Mysterious condition dubbed 'scromiting' hits weed smokers across the US !

[ozzieAI]

My CHS started when I moved to California 10 years ago. Nearly all the cannabis at the time caused me significant digestive issues, vomiting and pain. It took me about 3 years to figure out where the problem was coming from. The last 7 years are where I've tested aza breakdown times in cannabis with my own grows, and tested cannabis treated with neem products from other grows.

Anything with neem/aza in it causes problems. Light contamination takes days to weeks before the problems show up. Heavy contamination has symptoms showing up immediately. Dabbing heavily contaminated causes instant problems. The time delay effect with lightly contaminated has been the biggest problem. Dabs made with lightly contaminated cannabis have a much higher concentration than flower and can make recognition/symptoms show up quicker.

there is no independent evidence of this....there are cases of CHS that do NOT involve neem/aza strongly suggesting other forces at work.

I can dab or smoke as much "clean" cannabis as I want. Zero issues. If aza wasn't a cause of CHS, the last 10 years would have been SIGNIFICANTLY different for me. Being incapacitated in your mid 30's, to the point you're using mass opiates and a walker, is massively scary. Especially when every doctor you talk to throws up their hands and says, "I have no idea what's going on."

the use of neem oil does NOT make mine or anyone else's cannabis 'dirty'.

So, for me it's strictly aza related. The last year without growing my own has been a nightmare. The best thing which happened this year was getting rid of the overblown H.Pylori infection which caused continued digestive issues after each aza poisoning. I'm now 30 days into flower, so things are looking up.

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sorry you get sick, but the language and tone of finality you use in your posts weakens your message. there are many, many of us that DO use neem/aza and have done for years that do NOT have any of the experiences you describe. would love to know exactly how many people are suffering from CHS....and the number of people using neem treated pot without any problems?

for those that are interested,here is a link to the Bio Pesticides Registration Document for Neem Oil.: https://www3.epa.gov/pesticides/che...registration/decision_PC-025006_07-May-12.pdf

and here it started back in 2013: https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=274706

been wondering this for a while now does DC = TCG??

 

[TychoMonolyth]

In every office I work in (I'm a consultant), I see signs "No perfume" or "No citrus" or "No whatever". There's absolutely no scientific proof that Axe body spray or Channel #5 gives people migraines. But it does and it's very real.

So if you find commercial weed gives you the dry heaves, grow your own. If that works, you're golden. If it doesn't, you may have developed an allergy to it. Try oil. It'll give you a way longer lasting high that'll go for hours (3-4), and in my opinion, a better high.

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

there is no independent evidence of this....there are cases of CHS that do NOT involve neem/aza strongly suggesting other forces at work.

There are a handful of growers who claim no neem/aza use, and still claim CHS problems. In almost every single instance, the grower has had missing information about the grow.

• Getting clones from someone else
• Using soil from someone else
• Having a grower *tell them* there isn't any aza

I've read of one person in Australia who swears they're growing from seed, no neem, and still has CHS (Neem trees also grow in many places in Australia). The rest have huge gaps of missing information, in areas where neem/aza is usually found. I've personally been lied to by growers about their pesticide usage, repeatedly.



Is it possible CHS can come from cannabis itself? Yes, and I have acknowledged this possibility for a few years now. Is it probably the main cause of CHS? Not even a remote consideration.


Quit getting irritated about people finding an issue with something you consider safe. (Asbestos installers, manufacturers and salesmen had the exact same attitude you do, when people began saying there was a problem.)

 

[eventualist]

WTH?

WTH?

What the hell? I have never heard of this and it sounds like a bunch of malarky... I guess somewhere, someone can get sick... but the alarming nature of the OP is a bit odd.

Smoked all kinds of weed for almost 40 years now. Mexican brick to homegrown to the now flood of good quality bud migrating East from Co or CA... either way, I have never heard or experienced this.

I smoke a lot, so I'm trying to understand all this, even after reading this, I'm doubtful that it's a real thing. But apparently it is if some of you are experiencing it.

I think it sounds like fake weed, that spice crap.

