool, those are some detailed directions! Sounds good, but I don't want to be messing with the breaker box. Thanks for the post though!

Cheers! :friends:

 

[Nugs of Science]

Rolando Mota, could give me more info on those units that plug into the dryer plug. Thanks
NoS

 

[Rolando Mota]

Hey Nugs! They were pretty sweet, I didn't examine them too closely since I knew they were out of my price range. I believe they were made in house, it's a bigger shop and I know they make their own ballasts, charcoal scrubbers, etc. I'd link to the web site, but it's very incomplete and doesn't list these subpanels. Basically they were similiar to what igrowMyOwn built, except with breakers too. So they had a breaker, timer and outlets. The $300 one had two 240v outlets, the one next to it had eight outlets (don't know if there is an inbetween model.)

 

[MoeWeed]

I sometimes forget how complicated it sounds. I am a commercial electrician by trade.

Good luck with the lights. If there are any questions I can answer for you give me a holler. I built a timer out of a 6x6x4 metal junction box, 1 4-pole lighting contactor a small plug in timer and a cord with a plug.

I mounted the relay in the j-box ran the cord and plug into the 110v control terminals. I wired a 30 amp circuit from the panel to the relay in the box.
Then I wired the ballast cord to the load side of the relay.

Plug the timer into an outlet, plug the cord to the relay box into the timer.

When the timer turns on the relay is energized and the contacts close turning on the light.

This way the only load thru the time is the relay coil, That is almost nothing.
This keeps you from running the whole load thru the timer and allows you to buy the small timer not the heavy duty appliance timers.

This set up can be built for less then $50.

 

[Rolando Mota]

Awesome - thanks for posting Moe! One question you can answer for me is do I have to wire directly into the dryer outlet, or could I buy a dryer power cord, plug it in and wire to the other end?

 

[Nugs of Science]

Found one!

Found one!

I am surprised I missed this because I bought my digital ballasts from here.
http://www.progressive-growth.com/index.php
Here is the dryer plug "extender" Nice piece of hardware; albeit, pricey.



Link to timer panel:
http://www.progressive-growth.com/products.php?cat=31

 

[MoeWeed]

Dryer Cord

Dryer Cord

If you buy a relay that has a 240v coil then you can put a dryer cord on the relay box and plug right into the dryer receptacle.

Relays come in many variations with regards to control voltage. Some need 24vac or 24v d/c, or 120v a/c, or 240v a/c. The list goes on and on.

If you buy a relay with a 240v coil this should do the trick. BUT you still need the power for the actual light.

 

[MoeWeed]

Amperage of Light(load)?

Amperage of Light(load)?

What is the amp draw of the 1000w and the 400w? My 400hps draws 3.8 amps at 110v. If wired at 240v it draws only 1.9 amps. I don't have any 1000w lights so I don't know waht they draw. I would guess it to be
@ 8 amps at 110v and @ 4 amps at 240v.

If you have 2-400w @3.8amp ea. and 2-1000w at 8 amps each you would need @ 24 amps worth of 110v power.

If you can re-wire to 240v then you would need 3.8amps for the 2-400w and 8 amps for the 2-1000w. This would only require @12 amp circuit. You have a 30 amp available with the dryer circuit.

Rewiring to 240v will allow you to run all twice as many lights for the same amount of electricity.

If you build the relay box with 110v coil relays and get 2 4-pole relays you can run all 4 lights on seperate outlets with one control. This gets a little more involved, but it starts out with the same relay box design in my earlier post.

When building any kind of power distribution box just remeber safety first. Plastic junction boxxes are nice instead of the metal ones because of the damp/wet conditions in the garden. Make sure everything is grounded properly. And use GFCI receptacles or breakers.

Electric is extremely safe to use and work on if proper safety procedures are followed.

Good luck and don't let the smoke(electrically speaking) out

 

[Rolando Mota]

Shit, my plants are in the dark! Took my ballast in to the shop today and had it switched over to 240v, and also bought a intermatic t-103 timer. The guy at the shop assured me it was a straightforward affair to wire the ballast to the timer and the timer to the dryer outlet. I followed the intructions they provided, but the light won't come on. It doesn't seem like the timer is running either. The instructions show the power as being black, white and green but the wires in the outlet were black, white and red. I figured black and white matched, so the red wire = green. Is this where I screwed up?

Not sure what to do, take the ballast back and have it switched back to 110? Try another timer? I've got to work tomorrow, so I won't have much time to deal with it. But I've got to come up with something quick, I don't want my plants to go without light for more than a couple of days. Help!

 

[Rolando Mota]

Any ideas?

 

[MoeWeed]

Outlet black to timer black
Outlet red to timer white
Outlet white to timer green.

Since your dryer cord has only 3 wires when it is used for 240v there is no neutral. This is what the white is USUALLY used for.

On the timer; since the timer you bought is to be used at 240v the white wire is not a neutral, it is a common.(the other half of the 240v circuit)

Try this and see if it helps

 

[Guest]

Here is the manual for an Intermatic T104 which should be what you have. I did not see a T103 on Intermatics site.

Manual

You should not be using terminal (A) This terminal is for 277v & 480v applications. Move the green wires to the ground terminal and not to terminal (A). This will fix your issue.