Moved to 20 gallons and still...

[Week 4]

I've been going through some deficiencies lately that slowly creep in after week 3 of flower and then go full bore by week 6. Doesn't matter if I'm in 10 gallon pots or 20 gallon pots.. I'm thinking Calcium. Would a little water soluble Calcium Phosphate help (during the stretch) ? That's where my mind is at this moment. Top to mid level . wherever direct lighting hits the leaves. More at the top. Soil is top dressed with proprietary organic dry amendments. Occasionally brew earthworm casting tea and also top dress with castings with a few red worms. Soil is from hydro store Lush and Happy Frog, maybe Ocean Forest. Indoor grow tent, LED lighting.

 

[stiff]

If you're using tab water, check your quarterly water analysis for your calcium and magnesium levels. And if they're too low adjust with calmag or so. How long have you been using the LED light? It's quite common to happen when you switch from HPS to LED..as the plants need a lot more fertiliser under those new lights.

As a rough guide you could say:
-seedlings want 50mg calcium and 17mg magnesium per litre of water.
-Midway through veg give them around 100mg calcium and 33mg od magnesium.
-Towards midflower around 150mg calcium and 50mg magnesium

 

[Week 4]

If you're using tab water, check your quarterly water analysis for your calcium and magnesium levels. And if they're too low adjust with calmag or so. How long have you been using the LED light? It's quite common to happen when you switch from HPS to LED..as the plants need a lot more fertiliser under those new lights.

As a rough guide you could say:
-seedlings want 50mg calcium and 17mg magnesium per litre of water.
-Midway through veg give them around 100mg calcium and 33mg od magnesium.
-Towards midflower around 150mg calcium and 50mg magnesium

Been growing for maybe 3 years and just the LED lights. I've had no problems with some strains but these last few, they've been a little anwry.

 

[xtsho]

Too much of something.

The overfeeding of any plant food can cause nutrient deficiencies.

 

[Week 4]

Too much of something.

The overfeeding of any plant food can cause nutrient deficiencies.

Thanks, I was wondering about that too, only because of no tip burn did I rule that out. And the mid to lower leaves are super healthy. But that is correct, one nutrient can lock everything out. Been using proprietary amendments, I hope these companies know how to blend a balanced top dress. I've also ruled out the water, it's happening with RO filtered water on my last grow, and tap water with this grow. Another plausible idea is that maybe 900-950 par is just to much for my tent? Drop it down to 850-750?? (The troubled plant is far right, the front left is slowly creeping in with the same thing, the other pots no problems so far but they're different strains. They're in 10 gallon pots ...go figure)

 

[Crooked8]

What i find odd is that the damage looks unusual to me. Typically necrosis is seen in the inner veinal sections or at a leafs edge. But your necrotic spotting appears to come from or be only really on the veins of the leaf themselves. I think your medias ph is too low and you are seeing a form of micro toxicity.

 

[Week 4]

What i find odd is that the damage looks unusual to me. Typically necrosis is seen in the inner veinal sections or at a leafs edge. But your necrotic spotting appears to come from or be only really on the veins of the leaf themselves. I think your medias ph is too low and you are seeing a form of micro toxicity.

My soil was off by a point a few times, 7.1 on the soil pH meter, only way I could remedy it was with the ewc tea which would drop it down to 6.9.. go microbe power. I just dropped some tea 36 hours ago, will check the soils pH again and compare that to the healthy plants. Something in the soil is raising the pH above 7, I'll probably need to drop some compost here soon.

 

[Week 4]

Thanks everyone for your inputs, took some soul searching and I believe you were all right. I did what I really don't like to do, especially in organics, and that is too water till runoff. I usually water 5-10% to the pots volume. About 2 gallons per 20 gallon pot. Today I watered 5 gallons per pot to make sure the soil got a good drenching. Loosen up any salt deposits from the ca mag I have been giving. I'm gonna learn how to stay away from the bottled stuff and maybe do more watering with runoffs at first signs of trouble from now on. Even if I'm in organic soil.

 

[eastcoastjoe]

Soil is top dressed with proprietary organic dry amendments.

Just curious why your topdress ingredients are “ proprietary” ?

 

[Week 4]

Just curious why your topdress ingredients are “ proprietary” ?

Cheaper and easier to use, vs buying 10 different products and mixing it myself. Craft Blend from Build A Soil is what I use

 

[X15]

Plants in your pic are kinda showing me that there is a lot of something in the soil. They look a lot better than what I was expecting after seeing that isolated leaf pic tho.
I really wouldn’t go to hard on the watering though. That size pot, with a mulch layer on them.. that’s a slippery slope.
Can I ask, When are you watering in reference to your light schedule?

I’ve always had better results with the approach of ,… give the plant what it will drink, not much more. We want the plant to be able to regulate and buffer it’s own ph health… and excess water saturation can really make that a tough thing to do.
It would be helpful to know how frequently you water and when.

Pretty rad set up you got!

 

[Week 4]

Plants in your pic are kinda showing me that there is a lot of something in the soil. They look a lot better than what I was expecting after seeing that isolated leaf pic tho.
I really wouldn’t go to hard on the watering though. That size pot, with a mulch layer on them.. that’s a slippery slope.
Can I ask, When are you watering in reference to your light schedule?

