Moldy walls...HELP!!..(With Pictures)

[Fast Pine]

I am getting mold growing on the walls, in certain places in my grow room...Im quite worried, and to make matters worse...I just switched over to flower..


Its in a basement, temp's are ~30 degrees outside, and 85 inside. Humidity is 60-80% all the time...Which is causing alot of condensation to build up in random places on the roof, and drip and run down the walls. Its muggy as hell!.. This water is brownish, and puddles up on the floor and stains the wall. Its probably spreading the mold spores everywhere!


It got bad about a week ago. I scrubbed off all the mold, with amonia. Let the walls dry, and painted over it...Well, Now the paint is bubbling up, and mold has started to grow again!!


...Its a co2 enriched environment. The room is sealed, with no passive and active ventilation. Im pretty sure I could solve this problem with some good ventilation...But, I just spent quite a bit of money to get my co2 system running perfect ..I am astonished by the results, and really dont want to put that toy away..especially during flower..Which means the room must remain sealed...If possible ..





Here is the drippy roof...with condensation..




Heres the stained walls, and water pooling up on the floor!!




This area was HEAVILY moldy before I cleaned and painted...Its starting to bubble and grow back!!




This is a small patch the size of a quarter...This grew in 1week.





These are the hopefuls..They dont have any mold on them ...yet ..
................................................................................................

Help..Please help..How do I get this under controll?

Thanks.

FP

 

[Babbabud]

Well you could scrub it down again and then there is special paint that keeps the mold away. But your going to have to figure out the humidity problem reguardless. I would think a de humidfier would help alot but they are expensive from what ive seen.

 

[FunkBomb]

You've gotta get that humidity in check. As for the mold you may just want to spend a day with lots of bleach to kill the spores. Best of luck and be safe, mold can do a lot of harm to many things.


-Funk

 

[Guest]

I would add some kind of insulation to the spots where mold is occuring, or cover the walls with some, this will increase the temperature of the spot where the water is condensing, and water wont condense there. I use reflectix bubble wrap insulation, it works great. And like suggested above, it would be much easier to just get a dehumidifer, but either way youll be spending money to fix your problem. Hope that helps a bit.

 

[dankbudz]

your problem is humidity even if you had ventilation with humidity 60-80% all the time youd have mold then too

 

[jd2769]

dank is that you? Or another dank budz?

 

[Fast Pine]

I just called my local hydroshop...They dont have any dehumidifiers, and they said they coundnt find anyone who had one?

Where do I get one, and how much are they?

 

[Guest]

home depot, between 50 and 100 dollars

 

[supafly]

Go to a home center. Lowes or home depot. Im sure they would be much cheaper at one of those places.

 

[supafly]

Wow he was just alittle faster than me

 

[CaptJamesTKirk]

eBay

 

[Fast Pine]

so the mold should stop, when the humidity goes down?

 

[Guest]

correct! mold needs moisture to survive.

 

[Fast Pine]

Say,
does running co2 enrichment cause the humidity to go up?

Someone told me that the dehumidifier may create too much heat for my enclosed setup?

 

[Guest]

co2 will raise the humidity because it raises the plants metabolism, plants naturally pump moisture in the air, so when u put the plants on overdrive with co2, that makes more moisture. an air conditioner also takes humidity out of the air, while cooling your room too. maybe spend money on the AC if anything, and see how it handles your humidity problem, because once you put a dehumidifier, it adds heat, and you may just need to add an AC after that. some AC units, like the portable ones, come with a vent tube, that you can attach to an exhaust outlet in your room, this expels the hot air created by the ac. otherwise a window mounted unit will do. these types leave one half of the unit hanging outside of the room (the heat causing half,) either by use of a window or a hole you created yourself. portable ac's are a lot more expensive. calculate the square footage of your room, then find a suitable ac or dehumidifier, they come in ratings of BTU.

 

[Fast Pine]

Great info..Thanks alot..

So, Is there any other way to get the condensation to stop?

I was thinking of just setting up a squirell cage fan on a timer, and vent the room out the window every couple of hours.. Hoping that will help keep the humidity down, and maby stopping the condensation????

The condensation is bad ..like real bad...There is probably a gallon or two of condensation on the walls and floor...Its only happening on the walls that have cold on the other side... The walls are wet all over, slimy and gross. They are sweating brown pools of nasty water..Its just compounding and spreading the mold..The paint is bubbling up everywhere!!..I was thinking of drying out the room, scraping all the bubbles, cleaning with bleach, and painting over with anti mold paint...Wadda ya think.