 

[TychoMonolyth]

I don't know anyone with Epidermolysis Bullosa, but I know it's real. Hell I only heard about it a last year. Nasty. Warning. Don't google the images, you'll puke (yet some dick head will anyway).

Some people are allergic or develop allergies to pot. Period.

 

[ozzieAI]

There are a handful of growers who claim no neem/aza use, and still claim CHS problems. In almost every single instance, the grower has had missing information about the grow.

• Getting clones from someone else
• Using soil from someone else
• Having a grower *tell them* there isn't any aza

I've read of one person in Australia who swears they're growing from seed, no neem, and still has CHS (Neem trees also grow in many places in Australia). The rest have huge gaps of missing information, in areas where neem/aza is usually found. I've personally been lied to by growers about their pesticide usage, repeatedly.

so when you get information that you agree with, that's okay, but when you get information that contradicts your theory, people are lying. yes there are neem trees in Australia, i have one in my yard, so how is a tree able to 'pollute' my grow or anyone else's grow???

Is it possible CHS can come from cannabis itself? Yes, and I have acknowledged this possibility for a few years now. Is it probably the main cause of CHS? Not even a remote consideration.

again information that doesn't fit the theory is discounted...

Quit getting irritated about people finding an issue with something you consider safe. (Asbestos installers, manufacturers and salesmen had the exact same attitude you do, when people began saying there was a problem.)

except for the fact that neem has been used for 1000s of years in agriculture in india where is there is a large use of cannabis and only recently is CHS raising it's head.

how about the fact that ALL cases are associated with high level cannabis use/abuse...the one constant in ALL the cases i have found.

and again does DC = TCG

 

[Douglas.Curtis]

except for the fact that neem has been used for 1000s of years in agriculture in india where is there is a large use of cannabis and only recently is CHS raising it's head.

Just one more example of where your thinking is completely wrong, because the status quo is not based on cannabis facts. Neem/aza rapidly breaks down on the **SURFACE** of fruits and vegetables, as it has for thousands of years of agriculture. Yep, totally and completely true. This information does not apply to cannabis.

Why is it so difficult for you to accept the fact cannabis absorbs neem/aza and prevents it from breaking down? I've done the tests myself, as have others. Name me one single **Agricultural** testing which has been done on aza/cannabis/humans. The only ones I've found are informal ones like mine.

I'm done replying to you. Everyone who does not have a neem/aza bias (asbestos fanboys), like yours, can plainly see there's something to investigate. Grow your tainted cannabis, I'm not using any of it and I feel sorry for anyone with CHS who comes across it. Have a wonderful life.

 

[ozzieAI]

Just one more example of where your thinking is completely wrong, because the status quo is not based on cannabis facts. Neem/aza rapidly breaks down on the **SURFACE** of fruits and vegetables, as it has for thousands of years of agriculture. Yep, totally and completely true. This information does not apply to cannabis.

i do agree with you...neem when used systemically DOES hang around...in fact it has a half life of 46 days in soil...but when sprayed on it only lasts a matter of hours...

so for those who use neem cake as an soil amendment through out the ages in the production of all sorts of crops including cannabis why is CHS only a recent aliment?

Why is it so difficult for you to accept the fact cannabis absorbs neem/aza and prevents it from breaking down? I've done the tests myself, as have others. Name me one single **Agricultural** testing which has been done on aza/cannabis/humans. The only ones I've found are informal ones like mine.

exactly...so the question is 'why isn't anyone testing for it?' has it got the potential to cause harm...possibly. considering the long term uses of neem throughout history from personal applications such as toothpaste, skin lotions, soaps, treating diseases etc, to farming/agriculture it would make sense that if neem made people sick through these applications there WOULD be evidence.

I'm done replying to you. Everyone who does not have a neem/aza bias (asbestos fanboys), like yours, can plainly see there's something to investigate.

asbestos was first used in the 1920s and was phased out in the 1980s, neem on the other hand has been used 'safely' for 1000s of years. i encourage wholeheartedly this investigation, but it is not plain to see.

