Mexican Pot Gangs Infiltrate Indian Reservations in U.S.

[Skip]

As you wish...

So lemme get this straight. For many of you, it's perfectly fine to allow illegal aliens to be smuggled into our country, to abuse our public and private lands, to do illegal grows that provide a great excuse for the permanent presence of Feds & DEA agents in our state, to be armed and set traps that might even kill an innocent hiker, just so ONE BIG GUY can reap in enormous profits.

And people (landowners, LEOs etc.) shouldn't harm a hair on their heads.

But when it comes to HOMELAND SECURITY, it's just fine to send HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF SOLDIERS to foreign lands where the natives there have done NOTHING TO US AT ALL, and rain bombs down upon them, killing thousands of innocent men, women and children. That's just fine to a lot of you, I know....

Just want to get our morality sorted out so I know what is allowed (politically correct) in America these days, and what isn't...

 

[Organic-Dank]

this is all bull shit..... who told ya mexican are raping woman and growing poison?? Mr. bush???? yeah I heard that form the bush administration a few times They also said that 911 was osama and that he had huge high tech undergrond bases hahah Mexican Cartels... give me a brake outdoor is not hurting anyone no electricity no harm even better more plants more oxygen and not Everyone can grow legally skip seriously (hope ya feel all mighty by being able to kick or ban someone) pufffffffff and I liked icmag

 

[Skip]

Stop putting words into my mouth (and personal insults- read the TOS) and maybe I'll stop banning.

Plus I know that it's NOT cartels actually hiring these guys but rich WHITE growers, some who may frequent this site, who are responsible for what is happening in our forests. Dig it! Time to stop the illegal grows and let the Feds play elsewhere.

Don't like my opinions, go somewhere where they censor people for speaking their minds.

Can't grow thousands of plants legally? Then LEGALIZE IT!

But NO! You ppl who organize these huge grows on public lands don't want cannabis legalized cause your fuckin' greedy. That's the bottom line. Greed is what is stopping it from becoming legal. Don't matter if you're a grower, a pharmeceutical company, a beer company or whatever. Endless greed continues to keep marijuana illegal, continues to keep the FEDS on our backs, and continues to get nearly ONE MILLION AMERICANS arrested each year.

Yeah, I'm calling ALL OF YOU OUT who want to keep cannabis illegal so you can continue to rip us off...

You know who you are, and you are just as responsible as the LEOs for these consequences that ruin the lives of cannabis users everywhere. Time to own up to your responsibilities and get on board the LEGALIZATION train.

Put those millions you all haul in each year to better use. Once and for all, let's lobby for legalization like never before. But we need you guys on the same page with us. No more excuses like "not everyone can grow legally". Well MAKE IT SO! We have the power and momentum happening now. Now is the time we can make a difference before the anti-drug forces mobilize again.

Don't blow this opportunity by being selfish and greedy.

 

[Kola Radical]

Legalize it and kill their business.

These guys are selling to large cities on the east coast where they can get 10K per lb.

Buy and grow locally. We don't need law enforcement to fix the black market problem. Only removing prohibition will kill it.

 

[DIGITALHIPPY]

hoo-rah for the minute men....
go get-em fellas.

 

[Skip]

Legalize it and kill their business.

These guys are selling to large cities on the east coast where they can get 10K per lb.

Buy and grow locally. We don't need law enforcement to fix the black market problem. Only removing prohibition will kill it.

Exactly! I think it's our problem, not law enforcement's. We need a new attitude here if we are to ever get out of this conundrum. We are the suppliers and the market. We decide whether to grow legally or not. We need to encourage more ppl to grow legally and form legal collectives.

Look we have nearly what we've wanted for decades now. We can either embrace it or blow it. So if you CAN grow legally, what is your excuse for growing illegally, other than greed?

Yeah you're gonna say the demand is there. Well guess what? If the huge outside grows aren't there, then what happens? Prices go up when supply cannot meet demand.

Then what happens? More ppl get disgusted with the price and start to grow their own. Then market demand goes back down, along with the price.

That is the place we need to get to. It might take sometime to get there, but we never will and we will continue to have the Feds breathing down our necks if we don't.

So we are more in control of this situation than we realize.