 

[vavwl]

I'd get a dehumidifier in there. Mold is impossible to kill off if you make a perfect environment for it to grow. You'll never get rid of all the spores, its impossible they are everywhere.

If money isn't an option ozone is supposed to work wonders against mold. I've heard of people cleaning really moldy houses with ozone generators. But again, the environment is the problem.

perhaps change the sheathing on the walls? It may be expensive, but get something that won't absorb water. sheetrock is terrible for mold growth. Perhaps pull it down and just put up a solid white vapour barrier. Anything made out of wood, or particleboard, or gypsum will absorb water and grow mold. So you have to either seal the surface with paint or just change to a plastic or tilebacker board.

 

[Fast Pine]

Check this out, The walls are concrete, 7' up, then it turns to wood. alot of the mold is growing around or out of this crack, seperating the concrete from the wood..

does any body have any idea about how much heat a dehumidifier will create?

 

[Deer_Slayer]

I would definatly get that problem fixed ASAP or your not going to harvest anything except moldy buds. I dont think a dehumidifer would give off any noticable heat, the coils on a dehumidifer actually get cool and frosty.

I would look at setting up some sort of ventilation system with that severe of a humidity problem and re-dial your setup in after that. Your grow room sounds like 1 big humidity dome.


Check out this link I found for you. http://www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca/en/co/maho/yohoyohe/momo/momo_001.cfm

Choosing a dehumidifier

Moisture in house air can be a problem when there is either too little or too much. Air that is “too dry” can cause discomfort, dried and itchy skin and nasal passages, cracked or rickety furniture, and sparks when you reach for a doorknob or another person.

Air that is “too damp” can cause itchy skin and nasal passages, ongoing condensation on windows, water damage to materials, mold growth and even rot of wood materials in your house.

What Is Relative Humidity?

Relative humidity is a percentage. It tells you how much moisture is in the air relative to the maximum amount the air can hold at that temperature. For instance, when air at a given temperature contains all the water vapour it can hold at that temperature, the relative humidity is 100 per cent. If the humidity is higher than 100 per cent, moisture will begin to condense from the air. If the air contains only half the water it can hold at that temperature, the relative humidity is 50 per cent.

Warm air can hold more moisture than cool air. The relative humidity of a sample of air will change as the temperature changes, even though the actual amount of moisture in the sample air does not. For example, as a sample of air cools, the relative humidity rises.

Note that both excessively dry and overly damp conditions can both lead to the same problem of dry and itchy skin and nasal passages. In the first case this is because the air is dry and in the second case because it contains mold debris and spores that are toxic.

You can adjust and control the relative humidity in your house. This About Your House suggests some ways of avoiding problems caused by air that is too damp and tells you how to select and use a dehumidifier.

What is the “right” moisture level?

Generally, the “right” moisture level— the relative humidity—in your house is less than 50 per cent. At less than 50 per cent relative humidity it is unlikely that mold will grow indoors.

There are cases when 50 per cent relative humidity is too high. For instance, if there is condensation on your windows in cold weather, it's a good idea to lower your relative humidity to as low as 30 per cent.

Another instance: if you, or someone in your family, is asthmatic, you should consider keeping the humidity level in the bedroom at 40 per cent or less.

Dust mites prefer relative humidity of 50 per cent and higher. Dust mites leave debris in bedding, and the debris aggravates asthma. Keeping the relative humidity at 40 per cent or less controls the dust mites and reduces their effect on asthmatics.

Sometimes, reducing relative humidity won't solve moisture problems. Defects in insulation or the air barrier in walls and ceilings can cause cold spots in your house. They show up as areas where there is always condensation, even if relative humidity is 50 per cent or less. A dehumidifier won't solve the problem. You will need help from a qualified builder, renovator or insulation specialist.

Where does moisture in air come from?

Moisture can come into your home from many places. Outside sources include the soil around your house, surface water drainage and damp outdoor air. Breathing and perspiration by you, your family and your pets is a major source of indoor moisture. So are showering, bathing, drying clothes indoors, venting clothes dryers indoors, washing dishes and floors and humidifiers.