Grow your tainted cannabis, I'm not using any of it and I feel sorry for anyone with CHS who comes across it. Have a wonderful life.

i have never ever come across anyone with CHS so there is no one to feel sorry for. everyone else likes my pot...

thanks for your well wishes TheCleanGame...oops i mean Douglas

 

[Bobby Boucher]

When I wound up with that nasty firecrackers dab, we facetimed the broker who sent out the 10#s of material and his response was "You should have told me you were rinsing it, you aren't supposed to be rinsing any of this lightdep or outdoor, I woulda got you some indoor".

^^ Although my knowledge and experience are both pretty limited, this makes a ton of sense to me. Whenever we don't spray or forget to spray poisons into the pumpkin soil, the mf'ers just don't grow. They get taken out by bugs before they ever get a chance.

So.. I've never grown outdoors. But it makes sense, to me, that concentrating and freebasing chemicals an outdoor farmer MUST use in a commercial setting, could have some minor repercussions, to say the least.

I have grown my own for quite some time, and have distanced myself from all these other dumbass pot dealers, so all of this is pretty inconsequential to me now. I'm still curious, but I'm not losing any sleep. If anyone wants to shed some light on any of these statements, great, otherwise... yea... no big deal.

 

[TychoMonolyth]

When I wound up with that nasty firecrackers dab, we facetimed the broker who sent out the 10#s of material and his response was "You should have told me you were rinsing it, you aren't supposed to be rinsing any of this lightdep or outdoor, I woulda got you some indoor".

^^ Although my knowledge and experience are both pretty limited, this makes a ton of sense to me. Whenever we don't spray or forget to spray poisons into the pumpkin soil, the mf'ers just don't grow. They get taken out by bugs before they ever get a chance.

So.. I've never grown outdoors. But it makes sense, to me, that concentrating and freebasing chemicals an outdoor farmer MUST use in a commercial setting, could have some minor repercussions, to say the least.

I have grown my own for quite some time, and have distanced myself from all these other dumbass pot dealers, so all of this is pretty inconsequential to me now. I'm still curious, but I'm not losing any sleep. If anyone wants to shed some light on any of these statements, great, otherwise... yea... no big deal.

I come from four generations of farmers. If you don't use fertilizers, herbicides and pesticides, your cattle will starve. Hell, they can starve even when you do use all that. All you need is a year with poor rainfall.

It's the same for Cannabis. Don't use any magic fairy dust, then the price should go up for it. But no one wants to pay it. So most growers will grab tinkerbell and giver her a shake over their crops.

 

[bigtacofarmer]

I come from four generations of farmers. If you don't use fertilizers, herbicides and pesticides, your cattle will starve. Hell, they can starve even when you do use all that. All you need is a year with poor rainfall.

It's the same for Cannabis. Don't use any magic fairy dust, then the price should go up for it. But no one wants to pay it. So most growers will grab tinkerbell and giver her a shake over their crops.

You are so wrong. I know several organic farmers who use no added pesticides, herbicides or fungicides. One who has been on the same 300 acres organic farm for over 80 years. Food soil bacteria and fungus and growing diverse crops and companion planting will keep pests away. Yes a few pest eat a few things but a proper ecosystem keeps them from destroying too much.

Not to mention if an insect is smart enough to not want to eat a poison fruit or vegetable I do not want to feed it to my family either.

If you choose to grow with synthetic techniques and spray who knows what on your food and herb. Please just tell the people that consume your products everything you add.

But do not spread lies and ignorance just because you are to invested in your own system of lies and poison to see or listen to the truth.

 

[TychoMonolyth]

You are so wrong. I know several organic farmers who use no added pesticides, herbicides or fungicides. One who has been on the same 300 acres organic farm for over 80 years. Food soil bacteria and fungus and growing diverse crops and companion planting will keep pests away. Yes a few pest eat a few things but a proper ecosystem keeps them from destroying too much.

Not to mention if an insect is smart enough to not want to eat a poison fruit or vegetable I do not want to feed it to my family either.

If you choose to grow with synthetic techniques and spray who knows what on your food and herb. Please just tell the people that consume your products everything you add.