Hell, even Eddy Lepp tried to do a legal grow with 30,000 plants, and one day soon, it might be possible.

When that day happens, we won't need to talk about the nationality of people doing illegal grows because there won't be any illegal grows.

 

[Organic-Dank]

10 k per lb lol ahha maybe if they sold evey gram for 20$$$ to highschool kids...be realistic mate.... anyways I'm all for legalizeing it and trust me I'm not greedy not for one bit. but I don't wish death upon anyone even mexicans growing weed illegally ... they are working for survival they got familys im sure... and kids too maybe if there where good paying jobs out there they would do something else... and I don't think everyone can grow cannabis legally... the ones that dont want the laws change is not the mexicans buddy is the damn big big people im not talking about a marijuana boss or whatever you wanna call it king pins is the Bigger people ... electricity companys drug companys ect... man I've met some big people before and they are all for legalizein it mate they are ready to pull out the nices coffee shop the world has ever seen, work hard and just like to see a good job get well done. Legalize it I been waiting for this to happen ive spoken to everyone I know about the benefits of medical cannabis.

 

[Skip]

OK, so let's frame the issue another way...(these are just rhetorical questions)

How many of you have a weapon on hand to defend your crop?

How many of you have set up booby traps to defend your crop?

How many of you would use force to defend your crop?

And as the report says the Mexicans were armed.

So who is it who is bringing potential violence to the herb?

And who here isn't willing to use force to defend their own land from abuse.

So why would you deny Native Americans that same right?

Remember they are sovereign nations (and they were invaded by foreigners - again).

Of course I don't think they should kill anyone. Always better to smoke a peace pipe with them...

But I do believe that should be their right to use force should they choose to do so.

And until a BIG MESSAGE is sent to the uh, "cartels", they will continue to expand their operations on public and sovereign lands. Then bigger and bigger seizures, more possibilities of violent encounters, adding more negative attention to the whole legalization debate.

You know just cause this is a cannabis site, doesn't mean everyone should support cannabis growing in every form. People must draw their own lines as to what might be acceptable in their eyes.

The fact that cannabis has been illegal for so long and many of us have been using it for so many years, we adopt the outlaw mindset, and then that allows us to view other illegal activities as being OK to do.

But at least for me, the dangers involved, the risk of seizure, crop failure, damage to land, inconvenience, risk of incarceration, etc. would make large outdoor grows in forests seem unwise, not to mention logically illegal.

Cannabis is illogically illegal. That's an important difference to me.

Any potential violence associated with cannabis is mostly due to the fact that it remains illegal.

Legalize it and it will have less violence associated with it than aspirin.

 

[FreshlyShaven]

As you wish...

So lemme get this straight. For many of you, it's perfectly fine to allow illegal aliens to be smuggled into our country, to abuse our public and private lands, to do illegal grows that provide a great excuse for the permanent presence of Feds & DEA agents in our state, to be armed and set traps that might even kill an innocent hiker, just so ONE BIG GUY can reap in enormous profits.

And people (landowners, LEOs etc.) shouldn't harm a hair on their heads.

But when it comes to HOMELAND SECURITY, it's just fine to send HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF SOLDIERS to foreign lands where the natives there have done NOTHING TO US AT ALL, and rain bombs down upon them, killing thousands of innocent men, women and children. That's just fine to a lot of you, I know....

Just want to get our morality sorted out so I know what is allowed (politically correct) in America these days, and what isn't...

What in God's name are you talking about? If we don't support the mass murder of or violence against Mexicans, we support imperial wars and think Mexican cartels are dandy?

Nobody is defending people who ruin public lands and use violence. But slandering the entire Mexican people for the actions of their organized crime syndicates is stupid. And keep in mind that most of the workers on these plots are little more than pawns willing to risk their freedom to feed themselves or send money to their impoverished family. Sure, the gangsters are mostly evil fuckers, but they're the last to get caught.

Also, your idea that now that medical marijuana is legal, all illegal cultivation is unnecessary(or whatever it is exactly you're trying to argue) is false- sure, in some states, getting a card is easy and dispensaries abound, but most of the country lives in states without medical marijuana and most medical marijuana states have very selective rules that exclude many patients from a legal source of medicine. Until the laws are changed, and pot is freely available through legal channels to all adults, there will always be a black market in pot. And the black market will inevitably get more and more violent and destructive the more it is repressed and attacked by LEO.