Most houses have more than one source of moisture. Moisture can cause problems once in a while, or all the time. A little prevention can keep excess moisture out of your home's air and prevent both occasional and continual problems.

Catastrophes—such as plumbing leaks or floods—can cause serious problems very quickly. You will need emergency repairs to deal with them.

Checking the moisture level in your house

A "hygrometer" measures relative humidity. A hygrometer is an inexpensive, easy-to-use instrument, sometimes called a humidity sensor or relative humidity indicator. There are mechanical and electronic hygrometers. A mechanical hygrometer usually costs $10 or less. Electronic hygrometers cost $35 to $60. Measuring Humidity, in the About Your House series, shows you how easy it is to calibrate and use a hygrometer. There are ordering instructions at the end of this About Your House.

Stopping moisture

Preventing moisture from entering your house is the best way to solve moisture problems.

If you have surface leaks you can fix them by grading the soil around your house. You can fix groundwater leaks by repairing basement or crawl space walls and floors. At the end of this About Your House there is a list of Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) publications about basement problems.

Easy preventive measures include shutting down humidifiers, drying clothes outdoors and venting the clothes dryer outside the house. One of the best ways to reduce moisture is to use a good quality, quiet bathroom fan. It vents moisture from showers and baths.

In hot, muggy weather, ventilate your house as little as possible. Air out your house when there's a dry spell and no chance of moisture problems. However, you can reduce relative humidity in dry, cold weather by increasing ventilation. A whole-house ventilation system, such as a heat recovery ventilator (HRV) or an exhaust fan coupled with fresh air intakes, will increase ventilation and dry out house air.

In the summer you can use an air conditioner that removes water from incoming air instead of just cooling it. Look for an air conditioner with a high “latent heat” rating rather than a good “sensible heat” rating.

In regions where there are months of cool, damp weather or hot, muggy weather, ventilation just adds more moisture to indoor air. A dehumidifier is an effective way of preventing moisture problems.

Dehumidifiers and how they work

Heat pump dehumidifiers

Dehumidifiers use a heat pump (similar to an air conditioner's heat pump) or chemical adsorbents to remove moisture from the air without cooling the air.

A heat pump dehumidifier uses a fan to draw indoor air over a heat exchange coil. The coil is almost freezing. The water in the air condenses on the coil and is drained. A second heat exchange coil reheats the air, which the dehumidifier exhausts into the room.

A heat pump dehumidifier dumps heat lost from the compressor and fan motors into the air. It returns to the indoor air the heat generated by the dehumidifier turning water vapour to liquid.

Chemical adsorbent dehumidifiers

This type of dehumidifier is designed for hot, humid climates and is not really suited for use in Canada.

Chemical adsorbent dehumidifiers absorb moisture from the air with a “desiccant”—a drying agent such as silica gel. The desiccant is on a heat exchange wheel. A separate air loop dries the wheel and exhausts the hot, damp air outdoors through special ducting.

A chemical adsorbent dehumidifier uses more energy than a heat pump dehumidifier. It is only cost-effective when it uses natural gas for heat exchange—and then only if natural gas is available at a low summer rate.

Homemade dehumidifier

Some inventive people use bags of road de-icing salt to absorb moisture from the air. The wet salt solution drips into a pan or floor drain, drying the air. Because the salt runs off with the water removed from the air, it must be replaced. The system has no moving parts.

If you try this homemade dehumidifier, remember that salt is highly corrosive to metals and quite hard on the skin.

Dehumidifying ventilators

This type of dehumidifier has a sensor-controller and exhaust fan. You set the sensor-controller to run when humidity reaches a set level. A dehumidifying ventilator is particularly effective if the humidity source is in your basement.

Dehumidifying ventilators don't recover heat but they use less electricity than heat pump dehumidifiers. They are not effective in hot, muggy weather, as they bring more outside air into the house. They can be effective in cold weather.

A dehumidifying ventilator depressurizes your basement, which can cause combustion gas spillage. Make sure your heating contractor checks the venting for your gas furnace, water heater and wood-burning appliances. Consider using a carbon monoxide warning device if you install a dehumidifying ventilator.

Choosing a Dehumidifier

Dehumidifier purchase costs

Heat pump dehumidifiers are complex, low-production machines and are not low-cost items. Spring seems to be the best time to buy: in the last few years dealers have held sales early in the spring with savings of $50 to $100.

The more water a dehumidifier holds —which is measured in litres or U.S. pints a day—the more it costs. You pay more for special features.