I’ve always had better results with the approach of ,… give the plant what it will drink, not much more. We want the plant to be able to regulate and buffer it’s own ph health… and excess water saturation can really make that a tough thing to do.
It would be helpful to know how frequently you water and when.

Pretty rad set up you got!

Hey thanks. I'm gonna get some criticism for this but I use a soil moisture meter. I calibrated it so that when it hits 50% it's time to water the pots. I then water 10% the volume of the pot. So for the 20 gallon pots it's 1.5 or 2 gallons of water. And only when the meter hits 50%. The 10 gallon pots are not drinking as much and are the healthiest in the tent. Ive been watering them at 3 or 4 day intervals,(going off what the moisture meter reads) maybe 5. They just don't drink much (right now) but look awesome. And when I do water them it's just a gallon of water. So since they have been in these pots no runoff whatsoever. Until today .. the two 20 gallon pots showing signs of trouble (well one really and the other 20 is slowly showing) I decided to water till runoff, and I mean some good runoff, as if I was flushing. I'm two weeks away from harvest so no biggie.

The 20 gallon pots are Bubba Runtz.

The 10 gallon pots are California Dream

They're in what's turned out to be in the Flower tent. The California Dream was added 4 weeks after the Runtz were inserted.

There's a scenario playing in my head bouncing around threads (and from input here). I probably dumped too much of the extras that were not needed. Like Seabird Guano, and some Neptunes Harvest (water soluble) 2-6-4. The guano was added during the stretch. And after the stretch I was feeding once a week the Neptunes Harvest for a couple weeks. Not knowing that it was probably causing a lockout. The main reason why I sorta flushed (the 20 gallon pots) today.

The 10 gallon pots are fine, they are doing better than expected. Almost to good. And if I do start to see signs from them, I'm flushing the soil ASAP. Instead of waiting to see what happens.

 

[Ca++]

I reckon it could be mold. Somewhat systemic. H2O2 then shark it, in the ground and over the plants. Reset the eco system.

 

[morgellons]

I reckon it could be mold. Somewhat systemic. H2O2 then shark it, in the ground and over the plants. Reset the eco system.

Sorry for the intrusion Week, i maybe have your similiar problems so i just wondering
How much H2O2 per Liter of water should be used to ? thanks Ca++

 

[Brother Nature]

The back right plant in your tent photo looks over fertilized, my money would be on an over abundance of one nutrient locking out others. The mention of mold above is a good clue too. It's not too hard to check your root structure in those fabric pots so that would also be something to look at.

 

[Ca++]

@morgellons
Do you feel lucky?

120ppm has a nice cleaning action. It will support many oxygen loving species, and nail the anaerobic one's. It's a good start, that will save your new bennies some work.

Great white was just a suggestion. It's obviously a marketing think, and half of the many things in there, may be useless. The option is there to be much more targeting in the approach. I'm not latin, but bactillis subtillis 727 or something? Southern AG have a good one.

I'm a chemicals guy, so it's really not my forte. I keep looking though, as molds are such an issue, even when we can't see them.


Edit: I notice straw in the OPs pics. It's commonly seen in problem grows, and has been said to cause problems. Now I'm drawn to the fact it's fabric pots, I see no reason for it. It's just another vector

 

[X15]

Flushing 20 gallons of soil isn’t going to help anything though. You won’t be flushing out much of anything and definitely creating a stressful situation for the roots. Soil and coco move water differently.
You may only have two weeks left on those but that soil is not cheap, don’t want to be left with some anaerobic soil for the next run.

 

[X15]

Something I like to use if the soil gets too wet is Sav-A-Chick. You can get it for a few bucks at any feed store. Comes in little packets. Bacillus Subtilis. Very helpful with anaerobic situations

 

[Ca++]

Flushing 20 gallons of soil isn’t going to help anything though. You won’t be flushing out much of anything and definitely creating a stressful situation for the roots. Soil and coco move water differently.
You may only have two weeks left on those but that soil is not cheap, don’t want to be left with some anaerobic soil for the next run.

Are you reply to me?
I'm not suggesting a flush.

Using h2o2 won't leave anaerobic soil, it's the exact opposite. That is it's mode of action.
Soil growers tend to think they can't use h2o2, while using it straight from there tap. 120ppm h2o2 is common after treatment works, and boosts soil health. I grow in soil using it, and have tried to kill the soil for the last week, but couldn't. It's why I asked if he feels lucky. 120ppm is merely helpful I was saying. It won't kill it. The plants will likely look better in hours.

If you are buying little packets of Bacillus Subtilis, you should look at the product I suggested. I'm not sure which you are buying, but this one wins in trials. D747 (I knew it was a plane)

Garden Friendly Fungicide - Southern Agricultural Insecticides, Inc.

FOR ORGANIC USE

southernag.com

This is filtering down from farming suppliers, with more realistic pricing.

 

[Week 4]

Interesting that the fungus/mold was brought up because it seemed like I was or did have a little problem with that at the early stages of the flip. Looked like the classic white fungus. I had some lactic acid bacteria I made up and used that to spray the plants and used as a soil drench. Seems to have controlled the situation. I've never read or heard of the peroxide use for fungus control, that's interesting.
As for the soil possibly going anaerobic, I have a good mix of perlite in the soil and it drains really well. Not overly concerned about that.
Lot to take in here, thanks for the thoughts and ideas.