Natural light and HPS/MH lighting

[Ganoderma]

Okay we all know that the big halid in the sky very bright, so let me get to the point

in one sq. foot of light from the sun would = how many lumes, and then as a result how many HPS lights or MH light would it take to = that same amount of light out put


wasn't sure if this was the right Forum for this or not?

 

[BombSquadron65]

A bright sunny day is roughly 10,000 to as high as 13,500 lumens. However, optometrists rate a bright sunny day as between 8,000 and 10,000 lumens. Shade is between 2,500 and 3,000 lumens.

-edit- Keep into account that all these are per sqft. Sunlight is typically measured as lux (amount of light hitting 1 square meter = 9sqft) and a bright day is rated between 30klx (kilolux) and 100klx.

 

[Guest423]

no wonder they love my 143,000 lumen hps then lol

good info bomb

peace

 

[BombSquadron65]

Yep! Sun's damn bright!

So, technically if you limit a 150HPS into a 1'dx1'wx2'h space you are equating the intensity of the sun on a bright day! WOW!

 

[NiteTiger]

Yep! Sun's damn bright!

So, technically if you limit a 150HPS into a 1'dx1'wx2'h space you are equating the intensity of the sun on a bright day! WOW!

In intensity, maybe, but not in spectrum. You can't come close to the sun for plants

 

[BombSquadron65]

True.

 

[Guest]

sure ya can

flower under a sodium + a halide. and 'full spectrum' flourescents to supplement.

theres a longgggg thread on this here somewhere, lemme see if i can dig it up...

 

[BombSquadron65]

Cool! Please do jack!

 

[Ganoderma]

you don't have to pay for sun light, grow lights cost money to run, but each have thier own up sides and down sides.

So technically speaking, you'd need about 150 watts per sq foot to match what the sun putts out, with a normal hps bulb,

a 400w hps would need to be limited to about 3.7sq feet

a 600w hps would need to be limited to about 6.8sq feet

a 600w hps would need to be limited to about 10.3sq feet

to get the same lumes or lux as what the sun puts out but with same ballance in the light spectrum

 

[Guest]

Ganoderma : thank you
but i think theyre talking about the sun's uv-b radiation and it's effect on potency, henceforth usin a mh in flower to add them UVBeez.
ps- if you ask any cash cropper theyll tell you 150/sq. ft. (or better) is ideal.

anyway, i couldnt find the thread for ya, BS65, but again, use a halide and hps combo + Full Spectrum Flourescents, for all spectrum light..
it works best in my, and many others experience. even in veg.

PLUS uv-b from the halide = theoretically higher potency product,

IME, red spectrum = lush growth, blue=tighter more compact growth

it really cant hurt to use both.
your plants and patients will love you for using the combination

be well

 

[BombSquadron65]

Not quite. The sun is a lot stronger than any light available on the market. In order for a 150HPS to eqaul the luminosity (hence the term lumin) of the sun it would have to be constrained to a 1 sqft base with a height of no greater than 2 feet. Light deteriorates quickly. So, the higher your lights from their source the weaker the luminous intenisty.

On paper a 400 could cover 5.8 sqft (base) but in order to maintain that intensity it would have to stray no higher than 1'. Light begins to deterioate drastically after the 1' mark. Obviously it is not possible for the light to adequately cover a base of 5.8 sqft while being only 1' high. So, while this is possible for the 150 and 250 (due to it's intenisty output versus low area coverage) it becomes inherently more difficult to calculate for a 1,000 HPS without the assistance of a light meter. While the 1k HPS can emite much more light, there becomes the issue of light tapering off at the edges and thus, the equation becomes muddled.

Also, plants cannot utilize more than 10,000 lumens, so going higher is worthless. Another thing, as Nite Tiger said, is that even by doing this your light still lacks the variety of spectrum of the sun. As Capt. Jack pointed outy it is possible. The problem you run into is that you need a vast array of lights. Specialty lights for coral reef growth have shown to be of a very beneficial wavelength intensity for Mj cultivation. (or so many a great minds contended on OG a long time ago) The problem is that the set up is expensive and really only good for a very narrow band of color spectrum. This belies the inherent problem with getting the "full spectrum" and especially the "full spectrum" intense enough as the sun.