In 2000, you can expect to pay between $200 and $250 for a unit rated at 10 L (21 U.S. pints or 2.1 imperial gal.) a day—suitable for a small house with a moderate moisture problem. The price rises to between $250 and $350 for a unit with a capacity of 20 L (42 U.S. pints or 4.3 imperial gal.) a day—suitable for a large house with more severe problems.

Running costs for both units are about the same if they both have the same Efficiency Factor. The next section explains the Efficiency Factor.

Don't try to save money by buying a unit that does not have automatic defrost. If a room is too cool, a dehumidifier can frost over and stop removing moisture. A frosted-over dehumidifier left running for a long time will break down.

Get a unit with a two-speed fan. They are quieter at lower humidity, which reduces the nuisance factor. Test all units in the store for noise level, especially if you plan to use one in or near a bedroom.

The Efficiency Factor

The Efficiency Factor (EF) is a guide to a dehumidifier's operating cost. The product brochure or operator's manual usually give the EF. If they don't, you'll find the EF on a label behind the water collection bucket.

The EF is the amount of water, in litres, a dehumidifier removes at 27°C (80.6°F) and 60 per cent relative humidity for each kilowatt hour (kWh) of electricity. If electricity costs 8 cents a kilowatt hour, which it does in many parts of Canada, a unit with an EF of 1.2 will remove 15 L (32 U.S. pints or 3.3 imperial gal.) foreach dollar in electricity costs. An advanced unit with an EF of 2.4 will remove 30 L (63 U.S. pints, 6 1/2 imperial gal.) of water for each electrical dollar spent.

Because condensation gives off heat a dehumidifier acts as a heat source. This can be useful in spring or fall, when basements tend to be cool. In mid-summer, the heat added by a dehumidifier is counterproductive.

Total cost

Total cost includes the purchase price, operating and maintenance costs and repair costs.

The table below shows that an efficient dehumidifier with an EF of 1.8 will save $36/year on operating costs compared to a more conventional dehumidifier. These savings will soon pay back the additional cost of purchasing a more efficient device.

Choosing a dehumidifier

When you choose a dehumidifier, make sure you know:

1. The size you need for your house—most manufacturers have sizing charts.
2. Purchase cost.
3. The EF.
4. Whether you have to empty the condensate tub or the unit is self-draining. A self-draining dehumidifier is best, because you don't have to remember to empty the tub every day.
5. Whether it has an automatic defrost feature—it should have one.
6. The noise level at low and high speed.

Dehumidifier EF
1.2 1.8
Days used a year
80 80
Litres removed a day
20 L 20 L
Electrical cost per year
$107 $71


Annual savings $36

1. The manufacturer's reputation for quality and guarantees.
2. The service available from the seller or a local service depot.

Placing your dehumidifier

If you have forced-air heating and central cooling and the fan moves the air continuously, it doesn't really matter where you place the dehumidifier. It will remove roughly the same amount of moisture from the house no matter where you place it.

The most convenient spot is usually the laundry room, on a shelf over the laundry sink so condensate drains directly into the sink. There are two reasons for placing your dehumidifier in your laundry room: it can be warm, and dehumidifiers are more efficient in warm air, and there's a convenient drain.

If your basement is cool use a self-draining dehumidifier and put it where it can drain.

If you have hydronic or baseboard heating, place the dehumidifier where you have the worst dampness problem, as long as that location is not cold. If you have automatic defrost, a cool location is okay.

Placing a dehumidifier in a bedroom may not be a good idea. The unit may be too noisy and you have to empty the condensate tub every day.

Maintenance and operating tips

Clean the internal filters frequently. Start by cleaning them every two weeks. If the filters are not very dirty you can clean them less often.

Vacuum the coils every spring and fall if they get dirty.

You can't set and forget the controls on a dehumidifier. In the muggy days of summer, set the controls to remove more moisture. Lower the setting to remove less moisture in spring, fall and on clear, dry summer days.

When a dehumidifier doesn’t solve the problem

A dehumidifier alone may not solve severe moisture problems in your house. Your first course of action is to find the moisture source. Take steps to reduce the amount coming into your house—or to stop it completely. Remember: a dehumidifier is useful— but it isn't magic.

 

[Guest]

I use a 45 pint dehumdifier,they are not 50-100 dollars more like 300-350 dollars