But do not spread lies and ignorance just because you are to invested in your own system of lies and poison to see or listen to the truth.

I'm as oragnic as you can get you bird brain. I even make my owm IMO 2. I was talking about growers in general. If you have a dairy farm, or beef cattle, and you don't use modern growing techniques, you're fucked. I have chickens who free range and a couple beef that graze pasture all summer. No hormones or anything else is used. But I can afford that because it's for me and my kids freezers. But to do this commercially? Like to live on? No way.

 

[Bobby Boucher]

In a perfect world..

In less than ideal locations, with less than ideal ecosystems, less than ideal legal climates, and product moving at 1k per, synthetics are assumedly being sprayed most everywhere.

I wouldn't know for certain, but it sounds like a healthy assumption.

If a dispensary don't want it, someone out east will mail order the shit sight unseen, without any recourse, for twice what the dispensary is paying out anyways. Ya'll legal boys might not fully understand the struggle.

Plenty of pot farmers are hardened criminals who don't give 2 fucks about the end user. If everyone thought like tacofarmer, the world would be a better place, but they don't.

 

['Boogieman']

I'm as oragnic as you can get you bird brain. I even make my owm IMO 2. I was talking about growers in general. If you have a dairy farm, or beef cattle, and you don't use modern growing techniques, you're fucked. I have chickens who free range and a couple beef that graze pasture all summer. No hormones or anything else is used. But I can afford that because it's for me and my kids freezers. But to do this commercially? Like to live on? No way.

Yea im from Indiana and know a lot about commercial farming and trust me if we could go 100% organic we would. You know the weed farmers in california who freak out and go chem out of desperation, imagine that x 1000.

 

[bigtacofarmer]

I'm as oragnic as you can get you bird brain. I even make my owm IMO 2. I was talking about growers in general. If you have a dairy farm, or beef cattle, and you don't use modern growing techniques, you're fucked. I have chickens who free range and a couple beef that graze pasture all summer. No hormones or anything else is used. But I can afford that because it's for me and my kids freezers. But to do this commercially? Like to live on? No way.

Yup. I still know you are wrong. Seen it proven with my own eyes at several farms. Is it harder work, yes. But not impossibe. Thanks for calling me birdbrain you dotard!

 

['Boogieman']

Yup. I still know you are wrong. Seen it proven with my own eyes at several farms. Is it harder work, yes. But not impossibe. Thanks for calling me birdbrain you dotard!

Maybe in a steady climate but how would you go about it in the midwest? I ask because my family has farmed for over 150 years in Indiana and the few times we tried 100% organic we severely lost our ass. There is more money in organic produce so were very interested.

 

[TychoMonolyth]

Yup. I still know you are wrong. Seen it proven with my own eyes at several farms. Is it harder work, yes. But not impossibe. Thanks for calling me birdbrain you dotard!

Apologies. Hadn't had my breakfast. I'm good now. Had extra bacon.

Let's just agree to disagree.
I still think organic is the way to go for small hobby, even small full time vegetable farmers who sell at markets and directly to restaurants. But commercial or regular dairy, beef or cash crop? No way on earth.

 

[coconutcurry]

I also know scromiting. Sometimes it's also combined with white foam coming out of my mouth and an insane flicker in my eyes. I do this every morning when I read the newspapers, but I doubt it's the weed which makes me screeming and puking the same time.

 

[TychoMonolyth]

^^^ lmao @ foam!!
Too much news induces fits of laughter in me. Sometimes, I get depressed.

 

[bigtacofarmer]

I live in mid Michigan. Its all about keeping the soil alive and planting diverse enough crops to where the pest have competion from other insect. Plants they like and plants they do not like. A system of checks and banances. Proper crop rotation and composting. The one large farmer uses composted cow and horse manure and has great yields. I supposed having cows and horses is a big help. I have not eaten meat in a while so I cannot speak for the quality of his beef but several people have called it the best the ever had. I have watched his cow play like puppys. Happiest cows I ever met.

http://www.themaplegrille.net/

Alot of his beef and produce ends up here. He also does turkeys and honey.