While I'm not doubting it's possibilty, I am content to believe that the cost/benefit of it would be astronimically at a disadvantage to the purchaser/grower.

-edit- That's okay Jack. Yeah, whenever I can get the $$$ to spring I'm gonna get a 70MH. Might get a 150 though... you know if they make changeable HPS bulbs for 70 and 150 MH's?

 

[Guest]

for those coral bulbs maybe, but not for a mh or some supplemental flours..

its cheap for these things one just has to be a resourceful shopper and have a bit of DIY skills.

great friggin post.

i just learned a couple things, thank ya.

whats the ge lamp code on the bulb you're referring to?

if not what type of contact/base and what type of gas?

a buddy of mine owns a supply house and ill call him tomorrow for some info so i can educate myself LOL

 

[Guest]

a switchble medium base bulb? LOL i doubt it bro

if they do, the cost liekly makes it more worth it to hit up depot for 2 seperate fixtures, 1-70hps 1-70mh for like 60,70 bucks total maybe? i dont buy (shit) lighting there, so i dont know.

if not go to a local electrical supply, and ask em if they have anything cheap they can sell ya to rig up for your daughters science fair project...hehehe

 

[Ganoderma]

LOL

LOL

a switchble medium base bulb? LOL i doubt it bro



if not go to a local electrical supply, and ask em if they have anything cheap they can sell ya to rig up for your daughters science fair project...hehehe

That just cracked me up, its practical tho

 

[A+Dank]

What is unique about the coral reef lights?
I never found that on OG... i did find quite a bit about adding more blue to your spectrum using MH... and adding uvb via REPTILE lights which were very efficeint at putting out uvb....there remains some debate tho about wether uvb actually increases potency...i think it does...but not by "making" more thc...it just makes the plant "sweat more sunscreen" which is the triches (pretty technical, huh?) Good thread indeed!
has anyone found a really optimal ratio of mh to hps in watts for veg and flower? i assume more hps for flower and more mh for veg, following what jack wrote that a full specturm all the way though is superior to either or...but there has to still be a slant to it. anyone dialed that in? i sure havn't! im going windowsill and hps all the way.
+

 

[Ganoderma]

yes, true, for a fuller spectrum of light with man made grow lights you need to use both types of lights, HPS and MH, but yet using them both together still doesn't come close to the light spectrum that you'd get from the sun. but I don't know what spectrum range that plants use, or paticually what spectrum range cannabis uses, or what the exact light spectrum is of the HPS lights and the MH lights.

 

[Verite]

Two problems, one is the sun is truly full spectrum [ seen and unseen ] and so far bulbs arent. Second is that the suns lumens are a fixed constant somewhat in the sense that they dont diminish after having traveled some nine million miles. So the light hitting the top of the plant is equal to the light hitting the bottom. You cant make a bulb do that either.

 

[Guest]

Sweet I am kicking the suns ass at 16000+ lumens per square foot. Take that you raison scooping, sunglass wearing, big ball of flaming gas!!!! You may have full spectrum but...but...dammit you got me Mr. Golden Sun, please shine down on me.

 

[Ganoderma]

Okay I just read this other post in this forum that could be applyed to this thread its called Lumens, and lux and PAR, oh my! http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=17118

 

[Ganoderma]

Two problems, one is the sun is truly full spectrum [ seen and unseen ] and so far bulbs arent. Second is that the suns lumens are a fixed constant somewhat in the sense that they dont diminish after having traveled some nine million miles. So the light hitting the top of the plant is equal to the light hitting the bottom. You cant make a bulb do that either.

to bad no one has been able to build a Hydrogen light bulb, the real problem is that most of all light bulbs are filled with an innert gas/gasses, and hydrogen is far from being innert, and that there is the problem with trying that