 

[dank.frank]

Skip, man...you are RIGHT on point.

I don't want to be as blatant as you have been about the race side of things, because I have my own personal issues with what is happening at our border and in foreign countries. I think we as greedy Americans are fully to blame for the fact that we have an immigration issue. If they flooded our country...got here, realized that NO ONE was going to give them work....they'd stop coming...kinda simple. BUT NO...just like greedy Americans to find a way to make the individual more money, whilst putting the Americans who broke their backs and bleed and worked 15 hour days to get them where the are in the first place...now they sell US out to hire some shoddy, half-assed employee to do the job, simply because it lines the pocket of the individual faster....IT IS SICK.

I am NOT at all racist, and I have zero issue with Mexicans or immigrants. I have a problem with the greedy Americans who encourage AND CREATE THE DEMAND and the possibility in the first place.

It is much the same was with the MMJ. I have been on record on MANY occasions thumping and encouraging people TO NOT try to bend the laws and test their limits. THE ONLY way to truly further legalization or even a national form of regulation is to show that when given an inch we (the communities as a whole) don't attempt to take a mile. By testing the limits of the laws in the MMJ states, all we really do is show other and politicians that they were right and it is nothing more than a farce to allow people to smoke "dope". This type of negative attention is NOT what is needed. MMJ and the patients and providers need to become more active in the communities they reside in as well. It is the only billion dollar industry that has nearly zero (in comparison) lobbyists and we as the constituents are the ones that pay the cost. Not only in laws not going in our favor, but also by failing to win public opinion. NOW, I hate the politics of it all, but the simple fact is, it is essential that we have a foothold in the system in order to change the system. Activism and non-violent protest is what ALL people should be willing to participate in, but there need to be those figureheads that capable of representing and relating to all peoples. Those suit and tie microphone types that make the general populace, albeit I feel most of the general populace are sheep...well why not let us herd them in a more positive direction by NOT proving the right wingers and left wingers to be correct in their accusations an skepticism of the MMJ communities.

This isn't a if you can't beat them, join them type of approach, but rather, a join them to beat them mentality. It is possible to be part of the system and lubricate the gears of policy change, WITHOUT becoming a sell out and an outcast. It is all about how we present ourselves and how we are viewed by those that come into contact with us. We can choose to embrace the old "stoner" montage, and I see nothing wrong with that...but there still needs to be the iconic American patriot who isn't an extremist, but rather a realist. Just like Skip was saying, in order to have this spread like wildfire and to truly see an end to prohibition...no one should be attempting to have a 20,000 plant garden, but rather we should have 10,000 people growing two plants. This is the way to integrate ourselves into the community and when it is seen that the guy next door can grow a garden, and still have you over to watch football and enjoy a BBQ...then we are making progress.


Anyway....



dank.Frank

 

[dank.frank]

And keep in mind that most of the workers on these plots are little more than pawns willing to risk their freedom to feed themselves or send money to their impoverished family.

Well, doesn't that just make them the moral type of person I'd want next door. See the fact of the matter is, they fear for their lives (possible) but won't hesitate to take yours as a result. I don't feel sorry for someone who makes a intentional decision to make money this way to support their families. Chick coops hire too. It is their choice who employs them. NOW...to take it one step further...if the people stop working for the crime lord...well, hmmm...he can't do it all on his own...so they ARE the avenue that CREATES the boss. They give him the power and the money...just like an employee of any industry. You think if one day they all just said...hmmm, I'm not doing this anymore, that the drug lord is going to bring millions upon millions of dollars of drugs into this country on his own...NOPE. They hold just as much accountability as he does...they are solely responsible for their own decisions. And to suggest otherwise, that they are incapable of being poor and DESERVE more and that this line of work is acceptable and proper for them because of such a situation...is more offensive and disgusting to me than anything that been expressed yet.

I have been dirt poor for the better part of my entire life. Grew up in a cinder block house with a concrete floor and 6ft. ceilings. It was like being in a mansion when my parents we able to afford a single wide in a trailer park. AND I HAVE NEVER killed, stolen, threatened or done anything that would put another human being in dire jeopardy. Being poor and having a family is no excuse nor does it excuse being a drugs lords pawn. PERIOD. WOW.

And please, don't be offended. Not a personal attack, but rather the nature of different opinions. It in no way means I disrespect you as an individual or as a person.

Also, your idea that now that medical marijuana is legal, all illegal cultivation is unnecessary(or whatever it is exactly you're trying to argue) is false- sure, in some states, getting a card is easy and dispensaries abound, but most of the country lives in states without medical marijuana and most medical marijuana states have very selective rules that exclude many patients from a legal source of medicine. Until the laws are changed, and pot is freely available through legal channels to all adults, there will always be a black market in pot. And the black market will inevitably get more and more violent and destructive the more it is repressed and attacked by LEO.

But the road to legalization is not through continued illegal activities. The road to legalization is through compliance and a TRUE shortage. Once the demand has risen to a point where the consumers and patients are forced TO ACT and become ACT-TIVISTS...then we will see true change. IF we can always go to the corner and get it from petty the pot peddler, what motivation is there for us to push for legalization? The correct route is to abide within the law, and by such compliance, it will be shown that there is MORE that needs to be done to ensure everyone has access to the medicine they need.



dank.Frank

 

[hazy]

Plus I know that it's NOT cartels actually hiring these guys but rich WHITE growers, some who may frequent this site, who are responsible for what is happening in our forests. Dig it! Time to stop the illegal grows and let the Feds play elsewhere.

Don't like my opinions, go somewhere where they censor people for speaking their minds.

Saying that Mexican nationals who grow large illegal crops in our National forests and Reservations etc., are doing it for WHITE bosses can only be your 'opinion', I'd like to see proof of that and not just an anecdotal story.

 

[Rhyolite]

Post erased.

 

[dank.frank]

Haha well since this thread is going in this direction, than I have something to add
The problem with leagalizing weed for the government is how will they be able to hull in massive amounts of tax from it? When it's leagal, people can grow it themselves... Which leaves the gov without any tax money. Also they wouldn't want America to be a pot head nation, if you look at it from a side, most countries look up to america and ask for help in fianances and other shit like that. And if Kanibbus ever becomes leagal, I would chuck my life savings into hydro products on wallstreet for sure.

So let's just grow and be happy.

Well, in the line of the same logic.

Alcohol is legal, yet VERY few people have home breweries and make their own beer. There is going to be that portion of the market that decides it is fun and a hobby, and grow their own. HOWEVER, the key majority is still going to head to the local store and buy something to smoke on. There will be HUGE gains in taxes...not only from the sales, but also from those selling that can now pay income tax. Not to mention the thousands of companies that would spring up and their corporate taxes and then to take it one step even further, the amount of money AND JOBS that would be generated as a result of needing regulatory agencies and inspectors and so forth.

 

[Organic-Dank]

I just thought the statements that skip made where false and out of place and was miss informing everyone so I had to jump in. Cannabis has a long way to be fully legalized...With the grows that Ive done i could have probably supply fuel for my whole entire family friends ect, cloth, food, you name it they cant control it so you (we) cant have it.. thats how it works. Skip due to the laws many growers go underground because they don't trust the government why??? because it has back stabbed so many and Im not going down in history for trusting the enemy.

 

[Organic-Dank]

Well, in the line of the same logic.

Alcohol is legal, yet VERY few people have home breweries and make their own beer. There is going to be that portion of the market that decides it is fun and a hobby, and grow their own. HOWEVER, the key majority is still going to head to the local store and buy something to smoke on. There will be HUGE gains in taxes...not only from the sales, but also from those selling that can now pay income tax. Not to mention the thousands of companies that would spring up and their corporate taxes and then to take it one step even further, the amount of money AND JOBS that would be generated as a result of needing regulatory agencies and inspectors and so forth.

Please never compare Cannabis with alcohol... Cannabis is a weed it grows anywhere lol why would ppl not grow their own outdoors if it was legal??

 

[Rhyolite]

Post erased.

 

[Harvest]

10 k per lb lol ahha maybe if they sold evey gram for 20$$$ to highschool kids...be realistic mate....

Ive deff seen people pay 9-10 a lb on the east coast for west coast finest.

 

[dank.frank]

Please never compare Cannabis with alcohol... Cannabis is a weed it grows anywhere lol why would ppl not grow their own outdoors if it was legal??

Because people are pathetically lazy. And if it was legal, why would some one wait 4 months to grow and smoke, if they could just zip down to the 711 and buy a sack for $10. Because there is a lot of people that have no clue about the frosty frosty dank that most of us are accustomed to, nor do they really care for that matter.

I know people that will simply say...it gets me there, that's good enough.

Wasn't some much comparing the two in any other terms than the aspect of it being a hobby for some people vs. just being easier to go to the store and get it. Which I suppose is not so much a comparison of cannabis to alcohol, as much as it is a comparison of how people chose to spend their time.


dank.Frank

 

[FreshlyShaven]

Well, doesn't that just make them the moral type of person I'd want next door.

You realize you're talking to a forum filled with illegal marijuana growers, including those who grow on public land, right? I mean, sure, the syndicates and the various gangs can be violent but that doesn't mean that everyone involved, like the guy paid to install PVC piping for irrigation or the mules, is an evil person. Sure, the black market is vicious and they're a part of it, but so are most people involved with the drug or even pot world in most of the country.

Chick coops hire too. It is their choice who employs them.

Have you been outside or read a newspaper lately? Do you really think it's as simple as that? There are far more unemployed than there are jobs and uneducated unspecialized labor is particularly worthless at the moment. If I were desperate and didn't know how I was gonna pay the rent or eat dinner and somebody offered me 2000 dollars a month to do some grunt work in the forest to grow some weed, I'd sure as Hell take it.

NOW...to take it one step further...if the people stop working for the crime lord...well, hmmm...he can't do it all on his own...so they ARE the avenue that CREATES the boss. They give him the power and the money...just like an employee of any industry.

And this is true of almost every drug dealer in the country. It sucks and it's a good reason to change the laws, but it's the way it is. Not just with pot- buying things from evil people or organizations is something we do everyday. Most of the world's lumber is illegally harvested and traded by the same syndicates that traffick drugs; bananas were based upon cheap and unorganized labor and we even initiated a genocide to ensure that(look up Guatemala's history); a giant percentage of chocolate you buy was created with child slaves; most meat was produced in horrific slaughterhouses that exploit cheap foreign labor and pay little heed to safety, the environment, or the animal's wellbeing; when you buy health insurance, you support an industry that regularly murders its customers and is able to buy enough influence to strangle any attempt at reform.

Yes, this is all fucked but this is the world we live in. We need to change the laws to make the marijuana industry transparent and ethical, but as long as growing or selling pot sends you to prison, that's the way it's going to be.

. You think if one day they all just said...hmmm, I'm not doing this anymore, that the drug lord is going to bring millions upon millions of dollars of drugs into this country on his own...NOPE.

But this would never happen. You can't change the drug industry by striking; there's 100 guys waiting to take your place.

But the road to legalization is not through continued illegal activities.

Sure, but the black market is going to be there whether we like it or not until we have the popular support to legalize the stuff. Which we don't, at least not nationwide and at least not yet. Opinions are changing drastically but it'll be decades before it becomes a winnable issue on the national scale.

he road to legalization is through compliance and a TRUE shortage. Once the demand has risen to a point where the consumers and patients are forced TO ACT and become ACT-TIVISTS...then we will see true change. IF we can always go to the corner and get it from petty the pot peddler, what motivation is there for us to push for legalization?

Dude, do you think that a pot shortage would be a boon for the legalization movement? Hell no- it would be evidence that prohibition works and that's how it would be spun. Do you think anyone in power would take a bunch of grumpy stoners yelling about how they've been sober for 10 days seriously?

Please never compare Cannabis with alcohol... Cannabis is a weed it grows anywhere lol why would ppl not grow their own outdoors if it was legal??

Because local shithead teenagers would steal it? Because people live in apartments? Because people want to be able to smoke at times of the year other than harvest season? Because most people aren't devoted enough to spend hours of effort to grow something they only use occasionally? Because they work most of the week and don't have time to tend to a garden?

I mean, you can grow your own vegetables or your own spices, but people still go to the supermarket.